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If Peter Lim had announced the European super league, Neville would be backing it. If Sky sports already had the rights to show it, Neville would be backing it So this idea he's standing up for EFL clubs, and non-league clubs, is complete BS Look at how they've handled Salford. Says one thing on Monday night football, the next morning he's sacking Graham Alexander with the club 5th in their league. Can't take anything he says seriously.
Yeah 1 racially abusive message is too many, but then again we live in a country where school kids get stabbed on their way into school, and no one bats an eyelid. These stories barely last 2 hours on the BBC news most read. But you'll see stories about the countryside being "too white" on there for days. Weird, weird media. Gaslighting people.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 10:31 - Jul 14 with 2016 views
Watching that Im surprised there werent any deaths to be honest, you would think that a country that has run major tournaments and experienced tragedies involving spectators before events like this would be organised a little better.
Maybe covid, football, "the great british summer" and the occasion provided the perfect storm for some England fans to behave like utter plonkers.
While I just cant see the sense in punching ticketless intruders when helping push them back out mightve sufficed, I can possibly empathise that some of those invoilved may have felt their saftey was put in jeopardy by those barging in.
Slightly concerning that wembley etc tried to cover up or minimise what actually happened.
I felt the papers etc here on the whole had a quite measured approach to this tournament, the toxic jingoism and nationalism that was present once upon a time was left to a handful of idiots on twitter etc. Some politicans didnt seem to read the room and made some ill advised comments.
The report by India's World is One News seems a bit of stretch to me mind, I get that England has had a long-standing problem with bad behaviour etc. but to argue that people that have just seen their team lose are angry because their countrys colonial past leads them to believe that England are entitled to win appears a little daft. I might be wrong or viewing matters through my own lens too much but whenever England or QPR have lost, Britains past has never factored in my disappointment. Then again Im not the type of herbert thatll throw trees into a crowd of fellow supports.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 11:10 - Jul 14 with 1957 views
Blocked by the LFW socialist campaign group for speaking truths about who I am and where I come from. How typical.
Those in the media and with large public profiles who go hunting down these statistically insignificantly tiny number of posts and deliberately amplify them millions of times out of proportion should bear some responsibility for the effect it has on people.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 11:47 - Jul 14 with 1891 views
Well we'll never know as Peter Lim didn't announce it and Sky didn't have the rights. Whether you agree with Neville or not I just don't see how it is embarrassing that he expressed an opinion on it.
not sure you can say no one bats an eyelid at people being stabbed. Those lists of stories on BBC are based on what people are reading, not really fault of the media if more people wanted to read or watch different things.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 11:56 - Jul 14 with 1822 views
So your argument is that racism stories sell, while 16-year-olds getting stabbed to death don't. So, therefore, the media is correct to cover the former extensively and make the latter a non-story?
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 12:40 - Jul 14 with 1780 views
Qatar is nowhere ready or experienced in handling anything like what went down on Sunday. Throw into the mix the nefarious characters that will attend from other nations, and it’s a recipe for disaster in my view.
People (and FIFA) don’t appreciate that this isn’t the Qatar World Cup, it’s the Doha World Cup. This event is taking place in one relatively small city; so keeping fans apart is made doubly difficult.
Of more concern: their police/security services are not used to dealing with anything remotely akin to what the world witnessed from London. I just don’t know if their police will be up to it and as for security guards used all over Qatar, they’re all from Africa: so imagine the abuse they’re in for.
I had heard plans afoot to deploy a large number of guards/security from Pakistan (about 100,000) but that’s all well and good, but how are they trained/prepared. I was at one game (African version of the European Supercup) that was well attended by well behaved fans. Put in the worst of England and say, Russia and you’re relying on inexperienced people to handle and retain order among ‘professional yobs’.
There’s frankly nothing bar sand outside of Doha and there’s not much for folks to do. Thus, their fanzones where it’s planned for fans to be able to drink were, as late as early-2019, going to be open to mixed as I was informed.
