| New Signing 15:51 - Feb 6 with 57368 views | Antti_Heinola |
Club just teasing a new signing on twitter...
must be an out of contract player? |  |
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| New Signing on 08:27 - Feb 8 with 3955 views | TK1 |
| New Signing on 06:26 - Feb 8 by Hunterhoop |
Top post. I support the publicly voiced strategy of buy low sell high, signing players based on data not managers’ whims, having a club ethos around style, develop talent either signed at 15/16 after braving let go by others’ youth set ups or through our own academy, and, most importantly, operate within FFP.
I agree with all that stuff that Hoos and Ferdinand continually spout. I do think they have failed to verbalise and sell a vision that excites and gets more of the fanbase on board (as opposed to just explaining the challenges) but I agree with their strategy.
That’s what makes this signing frustrating. It is simply not part of the strategy. We should not have to resort to this. They’re not acting how they told us they would, and needed to.
I hope Martin is a roaring success, like Paul Furlong, one of my favourite ever players.
I am just getting frustrated at how much we’re pandering to managers and making these short term decisions that go against the supposed strategy: Warburton’s last year (extending Wallace, signing Gray, pushing the boat out on players, Hendrick!, etc), Beale being able to sign a load of his men (Balogun, JCS) and bring in an army of loanees (like under McClaren) who have broadly underperformed, and now signing a 34 yr old released by a team well below us in the league only a couple of months ago.
We’re being told one thing, which I agree with, only to act completely differently. We’re told it is all about the big picture, long term development of the club, and then we make blindingly obvious short term decisions that clearly undermine the supposed strategy.
My problem is not the DOF model, my issue is we’re not following the DOF/Data Analytics model religiously enough. As soon as we have a wobble we waste money on a short term signing. Martin’s money could have been saved and help us capture a lower league talent in the summer, whilst we give more development time to Armstrong. We shouldn’t go down with the squad we have even without Dykes given the points total we’re on, so use the time wisely and build up a small pot to go get a long term target in the summer.
We are just inconsistent in approach. That permeates through the club and onto the pitch. |
They probably just think they can still make the play-offs, which would be transformative.And if they win three games in a row, they probably could - as any of ten teams can. And the manager has no doubt decided that, having coached the team for a couple of months, what is missing is the kind of experienced focal point number nine to hold the whole thing together, like Madine at Blackpool did for him. Everything else is there. Then his one striker he can muddle through with in the role gets pneumonia. Chris Martin became available, I imagine it's cheap, there's no fee, he outperformed any of our strikers last season...seems like an open goal for QPR.
I feel for the club on this. I don't understand the stick. It seems so obvious, an easy win in a difficult situation. If they'd spent big on a younger version that they couldn't afford in the summer they wouldn't have got stick, but they'd have been in bigger trouble. I have a much bigger problem with expensive Premier League loans, not matter how much we love watching Ethan Laird, because that really isn't the stated program and there is a long-term project in that same position. But this is a different thing entirely. Iff it goes well, he may be around next year and if not, well no great expense. He may even help Armstrong score a goal playing off him. |  | | |
| New Signing on 09:09 - Feb 8 with 3794 views | eastside_r |
| New Signing on 08:27 - Feb 8 by TK1 |
They probably just think they can still make the play-offs, which would be transformative.And if they win three games in a row, they probably could - as any of ten teams can. And the manager has no doubt decided that, having coached the team for a couple of months, what is missing is the kind of experienced focal point number nine to hold the whole thing together, like Madine at Blackpool did for him. Everything else is there. Then his one striker he can muddle through with in the role gets pneumonia. Chris Martin became available, I imagine it's cheap, there's no fee, he outperformed any of our strikers last season...seems like an open goal for QPR.
I feel for the club on this. I don't understand the stick. It seems so obvious, an easy win in a difficult situation. If they'd spent big on a younger version that they couldn't afford in the summer they wouldn't have got stick, but they'd have been in bigger trouble. I have a much bigger problem with expensive Premier League loans, not matter how much we love watching Ethan Laird, because that really isn't the stated program and there is a long-term project in that same position. But this is a different thing entirely. Iff it goes well, he may be around next year and if not, well no great expense. He may even help Armstrong score a goal playing off him. |
Yes, this.
