| Young lad in the east stand 11:56 - Aug 31 with 20711 views | BenJ94 |
Saw a young lad leaving the east stand yesterday after the game in a full Manchester United kit. I suppose you can only the parents. If I were a steward, I'd have stopped them from going in.  |  | | |  |
| Young lad in the east stand on 08:06 - Sep 2 with 1711 views | Trundle10 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 07:47 - Sep 2 by jack247 |
Ok, that's the third time you have avoided the question.
If you want to class someone who watches rugby 6-7 times a year as a fan, that is your perogative. That is what the vast majority who you are talking about do.
Cardiffs attendances haven't plummeted to the extent they have to go and play in the Arms Park, whilst being in the top division and the rugby equivalent of the champions league.
You don't think the Swans would sell out the Liberty against Brazil? We more or less do it against Crystal Palace. You are basing that argument on people turning up to see Australia, did they sell out the next home game?
If the 70,000 that go to the Millenium, actually cared about rugby and went to watch their region the following week, you would have a point.
And when have Wales ever been in the doldrums of international rugby? I doubt they have dropped out if the top 10.
And that is before we even look at participation levels. |
Yes these people are welsh and turn out in their numbers to follow Wales. Is that direct enough for you. Are you really comparing the Rabo Pro Direct to the premier league and the heineken cup to the champions league.... Really? Also if Swansea were made to merge with haverford west county and llanelli town. Cardiff city with merthyr and tns and newport county with cwmbran. Would people stop attending.
Lets go lower down then and compare the welsh premier leagues . Port Talbot town v Bala or in rugby Pontypridd v Ebbw vale. Wonder which would garner the most support. |  | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 08:13 - Sep 2 with 1705 views | Dr_Winston |
"Are you really comparing the Rabo Pro Direct to the premier league and the heineken cup to the champions league.... Really?"
They're the highest respective competitions that both clubs can play in. What other comparison could you make? |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 08:58 - Sep 2 with 1669 views | jack247 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 08:06 - Sep 2 by Trundle10 |
Yes these people are welsh and turn out in their numbers to follow Wales. Is that direct enough for you. Are you really comparing the Rabo Pro Direct to the premier league and the heineken cup to the champions league.... Really? Also if Swansea were made to merge with haverford west county and llanelli town. Cardiff city with merthyr and tns and newport county with cwmbran. Would people stop attending.
Lets go lower down then and compare the welsh premier leagues . Port Talbot town v Bala or in rugby Pontypridd v Ebbw vale. Wonder which would garner the most support. |
Right, well if you are classing me as a genuine Welsh rugby supporter, then on your mental criteria you have a point. I don't know when the Ospreys are playing next or the names of half their players, but I'm a genuine fan.
You understand my point, based on week in, week out attendances and participation levels. I understand yours based on lazy racial stereotyping. Let's just agree to disagree. |  | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 09:19 - Sep 2 with 1647 views | Uxbridge |
| Young lad in the east stand on 07:59 - Sep 2 by Dr_Winston |
Doesn't matter.
You said, direct quote: "When Wales were in the doldrums of international rugby you still could not get a ticket for love nor money".
That's clearly not true. Like much of the "Wales is our National Sport" argument. |
I was offered as many tickets as I could handle for the 6 nations and the world cup games. Not surprised they're so readily available given the ridiculous price.
In terms of support, of course the top football clubs are more highly supported, and I gather playing numbers are so heavily skewed towards football that the debate is entirely not worth having. True, at international level, more people (usually dressed with leek hats or pink cowboy hats) attend rugby games but does that make it the national sport? You would think a national sport would be the most highly participated or watched on something more than 5 games a year. |  |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 09:36 - Sep 2 with 1629 views | Whiterockin |
| Young lad in the east stand on 09:19 - Sep 2 by Uxbridge |
I was offered as many tickets as I could handle for the 6 nations and the world cup games. Not surprised they're so readily available given the ridiculous price.
