| The Squad 2022-2023 02:05 - Jul 25 with 8411 views | Kerouac |
Not looking too clever is it? A bit of a dog's breakfast...
- Crap keeper (without decent competition?)
- Rubbish Wing-backs
- Full-backs? Manning can play Left-back, Lati doesn't seem up to RB and Naughton is too old to deal with pacey wingers.
PLUS - Naughton, Lati and Manning have been playing their football at CB under Martin.
Sorinola up to it? He'd better be.
- CB? Wood looks decent, could partner Cabango and Darling? Darling had better be up to it given the outlay. Worrying signs in pre-season though, hope he comes good.
If we play 3 centre-backs we have lots of options and cover...but you can only play that way with decent wing-backs. We don't seem to have any.
- DM/CM
Should be fine with Joey and Fulton (who has never let us down but by the sounds of it is out of the door). I guess Harvey White is the specialist on Loan to replace Fulton as back up. With Grimes partnering Allen. Walsh seems to be a waste of space (nice little passer, but never fit). I prefer Ntcham at attacking midfield but hopefully he'll be able to do a job at CM if needed...don't like him in the tackle though
Wingers
- We don't have any except Garrick...although I'm convinced Joseph could do a good job there...unfortunately it seems that neither of them, nor Whittaker, will be given any game time there.
Attacking Midfield
- We have 3 players who can do a good job there...I guess Patterson is going to be used wider, he doesn't look comfortable there though. No pace.
Striker
- We have two top strikers for this division. I will be amazed if Piroe is not gone by September though. If Piroe goes presumably we'll have money to replace him but I don't think we'll be fortunate to pick up a similar player to Piroe's quality though...odds are against it. More likely to pick up somebody who used to play for MK Dons.
Joseph could step up and Whittaker has the raw talent.
Cullen, unfortunately, looks like he could use a move to Newport and build up from there...still not writing the boy off altogether though.
All in all, my assessment is that we are weaker this year than last year. The manager has not addressed the squad's weaknesses and there does not seem to be much of what you'd call a coherent plan...please prove me wrong, I've bought 2 season tickets, I would like to watch my club play competitive games throughout the season and not be near the relegation end...but honestly, this squad looks like they belong down the bottom (once Piroe goes)
SQUAD
Manager
Russell Martin
Goalkeeper
1) Andrew Fisher (ex-Mk Dons)
??) Who is the back up keeper?
Right-Back
22) Joel Latibeaudiere
26) Kyle Naughton
19) Tivonge Rushesha
Left-Back
3) Ryan Manning
29) Matthew Sorinola - £350k Union SG (ex-MK Dons)
Centre-Back
5) Ben Cabango
16) Brandon Cooper
23) Nathan Wood - £300k (Middlesboro)
6) Harry Darling - £2.3m (Mk Dons)
Defensive Midfield
4) Jay Fulton
7) Joe Allen - £Free (Stoke City)
Harvey White - LOAN?
Centre Midfield
8) Matt Grimes
28) Liam Walsh
Attacking Midfield
10) Olivier Ntcham
12) Jamie Patterson
45) Cameron Congreve
31) Oliver Cooper
Right-Wing
41) Jordan Garrick
14) Kyle Joseph
Left-Wing
11) Morgan Whittaker
Striker
17) Joel Piroe
9) Michael Obafemi
20) Liam Cullen
Most promising youngsters that haven't had a go yet...
48) Joel Cotterill
25) Lewis Webb
35) Lincoln McFadyen
36) Ben Lloyd
37) Daniel Williams
38) Cameron Evans ? (Did he go to Swindon?)
Offski
13) Steven Benda
2) Ryan Bennett
15) Nathaniel Ogbeta
Gone
Flynn Downes - £10m
Korey Smith - £Free
Ben Hamer - £Free
Yann Dhanda - £Free [Post edited 26 Jul 2022 18:14]
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 22:08 - Jul 25 with 1211 views | Kerouac |
Given it some more thought and I think I'd make this tweak to option 1.