After 13 pages this is about the closest to my views on this signing, which I am definitely not hating as much as I expected.
Cast our minds back to 2020/21, when Warburton's team were moribund and largely ineffective and the season was transformed in the January mostly by an 'overweight' Charlie Austin and 'past it / crocked' Stefan Johansen.
The point you make that Martin may do for Armstrong something similar to how Austin mentored Dykes is valid.
We live in hope (surely?) |  | | |
| New Signing on 09:14 - Feb 8 with 3748 views | TK1 |
| New Signing on 09:09 - Feb 8 by eastside_r |
Yes, this.
After 13 pages this is about the closest to my views on this signing, which I am definitely not hating as much as I expected.
Cast our minds back to 2020/21, when Warburton's team were moribund and largely ineffective and the season was transformed in the January mostly by an 'overweight' Charlie Austin and 'past it / crocked' Stefan Johansen.
The point you make that Martin may do for Armstrong something similar to how Austin mentored Dykes is valid.
We live in hope (surely?) |
Worth adding that Austin and SJ were both expensive loan signings on big wages, too, so really they were breaking the rules. CM isn't. He's a free agent on Championship wages. | | | |
| New Signing on 09:18 - Feb 8 with 3741 views | PinnerPaul |
| New Signing on 12:20 - Feb 7 by daveB |
Masterson and Smyth both played well for us and were then loaned out. Smyth young player of the season when we had Eze, Bright and Manning in the team. Played about 4 games for us after that season. Right wingers who have played more than him since he won that award, mid 30's semi retired Marc Pugh and Albert Adomah, and we wonder why we're skint
I find our attitude towards our own players bizarre.
Dion Sanderson was loaned to us last year, not very good but keep playing him every week he might get better.
One of the players we own has a bad game, off you pop on loan or never seen again as we sign someone else. Oh you played crap for a non league team, well we'd better either release you or give you one more year and a few loans, best not play you in the first team though just in case we lose even though we're losing anyway.
It just raises the issue if these players Kellman, Duke-Mckenna, Armstrong, Smyth, Masterson are not good enough why are we signing them in the first place, should we not be doing far better and have a far better hit rate with signings than this. Get those right and you don't need 5 loans a season to bolster the squad but with all of them as we never put them in our team we'll never know if they are good enough or not.
Rafferty Pedder another one, 21 years old now, impressing for the B team and under 21's, never even been on our bench at a club where we had 2 keepers sat on the bench the other week, out of contract this summer do we ever dare to look at him, maybe give him 10 minutes in the first team.
We signed one from Newcastle last year, named after Stan Bowles, never seen again.
I do get it that these kids may well be utter shit but why have an academy if you never use any of them, that was supposed to be the point in going down this route and if all the kids are shit why are we signing them to pro contracts
I know it's hard and never easy to get signings right and we all got carried away with that lockdown season but we don't make it easy for ourselves |
I still think if you believe Kelman can do a job for us despite all the evidence to the contrary then you may just as well say that Dykes, in fact our whole team, is good enough for the PL - "if only they were given the chance"
I usually agree with you on most things but this argument is just bizarre.
Lets go with the premise that Ramsey et all haven't got a clue and couldn't spot a good player if they fell over them - are you saying that everyone else who has seen our players play, AT A LOWER LEVEL, or 3 are wrong as well.
Sorry Dave it makes no sense to me. | | | |
| New Signing on 11:09 - Feb 8 with 3505 views | stanistheman |
| New Signing on 02:18 - Feb 8 by FredManRave |
No offence meant Davie but, imo, your post is completely missing the point.
I would suggest that, despite the, quite honestly, weird opinion that some fans seem to have on here of believing that other fans hope that we do badly, so they can remonstrate and complain, etc that is not actually the case. Even writing that seems weird. Difference of opinion, ideals, process, etc, maybe but end goal will always be the same for any true QPR fan.
