| Mass murder in Kenya 07:25 - Sep 22 with 22844 views | loftboy |
All in the name of that peacefull religion again |  |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 10:26 - Sep 24 with 2311 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 10:13 - Sep 24 by Pommyhoop |
Indeed . Neither do the young Muslims who dont go to these nice peaceful Mosques but go to the radical ones like Finsbury Park. |
Pommy, if you know about Finsbury Park mosque, don't you think Special Branch (aka Counter Terrorism Branch) know about it, too? |  |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 10:26 - Sep 24 with 2312 views | 1BobbyHazell |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 08:35 - Sep 24 by willis1980 |
I've attended plenty of protests over the years and wouldn't say the figures are as small as your trying to make out, such demonstrations have taken place more than once. The fact is that they've occurred, I can't think of any such demonstrations from the Muslim community, all that springs to mind are idiots burning poppies and that moron dressed up as a suicide bomber. In my eyes it's quite simple don't complain about the fact that the general public may believe that you are tolerant of terrorism if you're not willing to show that you're not. Especially in a time when attacks seem to be on the up and the argument that real Islam isn't like this seems to be wearing thin with a lot of people. |
Good for you for being active in your calls for peace, I have been so for many years and can assure you that active protesters are a very small minority. Read the rhetoric in our most popular newspapers to see how the majority support our genocide, I belive the word 'heroes' has replaced soldier. Not an attack on soldiers by the way, just on how the media have attempted to spin our views on the genocide we commit through the use of emotional manipulation.
As Brian Mcarthy points out, how would you or I know how much the violence is criticised by the Muslim World? I can assure you that our media and the likes of the newspapers I refer to above prefer to highlight and give space to the tiny minority of violent nutters as doing so leads to the fearful, angry scaremongering consciousnesses sadly seen in abundance in this thread. Who does that consciousness suit? Those with the real power who won't be letting one anti war vote in parliament stop their violent plans.
I'm presuming you don't know many/any muslims if you need to see a picture of a protest in a newspaper to prove that they dislike violence as much as you. The ones I know are, without exception, as gentle and mild a fellow human being as you could wish to meet. |  | | |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 10:38 - Sep 24 with 2289 views | Pommyhoop |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 10:26 - Sep 24 by isawqpratwcity |
Pommy, if you know about Finsbury Park mosque, don't you think Special Branch (aka Counter Terrorism Branch) know about it, too? |
You misunderstood me.I was answering Brian who said that We dont know what goes on in the Mosques .For all we know the Imans and Clerics might be condeming this evil radicalised form of Islam. I meant exactly we dont know they might because we dont go to these Mosques .Neither do these young Moslems who are being radicalised in places like Finsbury Park so they are not going to hear this 'condeming' that Brian said might be taking place.If however the Leaders were a bit more vocal these young radical Muslims might realise that the path they are taking has nothing to do with Islam.Muslims read dont they ,watch telly? [Post edited 24 Sep 2013 10:39]
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 10:56 - Sep 24 with 2267 views | willis1980 |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 10:26 - Sep 24 by 1BobbyHazell |
Good for you for being active in your calls for peace, I have been so for many years and can assure you that active protesters are a very small minority. Read the rhetoric in our most popular newspapers to see how the majority support our genocide, I belive the word 'heroes' has replaced soldier. Not an attack on soldiers by the way, just on how the media have attempted to spin our views on the genocide we commit through the use of emotional manipulation.
As Brian Mcarthy points out, how would you or I know how much the violence is criticised by the Muslim World? I can assure you that our media and the likes of the newspapers I refer to above prefer to highlight and give space to the tiny minority of violent nutters as doing so leads to the fearful, angry scaremongering consciousnesses sadly seen in abundance in this thread. Who does that consciousness suit? Those with the real power who won't be letting one anti war vote in parliament stop their violent plans.