In terms of support, of course the top football clubs are more highly supported, and I gather playing numbers are so heavily skewed towards football that the debate is entirely not worth having. True, at international level, more people (usually dressed with leek hats or pink cowboy hats) attend rugby games but does that make it the national sport? You would think a national sport would be the most highly participated or watched on something more than 5 games a year. |
I don't want to get any further involved in this Football v Rugby debate but it seems much is based on opinion not hard fact. |  | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 09:53 - Sep 2 with 1607 views | Trundle10 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 08:58 - Sep 2 by jack247 |
Right, well if you are classing me as a genuine Welsh rugby supporter, then on your mental criteria you have a point. I don't know when the Ospreys are playing next or the names of half their players, but I'm a genuine fan.
You understand my point, based on week in, week out attendances and participation levels. I understand yours based on lazy racial stereotyping. Let's just agree to disagree. |
The vast majority in wales would not know who swansea are playing next either. I do not know who cardiff city are playing next, or wales football team if i am being honest. Can reel off Swansea fixtures tho. Mine based on attendance and interest throughout the Welsh public. Was just going to suggest the same. Agree to disagree. Enjoyed the debate tho [Post edited 2 Sep 2015 9:59]
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| Young lad in the east stand on 10:31 - Sep 2 with 1559 views | yescomeon |
You're comparing attendances like a bunch of Cardiff fans here. A national sport has nothing to do with attendance at game or number of participants, it is about the cultural significance of the sport. If it were other wise almost all nations in the world would have association football as their national sport. Rugby is the national sport of Wales always will be. The fact that people (myself included) only give a shit about the national team proves nothing. |  |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 10:40 - Sep 2 with 1548 views | Richythejack |
| Young lad in the east stand on 10:31 - Sep 2 by yescomeon |
You're comparing attendances like a bunch of Cardiff fans here. A national sport has nothing to do with attendance at game or number of participants, it is about the cultural significance of the sport. If it were other wise almost all nations in the world would have association football as their national sport. Rugby is the national sport of Wales always will be. The fact that people (myself included) only give a shit about the national team proves nothing. |
Whoops!! looks like i started a good debate on here.
Really though its all about the culture and Wales has a rugby one as proven by the national team and the support they get. I hope this will change as i enjoy going across the border such as cities like Liverpool and Manchester because all they talk about is football. Football is part of the English culture and this is a vast difference in football as a sport between the two countries | |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 10:40 - Sep 2 with 1542 views | perchrockjack |
It could the national sport of some to ridicule whenever possible Welsh rugby or the national team, even wanting them to lose.
Massive inverted snobbery
As regards England, some interest here and in the likes of Leicester, Gloucester but no way rugby England national game even though participation wise (registered players),its the biggest in the world) | |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 11:21 - Sep 2 with 1513 views | jack247 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 10:31 - Sep 2 by yescomeon |
You're comparing attendances like a bunch of Cardiff fans here. A national sport has nothing to do with attendance at game or number of participants, it is about the cultural significance of the sport. If it were other wise almost all nations in the world would have association football as their national sport. Rugby is the national sport of Wales always will be. The fact that people (myself included) only give a shit about the national team proves nothing. |
So it's about something intangible rather than what its inhabitants actually choose to play/watch?
Saying everyone who watches Wales games are rugby fans is like saying everyone who celebrates Christmas is a Christian | | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 11:26 - Sep 2 with 1501 views | Dr_Winston |
Claiming that National Sport status has nothing to do with either attendances or participants is basically a thread ender. We can't go anywhere from there. | |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 11:30 - Sep 2 with 1496 views | jack247 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 10:40 - Sep 2 by perchrockjack |
It could the national sport of some to ridicule whenever possible Welsh rugby or the national team, even wanting them to lose.
Massive inverted snobbery
As regards England, some interest here and in the likes of Leicester, Gloucester but no way rugby England national game even though participation wise (registered players),its the biggest in the world) |
I don't think anybody has ridiculed Welsh rugby or the national team. No-one has questioned their skill or commitment and the type of person who would want them to lose just because they prefer football, is the type of person who would want a Swans player to have a bad game, just because he criticised them on here and it backs up his point.