We ALL want what is best for QPR and for us to be successful, even though it's understandable that we have our own differing opinions of "the best" and "successful".
Getting to my main point, ALL the "nay sayers" as some might call them, ALL want CM to do well, play a blinder on Saturday, score the winning goal and finish the season as top scorer.
The angst is not against the player, it's against the fact that we're in a position where we have to sign him.
I think the main issue for most is that we've now been with our current "set up" for over 7 years now!
And where are we? Where is the consistent improvement over time? What have we improved and what consistency in our philosophy have we maintained?
Can anybody really see the clear path that is being maintained within the club that no matter who the manager is they will have to tow the clearly defined line of our recruitment and development policies and won't be allowed to make their own decisions or calls as that would be an exit from the clearly laid out plan that has been set up with a view to steady progression for the last 7 years!
There's not one QPR fan on here that doesn't want us to win on Saturday and have CM score the winning goal off his arse.
But there are many, many fans that are not seeing the progession and devlopment that would be expected after 7 years of a stable hierachy and with all the promises that were made at the very start and they're within their rights to voice those frustrations, quite understandably. [Post edited 8 Feb 2023 2:20]
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Good post Paul.
We have not made any real progress apart from a new training ground.
There are some promising young players like Lloyd, Drewe, Kolli, Pedder but we have been there before and have yet to see homegrown young players come through to the first team apart Kakay - and he isn’t even good, but just about ok with some glaring errors.
We have picked up some ‘rejects’ and done well with them (Eze, Chair, Dieng) along with plenty that have flopped (Oteh, Owens and a few others from Spurs and West Ham).
As for a settled style of player, manager, coach and playing style there has been no sign of it.
Of course most of us want the side to win and make progress although others just want to have a club to support regardless of which division it drops to. | | | |
| New Signing on 11:17 - Feb 8 with 3430 views | stanistheman |
| New Signing on 09:09 - Feb 8 by eastside_r |
Yes, this.
After 13 pages this is about the closest to my views on this signing, which I am definitely not hating as much as I expected.
Cast our minds back to 2020/21, when Warburton's team were moribund and largely ineffective and the season was transformed in the January mostly by an 'overweight' Charlie Austin and 'past it / crocked' Stefan Johansen.
The point you make that Martin may do for Armstrong something similar to how Austin mentored Dykes is valid.
We live in hope (surely?) |
Agreed and that is just what I am hoping Martin will add to the team. | | | |
| New Signing on 12:01 - Feb 8 with 3275 views | ngbqpr |
Whole thread getting a bit "what have the Romans done for us?" |  |
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| New Signing on 12:40 - Feb 8 with 3123 views | connell10 |
I'm waiting with bated breath on Clives take on this ......must be coming soon.? [Post edited 8 Feb 2023 12:42]
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| New Signing on 12:43 - Feb 8 with 3108 views | connell10 |
| New Signing on 12:01 - Feb 8 by ngbqpr |
Whole thread getting a bit "what have the Romans done for us?" |
They gave us Jordon Rhodes | |
| AND WHEN I DREAM , I DREAM ABOUT YOU AND WHEN I SCREAM I SCREAM ABOUT YOU!!!!! | | Poll: | best number 10 ever? |
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| New Signing on 12:48 - Feb 8 with 3073 views | daveB |
| New Signing on 09:18 - Feb 8 by PinnerPaul |
I still think if you believe Kelman can do a job for us despite all the evidence to the contrary then you may just as well say that Dykes, in fact our whole team, is good enough for the PL - "if only they were given the chance"
I usually agree with you on most things but this argument is just bizarre.
Lets go with the premise that Ramsey et all haven't got a clue and couldn't spot a good player if they fell over them - are you saying that everyone else who has seen our players play, AT A LOWER LEVEL, or 3 are wrong as well.
Sorry Dave it makes no sense to me. |
I'm not saying Ramsey doesn't have a clue but if they are all right and these players are not good enough why are we buying them?