I'm presuming you don't know many/any muslims if you need to see a picture of a protest in a newspaper to prove that they dislike violence as much as you. The ones I know are, without exception, as gentle and mild a fellow human being as you could wish to meet. |
sadly the majority of muslims (which arent a whole lot tbh) that I know personally believe the whole thing is a conspiracy and that it has all been orchastrated by the west. which makes debating the issue quite tedious to be honest, especially as its only a matter of time before over compensating (white) people in the room brand you a racist for even daring to broach the subject. throw my 2 mates from the nation of islam into the mix and you really want to give up on the subject all together, after all the NOI believes theres a spaceship circling earth ready to collect the "chosen" people (ie no pale faces).
i just feel that a large show of protest may help put to bed the notion that acts of terrorism are quitly tolerated, especially if it is too large for the media ignore. the media ofcourse do play a part in all of this, however, it isnt the media ordering yong men and women to arm themselves and storm a shopping mall. |  | | |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 11:01 - Sep 24 with 2261 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 10:38 - Sep 24 by Pommyhoop |
You misunderstood me.I was answering Brian who said that We dont know what goes on in the Mosques .For all we know the Imans and Clerics might be condeming this evil radicalised form of Islam. I meant exactly we dont know they might because we dont go to these Mosques .Neither do these young Moslems who are being radicalised in places like Finsbury Park so they are not going to hear this 'condeming' that Brian said might be taking place.If however the Leaders were a bit more vocal these young radical Muslims might realise that the path they are taking has nothing to do with Islam.Muslims read dont they ,watch telly? [Post edited 24 Sep 2013 10:39]
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I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques.
And as for 'us' not knowing what goes on in almost any mosque, unfortunately, I'd think you're wrong. I'd hate to gladden Clive_Anderson's heart (if it could be revived), but I reckon there'd have to be at least one 'informer' in any mosque in the UK, racially PC or not.
Would public Muslim demonstrations help arrest terrorism? It might help arrest the strain between the Muslim/non-Muslim divide, but no way it would diminish the hold radicals have over their potential jihadists. Too easy to talk past that one. | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 11:12 - Sep 24 with 2252 views | Pommyhoop |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 11:01 - Sep 24 by isawqpratwcity |
I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques.
And as for 'us' not knowing what goes on in almost any mosque, unfortunately, I'd think you're wrong. I'd hate to gladden Clive_Anderson's heart (if it could be revived), but I reckon there'd have to be at least one 'informer' in any mosque in the UK, racially PC or not.
Would public Muslim demonstrations help arrest terrorism? It might help arrest the strain between the Muslim/non-Muslim divide, but no way it would diminish the hold radicals have over their potential jihadists. Too easy to talk past that one. |
Sorry I forgot to put in the NOT.
Yes your right Muslim demonstrations might help arrest the strain between the Muslim/non Muslim divide. Small acorns and all that. Doing or saying nothing will certainly not help.
There were bigots on both sides in Northern Ireland who laughed ,threatened and physically attacked the Peace Women who marched under the Not In My Name theme. And there were people scoffing saying nothing will change, the divisions go too deep.
Like I said little acorns and all that. [Post edited 24 Sep 2013 11:14]
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 11:31 - Sep 24 with 2225 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 11:01 - Sep 24 by isawqpratwcity |
I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques.
And as for 'us' not knowing what goes on in almost any mosque, unfortunately, I'd think you're wrong. I'd hate to gladden Clive_Anderson's heart (if it could be revived), but I reckon there'd have to be at least one 'informer' in any mosque in the UK, racially PC or not.
Would public Muslim demonstrations help arrest terrorism? It might help arrest the strain between the Muslim/non-Muslim divide, but no way it would diminish the hold radicals have over their potential jihadists. Too easy to talk past that one. |
"I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques."
No, it wasn't. My point is that we don't know "whether".
And by "we" I meant us on this board, not the British secret service.
There were rumblings in this thread that intimated that Islamic clerics weren't criticising enough, loud enough, or even at all, and my point was that I didn't know whether they were.
As I say, for all we know the prevailing mood may be one of condemnation, and we may have one less thing to worry about.
In the twenty-six counties of Ireland during the seventies and eighties there was an overwhelming majority in favour of a thirty-two county Republic. Only a tiny minority favoured pursuing it through violence. That strong view was reflected wherever people gathered - on the street, in the pubs, and certainly from the alters of both Protestant and Catholic churches.