Option 1 -
4-3-3
-------------------------------Fisher ----------------------------------
------------------- Cabango --------- Darling ----------------------
Naughton ----------------------------------------------- Manning
-------------------------------- Allen ---------------------------------
-------------- Ntcham --------------------- Grimes ----------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
------ ----------------------- Patterson ------------------------------
---------------- Obafemi ----------------- Piroe --------------------
Subs: Latibeaudiere (RB/CB), Wood (CB/LB), Fulton (DM), Sorinola (LWB), Garrick (RWB), Congreve (CAM), Joseph (ST
...it makes us more solid and allows Patterson to play in his best position. Those full backs need to get forward and provide the width in possession though. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 22:40 - Jul 25 with 1171 views | Fireboy2 |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 22:08 - Jul 25 by Kerouac |
Given it some more thought and I think I'd make this tweak to option 1.
Option 1 -
4-3-3
-------------------------------Fisher ----------------------------------
------------------- Cabango --------- Darling ----------------------
Naughton ----------------------------------------------- Manning
-------------------------------- Allen ---------------------------------
-------------- Ntcham --------------------- Grimes ----------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
------ ----------------------- Patterson ------------------------------
---------------- Obafemi ----------------- Piroe --------------------
Subs: Latibeaudiere (RB/CB), Wood (CB/LB), Fulton (DM), Sorinola (LWB), Garrick (RWB), Congreve (CAM), Joseph (ST
...it makes us more solid and allows Patterson to play in his best position. Those full backs need to get forward and provide the width in possession though. |
Now I do like that side, I've said a few times that I hope when Allen plays it will mean that grimes moves further up the pitch as imo he would be better with the shackles off, him and ntcham would cause havoc alongside patterson, obafemi and piroe, ve always believed attack is the best form of defence. |  | | |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 23:24 - Jul 25 with 1155 views | DJack |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 21:51 - Jul 25 by Dr_Parnassus |
Yep now or never for him really.
If we have another season of building then no doubt next season we lose Obafemi and Darling and it’s the same rebuilding excuses.
No other manager I have ever seen, always seems to need to write off a season as soon as a player leaves. It’s part of the game, expected and predictable.
He needs to get on with it now. Although to be fair, in this instance it seems some fans are making excuses on his behalf instead of him making them. |
As you are already aware I was(am) in the "give Martin time" crowd. He's had the time, where we end up come the end of this season defines his early tenure - As you've pointed out some of the issues with players coming and going are part and parcel of the life of a club and as such all clubs should prepare accordingly. |  |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 02:21 - Jul 26 with 1114 views | STID2017 |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 23:24 - Jul 25 by DJack |
As you are already aware I was(am) in the "give Martin time" crowd. He's had the time, where we end up come the end of this season defines his early tenure - As you've pointed out some of the issues with players coming and going are part and parcel of the life of a club and as such all clubs should prepare accordingly. |
The only caveat I would add to that 8s timing of transfers.
If offers start coming in for the main targets ( primarily I would say Piroe, Obafemi and possibly Congreve ), then it is important business is concluded ASAP.
If sales take place at the 11th hour ( and the current owners have form for this ) then it may mean that whilst we may sign replacements, they may not be the ones RM would have wanted in and got say in mid August ?
This would undoubtedly leave the squad weaker and leave RM's hands somewhat tied until the next window in January. |  |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 02:29 - Jul 26 with 1104 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 02:21 - Jul 26 by STID2017 |
The only caveat I would add to that 8s timing of transfers.
If offers start coming in for the main targets ( primarily I would say Piroe, Obafemi and possibly Congreve ), then it is important business is concluded ASAP.
If sales take place at the 11th hour ( and the current owners have form for this ) then it may mean that whilst we may sign replacements, they may not be the ones RM would have wanted in and got say in mid August ?
This would undoubtedly leave the squad weaker and leave RM's hands somewhat tied until the next window in January. |
Again, that’s football, you have to adapt and use your resources and knowledge of the game.
I don’t think we ever managed to replace Dan James and we were only able to replace McBurnie in January when we brought Brewster in. He just got on with it, nobody suggesting we write a season off - we ended up 6th and giving us an outside chance of play off victory.
This side is very much the same as last year. The only difference is Allen for Downes plus we now have a stronger defence.
We do have a weakness at left back and potentially goalkeeper but I still expect to see some loans come in. Remember we very rarely have a perfect side and there is weaknesses usually somewhere or other.