Some players do well with lower league loans some don't, Darnell Furlong struggled a few times in league 2 but was very good when we finally played him in our team
I'm not saying Kellman can do a job for us I'm saying we simply don't know and to pay for a player, have him for 3 years and he's only played once is a complete failure on the clubs part. Kellman not the only one in this boat. If you keep spending the budget on players and then farm them out across the country you need a plan for what you do when they come back, 3 years in with Kellman and there doesn't seem to be any sort of plan other than loan him out again and hope for the best, if he's not going to make it here why are we paying him and why did we buy him
We then have this situation where you have all these players out on loan and need to make expensive short term signings to ensure we have a competitive first team. That was fine 5/6 years ago, we really shouldn't still be doing it now |  | | |
| New Signing on 13:02 - Feb 8 with 2997 views | PinnerPaul |
| New Signing on 00:07 - Feb 8 by Burnleyhoop |
Martin may well be old, fat and have an arse the size of a small planet, but I suspect his ball control, positional sense and finishing ability is far superior to that of Dykes.
To be honest, I’m almost looking forward to seeing what he can add to our game, as it won’t take much to improve on what we have been enduring of late. |
Right lets kill one myth once and for all - look at the offy signing video - he is NOT 'fat'! | | | |
| New Signing on 13:10 - Feb 8 with 2963 views | PinnerPaul |
| New Signing on 12:48 - Feb 8 by daveB |
I'm not saying Ramsey doesn't have a clue but if they are all right and these players are not good enough why are we buying them?
Some players do well with lower league loans some don't, Darnell Furlong struggled a few times in league 2 but was very good when we finally played him in our team
I'm not saying Kellman can do a job for us I'm saying we simply don't know and to pay for a player, have him for 3 years and he's only played once is a complete failure on the clubs part. Kellman not the only one in this boat. If you keep spending the budget on players and then farm them out across the country you need a plan for what you do when they come back, 3 years in with Kellman and there doesn't seem to be any sort of plan other than loan him out again and hope for the best, if he's not going to make it here why are we paying him and why did we buy him
We then have this situation where you have all these players out on loan and need to make expensive short term signings to ensure we have a competitive first team. That was fine 5/6 years ago, we really shouldn't still be doing it now |
We're going round in circles, but its NOT an unreasonable assumption to make re Kelman, based on the fact that he has done very little in League 2 that he won't do much in the Championship.
Sorry Dave, really don't follow that argument at all.
All clubs do it - Tim at Aston Villa - what are they supposed to do - take a chance on him in the PL or try him out in the Championship first?
OK, you and others some may rail against the loan system, but surely we can all agree, its not unique to us? | | | |
| New Signing on 13:19 - Feb 8 with 2905 views | daveB |
| New Signing on 13:10 - Feb 8 by PinnerPaul |
We're going round in circles, but its NOT an unreasonable assumption to make re Kelman, based on the fact that he has done very little in League 2 that he won't do much in the Championship.
Sorry Dave, really don't follow that argument at all.
All clubs do it - Tim at Aston Villa - what are they supposed to do - take a chance on him in the PL or try him out in the Championship first?
OK, you and others some may rail against the loan system, but surely we can all agree, its not unique to us? |
Kellman is just an example I'm trying to show of a player we have paid for, given a 3/4 year contract and then never played him. He might be good or rubbish I have no idea but when you do that with 9/10 others in the hope that one of them is good then one of them needs to break through and currently none of them are so you end up needing to make desperate loan and free transfer signings to fill the first team whilst continuing to sign these players and never using them
It's a very odd situation. I just think if we had signed Masterson/Kellman any of these on loan they'd have played 20/30 games for our first team and we could say they are decent or crap. If we are willing to do that with loan players from the prem why are we not doing that with players we own and if the answer is it's because the ones we own are crap then perhaps we need to do a bit better with the ones we buy. | | | |
| New Signing on 13:25 - Feb 8 with 2872 views | R_from_afar |
| New Signing on 02:18 - Feb 8 by FredManRave |
No offence meant Davie but, imo, your post is completely missing the point.