Not that anyone reading some of the papers in England could possibly have known that, such was the bile and hysteria that was spewed across their pages. For all I know, Islamic people of faith, little faith or no faith at all may feel the same abhorrence of violence, and may condemn it often and loudly. Not that we would know. |  |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:00 - Sep 24 with 2166 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 11:31 - Sep 24 by BrianMcCarthy |
"I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques."
No, it wasn't. My point is that we don't know "whether".
And by "we" I meant us on this board, not the British secret service.
There were rumblings in this thread that intimated that Islamic clerics weren't criticising enough, loud enough, or even at all, and my point was that I didn't know whether they were.
As I say, for all we know the prevailing mood may be one of condemnation, and we may have one less thing to worry about.
In the twenty-six counties of Ireland during the seventies and eighties there was an overwhelming majority in favour of a thirty-two county Republic. Only a tiny minority favoured pursuing it through violence. That strong view was reflected wherever people gathered - on the street, in the pubs, and certainly from the alters of both Protestant and Catholic churches.
Not that anyone reading some of the papers in England could possibly have known that, such was the bile and hysteria that was spewed across their pages. For all I know, Islamic people of faith, little faith or no faith at all may feel the same abhorrence of violence, and may condemn it often and loudly. Not that we would know. |
Firstly, Brian, study logic.
""I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques."
No, it wasn't. My point is that we don't know "whether". "
Your reply means that it is allowing all possibilities.
After that, I do not give a flying f*ck what LFW forum thinks about counter-terrorism as long as they (CTB) are on top of the job. LFW forum? Seriously?
And please, do not drag Northern Ireland into this. It's not similar. Leave it alone. You aren't helping. | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:06 - Sep 24 with 2162 views | Pommyhoop |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 11:31 - Sep 24 by BrianMcCarthy |
"I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques."
No, it wasn't. My point is that we don't know "whether".
And by "we" I meant us on this board, not the British secret service.
There were rumblings in this thread that intimated that Islamic clerics weren't criticising enough, loud enough, or even at all, and my point was that I didn't know whether they were.
As I say, for all we know the prevailing mood may be one of condemnation, and we may have one less thing to worry about.
In the twenty-six counties of Ireland during the seventies and eighties there was an overwhelming majority in favour of a thirty-two county Republic. Only a tiny minority favoured pursuing it through violence. That strong view was reflected wherever people gathered - on the street, in the pubs, and certainly from the alters of both Protestant and Catholic churches.
Not that anyone reading some of the papers in England could possibly have known that, such was the bile and hysteria that was spewed across their pages. For all I know, Islamic people of faith, little faith or no faith at all may feel the same abhorrence of violence, and may condemn it often and loudly. Not that we would know. |
I'm sorry Brian I admit I may of been looking out for it more being a Donegal man born in England but I remember the violence being publicly condemmed by both sides in Northern Ireland. Ive already mentioned the Peace Women and they started back in 79 I think.Also there were Catholic priests ,Bishops as well as Protestant vicars and Reverands who spoke out whether it was on marches ,written articles or political programs on the box. | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:08 - Sep 24 with 2160 views | wood_hoop |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 11:31 - Sep 24 by BrianMcCarthy |
"I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques."
No, it wasn't. My point is that we don't know "whether".
And by "we" I meant us on this board, not the British secret service.
There were rumblings in this thread that intimated that Islamic clerics weren't criticising enough, loud enough, or even at all, and my point was that I didn't know whether they were.
As I say, for all we know the prevailing mood may be one of condemnation, and we may have one less thing to worry about.
In the twenty-six counties of Ireland during the seventies and eighties there was an overwhelming majority in favour of a thirty-two county Republic. Only a tiny minority favoured pursuing it through violence. That strong view was reflected wherever people gathered - on the street, in the pubs, and certainly from the alters of both Protestant and Catholic churches.
