| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? 23:42 - Oct 16 with 43145 views | jackrabbit |
You'd think so from all the pompous pontification dominating the airwaves in the last few days. Pompous-Prat-in-Chief, Nick Clegg piled in with his fourpennorth today and in true Cleggy style managed to sway me right over onto the side of Evans. I had not given it much thought or had an opinion before - I wasn't that aware of Evans either as a footballer or a person - but I decided to read about the case.
From what I understand he went bed pissed wth a pissed-up 19 year old and sex took place - there was no physical violence. I wasn't there so i don't know the precise details. There was another person involved but he got off relatively mildly - Evans received a hefty jail term.
Now having served his fairly hefty sentence, he is being threatened with denial of his right to earn a living by continuing his career.
Now rape is a foul and terrible crime. However I have problem with some of these situations being described as 'rape'. Without being crass, when does 'persuasive and persistent seduction' carry over into 'rape'? I always thought it was when it was accompanied by force or violence to get your way. I am so glad I'm an old fart and was young when I was young in the 60s and 70s.
Since time immemorial women (and men) have woken up, taken one look at the head on the pillow next to them and instantly regretted the night before. Usually it has been logged under 'big mistake - not to be repeated' and then the person has just gone away and carried on with life. Je ne regrette rien. There was a song about it. Now all too often there is the cry of 'RAPE!' And the inevitable court case. As I say I'm talking generally and not specifically about the Evans case, but I am uneasy about the vilification that's taking place and I certainly see no reason why he should not return to his day job, - playing football.
Let all those who have not had a pissed-up one-night stand with a pissed-up bird, cast the first stone.
I'm now going to brace myself for the abuse! |  | | |  |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:46 - Oct 17 with 3712 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:41 - Oct 17 by Dr_Winston |
Better he earn a living playing football than signing on the dole.
A plumber convicted of sex offences is not barred from installing radiators after he gets released. Not sure why a footballer should be held to higher standards. |
perhaps because young kids don't look up to plumbers in quite the same way nor get the same attention in the media??
It's exactly the same reason why people in the public eye in general are questioned more, whether they be TV celebrities, MPs, whatever. |  | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:51 - Oct 17 with 3701 views | Dr_Winston |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:46 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
perhaps because young kids don't look up to plumbers in quite the same way nor get the same attention in the media??
It's exactly the same reason why people in the public eye in general are questioned more, whether they be TV celebrities, MPs, whatever. |
I would be surprised if any youngsters looked up to Ched Evans.
Whilst I do feel kinda icky defending him, his job shouldn't really have any relevance on how he is treated following release, no matter the public interest. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:52 - Oct 17 with 3695 views | C_jack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:32 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
because they genuinely feel that he shouldn't be allowed to represent the club they support perhaps?
I wouldn't want him near the Swans and don't want him near the Welsh team. |
Sheffield United don't have a support base of 100k. |  |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:54 - Oct 17 with 3683 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:51 - Oct 17 by Dr_Winston |
I would be surprised if any youngsters looked up to Ched Evans.
Whilst I do feel kinda icky defending him, his job shouldn't really have any relevance on how he is treated following release, no matter the public interest. |
That is why I have less strength of feeling about him 'working' for a club than representing Wales. But youngsters (irrespective of whether they should do) look up to footballers, and it does send a tacit 'it's not that bad really' message to impressionable youngsters (a lot of whom have very little moral guidance).
He wouldn't get a job in my company though - tell you that for nothing. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:56 - Oct 17 with 3674 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:52 - Oct 17 by C_jack |
Sheffield United don't have a support base of 100k. |
well we have a twitter following of 273k so do you want to bet on that?? | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:57 - Oct 17 with 3664 views | C_jack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:46 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
perhaps because young kids don't look up to plumbers in quite the same way nor get the same attention in the media??
It's exactly the same reason why people in the public eye in general are questioned more, whether they be TV celebrities, MPs, whatever. |
Parents should be the only role models to their kids, anyone else has no direct responsibility whatsoever.
Kids have nothing to do with this what so ever. You cannot take a child to a ground with all sorts of industrial chants and language coming from the stands, and complain that 11 men on the field should be role models. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:58 - Oct 17 with 3661 views | Dr_Winston |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:54 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
That is why I have less strength of feeling about him 'working' for a club than representing Wales. But youngsters (irrespective of whether they should do) look up to footballers, and it does send a tacit 'it's not that bad really' message to impressionable youngsters (a lot of whom have very little moral guidance).
He wouldn't get a job in my company though - tell you that for nothing. |
You got any decent jobs going in Swansea? 
