| Good Luck UK 12:13 - Dec 12 with 65853 views | PlanetHonneywood |
For the Eze, not the Pugh!
#votewarburton
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| Good Luck UK on 11:13 - Dec 15 with 2023 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| Good Luck UK on 11:06 - Dec 15 by QPR_John |
"Andrew Neil, Michael Portillo Alan Johnson talked a lot of sense. "
Maybe the reason the BBC dropped it |
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| Good Luck UK on 11:34 - Dec 15 with 1993 views | Hunterhoop |
| Good Luck UK on 00:42 - Dec 15 by BazzaInTheLoft |
I would agree with part of that, which is the LP membership and the electorate are at odds. However I think a Party should convince the electorate, not the other way round.
However this is where we disagree: the one thing this election has proven is that there is no 'broad electorate'. While I don't think Labour are anything other than a mild Social Democrat party they are percieved as 'Hard Left'. The Tories are perceived, probably rightly, as a English Nationalist party which they had to become to swallow the dangerous UKIP / BP vote.
Between them, the 'Hard Left' and 'Hard Right' parties took 77% of the overall vote, and the middle ground Lib Dems took 11%.
If Centrism (and Remainism) was so popular, the LDs would have been a major player in this election. But they barely put 4% on.
Something to note though, if we had a PR parliament like most European countries. Jeremy would be the prime minister in charge of a coalition that had 60% of the seats.
[Post edited 15 Dec 2019 0:56]
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Glad someone has worked this out. It’s an important point to make about our electoral system. However, 2 points:
1) Corbyn would not be prime minister of a left coalition; Starmer would. At a push Jess Philips. The Greens, SNP, and LDs categorically would not back a Corbyn premiership. You need a genuine leader who can unite the opposition and centre left, not a ridiculously stubborn bloke with terrible approval ratings across the electorate (as opposed to the LP membership).
2) Part of the reason we don’t have a form of PR is because Labour never pushed through electoral reform whilst in power (unsurprising as no one does), but not did they campaign hard for it when it was put to a referendum. It was a staggering example of a lack of foresight.
The only people who benefit for FPTP are the Tories. It’s been apparent for decades. Corbyn still wasn’t taking about it seriously in the last two elections. So short sighted.
Ultimately the LP leadership got their strategy all wrong, as did Swinson. Both were staggeringly stupid and got the tone of their pitch all wrong. They got what they deserved.
I’m hugely disappointed at the result as a social democrat, but I can accept it’s the fault of the parties that more closely represent me (LD, then Lab), not the electorate. Corbyn, McDonnell and Momemtum are p*ssing me off even more by continuing to show they are simply not listening to the public. You can’t implement any policies to help anyone unless you have power or a share of it.
Life is about compromise. It’s a necessary part of functioning as anything but an individual. The Lab party need to realise this. Alan Johnson was spot on. If Lab fail to listen they will be in the wilderness for decades and we’ll have no effective opposition for a Tory govt. That is not good for the country. Don’t become like the Tory party; put the country before the party! [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 11:48]
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| Good Luck UK on 12:10 - Dec 15 with 1951 views | francisbowles |
| Good Luck UK on 00:11 - Dec 15 by WEAREAWFUL |
Sorry baz but surely you mean a len mccluskey rigged election?!!! |
I think you missed out the word allegedly! |  | | |
| Good Luck UK on 12:16 - Dec 15 with 1948 views | Watford_Ranger |
| Good Luck UK on 11:08 - Dec 15 by stevec |
The main problem, which of these policies could any worker earning more than £10 an hour say to themselves ‘that’ll make me better off’. None of them which is one of the reasons why the North of England joined the South of England in turning their backs on you.
In the end the clincher was both Liberal and Labours scant understanding of democracy. If you’d accepted Theresa Mays sell out on Brexit, you’d probably have won a general election in 2022.