Not that anyone reading some of the papers in England could possibly have known that, such was the bile and hysteria that was spewed across their pages. For all I know, Islamic people of faith, little faith or no faith at all may feel the same abhorrence of violence, and may condemn it often and loudly. Not that we would know. |
'Not that anyone reading some of the papers in England could possibly have known that, such was the bile and hysteria that was spewed across their pages. For all I know, Islamic people of faith, little faith or no faith at all may feel the same abhorrence of violence, and may condemn it often and loudly. Not that we would know. '
A well made point, we know just how twisted and biased the press in this country can be, I am no defender of the faith of Islam and think that the arcaic messages it expects its followers to live by cause much anguish when a follower is expected to live in a society that is not perdominantly Muslim, even the different factions of Islam are still causing civil wars, something the Christian church on the whole has managed to eliminate, the taking of lives at least in the name of your God is a thing of the past, something that some followers of Islam seem hell bent on continuing no matter how futile it might be.
I am sure that most Muslims in this country do abhor the violence carried out in their name, they do however have a big PR problem and do not have it seems the required media power to get that message across, how they solve this is not easy and until they do , then the messages recieved by the general populace will stay in the negative. |  | | |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:10 - Sep 24 with 2155 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:00 - Sep 24 by isawqpratwcity |
Firstly, Brian, study logic.
""I think Brian's point was that we don't know that they are NOT condemning terrorism in the mosques."
No, it wasn't. My point is that we don't know "whether". "
Your reply means that it is allowing all possibilities.
After that, I do not give a flying f*ck what LFW forum thinks about counter-terrorism as long as they (CTB) are on top of the job. LFW forum? Seriously?
And please, do not drag Northern Ireland into this. It's not similar. Leave it alone. You aren't helping. |
Yes, my reply does allow all possibilities as I don't know whether or which. No matter.
I mention Northern Ireland because we can learn from it. Of course the two situations are not identical, and it's as neat an anology as I make and comment about from personal experience. Either way, we learn a lot from the past about human behaviour, including our own, including the assumptions that we made or make about other humans.
As for LFW, and whether you care about what the board thinks, fine. I do, or I wouldn't be bothered having a conversation with you all. I learn a lot on here. Mostly about dwarves, true, but still... | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:15 - Sep 24 with 2147 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:06 - Sep 24 by Pommyhoop |
I'm sorry Brian I admit I may of been looking out for it more being a Donegal man born in England but I remember the violence being publicly condemmed by both sides in Northern Ireland. Ive already mentioned the Peace Women and they started back in 79 I think.Also there were Catholic priests ,Bishops as well as Protestant vicars and Reverands who spoke out whether it was on marches ,written articles or political programs on the box. |
Absolutely. I just mentioned the twenty-six because I grew up there and under their institutions. | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:19 - Sep 24 with 2140 views | TheBlob |
I don't really see the need for violence since it would make greater sense to dominate via breeding numbers.There is growing alarm in some countries that there might be a "baby gap" developing and there are schemes encouraging childbirth in strategic areas with cash incentives.(crudely couched in terms of keeping the population steady to provide for an ageing population).There is paranoia afoot. |  |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:26 - Sep 24 with 2131 views | WarfieldHoop |
This will all be over within twenty years. Al-Qaeda is practically finished already, all that remains are offshoots working in different areas all with their own individual motives. Give them enough rope and they will hang themselves.
These things never last. They never fully go away but they all die down eventually. And then there will be something new to plague us with. | | | |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:33 - Sep 24 with 2009 views | TheBlob |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:26 - Sep 24 by WarfieldHoop |
This will all be over within twenty years. Al-Qaeda is practically finished already, all that remains are offshoots working in different areas all with their own individual motives. Give them enough rope and they will hang themselves.
These things never last. They never fully go away but they all die down eventually. And then there will be something new to plague us with. |
Yup.And you can make the Ireland analogy very nicely in as much it was about financial rewards as much as anything else.A Piece Of The Action,and a tasty bit of political respectability for the (former) militant leaders.There were some individuals who did very nicely out of The Troubles,and it'll be the same elesewhere. [Post edited 24 Sep 2013 12:34]
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:33 - Sep 24 with 2006 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:10 - Sep 24 by BrianMcCarthy |
Yes, my reply does allow all possibilities as I don't know whether or which. No matter.