Certainly International football should be beyond him. I suppose the rest of it depends on how "contrite" he is following release. If he shows genuine remorse and works hard to try and make up for what he did then I can't begrudge him a living doing what he is good at. | |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:59 - Oct 17 with 3658 views | C_jack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:56 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
well we have a twitter following of 273k so do you want to bet on that?? |
I can follow Accrington Stanley's twitter account in 30 seconds, they're not expanding their support base.
Sheffield United's ground holds roughly 30k, so where have the other 70k signatures come from? and with what purpose? | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 21:04 - Oct 17 with 3651 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:57 - Oct 17 by C_jack |
Parents should be the only role models to their kids, anyone else has no direct responsibility whatsoever.
Kids have nothing to do with this what so ever. You cannot take a child to a ground with all sorts of industrial chants and language coming from the stands, and complain that 11 men on the field should be role models. |
some kids unfortunately do not have strong parental role models.
Also footballers have a far wider influence than on just the kids in the ground. If you can't see why it's different for someone being a plumber than I suggest you wonder how many plumbers returning to work get mentioned on the national news or in the national press.
I get it - you don't care - great! But some of us have a different set of values, and ones that are not based on being envious of nights out in Rhyl. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 21:07 - Oct 17 with 3646 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:59 - Oct 17 by C_jack |
I can follow Accrington Stanley's twitter account in 30 seconds, they're not expanding their support base.
Sheffield United's ground holds roughly 30k, so where have the other 70k signatures come from? and with what purpose? |
oh for God's sake - our ground holds 20,700 - we took over 40,000 to Wembley for the playoff final - so what's our support base?
There are more people interested than people who watch Sheffield Utd every week.
As I said - the purpose is that they don't want him to play for the club anymore. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 21:23 - Oct 17 with 3623 views | Starsky |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:41 - Oct 17 by Dr_Winston |
Better he earn a living playing football than signing on the dole.
A plumber convicted of sex offences is not barred from installing radiators after he gets released. Not sure why a footballer should be held to higher standards. |
Yeah but i wouldn't want anywhere near my wife's knicker drawer. |  |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 21:33 - Oct 17 with 3608 views | Spratty |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 20:51 - Oct 17 by Dr_Winston |
I would be surprised if any youngsters looked up to Ched Evans.
Whilst I do feel kinda icky defending him, his job shouldn't really have any relevance on how he is treated following release, no matter the public interest. |
Not even if he was a teacher, policeman, worked in youth care service.
Kids look up to footballers you only have to read the back of their replica shirts. They become role models if we like it or not.
There appears no remorse for what he did, which is pretty damning given the apparent state of her and he came into the room uninvited to take habeas corpus of a non sober naked girl - whilst his 2 pals took a video through the window, regardless of his claim she consented. |  | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 21:33 - Oct 17 with 3608 views | C_jack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 21:04 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
some kids unfortunately do not have strong parental role models.
Also footballers have a far wider influence than on just the kids in the ground. If you can't see why it's different for someone being a plumber than I suggest you wonder how many plumbers returning to work get mentioned on the national news or in the national press.
I get it - you don't care - great! But some of us have a different set of values, and ones that are not based on being envious of nights out in Rhyl. |
No they don't, only the influence that people such as yourself bestow upon them, as the shining light for our youth.
What set of values are those then? one that restricts those who have been imprisoned from returning into society? | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 21:52 - Oct 17 with 3565 views | canhecatchit |
Then if this bloke that slept with this woman with consent was still there, why on earth did he not stop this going on? Surely he should have been done for not stopping it? |  |
| Swansea City, my one and only love , oh and then there's the Wife |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? (n/t) on 22:06 - Oct 17 with 3539 views | jackrabbit |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:16 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
I can only imagine that the accounts that the OP has read of that night are the ones published by his family.
Again I repeat that his supporters have done a phenomenal job at persuading everyone that it was all a bit of a p*ssed up lark.
What actually happened - Evans let himself in to a hotel room that was not his (after persuading the desk clerk or similar to give him a key even though he had no right to it - it wasn't his room - it was his mate's room, who the girl did have sex with and who was acquitted of any wrong doing). He then had sex with a woman that was unconscious and therefore could not possible give consent and filmed it.
That is rape. Full stop. It didn't need to be violent did it - she was unconscious and couldn't resist.
