| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? 23:42 - Oct 16 with 43193 views | jackrabbit |
You'd think so from all the pompous pontification dominating the airwaves in the last few days. Pompous-Prat-in-Chief, Nick Clegg piled in with his fourpennorth today and in true Cleggy style managed to sway me right over onto the side of Evans. I had not given it much thought or had an opinion before - I wasn't that aware of Evans either as a footballer or a person - but I decided to read about the case.
From what I understand he went bed pissed wth a pissed-up 19 year old and sex took place - there was no physical violence. I wasn't there so i don't know the precise details. There was another person involved but he got off relatively mildly - Evans received a hefty jail term.
Now having served his fairly hefty sentence, he is being threatened with denial of his right to earn a living by continuing his career.
Now rape is a foul and terrible crime. However I have problem with some of these situations being described as 'rape'. Without being crass, when does 'persuasive and persistent seduction' carry over into 'rape'? I always thought it was when it was accompanied by force or violence to get your way. I am so glad I'm an old fart and was young when I was young in the 60s and 70s.
Since time immemorial women (and men) have woken up, taken one look at the head on the pillow next to them and instantly regretted the night before. Usually it has been logged under 'big mistake - not to be repeated' and then the person has just gone away and carried on with life. Je ne regrette rien. There was a song about it. Now all too often there is the cry of 'RAPE!' And the inevitable court case. As I say I'm talking generally and not specifically about the Evans case, but I am uneasy about the vilification that's taking place and I certainly see no reason why he should not return to his day job, - playing football.
Let all those who have not had a pissed-up one-night stand with a pissed-up bird, cast the first stone.
I'm now going to brace myself for the abuse! |  | | |  |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:55 - Oct 17 with 2588 views | WarwickHunt |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:53 - Oct 17 by NOTRAC |
How about shagging your brothers wife? |
No thanks. My sister-in-law's a munter. |  | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:13 - Oct 17 with 2542 views | JackSomething |
I'd like to propose no more Ched Evans threads, as it all results in is the evidence that a percentage of our supporters are misogynistic and/or ignorant. |  |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:20 - Oct 17 with 2549 views | lifelong |
With Lisa 100% on this.
In life there are certain things you do where you simply cannot go back to the way things were before.
I would suggest that committing the horrific crime of rape would come into that category.
I wonder how those of us with daughters would feel if they went on a night out, had too much to drink and somehow got separated from their friends and ended up in this situation? |  | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:32 - Oct 17 with 2501 views | JackSomething |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:20 - Oct 17 by lifelong |
With Lisa 100% on this.
In life there are certain things you do where you simply cannot go back to the way things were before.
I would suggest that committing the horrific crime of rape would come into that category.
I wonder how those of us with daughters would feel if they went on a night out, had too much to drink and somehow got separated from their friends and ended up in this situation? |
Well said.
I'm amazed from Lisa's posts that his girlfriend's rich father is apparently pouring money into a media campaign to exonerate him. As a father, I'd be personally more concerned if this guy was the kind of man I wanted my daughter to be with. Still, money loves money I suppose. | |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:36 - Oct 17 with 2504 views | monmouth |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:20 - Oct 17 by lifelong |
With Lisa 100% on this.
In life there are certain things you do where you simply cannot go back to the way things were before.
I would suggest that committing the horrific crime of rape would come into that category.
I wonder how those of us with daughters would feel if they went on a night out, had too much to drink and somehow got separated from their friends and ended up in this situation? |
He might not be evil incarnate but based on his actions he is a nasty piece of lowlife sh1t. How anyone can defend him or try to paint his actions as anything but despicable is frankly beyond me. |  |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:42 - Oct 17 with 2493 views | Curcubita_Ultra |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:20 - Oct 17 by lifelong |
With Lisa 100% on this.
In life there are certain things you do where you simply cannot go back to the way things were before.
I would suggest that committing the horrific crime of rape would come into that category.
I wonder how those of us with daughters would feel if they went on a night out, had too much to drink and somehow got separated from their friends and ended up in this situation? |
This ....^^^^^^
Also, apart from if it was a daughter/sister/niece, and regardless of any perceived promiscuity, I wonder if some of the loons would be happy if a man broke into their hotel room and shoved one up trap 2 while they were in a drunken slumber?
Further, if it was a Pakistani taxi driver that had done this the same people would be calling for him to be hanged but because he's a white footballer who plays for Wales it's somehow acceptable....?
Something must be very wrong in the education and parenting system to make young men think it's ok to force yourself onto a woman. I did plenty of stupid things in my youth but when it came to sex I knew the difference between rape and consent. It's basic wrong and right.