I would suggest that, despite the, quite honestly, weird opinion that some fans seem to have on here of believing that other fans hope that we do badly, so they can remonstrate and complain, etc that is not actually the case. Even writing that seems weird. Difference of opinion, ideals, process, etc, maybe but end goal will always be the same for any true QPR fan.
We ALL want what is best for QPR and for us to be successful, even though it's understandable that we have our own differing opinions of "the best" and "successful".
Getting to my main point, ALL the "nay sayers" as some might call them, ALL want CM to do well, play a blinder on Saturday, score the winning goal and finish the season as top scorer.
The angst is not against the player, it's against the fact that we're in a position where we have to sign him.
I think the main issue for most is that we've now been with our current "set up" for over 7 years now!
And where are we? Where is the consistent improvement over time? What have we improved and what consistency in our philosophy have we maintained?
Can anybody really see the clear path that is being maintained within the club that no matter who the manager is they will have to tow the clearly defined line of our recruitment and development policies and won't be allowed to make their own decisions or calls as that would be an exit from the clearly laid out plan that has been set up with a view to steady progression for the last 7 years!
There's not one QPR fan on here that doesn't want us to win on Saturday and have CM score the winning goal off his arse.
But there are many, many fans that are not seeing the progession and devlopment that would be expected after 7 years of a stable hierachy and with all the promises that were made at the very start and they're within their rights to voice those frustrations, quite understandably. [Post edited 8 Feb 2023 2:20]
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Fair enough, we are not where we want to be and our strategy does need to be consistent but you are overlooking the fact that the club has managed to - fairly comfortably up until now, God forbid that should change this season - stay in the division whilst cutting our costs to get us closer to being self-sustaining and keeping us FFP / PS compliant.
Both those things are dull and not the reason why we follow Rangers but they are of vital importance if we want QPR to have a long term future as a professional club.
I think we can do better, I am not saying things are perfect, but comfortably staying up while drastically cutting our playing budget is a minor miracle and I am genuinely impressed that we have done it, not to say eternally grateful. |  |
| "Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1." |
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| New Signing on 13:52 - Feb 8 with 2744 views | kernowhoop |
As far as the central focus of our attack is concerned, we are in a fix.
We now have an answer to see us through to the end of the season.
He brings experience and a full understanding of the league that we compete in.
His signing is a signal that, despite recent set-backs, we still have some ambition for 2022-2023 and he has probably not done much damage to the budget.
When he has scored a couple of goals or has laid off the ball for others to do that, it will all make more sense.
Welcome Chris. We wish you luck. | | | |
| New Signing on 15:35 - Feb 8 with 2421 views | denhamhoop2 |
Not sure about the vitriol over this signing we currently have 1 centre forward at the club who has been in hospital with pneumonia so will be out of action for quite a while. Martin is neither the most mobile or agile of forwards but will give us a focal point in attack and has scored double figures in 5 Championship seasons over his career. Hopefully wages wise he won't be too expensive and most certainly will be a cheaper option than Lowe is. Have always thought he is a better footballer than most give him credit for just hope and with Dykes at the club they can compare notes over who had the worst miss in a career Dykes v Hull or Martin v Us | | | |
| New Signing on 16:13 - Feb 8 with 2265 views | PinnerPaul |
| New Signing on 13:19 - Feb 8 by daveB |
Kellman is just an example I'm trying to show of a player we have paid for, given a 3/4 year contract and then never played him. He might be good or rubbish I have no idea but when you do that with 9/10 others in the hope that one of them is good then one of them needs to break through and currently none of them are so you end up needing to make desperate loan and free transfer signings to fill the first team whilst continuing to sign these players and never using them
It's a very odd situation. I just think if we had signed Masterson/Kellman any of these on loan they'd have played 20/30 games for our first team and we could say they are decent or crap. If we are willing to do that with loan players from the prem why are we not doing that with players we own and if the answer is it's because the ones we own are crap then perhaps we need to do a bit better with the ones we buy. |
I agree its not good we have not brought anyone through BUT the reason Villa are doing it with Tim is the same reason we do it - if they can't make an impression in the league below then they are not going to make it in league(s) above.