You defied democracy and paid the price. |
Presumably the ones which most people support would be quite popular. | | | |
| Good Luck UK on 12:29 - Dec 15 with 1938 views | wood_hoop |
| Good Luck UK on 11:34 - Dec 15 by Hunterhoop |
Glad someone has worked this out. It’s an important point to make about our electoral system. However, 2 points:
1) Corbyn would not be prime minister of a left coalition; Starmer would. At a push Jess Philips. The Greens, SNP, and LDs categorically would not back a Corbyn premiership. You need a genuine leader who can unite the opposition and centre left, not a ridiculously stubborn bloke with terrible approval ratings across the electorate (as opposed to the LP membership).
2) Part of the reason we don’t have a form of PR is because Labour never pushed through electoral reform whilst in power (unsurprising as no one does), but not did they campaign hard for it when it was put to a referendum. It was a staggering example of a lack of foresight.
The only people who benefit for FPTP are the Tories. It’s been apparent for decades. Corbyn still wasn’t taking about it seriously in the last two elections. So short sighted.
Ultimately the LP leadership got their strategy all wrong, as did Swinson. Both were staggeringly stupid and got the tone of their pitch all wrong. They got what they deserved.
I’m hugely disappointed at the result as a social democrat, but I can accept it’s the fault of the parties that more closely represent me (LD, then Lab), not the electorate. Corbyn, McDonnell and Momemtum are p*ssing me off even more by continuing to show they are simply not listening to the public. You can’t implement any policies to help anyone unless you have power or a share of it.
Life is about compromise. It’s a necessary part of functioning as anything but an individual. The Lab party need to realise this. Alan Johnson was spot on. If Lab fail to listen they will be in the wilderness for decades and we’ll have no effective opposition for a Tory govt. That is not good for the country. Don’t become like the Tory party; put the country before the party! [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 11:48]
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'I’m hugely disappointed at the result as a social democrat, but I can accept it’s the fault of the parties that more closely represent me (LD, then Lab), not the electorate. Corbyn, McDonnell and Momemtum are p*ssing me off even more by continuing to show they are simply not listening to the public. You can’t implement any policies to help anyone unless you have power or a share of it.'
'Life is about compromise. It’s a necessary part of functioning as anything but an individual. The Lab party need to realise this. Alan Johnson was spot on. If Lab fail to listen they will be in the wilderness for decades and we’ll have no effective opposition for a Tory govt. That is not good for the country. Don’t become like the Tory party; put the country before the party!'
Great post Hunterhoop,
You have put exactly how I feel, your post is far more coherent than I could ever have ever put.
One point I would like to put forward is that Brexit was such a dominating factor that it
overshadowed much of the manifesto that the LP had put out.
Must have put a bit of the 'shits' up Johnson and the rest of the 'Im alright Jacks' though,
suddenly austerity is over and some of the desperatly needed social funding is now on Tory lips and being touted as part of the 'One Nation'
But we will see just what Tories come up with and how much change will actually occur, by the time of the next election comes round, just who will get the blame if they revert back to type and piss all over those not near the top of the social spectrum. |  | | |
| Good Luck UK on 12:35 - Dec 15 with 1925 views | nix |
| Good Luck UK on 11:34 - Dec 15 by Hunterhoop |
Glad someone has worked this out. It’s an important point to make about our electoral system. However, 2 points:
1) Corbyn would not be prime minister of a left coalition; Starmer would. At a push Jess Philips. The Greens, SNP, and LDs categorically would not back a Corbyn premiership. You need a genuine leader who can unite the opposition and centre left, not a ridiculously stubborn bloke with terrible approval ratings across the electorate (as opposed to the LP membership).
2) Part of the reason we don’t have a form of PR is because Labour never pushed through electoral reform whilst in power (unsurprising as no one does), but not did they campaign hard for it when it was put to a referendum. It was a staggering example of a lack of foresight.
The only people who benefit for FPTP are the Tories. It’s been apparent for decades. Corbyn still wasn’t taking about it seriously in the last two elections. So short sighted.