Ridiculing the plastic national rugby fans who don't have a clue about their local side (of which I am one) is a different matter.
The point is, that it is nowhere near as big as football here in terms of attendance or participation. That is not being disrespectful to rugby at all.
England may have the most registered rugby players worldwide, but like Wales, it will
have a lot more registered footballers. | | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 11:48 - Sep 2 with 1463 views | perchrockjack |
With respect 247, they have. Not on this thread but over the years;I wouldn't want to "embarrass" them.
Its all to do with the coverage rugby gets compared with football especially Swans and I understand the annoyance . I also understand those being bullied to play ar the old rugby only schools. Its wasn't good. I was ordered to play and hated it although I was told I was a natural 10. as I was quick, could kick and was as cocky as feck with the ball.
I refused to play for the school team and played football instead but then went on to play rugby before I got into Speedway. | |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 12:44 - Sep 2 with 1426 views | jack247 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 11:48 - Sep 2 by perchrockjack |
With respect 247, they have. Not on this thread but over the years;I wouldn't want to "embarrass" them.
Its all to do with the coverage rugby gets compared with football especially Swans and I understand the annoyance . I also understand those being bullied to play ar the old rugby only schools. Its wasn't good. I was ordered to play and hated it although I was told I was a natural 10. as I was quick, could kick and was as cocky as feck with the ball.
I refused to play for the school team and played football instead but then went on to play rugby before I got into Speedway. |
Ok. Well I can agree with you in that. I have seen people ridiculing rugby on here in the past and I'm totally with you on that point. I do enjoy the game, though I'd rather watch te Southern Henisphere teams play each other than Wales games, because I am not a hardcore fan and they are far more entertaining.
Nothing against rugby at all. It is not the players fault it is badly supported | | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 12:51 - Sep 2 with 1411 views | Uxbridge |
| Young lad in the east stand on 12:44 - Sep 2 by jack247 |
Ok. Well I can agree with you in that. I have seen people ridiculing rugby on here in the past and I'm totally with you on that point. I do enjoy the game, though I'd rather watch te Southern Henisphere teams play each other than Wales games, because I am not a hardcore fan and they are far more entertaining.
Nothing against rugby at all. It is not the players fault it is badly supported |
Quite. I quite like rugby. I even had a season ticket for the Whites for quite some time. I'm even happy for that franchise to borrow our pitch a few times a year. All good for the city.
However as you say it's possible to enjoy rugby and still see it as a minority sport in Wales. All the more remarkable given the media pushing the myth that we're all a bunch of rugby playing, beer swilling, harmony singing valley dwellers. | |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 13:31 - Sep 2 with 1376 views | yescomeon |
| Young lad in the east stand on 11:21 - Sep 2 by jack247 |
So it's about something intangible rather than what its inhabitants actually choose to play/watch?
Saying everyone who watches Wales games are rugby fans is like saying everyone who celebrates Christmas is a Christian |
Indeed, but christmas is interwoven into the culture of the country, you're kind of making my point for me there. | |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 14:10 - Sep 2 with 1337 views | Phil_S |
| Young lad in the east stand on 07:47 - Sep 2 by jack247 |
Ok, that's the third time you have avoided the question.
If you want to class someone who watches rugby 6-7 times a year as a fan, that is your perogative. That is what the vast majority who you are talking about do.
Cardiffs attendances haven't plummeted to the extent they have to go and play in the Arms Park, whilst being in the top division and the rugby equivalent of the champions league.
You don't think the Swans would sell out the Liberty against Brazil? We more or less do it against Crystal Palace. You are basing that argument on people turning up to see Australia, did they sell out the next home game?
If the 70,000 that go to the Millenium, actually cared about rugby and went to watch their region the following week, you would have a point.
And when have Wales ever been in the doldrums of international rugby? I doubt they have dropped out if the top 10.
And that is before we even look at participation levels. |
And when have Wales ever been in the doldrums of international rugby? I doubt they have dropped out if the top 10.