I mention Northern Ireland because we can learn from it. Of course the two situations are not identical, and it's as neat an anology as I make and comment about from personal experience. Either way, we learn a lot from the past about human behaviour, including our own, including the assumptions that we made or make about other humans.
As for LFW, and whether you care about what the board thinks, fine. I do, or I wouldn't be bothered having a conversation with you all. I learn a lot on here. Mostly about dwarves, true, but still... |
No offense, Pommy. I understand that your mention of the Peace Women was an indicator to resolution, not a parallel to the NI situation.
Brian, this thread is a conga line of idiots, without you drawing a direct comparison to NI. (And I'm not decrying your experience there: I thank whatever life-determining entity that I didn't have to go through that.)
I beat Clive_Anderson on a charge of racism last night and he was up and running again within the hour. Some people you can't change. | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:37 - Sep 24 with 1997 views | Cliff |
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-coventry-warwickshire-24208668
Perhaps we should deport all white Anglo-Saxons from a christian background as well?
I truly can't get my head around how someone who has enough intelligence to type in sentences, is also so stupid as to believe that all people of a particular race and/or religion should be punished for the actions of a few. |  | | |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:39 - Sep 24 with 1993 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:33 - Sep 24 by isawqpratwcity |
No offense, Pommy. I understand that your mention of the Peace Women was an indicator to resolution, not a parallel to the NI situation.
Brian, this thread is a conga line of idiots, without you drawing a direct comparison to NI. (And I'm not decrying your experience there: I thank whatever life-determining entity that I didn't have to go through that.)
I beat Clive_Anderson on a charge of racism last night and he was up and running again within the hour. Some people you can't change. |
Jesus, it must be hell in your head. | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:40 - Sep 24 with 1991 views | Cliff |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 23:03 - Sep 23 by SpiritofGregory |
Maybe the Muslim Council of Britain never say anything of any note because deep down they wish for the same in that they want the world to be one big Islamic state. They don't use violence, they use the Western liberal system and financial backing from elsewhere to gain influence and expand.
What do they call it - oh yes Cultural Jihad.
We have too many champagne socialists in the Uk and the rest of Europe who are too busy feathering their own nests to care about the proud heritage of our continent.
I fear that it will all end in tears. |
Or maybe, they don't feel any more responsibility for these mass murders, than you do for the mass murders by Christians, in both the States and, fortunately rarely, here. [Post edited 24 Sep 2013 12:48]
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:45 - Sep 24 with 1975 views | willis1980 |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:08 - Sep 24 by wood_hoop |
'Not that anyone reading some of the papers in England could possibly have known that, such was the bile and hysteria that was spewed across their pages. For all I know, Islamic people of faith, little faith or no faith at all may feel the same abhorrence of violence, and may condemn it often and loudly. Not that we would know. '
A well made point, we know just how twisted and biased the press in this country can be, I am no defender of the faith of Islam and think that the arcaic messages it expects its followers to live by cause much anguish when a follower is expected to live in a society that is not perdominantly Muslim, even the different factions of Islam are still causing civil wars, something the Christian church on the whole has managed to eliminate, the taking of lives at least in the name of your God is a thing of the past, something that some followers of Islam seem hell bent on continuing no matter how futile it might be.
I am sure that most Muslims in this country do abhor the violence carried out in their name, they do however have a big PR problem and do not have it seems the required media power to get that message across, how they solve this is not easy and until they do , then the messages recieved by the general populace will stay in the negative. |
basically what i was trying to say but put better  | | | |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:56 - Sep 24 with 1960 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 12:39 - Sep 24 by BrianMcCarthy |
Jesus, it must be hell in your head. |
No, why? | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 13:09 - Sep 24 with 1936 views | BrianMcCarthy |
You sounded tortured! | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 13:11 - Sep 24 with 1926 views | TheBlob |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 13:09 - Sep 24 by BrianMcCarthy |
You sounded tortured! |
Well he is,all that living upside down bound to have an effect eventually. | |
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| Mass murder in Kenya on 13:12 - Sep 24 with 1926 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Mass murder in Kenya on 13:09 - Sep 24 by BrianMcCarthy |
You sounded tortured! |
I've just gone back through our conversation and cannot see what you are talikng about. | |
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