Ultimately the LP leadership got their strategy all wrong, as did Swinson. Both were staggeringly stupid and got the tone of their pitch all wrong. They got what they deserved.
I’m hugely disappointed at the result as a social democrat, but I can accept it’s the fault of the parties that more closely represent me (LD, then Lab), not the electorate. Corbyn, McDonnell and Momemtum are p*ssing me off even more by continuing to show they are simply not listening to the public. You can’t implement any policies to help anyone unless you have power or a share of it.
Life is about compromise. It’s a necessary part of functioning as anything but an individual. The Lab party need to realise this. Alan Johnson was spot on. If Lab fail to listen they will be in the wilderness for decades and we’ll have no effective opposition for a Tory govt. That is not good for the country. Don’t become like the Tory party; put the country before the party! [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 11:48]
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Great post. |  | | |
| Good Luck UK on 12:36 - Dec 15 with 1922 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
Me me me
I got called a Tory on here many a time from a few and Bazz, I'm not. but they refused to listen to me or my like.
I'm what a lot of those that voted Tory (I did not vote) this time were/are
Labour leave voters and like them, not far left and not Blairites.
Very tricky ground in where they go next, I don't have a party as things stand and I think those that lent their vote don't.
Momentum was chucking abuse at what should have been their own Labour votes, you saw that on here, a micro version of what was going on in the real world. [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 12:37]
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| Good Luck UK on 13:34 - Dec 15 with 1856 views | charmr |
Touch peoples taxes, fags and beer and you’ll never win an election. Here in the US no one touches the gas/petrol prices, they know better.
I don’t understand why basic needs like heat and light need to be run by companies answering to shareholders.
Or why not have a central bank with fair interest rates that puts money into the treasury for public spending. This working to pay bills with over inflated prices on bricks and mortar sounds more like modern slavery to me. What the fcuk is wrong with a four day week. Automation is on its way as companies will lay off workers. I’m all for private enterprise I here, well Govt funding in institutions are the wealth creators not poxy Walmart.
We’re born and are idealistic, then the system grinds us down causing apathy and cynicism and we all seem ok with that. Blatant lying is now wholly acceptable.
Check out Andrew Yang, it’s an interesting perspective. Sadly way too out there,and would freak out anyone who doesn’t like change. [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 14:10]
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| Good Luck UK on 13:52 - Dec 15 with 1822 views | Northernr |
| Good Luck UK on 01:55 - Dec 15 by Jigsore |
it's not an excuse to say general media has been a disgrace this election. I don't even think it's the main factor. you've also managed not to mention Brexit at all which I find astounding.
The only Governments we have had for a long time now are ones given the blessing of Rupert Murdoch. You cannot ignore that. There is no f*cking point in a 'proper opposition' if it's just changing the colour of the walls after whoever the previous incumbent is burns out. an Opposition who just accept everything the Conservatives and aren't willing to reform aren't a proper opposition. And you can dance to Murdoch's tune if you want but as long as the Conservatives aren't too badly damaged goods they will find a way to monster you. JFK would be as unpopular as Jimmy Saville in 4 years too.
Labour do need to find someone more appealing to the electorate in general that much is obvious. If it wasn't so important i'd actually enjoy a Jess Phillips leadership just to see genuine shock on her daft mug when she realises The Times only like her because they can rely on her to publicly take a crap on the Corbyn cabinet. It needs be someone with broad appeal... maybe Angela Raynor. The moderates can cry all they like about Corbyn but frankly they challenged him in 2016 and the best they could come up with was Owen Smith, a nobody that will not even be a footnote in british history.
the positive I would take from this election if I was Labour is a) when presented in a vacuum to people a lot of their policies like higher rate of tax for the super rich and some degree of nationalisation were actually reasonably popular (yougov) and b) for the first time in many years they actually have a large amount of mostly younger activists who are willing to volunteer time and give money to the party, a part of politics Blair strangled the life out of. They need to use that to their advantage. [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 1:58]
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You're right I haven't mentioned Brexit, because I can already feel the Momentum lot trying to form this narrative that actually Magic Grandpa wasn't the problem, the manifesto was popular, people love the policies, if it was proportional representation we'd be in a better place and the only problem was Brexit. So if we just carry on down this road, get Corbyn 2.1 in as leader, let the Tories mess up Brexit, then next time people will come round to their way of thinking.