Still can't see how if they play 20/30 games in league 2 and do nothing, you think playing 20/30 games in a league 1,2 or 3 levels above will work?
Just don't get the logic - as I've said - everyone does it! | | | |
| New Signing on 16:40 - Feb 8 with 2175 views | essextaxiboy |
| New Signing on 13:02 - Feb 8 by PinnerPaul |
Right lets kill one myth once and for all - look at the offy signing video - he is NOT 'fat'! |
I always used to confuse him with Jon Parkin .... who is fat |  | | |
| New Signing on 16:45 - Feb 8 with 2114 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| New Signing on 12:43 - Feb 8 by connell10 |
They gave us Jordon Rhodes |
Vine. Don't forget the Rowan Vine.
Yeah Reg, that's someone we'd really miss. [Post edited 8 Feb 2023 16:49]
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| New Signing on 17:45 - Feb 8 with 1969 views | thame_hoops |
| New Signing on 12:40 - Feb 8 by connell10 |
I'm waiting with bated breath on Clives take on this ......must be coming soon.? [Post edited 8 Feb 2023 12:42]
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He already did… 9th reply on page 1. |  | | |
| New Signing on 19:13 - Feb 8 with 1789 views | connell10 |
| New Signing on 17:45 - Feb 8 by thame_hoops |
He already did… 9th reply on page 1. |
No he usually does a whole piece on any new signing.....I'm looking forward to this one ...  | |
| AND WHEN I DREAM , I DREAM ABOUT YOU AND WHEN I SCREAM I SCREAM ABOUT YOU!!!!! | | Poll: | best number 10 ever? |
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| New Signing on 19:28 - Feb 8 with 1732 views | RsinWales |
My quick take on things, is it is a decent enough move in the circumstances. If Lyndon is not back for several weeks (a reasonable assumption) then it would be a bit daft to try and battle on with only Lowe and a striker who has never scored a senior goal.
It's a fix until the end of the season and almost essential - if either Lowe or Armstrong get injured we would be horribly exposed.
If we use the players wisely it should permit all three some game time, and hopefully a bit of mentoring for young Sinclair. | | | |
| New Signing on 21:50 - Feb 8 with 1535 views | terryb |
| New Signing on 19:13 - Feb 8 by connell10 |
No he usually does a whole piece on any new signing.....I'm looking forward to this one ... |
Read what he said Jon. He won't be writing a welcome. | | | |
| New Signing on 22:07 - Feb 8 with 1470 views | Hunterhoop |
| New Signing on 08:27 - Feb 8 by TK1 |
They probably just think they can still make the play-offs, which would be transformative.And if they win three games in a row, they probably could - as any of ten teams can. And the manager has no doubt decided that, having coached the team for a couple of months, what is missing is the kind of experienced focal point number nine to hold the whole thing together, like Madine at Blackpool did for him. Everything else is there. Then his one striker he can muddle through with in the role gets pneumonia. Chris Martin became available, I imagine it's cheap, there's no fee, he outperformed any of our strikers last season...seems like an open goal for QPR.
I feel for the club on this. I don't understand the stick. It seems so obvious, an easy win in a difficult situation. If they'd spent big on a younger version that they couldn't afford in the summer they wouldn't have got stick, but they'd have been in bigger trouble. I have a much bigger problem with expensive Premier League loans, not matter how much we love watching Ethan Laird, because that really isn't the stated program and there is a long-term project in that same position. But this is a different thing entirely. Iff it goes well, he may be around next year and if not, well no great expense. He may even help Armstrong score a goal playing off him. |
Yes, I get the short term logic. That simply isn’t how you build an ethos, identity, and long term success. Making short term decisions always seems logical in the short term, and may even bring success in the short term, but the more you focus on the short term, the more you lose sight of the long term and the bigger picture. It is poor leadership. |  | | |
| New Signing on 22:11 - Feb 8 with 1463 views | Burnleyhoop |
| New Signing on 13:02 - Feb 8 by PinnerPaul |
Right lets kill one myth once and for all - look at the offy signing video - he is NOT 'fat'! |
But he is as slow as a cart horse…. | | | |
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