Looking at Qatari media, they’ve been inundated by people (Arab and non-Arab) in the region utterly shocked at the scenes and accounts coming out of London. This might be the catalyst for some urgent rethinking. There are also 10,000 US military personnel based there - maybe let them loose on the types of thugs who disgraced England on Sunday.
Frankly, while I had no plans to stay for the Doha World Cup, I would avoid the place (and add Dubai to that) like the plague between November and December 2022!!
'Always In Motion' by John Honney available on amazon.co.uk
I worked at Wembley stewarding in the 80's. It was a problem, more with people jumping the turnstiles and sprinting. Many of the stewards came from rugby clubs associated with Wasps and one of the reasons I think was the amount of tackling you had to do with the almost gazelle like jumping ability of those trying that method of entry. They would basically walk around the stadium trying their chances at each block.
I remember one game involving Liverpool fans being a lot like that. It was also nice to engage with banter after ejecting some of the ticketing challenged customers, playfully explaining that they were going to "stab my eyes." Such naughty humorous scally scamps, how we laughed at their playfulness.
So this wasn't anything new, just appeared to be poorly managed.
Never knowingly understood
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 13:15 - Jul 14 with 1702 views
Not really what I said was it. They report on hundreds of different stories it's upto the public what they choose to read which is how they display the top 10 most read stories. You can't force people to be interested in stories no more than they can force you to watch a tv show, if people are not interested they won't watch it.
if they were not reporting on anything else you might have a point but fact you know about a 16 year old getting stabbed suggests it's been reported by at least one news agency.
The main stories in the news will always be influenced by what the general public are most interested in and what they are talking about hence the several years of Brexit being the only story in town. 3 England players getting racial abuse the night they lost a final watched by 31 million people was never going to be a story that disappeared quickly and nor should it.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 13:24 - Jul 14 with 1651 views
I'm umming and ahhring about going for a month during the WC as my brother is out there and i'll have free accommodation. Been there before and had mixed feeling on Doha as a City and less mixed feelings on the cost of a pint.
I've convinced myself due to it's location, cost of hotels, and bad coverage that it's going to be relatively fan free compared to say a Germany or even Russian WC.
Is that the feeling out there or are they preparing for the end of the world?
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 14:26 - Jul 14 with 1550 views
They would have witnessed the abuse Beckham suffered in 1998, the abuse Souhgate faced in 1996 and they're determined - rightfully - to avoid the same happening to the 3 players who missed penalties on Sunday. It's noble.
However, apart from calling Rashford's penalty what it was, shit, there wasn't widespread abuse of the players but they still feel the need to 'show them love' which is why they are concentrating on the racist abuse received which is, again, noble.
BUT, the problem is that in doing so they haven't mentioned how little abuse there was (of course 1 idiot abusing someone for the colour of their skin is 1 too many) and it's not known where the perpetrators are located. By given it such a prominent position in newspapers and in news coverage they are creating a false impression that the players were subjected to a horrendous amount of abuse and the nation is racist to the core. That's my problem with the coverage.
It's about time News Agencies were forced to use accurate statistics.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 14:29 - Jul 14 with 1535 views
I think when this kind of thing comes up it's important to shine a light on it and make people aware that this kind of behavior is not only unacceptable but there are consequences to sending tweets or private messages to someone with the intent to abuse them. It wouldn't be accepted if they did this on the street so shouldn't be accepted when they do it on their phones as well.
I think since George Flloyd last year a light has been shone on this issue and it's been heavily covered across the media and in society, that has certainly peed a lot of people off who are sick of hearing about it but annoying a few people shouldn't be a reason to not highlight these things when they happen on such a big event.
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 15:27 - Jul 14 with 1470 views
Superb post willis1980 and a shocking news video to show some of the behavior last Sunday. I cringe to think what would have happened if a stampede got started and sometimes it only takes one word ,noise or panic there would have been deaths for sure IMO.Only the new design saved this outcome i think imagine the older Stadiums how brutal this would have been. There is no excuse for the security /lack of at all.It already happened at Old Trafford this season before the Liverpool V Utd game.They should have immediately implemented new policy's and security arrangements for all Stadiums not to mention for the biggest game in England in half a century .Shame on those ticketless thugs they destroyed a lot of peoples enjoyment of a magnificent occasion
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 15:49 - Jul 14 with 1439 views
if thats how you want to read that then fair enough.
