| David Davis on 20:27 - Jul 9 with 2834 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
I'm die hard Labour and have no interest in them or their kind but I am 100% for getting out of the EU
It's only been the Remainers that have made any noise since the vote but that does not mean there will not be a hell of a lot of trouble on every level of politics if it does not happen, all credibility will be lost.
They barely have any now. [Post edited 9 Jul 2018 20:29]
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| David Davis + Boris on 20:57 - Jul 9 with 2765 views | Tonto |
"Only remainers have made noise"?
I can only assume you have been deaf to all the deafening noise made by the hard brexiteers then. Jacob Rhys Mogg alone has been spouting the hard Brexit matra loud enough to drown out a Metalicca concet! |  |
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| David Davis + Boris on 21:02 - Jul 9 with 2744 views | aston_hoop |
Jeremy Hunt new foreign secretary. Helped make a mess of the health service so obviously well worth keeping in a key role?? Its like there is someone out there laughing at us all. |  |
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| David Davis on 21:17 - Jul 9 with 2707 views | CiderwithRsie |
| David Davis on 15:41 - Jul 9 by hopphoops |
Every time I come close to commenting I give up. I find it all so massively depressing. |
....is the correct answer! Well done. |  | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 21:32 - Jul 9 with 2660 views | easthertsr |
When Norths kept going on last year after the election of how May won lots of us could see that she was mortally wounded and it could only end one way. Yes she got the most votes but the fallout of that election stands all over today's events. You cannot square a circle, as she didn't get a majority to back her she has hung on and on until today shows the Tories are utterly split over Europe. The Brexit vote can only go again back to the people, no-one predicted the complete, shambolic incompetence of how things have panned out, we all deserve to reassert our say on this vital decision. [Post edited 9 Jul 2018 21:36]
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| David Davis + Boris on 21:49 - Jul 9 with 2626 views | QPR_John |
| David Davis + Boris on 21:32 - Jul 9 by easthertsr |
When Norths kept going on last year after the election of how May won lots of us could see that she was mortally wounded and it could only end one way. Yes she got the most votes but the fallout of that election stands all over today's events. You cannot square a circle, as she didn't get a majority to back her she has hung on and on until today shows the Tories are utterly split over Europe. The Brexit vote can only go again back to the people, no-one predicted the complete, shambolic incompetence of how things have panned out, we all deserve to reassert our say on this vital decision. [Post edited 9 Jul 2018 21:36]
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If we have to have a second referendum, unusual for the EU if they don't get the right answer in the first, lets get the rules spelt out first. What happens for instance if it is a 52 48 split for staying in. [Post edited 9 Jul 2018 21:50]
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| David Davis + Boris on 22:01 - Jul 9 with 2589 views | easthertsr |
| David Davis + Boris on 21:49 - Jul 9 by QPR_John |
If we have to have a second referendum, unusual for the EU if they don't get the right answer in the first, lets get the rules spelt out first. What happens for instance if it is a 52 48 split for staying in. [Post edited 9 Jul 2018 21:50]
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No-one who voted two years ago could see the complete pig's ear that has occurred over the time since. When the final deal or no deal happens then it must be put to all of us to decide yes or no. | | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 22:20 - Jul 9 with 2554 views | CiderwithRsie |
| David Davis + Boris on 21:02 - Jul 9 by aston_hoop |
Jeremy Hunt new foreign secretary. Helped make a mess of the health service so obviously well worth keeping in a key role?? Its like there is someone out there laughing at us all. |
You ain't seen nothing yet.
Hunt's halfway competent and it's not all his fault the NHS is a mess, he might be OK as Foreign Sec.
But the new Health Sec is Matt Hancock and everyone who has ever met him seems to think he's the biggest end of a bell in Parliament, including Big Ben. | | | |
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| David Davis + Boris on 22:23 - Jul 9 with 2551 views | colinallcars |
| David Davis + Boris on 22:20 - Jul 9 by CiderwithRsie |
You ain't seen nothing yet.
Hunt's halfway competent and it's not all his fault the NHS is a mess, he might be OK as Foreign Sec.