Even back to Brendans side it had Alan Tate and Mark Gower in it.
Piroe, Obafemi and Pato are an incredible front 3.
Ntcham, Grimes and Allen are a very good middle 3.
Naughton, Woods/Cabango, Darling are a very good defensive 3.
Leaving Fisher and Manning as potential weaknesses. Anytime you go into a season with only 2 weaknesses, you have to be looking top 6. |  |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 02:36 - Jul 26 with 1110 views | STID2017 |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 02:29 - Jul 26 by Dr_Parnassus |
Again, that’s football, you have to adapt and use your resources and knowledge of the game.
I don’t think we ever managed to replace Dan James and we were only able to replace McBurnie in January when we brought Brewster in. He just got on with it, nobody suggesting we write a season off - we ended up 6th and giving us an outside chance of play off victory.
This side is very much the same as last year. The only difference is Allen for Downes plus we now have a stronger defence.
We do have a weakness at left back and potentially goalkeeper but I still expect to see some loans come in. Remember we very rarely have a perfect side and there is weaknesses usually somewhere or other.
Even back to Brendans side it had Alan Tate and Mark Gower in it.
Piroe, Obafemi and Pato are an incredible front 3.
Ntcham, Grimes and Allen are a very good middle 3.
Naughton, Woods/Cabango, Darling are a very good defensive 3.
Leaving Fisher and Manning as potential weaknesses. Anytime you go into a season with only 2 weaknesses, you have to be looking top 6. |
As it stands and with no further additions and IMHO this squad will do some serious damage in the Championship.
Rip Piroe and Obafemi from it without adequate replacements between September and January, then we are struggling for goals, whatever the strength elsewhere in the squad. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 05:13 - Jul 26 with 1093 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 02:36 - Jul 26 by STID2017 |
As it stands and with no further additions and IMHO this squad will do some serious damage in the Championship.
Rip Piroe and Obafemi from it without adequate replacements between September and January, then we are struggling for goals, whatever the strength elsewhere in the squad. |
We won’t lose both, but we may well lose Piroe.
But Martin would have been aware of that for a long time. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 07:50 - Jul 26 with 1077 views | jojaca |
I personally think the squad is weaker going into the first game, I think we will miss Christie and Wolf's work rate. I can't comment Matthew Sorinola yet, but on paper it does not look an upgrade over Wolf. Given the choice between Allen and Downes at this stage, you would pick Downes all day long.
Also everyone is presuming Darling and Wood are good signings, the championship is step up for them. These could quite easily flop.
We have not addressed any issues with the team from last season, no pace in the team, no creative playmaker, no set piece expert and still have wingback/wingers problems. We have a bloated squad and can't struggle to shift players on because quite frankly some of them would struggle in league two. |  |
| Even when you know, you never know? |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 08:40 - Jul 26 with 1053 views | magicdaps10 |
I think that a massive issue here, it's being said that people who are saying that posters who asked to give Martin time are now being called out and their time is up.
I just don't understand why the expectation that is being set is now too 6!
I agree that the transition time umis up but that doesn't then all of a sudden the expectation set by some us now a top 6 finish. It's certainly time for Martin to oroduce better than last season and that means a step forward of around 10/12th for myself.
Let's understand that last seasons transition season is gone but let's not make ridiculous and unfounded predictions. The OP along with others on here have shown weaknesses with the squad and raise concerns BUT not concerns for us to be any weaker than last seasons squad......throw in the obvious new signings we will see between now and the close of the window.
We certainly will expect and demand an improvement on last season or questions will be asked
But top 6 when you take a look at the teams in the league... Let's be real.
10/12th and anything else will be a bonus and a real achievement for all involved. |  |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:17 - Jul 26 with 1042 views | Kerouac |
The difference between last season and this season (the manager is responsible for ensuring we have a competitive squad)...
...where I think we are weaker is in bold.
GK
Last season we had Hamer and Benda in the squad, both of whom are better than Fisher. GK is now a weakness...a weakness created by the manager, HE signed fisher and forced the other 2 to seek employment elsewhere.
CB
This season we have; Cabango, Darling, Wood, Naughton, Latibeaudiere & Cooper...with Manning an option in a 3.