And I despair at this.
I'm up north this weekend for our match, staying with my parents. They're from working class families, dad's family were steel workers, mum and now step dad's parents were railway workers, so all Labour and unions. My mum has probably moved herself into upper middle class now, retired when my dad died, married a richer guy. They live in one of these northern wards that's always been Labour, always really should be Labour given what the Tories have done to it historically, but has just gone blue. I asked them if they voted Conservative and they said absolutely not, because Boris Johnson's a liar and because of Brexit. So I asked f they voted Labour and they said absolutely not, because they felt the manifesto would bankrupt the country and because they hated and didn't trust Jeremy Corbyn. Never mentioned Brexit once.
There was a poll out last week on why people didn't vote Labour, and the leadership was streets and streets and streets ahead of Brexit in the reasons.
Blair made Labour electable, like it or not. Having a couple of policies that poll well when taken in isolation out of context, and getting a load of young people out knocking on doors, while handing the Conservatives their biggest majority in nearly 100 years is fck all use to anybody.
This post has been edited by an administrator |  | | |
| Good Luck UK on 15:11 - Dec 15 with 1725 views | colinallcars |
| Good Luck UK on 13:52 - Dec 15 by Northernr |
You're right I haven't mentioned Brexit, because I can already feel the Momentum lot trying to form this narrative that actually Magic Grandpa wasn't the problem, the manifesto was popular, people love the policies, if it was proportional representation we'd be in a better place and the only problem was Brexit. So if we just carry on down this road, get Corbyn 2.1 in as leader, let the Tories mess up Brexit, then next time people will come round to their way of thinking.
And I despair at this.
I'm up north this weekend for our match, staying with my parents. They're from working class families, dad's family were steel workers, mum and now step dad's parents were railway workers, so all Labour and unions. My mum has probably moved herself into upper middle class now, retired when my dad died, married a richer guy. They live in one of these northern wards that's always been Labour, always really should be Labour given what the Tories have done to it historically, but has just gone blue. I asked them if they voted Conservative and they said absolutely not, because Boris Johnson's a liar and because of Brexit. So I asked f they voted Labour and they said absolutely not, because they felt the manifesto would bankrupt the country and because they hated and didn't trust Jeremy Corbyn. Never mentioned Brexit once.
There was a poll out last week on why people didn't vote Labour, and the leadership was streets and streets and streets ahead of Brexit in the reasons.
Blair made Labour electable, like it or not. Having a couple of policies that poll well when taken in isolation out of context, and getting a load of young people out knocking on doors, while handing the Conservatives their biggest majority in nearly 100 years is fck all use to anybody.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Blair indeed made Labour electable and apart from Iraq did pretty well in office. If you look at things introduced by Blair's government it reads quite well. Better to have a government that can deliver some benefits than be permanently in opposition with protest policies. Apartfrom Iraq, Blairs other overseas interventions were beneficial. I often wonder how John Smith would have fared had he not tragically died. |  | | |
| Good Luck UK on 15:22 - Dec 15 with 1702 views | Jigsore |
| Good Luck UK on 13:52 - Dec 15 by Northernr |
You're right I haven't mentioned Brexit, because I can already feel the Momentum lot trying to form this narrative that actually Magic Grandpa wasn't the problem, the manifesto was popular, people love the policies, if it was proportional representation we'd be in a better place and the only problem was Brexit. So if we just carry on down this road, get Corbyn 2.1 in as leader, let the Tories mess up Brexit, then next time people will come round to their way of thinking.
And I despair at this.
