| RIP Fidel 07:39 - Nov 26 with 33179 views | QuakerJack |
Just announced that Fidel Castro has died... A truly sad day! RIP Fidel!! Hasta la victoria siempre!! |  |
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| RIP Fidel on 23:41 - Nov 30 with 1770 views | Darran |
Yeah I know. |  |
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| RIP Fidel on 00:15 - Dec 1 with 1758 views | Ebo |
| RIP Fidel on 23:41 - Nov 30 by Darran |
Yeah I know. |
Why insult when you get a fact wrong? Jee-whizz!! |  |
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| RIP Fidel on 09:42 - Dec 1 with 1714 views | nice_to_michu |
| RIP Fidel on 23:01 - Nov 30 by oh_tommy_tommy |
Heard of this guy
Fulgencio Batista |
What's your point? That Castro is better than Batista?
Khruschev was a bit better than Stalin, still awful. |  | | |
| RIP Fidel on 11:52 - Dec 1 with 1693 views | trampie |
The worst part was Yankees painting Cuban flags on their planes and then killing villagers by bombing and strafing, the best part was marching the traitors across the island and old women running out from their houses to punch them in the face and then Castro releasing most of the prisoners for food and medicine and things like tractors.
The Yanks for some reason thought the population would join them so they could then sent the might of their army, navy and air force in after a few days, the Brits tried to tell them they are solidly behind Castro and in the end Castro knew an attack was coming but he did not know where and it was the villagers that fought the Yanks until the Cuban army could get there, it was the farmers and villagers that got killed on Castro's side until his army took care of business, I seen some old timer on the box saying how he ran down to the beach with his old bolt action rifle and shot a Yank right between the eyes, the guy seemed very proud to defend his country and why wouldn't he anyway.
PS Yankees don't get into a fist fight with Cubans they are way too good in that discipline, lol. [Post edited 1 Dec 2016 12:41]
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| RIP Fidel on 12:02 - Dec 1 with 1683 views | Darran |
| RIP Fidel on 00:15 - Dec 1 by Ebo |
Why insult when you get a fact wrong? Jee-whizz!! |
What the f*ck has the current population got to do with it you dopey c*nt?
(that's an insult) | |
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| RIP Fidel on 12:04 - Dec 1 with 1680 views | controversial_jack |
| RIP Fidel on 09:42 - Dec 1 by nice_to_michu |
What's your point? That Castro is better than Batista?
Khruschev was a bit better than Stalin, still awful. |
Shame on Castro, for bringing in free health care, free education, with classroom sizes that would shame Britain, one of the lowest crime rates anywhere, total literacy, 80% home ownership, and training 50,000 doctors to help in the third world for free.
Why let facts interfere with ignorance and bigotry when we can believe the lies coming from the right wing media. |  | | |
| RIP Fidel on 12:19 - Dec 1 with 1665 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
| RIP Fidel on 09:42 - Dec 1 by nice_to_michu |
What's your point? That Castro is better than Batista?
Khruschev was a bit better than Stalin, still awful. |
He was a lovely fella Batista
Have a good read up on him
And while you are at it
Have a good read up on Castro |  |
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| RIP Fidel on 12:46 - Dec 1 with 1655 views | nice_to_michu |
| RIP Fidel on 12:19 - Dec 1 by oh_tommy_tommy |
He was a lovely fella Batista
Have a good read up on him
And while you are at it
Have a good read up on Castro |
Again, what is your point?
So what that the previous regime was worse, in your opinion, than Castro? It didn't follow that Castro is a saint by default.... | | | |
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| RIP Fidel on 12:57 - Dec 1 with 1651 views | controversial_jack |
| RIP Fidel on 12:46 - Dec 1 by nice_to_michu |
Again, what is your point?