Yes, men get falsely accused and that deserves reciprocal prosecution but this utter bulb was arrogant or intoxicated enough to even film himself doing it [Post edited 17 Oct 2014 9:45]
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:43 - Oct 17 with 2490 views | Spratty |
https://www.crimeline.info/case/r-v-ched-evans-chedwyn-evans
To take a very drunken girl back to your hotel room on a one to one to have sex with them is highly questionable.
To let yourself into a room where you know this has occurred and have sex with that girl is another matter altogether, as it seems the jury concluded.
The issue of rehabilitation! is a different matter. However the fact that it appears from comments here that the matter is being made light of might suggest rehab is not what we are looking at. For club and country it is not a good look, nor a good example to youngsters who may look up to these players as gods. |  | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:48 - Oct 17 with 2480 views | Spratty |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:42 - Oct 17 by Curcubita_Ultra |
This ....^^^^^^
Also, apart from if it was a daughter/sister/niece, and regardless of any perceived promiscuity, I wonder if some of the loons would be happy if a man broke into their hotel room and shoved one up trap 2 while they were in a drunken slumber?
Further, if it was a Pakistani taxi driver that had done this the same people would be calling for him to be hanged but because he's a white footballer who plays for Wales it's somehow acceptable....?
Something must be very wrong in the education and parenting system to make young men think it's ok to force yourself onto a woman. I did plenty of stupid things in my youth but when it came to sex I knew the difference between rape and consent. It's basic wrong and right.
Yes, men get falsely accused and that deserves reciprocal prosecution but this utter bulb was arrogant or intoxicated enough to even film himself doing it [Post edited 17 Oct 2014 9:45]
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Agree - although from the case notes I posted (full transcript also attached) it seems like he took 2 other friends with him to the hotel and they stayed outside and filmed it through the window (which suggests they knew what was going on). In some ways this seems worse. | | | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:55 - Oct 17 with 2464 views | Uxbridge |
As this thread demonstrates, there will be many include Chedwyn who genuinely believe that his actions were in no way wrong. That's pretty depressing.
As for his future employment, as a society we either believe in the principle of rehabilitation or we do not. I'd hate to see someone of his ilk at our club, but I don't think it's something you can legislate on. Without wanting to get out the crime hideousness sliderule out, but football hasn't exactly shied away from employing people straight out of gaol who have committed some pretty indefensible acts. Would seem strange to draw the line here and now. |  |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:03 - Oct 17 with 2439 views | skippyjack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:12 - Oct 17 by YrAlarch |
I am struggling to understand why there is such a witch hunt concerning this this young man. Even the news media refer to him as the 'rapist footballer'. He has been found guilty of a serious criminal offence, sentenced to imprisonment, and served the time deemed, by law, appropriate. Surely he is now due the opportunity, like other offenders, to re-integrate into the community, making a positive contribution to society (assuming that is what professional footballers do). I do not recall such a outcry against other footballer offenders, like those who kill others in car crash and then leg it from the scene. Is it not time to allow him to rehabilitate and ply his trade like other ex-cons. |
What about the people on the Breadline? You know.. the one's who are eating from the food banks.. working in a 9-5 and barely 'living' without any convictions.. are people human? Go on Ched boy.. earn a decent living.. while those scroungers on the food banks starve.. you deserve it after all
Society ^.. I'm a fully fledged member of the 'Future Generation Society' in other words.. clean up the mistakes that the 'Older' generation can't quite grasp. [Post edited 17 Oct 2014 10:37]
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| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:06 - Oct 17 with 2416 views | JackSomething |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:55 - Oct 17 by Uxbridge |
As this thread demonstrates, there will be many include Chedwyn who genuinely believe that his actions were in no way wrong. That's pretty depressing.
As for his future employment, as a society we either believe in the principle of rehabilitation or we do not. I'd hate to see someone of his ilk at our club, but I don't think it's something you can legislate on. Without wanting to get out the crime hideousness sliderule out, but football hasn't exactly shied away from employing people straight out of gaol who have committed some pretty indefensible acts. Would seem strange to draw the line here and now. |
Agreed. Leaving aside the morality of the situation, I think he's perfectly entitled to look for a club and it's up to the people in charge of football clubs to decide if they want to employ a convicted criminal. Same as it is for everyone who comes out of jail. The negative publicity will possibly limit his market, but I imagine he'll have far more options than the average ex-con looking for a 'normal' job. As you say, other examples show that some football clubs will forgive pretty much anything you do off the pitch if you play well enough on it.