I'm up north this weekend for our match, staying with my parents. They're from working class families, dad's family were steel workers, mum and now step dad's parents were railway workers, so all Labour and unions. My mum has probably moved herself into upper middle class now, retired when my dad died, married a richer guy. They live in one of these northern wards that's always been Labour, always really should be Labour given what the Tories have done to it historically, but has just gone blue. I asked them if they voted Conservative and they said absolutely not, because Boris Johnson's a liar and because of Brexit. So I asked f they voted Labour and they said absolutely not, because they felt the manifesto would bankrupt the country and because they hated and didn't trust Jeremy Corbyn. Never mentioned Brexit once.
There was a poll out last week on why people didn't vote Labour, and the leadership was streets and streets and streets ahead of Brexit in the reasons.
Blair made Labour electable, like it or not. Having a couple of policies that poll well when taken in isolation out of context, and getting a load of young people out knocking on doors, while handing the Conservatives their biggest majority in nearly 100 years is fck all use to anybody.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
The election where Labour mostly lost a lot of leave voting seats, lost a lot of voters to a single-issue party called the Brexit Party and the Conservatives ran almost exclusively on the slogan of Get Brexit Done was not about Brexit at all? i'm not convinced. Lot's of people where I work are not particularly engaged with politics at all and just don't want to hear about Brexit in the news all the time anymore. They literally just want to get it done although i'm sure they'll be disappointed there.
I totally understand that lots of people don't like Corbyn! a lot of them don't know why particularly but he's not immensely popular fine. I like him personally BUT he was chosen because his competitors were Andy Burnham, Yvette Cooper and Liz Kendall! and they ALL followed the coalition narrative that austerity was necessary and we deserved it. Harriet Harman whipped to abstain on the hideous Welfare Bill in 2015 as interim leader. When the PLP tried a coup in 2016 who stood against Corbyn?? Owen Jones and Angela Eagle. Literally who? The Sensible Electable Moderatesâ„¢ of Labour haven't offered anything at all except loud public criticism.
now if anyone has an actual that doesn't involve Labour lurching to the new depths of the right the Tories have opened up where we deport people's grandparents who've lived here for 60 years, make the benefit system openly hostile and complicated to discourage use and desperately try to curry favour with Donald Trump's America then I would love to hear it. Because what Blair did was essentially ape a lot of John Major's policy in 1997 except he smiled more and wore jeans and met Oasis and Major was FAR more moderate than the Government we have now. Trying the same thing now is simply not acceptable... |  |
| “The thing about football - the important thing about football - is that it is not just about football.†|
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| Good Luck UK on 15:33 - Dec 15 with 1681 views | DannytheR |
| Good Luck UK on 15:22 - Dec 15 by Jigsore |
The election where Labour mostly lost a lot of leave voting seats, lost a lot of voters to a single-issue party called the Brexit Party and the Conservatives ran almost exclusively on the slogan of Get Brexit Done was not about Brexit at all? i'm not convinced. Lot's of people where I work are not particularly engaged with politics at all and just don't want to hear about Brexit in the news all the time anymore. They literally just want to get it done although i'm sure they'll be disappointed there.
I totally understand that lots of people don't like Corbyn! a lot of them don't know why particularly but he's not immensely popular fine. I like him personally BUT he was chosen because his competitors were Andy Burnham, Yvette Cooper and Liz Kendall! and they ALL followed the coalition narrative that austerity was necessary and we deserved it. Harriet Harman whipped to abstain on the hideous Welfare Bill in 2015 as interim leader. When the PLP tried a coup in 2016 who stood against Corbyn?? Owen Jones and Angela Eagle. Literally who? The Sensible Electable Moderatesâ„¢ of Labour haven't offered anything at all except loud public criticism.