But the new Health Sec is Matt Hancock and everyone who has ever met him seems to think he's the biggest end of a bell in Parliament, including Big Ben. |
Theyare down to the barrel-scrapings now. Basically the Tory party is a party of back benchers. |  | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 22:48 - Jul 9 with 2500 views | QPR_John |
| David Davis + Boris on 22:01 - Jul 9 by easthertsr |
No-one who voted two years ago could see the complete pig's ear that has occurred over the time since. When the final deal or no deal happens then it must be put to all of us to decide yes or no. |
Negotiation is an event between two parties who want different things who realise they must make concessions to the other party to reach a conclusion. Brussels do not want to make any concessions and are emboldened by the fact that the majority of the other side, the UK parliament, want the same thing as themselves. It is not a pigs ear as the whole thing is working perfectly for the establishment here and in Brussels | | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:05 - Jul 9 with 2470 views | kensalriser |
| David Davis + Boris on 22:48 - Jul 9 by QPR_John |
Negotiation is an event between two parties who want different things who realise they must make concessions to the other party to reach a conclusion. Brussels do not want to make any concessions and are emboldened by the fact that the majority of the other side, the UK parliament, want the same thing as themselves. It is not a pigs ear as the whole thing is working perfectly for the establishment here and in Brussels |
The EU doesn't want any of this. It didn't call the referendum, doesn't want the UK to leave and recognises that there will only be losers. |  |
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| David Davis + Boris on 23:10 - Jul 9 with 2462 views | QPR_John |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:05 - Jul 9 by kensalriser |
The EU doesn't want any of this. It didn't call the referendum, doesn't want the UK to leave and recognises that there will only be losers. |
Exactly so why is everybody still talking about negotiations there is no negotiation and never will be. Both major parties here want to stay in the EU, the EU wants us to stay, but nobody is prepared to say they want to ignore the referendum, democracy and all that, so they are all busy making sure we stay in without being accused of doing that very thing. | | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:29 - Jul 9 with 2419 views | kensalriser |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:10 - Jul 9 by QPR_John |
Exactly so why is everybody still talking about negotiations there is no negotiation and never will be. Both major parties here want to stay in the EU, the EU wants us to stay, but nobody is prepared to say they want to ignore the referendum, democracy and all that, so they are all busy making sure we stay in without being accused of doing that very thing. |
Arguably the most sensible option behind simply not leaving. | |
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| David Davis + Boris on 23:39 - Jul 9 with 2404 views | SydneyRs |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:35 - Jul 9 by Stanisgod |
I assume then the 48 have a whinge cos they lost and we have another vote  |
Based on the logic of the "will of the people" argument we keep hearing, whoever wins the next general election should govern for the rest of time. Even if it by a very small margin. | | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:54 - Jul 9 with 2381 views | essextaxiboy |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:10 - Jul 9 by QPR_John |
Exactly so why is everybody still talking about negotiations there is no negotiation and never will be. Both major parties here want to stay in the EU, the EU wants us to stay, but nobody is prepared to say they want to ignore the referendum, democracy and all that, so they are all busy making sure we stay in without being accused of doing that very thing. |
Both partys want to stay in ?
They both ran on manifestos that committed to take us out . Corbyn has been anti EU for decades .
You cant ignore the vote , parliament voted by a big majority to devolve this decision to the electorate . Even for remainers it would undermine our democracy . One person one vote and abide by the result . I for one would never vote again , I would be able to demonstrate with facts that there is little point . |  | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:54 - Jul 9 with 2379 views | Sharpy36 |
The UK leaving the EU is equivalent to 19 of the smaller nations all upping sticks and leaving at the same time. So we have always held the upper hand in any negotiations but barely have we shown any appetite to wield this clear advantage. Two points for me, firstly the divorce payment was clearly put on the table far to early. and secondly if i had my way we would have left on the 23rd June 2017. |  |
| 'You didn't know that was wrong, but now you do. If you do it again, I'll know you are doing it on purpose.' |
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| David Davis on 23:56 - Jul 9 with 2378 views | WanderR |
| David Davis on 11:21 - Jul 9 by CiderwithRsie |
Not keen on getting into Brexit debates here, but here's a question for everyone to satisfy my curiosity:
What do people think of EFTA (which we were in before we went into the Common Market)? Good idea? Bad idea? Never heard of it? |
Not the optimal outcome but I'd bite your arm off for it if the only alternative is Mrs May's current clusterfudge. |  |
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| David Davis + Boris on 23:59 - Jul 9 with 2369 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:35 - Jul 9 by Stanisgod |
I assume then the 48 have a whinge cos they lost and we have another vote |
Things were going so well.
Have you read any of the last three pages?
Such a variety of opinion shared and you string everyone into one band as the 48. You be labelling all 16m people remoaners next.