Last season we had; Cabango, Bennett, Rhys Williams, Naughton, Latibeaudiere & Cooper...with Manning an option in a 3.
We may be stronger here...mainly because Bennett and Williams were ditched last season, we are not necessarily stronger on paper as both Bennett and Williams had played their football at a higher level to those we have brought in.
RWB
Last season we had the loanees, Laird & then Christie, we also had the options of Naughton and Latibeaudiere (with Lati playing a decent amount of football there, Naughton playing sweeper). Garrick was loaned out, Joseph was never tried there.
This season we have Naughton and Lati & Garrick (& Joseph...but Martin doesn't seem to have the imagination to try and convert him)
LWB
Last season we had Bidwell and Manning starting off, plus Wolff was brought in on loan and ended up playing there...Ogbeta was brought in January and didn't get a sniff.
This season we have Sorinola (ex-MK Dons) and Manning...having let Ogbeta go.
DM/CM
Last season we had; Grimes, Downes, Korey Smith, Jay Fulton, Liam Walsh.
This season we have; Grimes, Allen, Jay Fulton and Liam Walsh...he may sign another on loan.
I've got us as weaker there as we have lost height, drive, and energy in Downes and Korey Smith was decent back up.
Attacking Midfield
Last season we had; Patterson, Ntcham, Wolff (who never played there) and Dhanda.
This season we have; Patterson, Ntcham, Congreve & Olli Cooper
Wingers
Last season we didn't have any, just some youngsters like Whittaker and Joseph and Garrick we could have chucked out there.
...and the same can be said of this season.
I've marked this area as weaker because Martin plays a system where the full-backs play in the winger position...he also allegedly is looking at switching to a flat back four and wingers may have been an option, even off the bench, to mix things up...
yet he has done nothing to address this weakness in our squad.
not even a bloody loanee.
Striker
Last season we had; Piroe, Obafemi, Joseph, Whittaker & Cullen
This season we have; Piroe, Obafemi, Joseph, Whittaker & Cullen
So why have I marked it weaker?
Because we will lose Piroe shortly, no doubt in my mind, are extremely unlikely to find a replacement as good and...if Martin has decided the youngsters he has as back up aren't good enough, he should have done more to move them on...he even could have loaned them all out and got enough of their wages covered to make a significant dent in us loaning a Premier League youngster as back up to Piroe and Obafemi.
You know, management of the situation. [Post edited 26 Jul 2022 9:18]
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:28 - Jul 26 with 1028 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 08:40 - Jul 26 by magicdaps10 |
I think that a massive issue here, it's being said that people who are saying that posters who asked to give Martin time are now being called out and their time is up.
I just don't understand why the expectation that is being set is now too 6!
I agree that the transition time umis up but that doesn't then all of a sudden the expectation set by some us now a top 6 finish. It's certainly time for Martin to oroduce better than last season and that means a step forward of around 10/12th for myself.
Let's understand that last seasons transition season is gone but let's not make ridiculous and unfounded predictions. The OP along with others on here have shown weaknesses with the squad and raise concerns BUT not concerns for us to be any weaker than last seasons squad......throw in the obvious new signings we will see between now and the close of the window.
We certainly will expect and demand an improvement on last season or questions will be asked
But top 6 when you take a look at the teams in the league... Let's be real.
10/12th and anything else will be a bonus and a real achievement for all involved. |
Nothing ridiculous about it at all.
This is one of the best teams we have had at this level. I can’t remember another time we have had X2 20 goal calibre strikers.
Then we have the likes of Pato, Allen, Grimes, Cabango, Darling, Naughton, Ntcham behind them. It’s a serious, serious side.
We are 8th favourites on average for the title as a result of having such a side, we have to be in the mix for top 6.
We seriously underperformed last year, so slight improvement is not good enough. Going from terrible to slightly less terrible is not acceptable.
Top 8 absolute bare minimum.
Top 6 is the realistic target. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:29 - Jul 26 with 1035 views | magicdaps10 |
I am going to a little breakdown on all individual players in what I think would be our strongest starting team, here goes.
Fisher-Jury is out on him and worries are certainly with fans. Cost 400k, not a player that seen top teams in this league chasing his signature for a relatively low fee.