So what that the previous regime was worse, in your opinion, than Castro? It didn't follow that Castro is a saint by default.... |
What regime in any country has ever been saintly? How did the British empire get on, mate | | | |
| RIP Fidel on 13:19 - Dec 1 with 1633 views | nice_to_michu |
| RIP Fidel on 12:57 - Dec 1 by controversial_jack |
What regime in any country has ever been saintly? How did the British empire get on, mate |
Nice straw man argument.
I haven't even mentioned the "British empire", let alone defended it.
The previous poster rejected criticism of Castro because he believed the previous regime was worse. How can you not see the weakness in that argument? | | | |
| RIP Fidel on 14:25 - Dec 1 with 1654 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
| RIP Fidel on 12:46 - Dec 1 by nice_to_michu |
Again, what is your point?
So what that the previous regime was worse, in your opinion, than Castro? It didn't follow that Castro is a saint by default.... |
He's been as bad as any other country in the hisrory of the world.
lagging way behind the USA when we talk about human rights etc.
Cuba was so corrupt at the time of the revolution it was blatantly done in public.
He was a dictator and like all dictators he was also ruthless.
You dont need to be a dictator to be ruthless .
Lets hope democracy comes to the good people of Cuba | |
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| RIP Fidel on 14:25 - Dec 1 with 1652 views | perchrockjack |
Castro killed dissidents. Facts.
Cubans have had their wealth taken away and diverted to Fidel and his cronies ,just as the former soviet leaders did . Have a look at how communism works , really works.
Cubans escaped from their country for a reason, emphasis on escape .
Still, plenty of gold medals in the 80 s when the country was virtually starving.
Steak for athletes , grass seeds for the people.
Nice 40s Chevies around Havana though with tights for timing belts | |
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| RIP Fidel on 14:41 - Dec 1 with 1644 views | trampie |
| RIP Fidel on 12:04 - Dec 1 by controversial_jack |
Shame on Castro, for bringing in free health care, free education, with classroom sizes that would shame Britain, one of the lowest crime rates anywhere, total literacy, 80% home ownership, and training 50,000 doctors to help in the third world for free.
Why let facts interfere with ignorance and bigotry when we can believe the lies coming from the right wing media. |
Yes indeed, many see Castro as having saved his people from American slavery because of the way American corporations were operating in Cuba. | |
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| RIP Fidel on 15:47 - Dec 1 with 1621 views | controversial_jack |
| RIP Fidel on 14:25 - Dec 1 by perchrockjack |
Castro killed dissidents. Facts.
Cubans have had their wealth taken away and diverted to Fidel and his cronies ,just as the former soviet leaders did . Have a look at how communism works , really works.
Cubans escaped from their country for a reason, emphasis on escape .
Still, plenty of gold medals in the 80 s when the country was virtually starving.
Steak for athletes , grass seeds for the people.
Nice 40s Chevies around Havana though with tights for timing belts |
Wouldn't the American trade embargo be to blame for that? | | | |
| RIP Fidel on 16:31 - Dec 1 with 1596 views | perchrockjack |
Not entirely.
Still, Soviet Russia was quite happy to prop him up
You seem obsessed with hating everything American.
I'm not their biggest fan but ,my God, I d have rather been brought up in Ann Arbor than anywhere in the old eastern bloc.
I'm biased as I had a good friend in Swansea who escaped from east Berlin and was almost shot by the border guards who, were , as in Cuba ,keeping the people IN. It's why passports were denied.
Think of it | |
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| RIP Fidel on 16:52 - Dec 1 with 1579 views | Groo |
One thing I've learned from this thread.
If you're a left winger Castro was a god and all bad things said are the lies of right wing press and governments.
If you're a right winger Castro was a devil and all good things are the lies of the red press and governments.
here's a bit from what's obviously right wing press.
"Of the many myths that some offer up about Fidel Castro’s Cuba, one tale is that despite Mr. Castro’s repression, he improved a few social programs.
Thus, in his statement on Mr. Castro’s death, Prime Minister Justin Trudeau asserted “significant improvements” in Cuban health care and education under the totalitarian tutelage of Fidel Castro.