I would like to see the FAW take a stance on this though and say he won't be considered for international duty. That's not limiting his employment rights, but would show that there are still some morals in football. I'm not holding my breath though. | |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:07 - Oct 17 with 2431 views | Lohengrin |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:36 - Oct 17 by monmouth |
He might not be evil incarnate but based on his actions he is a nasty piece of lowlife sh1t. How anyone can defend him or try to paint his actions as anything but despicable is frankly beyond me. |
He has his defenders, if that's what you want to call it, because the girl in question was no damsel in distress. She had made almost mirror allegations against members of Sale Rugby Club and was stupid enough to brag on Twitter about buying her and her pals matching pink Mini Coopers from her "winnings" before Evans's trial had even reached its conclusion. |  |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:08 - Oct 17 with 2423 views | monmouth |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 09:55 - Oct 17 by Uxbridge |
As this thread demonstrates, there will be many include Chedwyn who genuinely believe that his actions were in no way wrong. That's pretty depressing.
As for his future employment, as a society we either believe in the principle of rehabilitation or we do not. I'd hate to see someone of his ilk at our club, but I don't think it's something you can legislate on. Without wanting to get out the crime hideousness sliderule out, but football hasn't exactly shied away from employing people straight out of gaol who have committed some pretty indefensible acts. Would seem strange to draw the line here and now. |
Although just because a line hasn't been drawn doesn't mean it shouldn't be now.
I would like to see rapists, drunk drivers, killers, gangstas or any other low lifde behaviour disbarred from professional sport. It should be a licensed privilege, not a right, to play sport as a career as it is clearly a position of social influence and responsibility. Professionals have strict ethical guidelines that can lead to their expulsion, and a duty to act in the public interest. Sportsmen should be more so in my view given their public influence over young minds. Let him go and rehabilitate himself serving in B&Q. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:13 - Oct 17 with 2400 views | skippyjack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:07 - Oct 17 by Lohengrin |
He has his defenders, if that's what you want to call it, because the girl in question was no damsel in distress. She had made almost mirror allegations against members of Sale Rugby Club and was stupid enough to brag on Twitter about buying her and her pals matching pink Mini Coopers from her "winnings" before Evans's trial had even reached its conclusion. |
It doesn't matter.. he was convicted.. it's the rules.. the funny thing is.. Evans girlfriend defending him.. and pleading with clubs to sign him.. it's embarrassing.. she's not after the WAG lifestyle is she.. honest to f*ck.. what has this country become. | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:14 - Oct 17 with 2384 views | JackSomething |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:07 - Oct 17 by Lohengrin |
He has his defenders, if that's what you want to call it, because the girl in question was no damsel in distress. She had made almost mirror allegations against members of Sale Rugby Club and was stupid enough to brag on Twitter about buying her and her pals matching pink Mini Coopers from her "winnings" before Evans's trial had even reached its conclusion. |
So because she's no Mother Teresa, she deserved to have someone let themselves into her hotel room and have sex with her while she was unconscious, not to mention have his mates watching and filming the event?
You don't come across as the most enlightened soul on here, but I wouldn't wish such a scenario on you. | |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:15 - Oct 17 with 2348 views | Curcubita_Ultra |
Let's face it, footballers aren't the sharpest tools in the shed at the best of times. A combination of all that money, fast cars, adulation, free time and shit between their ears is a recipe for disaster. Should the clubs have more of a draconian approach like SAF employed? Would that have stopped the likes of Lee Hughes etc...? Is it time for the PFA to enforce a code of behaviour off the pitch?
That aside, I think that too many high profile people in sport politics and the media think they are above the law. To say to a footballer you can kill or rape and do a couple of years in chokey then resume your career sends out the wrong message to players and young supporters. Maybe I'm old fashioned. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:22 - Oct 17 with 2311 views | skippyjack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:08 - Oct 17 by monmouth |
Although just because a line hasn't been drawn doesn't mean it shouldn't be now.
I would like to see rapists, drunk drivers, killers, gangstas or any other low lifde behaviour disbarred from professional sport. It should be a licensed privilege, not a right, to play sport as a career as it is clearly a position of social influence and responsibility. Professionals have strict ethical guidelines that can lead to their expulsion, and a duty to act in the public interest. Sportsmen should be more so in my view given their public influence over young minds. Let him go and rehabilitate himself serving in B&Q. |
Exactly Monmouth.. I'd love a job in B&Q but I'm not skilled enough.. so I'll practically have to work voluntary.. it'll be a nice day when footballers can give up their free time to volunteer.. in Cheds case.. a dose of reality.. to remind him not to be a w*nker for the rest of his life. | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:27 - Oct 17 with 2301 views | skippyjack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:15 - Oct 17 by Curcubita_Ultra |
Let's face it, footballers aren't the sharpest tools in the shed at the best of times. A combination of all that money, fast cars, adulation, free time and shit between their ears is a recipe for disaster. Should the clubs have more of a draconian approach like SAF employed? Would that have stopped the likes of Lee Hughes etc...? Is it time for the PFA to enforce a code of behaviour off the pitch?