I am in the 48% and don't want another vote. The party I vote / work for is backing Brexit despite campaigning against it. As is the Tory party. Most sane Labour voters don't want another vote despite being nearly 70% remain voters.
My missus voted leave and I still make her a cup of tea every morning.
Stop the snideness. |  | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 00:02 - Jul 10 with 2364 views | Sharpy36 |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:39 - Jul 9 by SydneyRs |
Based on the logic of the "will of the people" argument we keep hearing, whoever wins the next general election should govern for the rest of time. Even if it by a very small margin. |
It`s how Referendums work. Maybe in 40 years time we can have a third one. Although the EU wont be around, perhaps some other entity perhaps something like the Common market perhaps ? | |
| 'You didn't know that was wrong, but now you do. If you do it again, I'll know you are doing it on purpose.' |
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| David Davis + Boris on 00:54 - Jul 10 with 2337 views | timcocking |
What a complete clusterfcuk. |  | | |
| David Davis on 03:53 - Jul 10 with 2295 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| David Davis on 14:14 - Jul 9 by CiderwithRsie |
I'm a classic Remainer but I don't agree with this at all. Some people didn't understand, but that's true in every vote and it was as bad on both sides.
Problem is that for Remain some people were keen, some were "meh" but everyone voted for the same thing. But for Leave there was a coalition - some wanted to stop immigration, some to get sovereignty, some to stop globalisation, some to open up trade with the USA etc. Arguably you can do all of those things with Brexit, but you can't do all of them at the same time and everything follows from that.
It's like having a poll on here to sack McClaren: Yes or No? If 52% vote Yes it doesn't mean people will like the new coach or that anyone decent would come here. |
Hard to disagree! Lord knows if that which has been discussed here continued for two more pages, we'll probably arrive at the solution.
The growing worry post-Brexit, was that if this was the best we could do negotiating from a relatively strong position at the outset, then heaven help us when we got down to some real trade deals.
The world had become fixated with trade deals, and invariably its the workers who must face the squeeze to accommodate them, and the customers to pay for them.
None of the advantages of globalisation and digitalisation have been fairly shared. The banking crisis of 2008 and the resulting measures to fix it (not that we have) did not see anything like the burden to do so fairly spread, much less those responsible being held to account for creating the mess. Cider is right, 'globalisation' is at the root of a lot of peoples' angst whether they know it or not!
Although he might be a monstrous knob, Farage did say one thing that is hard to disagree with: there is nothing the EU does that a few well drafted and agreed trade deals would not achieve! Something that seems beyond this government.
#clusterfukscominghome |  |
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| David Davis + Boris on 05:55 - Jul 10 with 2284 views | Watford_Ranger |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:39 - Jul 9 by SydneyRs |
Based on the logic of the "will of the people" argument we keep hearing, whoever wins the next general election should govern for the rest of time. Even if it by a very small margin. |
Both Will and the people knew exactly what Brexit meant and it’s only right that those paid to be informed and make the best decisions bottle it to allow Will and the people to decide. Two years along, Will knows good times are ahead though he still can’t point to any tangible benefits. Something about fish though. | | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 06:35 - Jul 10 with 2252 views | distortR |
| David Davis + Boris on 23:54 - Jul 9 by essextaxiboy |
Both partys want to stay in ?
They both ran on manifestos that committed to take us out . Corbyn has been anti EU for decades .
You cant ignore the vote , parliament voted by a big majority to devolve this decision to the electorate . Even for remainers it would undermine our democracy . One person one vote and abide by the result . I for one would never vote again , I would be able to demonstrate with facts that there is little point . |
i last voted decades ago, on a single issue one party had talked about in their manifesto, on getting in they did a turn about on that issue.
it is my contention that the manifesto should be akin to a contract.
Re - brexit, People were asked to vote on an issue without knowing what they were voting for, you can't blame the people for voting, the fault is with our inept and weak 'leaders'.
I get fed up with the sometimes sneering attitude to, generally, deprived northern areas that voted to leave, areas that have been let down for decades while our leaders offer no real change. Why would they ever vote for more of the same? | | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 07:39 - Jul 10 with 2195 views | derbyhoop |
Through all the resignation letters, and it wasn't just Davis and Boris, nobody has come up with an alternative plan.
And that's a summary of what The Washington Post said.
In effect, happy to stand on the sidelines carping, but unable to offer any viable solution. |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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