An inconvenient fact: Pre-Castro, Cuba was already better off than most Latin American countries on such indicators. Also, Mr. Castro’s rule knocked Cubans to the near-economic bottom of all Latin American countries, with subsequent negative effects on Cuba’s much-vaunted social model.
Some background: Before Mr. Castro came to power in 1959, Cubans suffered from a grasping, corrupt dictator and the U.S. mafia was involved in the island’s casinos, to name two issues. However, Cuba was not an economic straggler and it already “topped the charts” on multiple social indicators.
Consider education. Jorge Salazar-Carrillo and Andro Nodarse-Leon, the authors of Cuba: From Economic Take-Off to Collapse under Castro, note that in 1954, Cuba spent 4.1 per cent of its GDP on education. That proportion was higher than any Western European country and just above that of the United States (4 per cent). That translated into a comparatively high literacy rate in the 1950s and high female participation.
Or ponder Cuban health care. Cuba in 1957 already had more doctors per 1,000 people than did Norway, Sweden and Great Britain. In 1958, according to even one recent regime-friendly academic paper, Cuba “ranked in the first, second or third place in Latin America with respect to its healthcare indicators.” Circa the 1950s, that success included long life-expectancy rates, and the lowest infant-mortality rates in Latin America.
Economically, in 1958, Cuba’s per-capita GDP was $2,363 (OECD numbers in inflation-adjusted Gheary-Khamis dollars). That put it in the middle of the Latin American “pack.” Some countries had higher per-capita incomes (Argentina at $5,698 and Venezuela at $9,816 as examples) and others lower (Brazil and the Dominican Republic at $2,111 and $1,320, respectively).
Post-1959, after a revolution where Fidel Castro promised prosperity, democracy and the restoration of Cuba’s 1940 constitution — broken promises all, Cuba is now poor. In 2008, when Mr. Castro officially handed over power to his brother, Raul Castro, Cuba’s per-person GDP was just $3,764. Thus, on that measurement, Cuba was in the bottom third of all Latin American countries.
In February, 2008, I was in Cuba when Fidel Castro resigned and the statistics were obvious in the streets. I snapped a picture of one Havana pharmacy with half-empty shelves. Schools, hospitals and many apartment buildings were in disrepair. Much of the housing was literally crumbling. Havana was subject to egg rations.
Then there’s the social fallout from Mr. Castro’s nearly six-decade-old Revolution. One example: The Cuban government has long “pimped” out Cuban physicians to other countries in Latin America. The regime in Havana takes hard currency from host governments, and after a government cut, pays its doctors in Cuban pesos.
Cuba’s ridiculously praised social model is a model of near-universal poverty. It doesn’t mean much if needed pharmaceuticals are lacking, equipment is ancient and buildings are rotting, when physicians and others prop up the system through slave-labour pay, and when Cuba already had near-universal education and high literacy rates in the 1950s.
One could blame Cuba’s economic and social decline partly on the American embargo on trade with Cuba. I would, but then I support free enterprise. But Cuban communism, like other varieties, always disdained capitalism and with it international trade; all the American embargo did was reveal how self-sufficient socialism was a mirage.
What of Cuba’s future? Much will depend on when Raul Castro and the rest of the creaking, communist regime finally totter over, and if a more open economy, society and government arise.
Should that happen, there is reason for optimism. As Mr. Salazar-Carrillo and Mr. Nodarse-Leon point out, “Cuba in the 1950s was on a path to sustained economic growth.” In addition, as a share of the economy in the 1950s, compensation to Cuban workers was ahead of Switzerland, Australia and Germany and was first within Latin America. This meant something on the ground, as caloric intake for Cubans “was second only to Argentina and Uruguay, two meat-producing countries.”