now if anyone has an actual that doesn't involve Labour lurching to the new depths of the right the Tories have opened up where we deport people's grandparents who've lived here for 60 years, make the benefit system openly hostile and complicated to discourage use and desperately try to curry favour with Donald Trump's America then I would love to hear it. Because what Blair did was essentially ape a lot of John Major's policy in 1997 except he smiled more and wore jeans and met Oasis and Major was FAR more moderate than the Government we have now. Trying the same thing now is simply not acceptable... |
If we can let a Rangers analogy through the door, I'd say Labour is at the *exact* point in 2015 where Chris Ramsey had just been sacked as manager - venomous boos on all sides of the ground, Les' mate, got us relegated, out of his depth, should never have been appointed in the first place, etc - and we now welcome back proven winner Neil Warnock. [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 15:34]
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| Good Luck UK on 17:11 - Dec 15 with 1596 views | kensalriser |
| Good Luck UK on 22:51 - Dec 14 by Ned_Kennedys |
You think? Jello was never one for accepting builshit. |
I think as a Green party member, Bernie Sanders supporter and left wing campaigner he'd be disappointed that someone using his band's logo is busy disparaging and downposting people who share his politics. |  |
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| Good Luck UK on 17:14 - Dec 15 with 1595 views | Boston |
| Good Luck UK on 13:34 - Dec 15 by charmr |
Touch peoples taxes, fags and beer and you’ll never win an election. Here in the US no one touches the gas/petrol prices, they know better.
I don’t understand why basic needs like heat and light need to be run by companies answering to shareholders.
Or why not have a central bank with fair interest rates that puts money into the treasury for public spending. This working to pay bills with over inflated prices on bricks and mortar sounds more like modern slavery to me. What the fcuk is wrong with a four day week. Automation is on its way as companies will lay off workers. I’m all for private enterprise I here, well Govt funding in institutions are the wealth creators not poxy Walmart.
We’re born and are idealistic, then the system grinds us down causing apathy and cynicism and we all seem ok with that. Blatant lying is now wholly acceptable.
Check out Andrew Yang, it’s an interesting perspective. Sadly way too out there,and would freak out anyone who doesn’t like change. [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 14:10]
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Petrol / Gas prices are untouched! While the Feds have left the 18.4 tax per gallon alone since 1993, States have the right to levy whatever excise they like, which they do and, unless the electorate stops them, there are regular rate hikes across the country. Here in Massachusetts the State House applies an additional 26.54 cents per gallon, I took a look at Maryland and it adds 23.09, while Pennsylvania tops the list by charging another 58.02 cents.
Basic heat and light companies are and always have been private companies, they would need to be nationalized, that's not the system of government most come to the United States for.
Your Central Bank idea I have some sympathy for.
No one forces anyone to work.
Most of the people I grew up with, including myself, were not idealists.
Apathy and cynicism are the preserves of the malcontents.
Blatant lying is a human trait, how it's condoned by others is the problem.
Change...when the populace feel the need for such, it will happen. At the moment it's a rallying cry for those who cannot accept the normality of life.
Meanwhile it's 44f and sunny here in Boston, tad breezy though. [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 17:15]
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| Good Luck UK on 17:45 - Dec 15 with 1527 views | Ned_Kennedys |
| Good Luck UK on 17:11 - Dec 15 by kensalriser |
I think as a Green party member, Bernie Sanders supporter and left wing campaigner he'd be disappointed that someone using his band's logo is busy disparaging and downposting people who share his politics. |
Yeah he'll be distraught when he next logs on to the forum. |  | | |
| Good Luck UK on 17:56 - Dec 15 with 1504 views | connell10 |
| Good Luck UK on 17:45 - Dec 15 by Ned_Kennedys |
Yeah he'll be distraught when he next logs on to the forum. |
They are a shite band so good combo imo. |  |
| AND WHEN I DREAM , I DREAM ABOUT YOU AND WHEN I SCREAM I SCREAM ABOUT YOU!!!!! | | Poll: | best number 10 ever? |
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| Good Luck UK on 17:59 - Dec 15 with 1496 views | Boston |
| Good Luck UK on 22:09 - Dec 14 by kensalriser |
Jello would be so disappointed. |
Dunno. Big fan of him and the DK's in the 80's, but he stabbed his band mates in the back, repeatedly. | |
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| Good Luck UK on 18:04 - Dec 15 with 1484 views | Ned_Kennedys |
| Good Luck UK on 17:56 - Dec 15 by connell10 |
They are a shite band so good combo imo. |
Your choice of music matches your choice of politics I see. | | | |
| Good Luck UK on 18:37 - Dec 15 with 1628 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| Good Luck UK on 12:36 - Dec 15 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
Me me me
I got called a Tory on here many a time from a few and Bazz, I'm not. but they refused to listen to me or my like.