That aside, I think that too many high profile people in sport politics and the media think they are above the law. To say to a footballer you can kill or rape and do a couple of years in chokey then resume your career sends out the wrong message to players and young supporters. Maybe I'm old fashioned. |
It's simple.. they have too much time to do what they want.. volunteering In the city.. especially in the NHS can give everyone a lift.. if I walked in and volunteered they couldn't give a monkeys.. but the power a footballer possess.. they can make a huge impact.. | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:33 - Oct 17 with 2289 views | Uxbridge |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:08 - Oct 17 by monmouth |
Although just because a line hasn't been drawn doesn't mean it shouldn't be now.
I would like to see rapists, drunk drivers, killers, gangstas or any other low lifde behaviour disbarred from professional sport. It should be a licensed privilege, not a right, to play sport as a career as it is clearly a position of social influence and responsibility. Professionals have strict ethical guidelines that can lead to their expulsion, and a duty to act in the public interest. Sportsmen should be more so in my view given their public influence over young minds. Let him go and rehabilitate himself serving in B&Q. |
I don't see how you can legally limit it. When it comes to professionals being struck off it generally surrounds their competence, or lack of, to meet the requirements of that profession. Tricky to argue that. There is the role model argument but what parent would ever use a footballer as an example of a role model for their kids?
I dunno. I'd have little sympathy for him if football did bar him, and I certainly wouldn't want him near our club, but it's not an argument you'll ever get 100% of people to agree on. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:36 - Oct 17 with 2284 views | epaul |
I'd never exonate him and hope the bastad rots for what he did, and I have very good grounds to feel this way about him or any other scum rapist. The effect rape has on people is devastating I should know, yet some people are happy for him to carry on for shame on you |  |
| The hair and the beard have gone I am now conforming to society, tis a sad day
The b*stards are coming back though |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:39 - Oct 17 with 2269 views | Uxbridge |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:15 - Oct 17 by Curcubita_Ultra |
Let's face it, footballers aren't the sharpest tools in the shed at the best of times. A combination of all that money, fast cars, adulation, free time and shit between their ears is a recipe for disaster. Should the clubs have more of a draconian approach like SAF employed? Would that have stopped the likes of Lee Hughes etc...? Is it time for the PFA to enforce a code of behaviour off the pitch?
That aside, I think that too many high profile people in sport politics and the media think they are above the law. To say to a footballer you can kill or rape and do a couple of years in chokey then resume your career sends out the wrong message to players and young supporters. Maybe I'm old fashioned. |
That's an issue of sentencing as much as anything though isn't it? I thought his sentence was rather lenient to say the least, as were the likes of Hughes, King and that Plymouth keeper. On the flip side, I'd be very iffy about a society where one strike and you're marked for life. I can think of a few trips we'd have been lucky to recover from 
Guess my point is that I think it's an issue for each club. I would hope our club would take a very strict line on this. Ideally I'd like football fans in general to campaign to ensure no club touches them, however as we've seen with some Sheff Utd fans defending him to the hilt already, it's not very likely. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:43 - Oct 17 with 2260 views | skippyjack |
It's clear to see.. he gets convicted of rape.. the victim splashes out on new wheels and starts boasting.. Then the girlfriend of the convicted rapist starts defending him for his 'cheating' act of 'rape'.. starts pleading for clubs to sign him.. so she can also splash out on new wheels and boast.. F*cking women.. I'm off out for a pint. | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:43 - Oct 17 with 2257 views | Uxbridge |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:22 - Oct 17 by skippyjack |
Exactly Monmouth.. I'd love a job in B&Q but I'm not skilled enough.. so I'll practically have to work voluntary.. it'll be a nice day when footballers can give up their free time to volunteer.. in Cheds case.. a dose of reality.. to remind him not to be a w*nker for the rest of his life. |
If you're not skilled enough for a job in B&Q, then may I suggest learning some skills instead of moaning about how unfair life is? Iesu mawr. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:50 - Oct 17 with 2232 views | skippyjack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 10:43 - Oct 17 by Uxbridge |
If you're not skilled enough for a job in B&Q, then may I suggest learning some skills instead of moaning about how unfair life is? Iesu mawr. |
I question your attitude.. I'm pointing out the reality of it all in one sweep.. is that skill? | |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 11:00 - Oct 17 with 2215 views | MrSwansea |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 01:13 - Oct 17 by Joe_bradshaw |
Absolutely.
That was my point. The jury heard every word of the evidence from both sides and reached their verdict based on that.
That for me is infinitely more reliable than reports that concentrate on the sensational bits and often omit the crucial bits that result in the verdict that the jury reach. |
After my jury service I realised that the Justice System was a complete balls up. I sat on 3 cases, and the people on each case were completely and utterly bullied into decisions and swayed so much by outside factors it was unbelievable.
I am not saying he is 100% guilty, or 100% clean. I am just saying that the justice system is flawed.
Obviously me being the brain box i am, cant think of a better way to do it BUT it is flawed at the moment. | |
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