Before Fidel Castro’s repressive revolution and state came along, Cubans were already educated, showed decent health-care outcomes and were entrepreneurial. With his death, they might again experience this other critical human need long absent on the island: Opportunity." |  |
| Groo does what Groo does best |
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| RIP Fidel on 16:55 - Dec 1 with 1576 views | controversial_jack |
| RIP Fidel on 16:31 - Dec 1 by perchrockjack |
Not entirely.
Still, Soviet Russia was quite happy to prop him up
You seem obsessed with hating everything American.
I'm not their biggest fan but ,my God, I d have rather been brought up in Ann Arbor than anywhere in the old eastern bloc.
I'm biased as I had a good friend in Swansea who escaped from east Berlin and was almost shot by the border guards who, were , as in Cuba ,keeping the people IN. It's why passports were denied.
Think of it |
I'm not anti American, just anti American foreign policy. I detest imperialism, regime change and hegemony.
I just find it sadly ironic that we can find fault with Cuba or other countries, when we aren't exactly doing that well ourselves, especially the way we treat our poor and weaker remembers of society
What I do think is sad, is the lack of insight into many issues by many posters on here. They take the main stream media nonsense and don't bother to do their own research. I'm not suggesting you do, just in general
If anyone doesn't like that or find it offensive, then tough shit! | | | |
| RIP Fidel on 16:57 - Dec 1 with 1575 views | Atticus |
| RIP Fidel on 15:47 - Dec 1 by controversial_jack |
Wouldn't the American trade embargo be to blame for that? |
Of course America is to blame. Never mind that Castro's wealth is estimated at over $900 million and he popularized the look of sporting two Rolex's on his wrist. Nevermind that during Castro's life Cuba had economic trade with the Soviet Union, Russia, Europe, China, Canada, and South America. Nevermind that in the 1960's Castro seized over a $1billion of assets owned by American companies, who provided jobs to Cubans by the way, and put them under state control. Never mind that no communist government has ever brought economic prosperity to the average worker. Nevermind that despite the US embargo on Cuba, the US is still Cuba's fifth largest trading partner since medicine and food have always been excluded from the embargo. And never mind Cuban athletes, unlike their peers in other Caribbean nations, are prohibited from playing professional sports in pro leagues in the US or elsewhere in order to earn a living. It's not the failure of Castro's policies or his alliance with the Soviet Union, it's all the USA's fault. | | | |
| RIP Fidel on 17:14 - Dec 1 with 1561 views | controversial_jack |
| RIP Fidel on 16:57 - Dec 1 by Atticus |
Of course America is to blame. Never mind that Castro's wealth is estimated at over $900 million and he popularized the look of sporting two Rolex's on his wrist. Nevermind that during Castro's life Cuba had economic trade with the Soviet Union, Russia, Europe, China, Canada, and South America. Nevermind that in the 1960's Castro seized over a $1billion of assets owned by American companies, who provided jobs to Cubans by the way, and put them under state control. Never mind that no communist government has ever brought economic prosperity to the average worker. Nevermind that despite the US embargo on Cuba, the US is still Cuba's fifth largest trading partner since medicine and food have always been excluded from the embargo. And never mind Cuban athletes, unlike their peers in other Caribbean nations, are prohibited from playing professional sports in pro leagues in the US or elsewhere in order to earn a living. It's not the failure of Castro's policies or his alliance with the Soviet Union, it's all the USA's fault. |
Castro isn't worth anywhere near to that.There have been many bogus estimates and conjecture by the right wing media,, but not one shred of proof to back them up
Cuba is an island just like we are, It has to import 80% of it's food and all of it's commodities. The American embargo also took into effect other western countries who wished to remain in the good books of uncle Sam
The embargo didn't include medicine, you are right, but it did include food, with the exception of some tinned items. An embargo doesn't have to be total to destroy a countries economy, just look at what happened to Iraq with our sanction
You are right, communism doesn't enrich the prosperity of individual workers, that's not it's purpose, but tell me how is capitalism getting along in Africa, or Latin America, or large parts of Asia. Is it enriching the workers lives there? I'm sure the sweat shop workers would love to hear your response
Cuba isn't perfect but show me a country that is? | | | |
| RIP Fidel on 17:59 - Dec 1 with 1544 views | nice_to_michu |
| RIP Fidel on 16:55 - Dec 1 by controversial_jack |
I'm not anti American, just anti American foreign policy. I detest imperialism, regime change and hegemony.