I'm what a lot of those that voted Tory (I did not vote) this time were/are
Labour leave voters and like them, not far left and not Blairites.
Very tricky ground in where they go next, I don't have a party as things stand and I think those that lent their vote don't.
Momentum was chucking abuse at what should have been their own Labour votes, you saw that on here, a micro version of what was going on in the real world. [Post edited 15 Dec 2019 12:37]
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As a disabled man, your cutting your nose of to spite your face will ultimately effect you a lot harder than it will me. This may be cruel to say but it’s true. |  | | |
| Good Luck UK on 18:44 - Dec 15 with 1614 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Good Luck UK on 21:45 - Dec 14 by Sharpy36 |
I believe that the border issue is a complete red herring and therefore will not affect those counties that run along the border. In saying that there will have to be some form of customs check, which imo will involve a trusted trader and electronic tracking system. Systems are already in place. |
Really?
When the PSNI Chief among many other experts have advised that a re-imposition of a hard border would see an immediate return to mass violence? |  |
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| Good Luck UK on 18:45 - Dec 15 with 1613 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Good Luck UK on 22:09 - Dec 14 by kensalriser |
Almost no-one in England gives a fck about Ireland, North or South.
We even had a minister for NI who didn't realise people there voted along sectarian lines. |
Fair point! | |
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| Good Luck UK on 18:51 - Dec 15 with 1592 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Good Luck UK on 23:57 - Dec 14 by WEAREAWFUL |
Brian i will reverse your question, what are your views on england just walking away and leaving ireland to get on with it. Would it end in violence |
Good question.
I think I've just relayed my fears on this in a post a couple of minutes ago.
Put it this way, the experts have warned that violence would be almost assured.
On the human side, friends of mine up there have been preparing to move if a hard border were re-introduced, for the safety of their kids. | |
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| Good Luck UK on 18:52 - Dec 15 with 1580 views | Sharpy36 |
| Good Luck UK on 18:44 - Dec 15 by BrianMcCarthy |
Really?
When the PSNI Chief among many other experts have advised that a re-imposition of a hard border would see an immediate return to mass violence? |
I think you`re missunderstanding me Brian, i`m not advocating a hard border, far from it. |  |
| 'You didn't know that was wrong, but now you do. If you do it again, I'll know you are doing it on purpose.' |
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| Good Luck UK on 18:53 - Dec 15 with 1579 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| Good Luck UK on 00:32 - Dec 15 by LythamR |
This election result is a watershed moment, North Belfast result changing the balance of power away from the unionists probably forever. The Tory majority means no need for the government to be held to ransom by the DUP or the ultra unionists in the Tory ranks
I think Johnson and co will sell the unionists further down the river during the trade negotiations without any qualms and wil give Northern Ireland a referendum within the 5 year term secretly hoping that it votes for a United Ireland.
Its almost inevitable that a united ireland will come to pass eventually so this seems as good a time as any, hopefully it can be done quickly with as little violence as possible.
Some solution has to be offered to Unionists that might want to relocate to England, that will be tricky to sort out but not impossible and I would like to think the vast majority would want to stay. |
The fact that we're even talking about 'right of return' (and it would possibly be to Scotland, I would imagine, should it ever come to pass) shows the seismic shift since Johnson abandoned the Unionists since taking over.
Strange days. | |
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