Darling-A lot is expected from him at such a young age, there is a player there I am sure but again at 1.5M was there really a flurry of clubs in for him and are we just taking a calculated gamble on getting a bigger fee on him down the line.
Naughton-Coming to towards the end of his career, been a terrific pro for us. Was out of contract for us in the summer, at his age he would surely go where the money was.... Ended up renewing with us.
Cabango-As Darling, young and raw with potential. Talk of being valued x amount of Million with prem clubs being interested... Still with us.
Sorinola-Too early to ca here, seems to have potential but experience in league 1 and regular sub in Belgium is not an indicator of being a player who can take the league by storm but can certainly be a suprise.
Manning-Solid performer but comes with inconsistency. Signed from fellow champ team for a modest 250k.
Grimes-12 months ago he was less than 12 months of his contract, talk of moves to bigger championship clubs but renewed with us.
Allen-In his twilight years, bit of a coup but last couple of years has been performing to the exact level as Swansea City.
Patterson-Another we got on a free, certainly has talent and was available in January for a decent fee, a small fee for any team chasing promotion from the champ-he remains here.
Obefami and Piroe-Our 2 shining stars, the net is surely being cast by prem teams for these 2......if the club gets a top bid for either then most certainly one and quite possibly 2 woukd be gone. We certainly have a front 2 here that most teams would not only want in their squad but likely their starting 11.
Aside from the front 2, I firmly believe that's a mid tabling champ team, our front 2 have the potential to maybe make a push to the play offs but both being young coukd suffer from inconsistency and confidence, Piroe could suffer 2nd season syndrome that is quite common especially in this league.......especially if too much pressure is put on him. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:34 - Jul 26 with 1024 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:29 - Jul 26 by magicdaps10 |
I am going to a little breakdown on all individual players in what I think would be our strongest starting team, here goes.
Fisher-Jury is out on him and worries are certainly with fans. Cost 400k, not a player that seen top teams in this league chasing his signature for a relatively low fee.
Darling-A lot is expected from him at such a young age, there is a player there I am sure but again at 1.5M was there really a flurry of clubs in for him and are we just taking a calculated gamble on getting a bigger fee on him down the line.
Naughton-Coming to towards the end of his career, been a terrific pro for us. Was out of contract for us in the summer, at his age he would surely go where the money was.... Ended up renewing with us.
Cabango-As Darling, young and raw with potential. Talk of being valued x amount of Million with prem clubs being interested... Still with us.
Sorinola-Too early to ca here, seems to have potential but experience in league 1 and regular sub in Belgium is not an indicator of being a player who can take the league by storm but can certainly be a suprise.
Manning-Solid performer but comes with inconsistency. Signed from fellow champ team for a modest 250k.
Grimes-12 months ago he was less than 12 months of his contract, talk of moves to bigger championship clubs but renewed with us.
Allen-In his twilight years, bit of a coup but last couple of years has been performing to the exact level as Swansea City.
Patterson-Another we got on a free, certainly has talent and was available in January for a decent fee, a small fee for any team chasing promotion from the champ-he remains here.
Obefami and Piroe-Our 2 shining stars, the net is surely being cast by prem teams for these 2......if the club gets a top bid for either then most certainly one and quite possibly 2 woukd be gone. We certainly have a front 2 here that most teams would not only want in their squad but likely their starting 11.
Aside from the front 2, I firmly believe that's a mid tabling champ team, our front 2 have the potential to maybe make a push to the play offs but both being young coukd suffer from inconsistency and confidence, Piroe could suffer 2nd season syndrome that is quite common especially in this league.......especially if too much pressure is put on him. |
Nobody is buying the predictable early excuses Daps… 
Tick tock. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:38 - Jul 26 with 1028 views | jojaca |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:29 - Jul 26 by magicdaps10 |
I am going to a little breakdown on all individual players in what I think would be our strongest starting team, here goes.
Fisher-Jury is out on him and worries are certainly with fans. Cost 400k, not a player that seen top teams in this league chasing his signature for a relatively low fee.
Darling-A lot is expected from him at such a young age, there is a player there I am sure but again at 1.5M was there really a flurry of clubs in for him and are we just taking a calculated gamble on getting a bigger fee on him down the line.