And by the way - persistent seduction (by which I assume you mean failing to accept it when the woman (sorry, 'bird') says no) is rape when the woman says no. It's not that difficult to understand surely. And by saying you're glad you were young in the 60s and 70s - I do hope that you don't mean 'when women were told to shut up and get on with it' if they tried to report rape. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:09 - Oct 17 with 3535 views | Chief |
I wasn't there, so I don't know, but from what i've read, it sounds like Evans has been stitched up.
http://www.chedevans.com/
he was a silly boy yes, and shouldn't have put himself in this position, but from where I'm standing, it stinks. |  |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:12 - Oct 17 with 3528 views | jackb |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 13:10 - Oct 17 by Lohengrin |
He's convinced of his innocence and he's standing his ground. Being convicted by a court is absolutely no guarantee of the truth behind an allegation, we've seen that time and again. Why should he pretend to be remorseful just for a quiet life? That would be rank cowardice, nobody with a backbone would countenance that. |
nobody with a backbone would have sex with an unconscious woman and get his mates to film it |  | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:14 - Oct 17 with 3526 views | Chief |
and banning him from football? what else is he going to do? apply for Tesco? what if they have a petition to stop him from working there too? will people hound him into unemployment? craziness.
if he cant go back to professional football, will be he allowed to play football recreationally? to what standard? its a minefield. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:14 - Oct 17 with 3523 views | jackrabbit |
Too true pal:
"One thing that came out in the debate was an accusation that <name removed> herself had used Twitter, in the run-up to the trial, claiming that she would 'win big' - the inference being that she referred to a possible civil suit, or selling her story to the newspapers. It's been further stated that she had 'tried this before' - made more than one previous accusation of rape against rugby players or other professional sportsmen, allegations which were not sustained. "
But don't tell the sanctimonious prissies on here. Their minds are made up.
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:20 - Oct 17 with 3509 views | Chief |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:14 - Oct 17 by jackrabbit |
Too true pal:
"One thing that came out in the debate was an accusation that <name removed> herself had used Twitter, in the run-up to the trial, claiming that she would 'win big' - the inference being that she referred to a possible civil suit, or selling her story to the newspapers. It's been further stated that she had 'tried this before' - made more than one previous accusation of rape against rugby players or other professional sportsmen, allegations which were not sustained. "
But don't tell the sanctimonious prissies on here. Their minds are made up.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
there's a lot of talk about him having sex with an unconscious girl, wheres this come from?
the girl says she cant remember what happened so she does have a clue whether she was awake or not. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:31 - Oct 17 with 3476 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:09 - Oct 17 by Chief |
I wasn't there, so I don't know, but from what i've read, it sounds like Evans has been stitched up.
http://www.chedevans.com/
he was a silly boy yes, and shouldn't have put himself in this position, but from where I'm standing, it stinks. |
if you look at OJSimpson.com that probably gives an unbiased view of what happened to him as well.
Laughable. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:35 - Oct 17 with 3471 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:14 - Oct 17 by jackrabbit |
Too true pal:
"One thing that came out in the debate was an accusation that <name removed> herself had used Twitter, in the run-up to the trial, claiming that she would 'win big' - the inference being that she referred to a possible civil suit, or selling her story to the newspapers. It's been further stated that she had 'tried this before' - made more than one previous accusation of rape against rugby players or other professional sportsmen, allegations which were not sustained. "
But don't tell the sanctimonious prissies on here. Their minds are made up.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
I'd rather be a 'sanctimonious prissy' than someone who believes that the 'persuasive and persistent seduction of a bird' is anything other than harassment.
And to be fair, it's not our minds that were made up is it - it's the minds of the people that sat on the jury and heard all the evidence and the judge and the people that heard the appeal. You crack on though. It's like an episode of 'Ashes to Ashes' on here. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:36 - Oct 17 with 3467 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 21:33 - Oct 17 by Spratty |
Not even if he was a teacher, policeman, worked in youth care service.
Kids look up to footballers you only have to read the back of their replica shirts. They become role models if we like it or not.
There appears no remorse for what he did, which is pretty damning given the apparent state of her and he came into the room uninvited to take habeas corpus of a non sober naked girl - whilst his 2 pals took a video through the window, regardless of his claim she consented. |
exactly right. The day that a kid walks through a town in this country witt the name of a plumber on the back of their shirt is the day it becomes the same. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? (n/t) on 23:08 - Oct 17 with 3436 views | jackrabbit |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 23:11 - Oct 17 with 3419 views | epaul |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 22:14 - Oct 17 by jackrabbit |
Too true pal:
"One thing that came out in the debate was an accusation that <name removed> herself had used Twitter, in the run-up to the trial, claiming that she would 'win big' - the inference being that she referred to a possible civil suit, or selling her story to the newspapers. It's been further stated that she had 'tried this before' - made more than one previous accusation of rape against rugby players or other professional sportsmen, allegations which were not sustained. "
But don't tell the sanctimonious prissies on here. Their minds are made up.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Sanctimonious prissies aye, I thought he had been convicted of RAPE.Everything before regarding the victim is irrelevant. He raped her end of. Tell you what lets see who you call prissy when you experience and have to live with the consequences of someone close being raped and the damage it causes....irreparable |  |
| The hair and the beard have gone I am now conforming to society, tis a sad day
The b*stards are coming back though |
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