Which of course is a massive achievement when for so long you would struggle to find 10 nations playing rugby to any decent kind of level... |  | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 14:36 - Sep 2 with 1310 views | Jackanapes |
| Young lad in the east stand on 11:26 - Sep 2 by Dr_Winston |
Claiming that National Sport status has nothing to do with either attendances or participants is basically a thread ender. We can't go anywhere from there. |
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“The stupidest thing she knew was for people to act like they knew all about the things they knew absolutely nothing about.†|
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| Young lad in the east stand on 14:49 - Sep 2 with 1294 views | ScoobyWho |
| Young lad in the east stand on 14:10 - Sep 2 by Phil_S |
And when have Wales ever been in the doldrums of international rugby? I doubt they have dropped out if the top 10.
Which of course is a massive achievement when for so long you would struggle to find 10 nations playing rugby to any decent kind of level... |
Is there a top ten ?
I doubt they could scratch enough countries together to justify it.
Minority sport. Most people who go to Wales internationals haven't got a clue nor do they care about rugby. |  |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 14:52 - Sep 2 with 1291 views | jack247 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 14:10 - Sep 2 by Phil_S |
And when have Wales ever been in the doldrums of international rugby? I doubt they have dropped out if the top 10.
Which of course is a massive achievement when for so long you would struggle to find 10 nations playing rugby to any decent kind of level... |
Fair point. We did cover that bit though with Wales tickets being available in TESCO at the time. In all honesty, I don't follow rugby enough to know how easy it is to stay in the top 10. Like most people in Wales. | | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 14:56 - Sep 2 with 1285 views | jack247 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 13:31 - Sep 2 by yescomeon |
Indeed, but christmas is interwoven into the culture of the country, you're kind of making my point for me there. |
I haven't doubted it is woven into our culture. I completely agree with that.
Male voice choirs, sheep, leeks, daffodils and coal mines are all traditional stereotypes too. None of them really relevant to life in modern day Wales. | | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 15:08 - Sep 2 with 1275 views | morningstar |
| Young lad in the east stand on 14:49 - Sep 2 by ScoobyWho |
Is there a top ten ?
I doubt they could scratch enough countries together to justify it.
Minority sport. Most people who go to Wales internationals haven't got a clue nor do they care about rugby. |
There are 102 countries in the rugby world rankings.
http://www.worldrugby.org/rankings
Click on the full list. It really is hard to imagine some of these countries playing rugby!  |  |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 15:15 - Sep 2 with 1264 views | Trundle10 |
| Young lad in the east stand on 14:10 - Sep 2 by Phil_S |
And when have Wales ever been in the doldrums of international rugby? I doubt they have dropped out if the top 10.
Which of course is a massive achievement when for so long you would struggle to find 10 nations playing rugby to any decent kind of level... |
80s and 90s | | | |
| Young lad in the east stand on 15:17 - Sep 2 with 1258 views | ScoobyWho |
| Young lad in the east stand on 15:08 - Sep 2 by morningstar |
There are 102 countries in the rugby world rankings.
http://www.worldrugby.org/rankings
Click on the full list. It really is hard to imagine some of these countries playing rugby! |
Which is my point. Outside of the big 8 there is little competition. | |
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| Young lad in the east stand on 15:21 - Sep 2 with 1250 views | yescomeon |
| Young lad in the east stand on 14:56 - Sep 2 by jack247 |
I haven't doubted it is woven into our culture. I completely agree with that.
Male voice choirs, sheep, leeks, daffodils and coal mines are all traditional stereotypes too. None of them really relevant to life in modern day Wales. |
Rugby remains relevant in modern day Wales, at least at an international level. A few years of Success for Swansea and Wales isn't going to ingrain Football into the national psyche in the same way that Rugby has been. Maybe with a few decades of success with Wales consistently challenging at the top then maybe but at this point in time Football isn't interwoven into the country in the way that Rugby is, maybe it will be in the future, who knows. | |
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