I just find it sadly ironic that we can find fault with Cuba or other countries, when we aren't exactly doing that well ourselves, especially the way we treat our poor and weaker remembers of society
What I do think is sad, is the lack of insight into many issues by many posters on here. They take the main stream media nonsense and don't bother to do their own research. I'm not suggesting you do, just in general
If anyone doesn't like that or find it offensive, then tough shit! |
Which posters are you referring to and what did they say that was so wrong? | | | |
| RIP Fidel on 18:03 - Dec 1 with 1541 views | trampie |
Under Batista half of Cuban children did not attend school.
75% of arable land was foreign owned, Batista was said to have been in charged when 20,000 Cubans were killed, the rich got richer and poor got poorer, Castro sorted that sh*t out.
The people under Castro had a basic standard of living instead of abject poverty in lots of cases pre Castro, ironically the US does have cases of dire poverty.
Castro supported the little countries and peoples against the imperialist countries, a lot of Welsh people [not Brit Nat Welsh obviously, but Welsh Welsh] have similar sentiments.
Castro was a socialist and a nationalist, he wanted absolute sovereignty for his country until he came to power they did not have economic sovereignty, strangely enough it was the argument of 'leave' voters in the EU referendum, UK was a sovereign nation but did not have economic sovereignty, lol, I have to laugh right wing Kippers and Tories having a similar cause to Fidel Castro in that sense. lol. [Post edited 1 Dec 2016 18:09]
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| RIP Fidel on 18:44 - Dec 1 with 1524 views | nice_to_michu |
| RIP Fidel on 18:03 - Dec 1 by trampie |
Under Batista half of Cuban children did not attend school.
75% of arable land was foreign owned, Batista was said to have been in charged when 20,000 Cubans were killed, the rich got richer and poor got poorer, Castro sorted that sh*t out.
The people under Castro had a basic standard of living instead of abject poverty in lots of cases pre Castro, ironically the US does have cases of dire poverty.
Castro supported the little countries and peoples against the imperialist countries, a lot of Welsh people [not Brit Nat Welsh obviously, but Welsh Welsh] have similar sentiments.
Castro was a socialist and a nationalist, he wanted absolute sovereignty for his country until he came to power they did not have economic sovereignty, strangely enough it was the argument of 'leave' voters in the EU referendum, UK was a sovereign nation but did not have economic sovereignty, lol, I have to laugh right wing Kippers and Tories having a similar cause to Fidel Castro in that sense. lol. [Post edited 1 Dec 2016 18:09]
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Why are you and others banging on about Batista all the time? That was decades ago, it's hardly relevant when discussing the merits of a dictator who has been in power for as long as Castro.
Castro molded the country how he saw fit. If you're going to praise him for a good healthcare system then you better believe I will hold him accountable for all of his downfalls, of which there were many.
I'm totally disinterested in how good or bad Batista was. | | | |
| RIP Fidel on 19:54 - Dec 1 with 1512 views | perchrockjack |
Would you leave awakes to live in Cuba?
Of course not.
Would you leave Cuba to live in Wales.
Of course | |
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| RIP Fidel on 19:57 - Dec 1 with 1508 views | Darran |
| RIP Fidel on 19:54 - Dec 1 by perchrockjack |
Would you leave awakes to live in Cuba?
Of course not.
Would you leave Cuba to live in Wales.
Of course |
Nah I'd rather have a kip.  | |
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| RIP Fidel on 20:01 - Dec 1 with 1506 views | perchrockjack |
As you know, I've quit slagging off Wales as it upsets good folk.
Come the new year ,I ll think of something else.
Belgium seems good alternative | |
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