I'm really not seeing the link between my kids needing to arm themselves and what is the main story on the news. I'm a bit baffled by this all now to be honest as it's got a bit weird. I knew I'd regret saying anything
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 16:54 - Jul 14 with 1335 views
Sorry, but if you're happy to stay silent on working-class kids routinely stabbing each other to death in the street But feel the need to make a huge story about 4 racists in the UK sending abusive tweets to footballers, on the internet I do have to question that point of view, because it's wrong.
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:26 - Jul 14 with 1289 views
Mate, you make a lot of interesting points, but not for the first time, WTF are you going on about there? Where has Dave said he doesn't care about teenagers getting stabbed or feeling the need to arm themselves when they leave the house? I know you're the official spokesmen for all black people in the UK, but a lot of black Britons - namely various England internationals and former-England internationals - have spoken out against the racist tweets, so maybe not every Black person in Britain thinks we should be ignoring the subject. But you'll probably just dismiss them as being out-of-touch. Isn't it possible to care about both?
I agree that black people in the UK would benefit more from an end to knife crime than an end to racist tweets to footballers, but seeing as we can't find a way to police racist tweets, I don't hold out much hope for a simple solution to endemic knife crime. It goes without saying that it's absolutely heart-breaking seeing the senseless slaughter on an almost daily basis. The toll the current situation must take on people's mental health is unimaginable. But seeing as you absolutely panned me for a suggestion that Social media platforms could maybe ban specific words, I don't hold out much hope for us coming up with a practical solution to a far more complex issue.
How much time would you like to see the media devoting to each murder? What do you think increased coverage would achieve? What would you like to see happen? Genuine questions.
EDIT: I agree that the coverage has been disproportionate and reputationally unhelpful given the relatively small number of racist messages, and the fact that not all of them will have come from England fans.
[Post edited 14 Jul 2021 17:39]
Fulham FC: It's the taking part that counts
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:43 - Jul 14 with 1249 views
It's what I'm accusing the media of, focusing our minds on 4 people sending racist tweets, rather than the massive amounts of real violence happening constantly. Dave is defending the media for doing it I'm not saying Dave is doing it But if he wants to defend the media, I'll address my point to him.
What I want to see is the media being fair and proportionate. I've evidenced why I don't think they are being fair or proportionate. But because it's me, making a point contrary to the LFW community standards, nobody is able to accept that I might have a point.
EDIT - Just seen your edit. Bravo. At least you can see it. Shame about the others who cannot get their heads around this.
[Post edited 14 Jul 2021 17:47]
"Someone despises me. That's their problem." Marcus Aurelius
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 17:49 - Jul 14 with 1242 views
Okay, so how much attention would you like the media to dedicate to each murder, and what would expect the increased media attention to achieve? Assuming it became the top story on the News every night, and the public couldn't avoid coverage of the situation, then what would you expect to happen?
Fulham FC: It's the taking part that counts
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England ðŸ´ó §ó ¢ó ¥ó ®ó §ó ¿ v Italy 🇮🇹 Match Thread on 18:02 - Jul 14 with 1919 views
As the media reported on both I really don't see the issue. If you think one is more important than the other then that is completely upto you but both seem worthy stories that were covered.
The way news is covered usually reflects the public mood. I'm not looking to defend anyone here just giving their side of the argument.
The Fall out of England going out of the Euros, the tweets the crowd trouble etc is a massive story this week, if that had happened after QPR v Millwall you'd get far less coverage as far less people across the entire country are interested. As tragic as a teenager getting stabbed is that is not going to gain as much coverage this week same as the number of people dying of covid or any other worthy story is a long way down the news coverage as well when it would probably be main story in other weeks.
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