Naughton-Coming to towards the end of his career, been a terrific pro for us. Was out of contract for us in the summer, at his age he would surely go where the money was.... Ended up renewing with us.
Cabango-As Darling, young and raw with potential. Talk of being valued x amount of Million with prem clubs being interested... Still with us.
Sorinola-Too early to ca here, seems to have potential but experience in league 1 and regular sub in Belgium is not an indicator of being a player who can take the league by storm but can certainly be a suprise.
Manning-Solid performer but comes with inconsistency. Signed from fellow champ team for a modest 250k.
Grimes-12 months ago he was less than 12 months of his contract, talk of moves to bigger championship clubs but renewed with us.
Allen-In his twilight years, bit of a coup but last couple of years has been performing to the exact level as Swansea City.
Patterson-Another we got on a free, certainly has talent and was available in January for a decent fee, a small fee for any team chasing promotion from the champ-he remains here.
Obefami and Piroe-Our 2 shining stars, the net is surely being cast by prem teams for these 2......if the club gets a top bid for either then most certainly one and quite possibly 2 woukd be gone. We certainly have a front 2 here that most teams would not only want in their squad but likely their starting 11.
Aside from the front 2, I firmly believe that's a mid tabling champ team, our front 2 have the potential to maybe make a push to the play offs but both being young coukd suffer from inconsistency and confidence, Piroe could suffer 2nd season syndrome that is quite common especially in this league.......especially if too much pressure is put on him. |
I agree apart from the front 2, the team is very ordinary. | |
| Even when you know, you never know? |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:47 - Jul 26 with 1017 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:38 - Jul 26 by jojaca |
I agree apart from the front 2, the team is very ordinary. |
Naughton - top performer, Premier League experience
Cabango - International defender tipped for the Premier League
Darling - Exellent defender with a big football league reputation, tipped for the Premier League
Joe Allen - International midfielder with Premier League experience
Matt Grimes - One of the best midfielders in the Championship
Pato - 9 goals and 9 assists last term, a special player for us
Ntcham - Former French U21 player with Champions League and Europa League experience
Piroe - 22 goals last season, valued at 20m
Obafemi - deadly International striker, easily capable of £20+ goals
As far as Championship squads go, you can see why the bookies have made us 8th favourites for the title, which is the shortest we have been since Potters first season.
No more excuses, we have had the benefit of 50+ practice matches. No other team wrote a whole season off to prepare for this one. When you do that, you have to deliver. A slight improvement is not good enough, not even close.
We should be ready and raring to go from minute 1, more than any other side in the division.
Top 8 bare minimum. Top 6 the realistic target [Post edited 26 Jul 2022 9:53]
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 10:02 - Jul 26 with 1011 views | magicdaps10 |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 09:38 - Jul 26 by jojaca |
I agree apart from the front 2, the team is very ordinary. |
I think that's clear, the front 2 are a shining star but the rest are very ordinary aside from Darling who could join Piroe and Obefami as the season goes on.
If Darling was signed with championship experience then he would most certainly be the 3rd man but its his first step into this division so the jury will be out.
We have the stars who could kick us on to a possible challenge for the play offs but we woukd be outsiders for sure, anything else would be us batting above our capabilities but if all clicks and confidence is high then its possible.
Realistically wity what we have, we sit in that group no 2 in and around 8th-14th but with a little bit of star factor in 2 possibly 3 players...... Pending if Piroe and Obefami stay and Darling makes the step up. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 10:34 - Jul 26 with 988 views | magicdaps10 |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 10:05 - Jul 26 by Dr_Parnassus |
Clear to you as you are trying to dumb down expectations because you aren’t confident Russell can deliver, even after writing off a whole season.
The fact you are saying 14th is hilarious
The bookies, experts and data analysts also have us top 8.
Top 8 minimum. Top 6 aim.
That’s the mantra. [Post edited 26 Jul 2022 10:06]
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My prediction is top half, between 10/12th.
Nookies vary in having us between 7th and 14th as we previously discussed so clearly in the word you use, that is the mantra.
I am not dumbing down expectations, I am just not clearly expecting the same outcome as yourself, could be argued that you are upping the expectations!
How do you want me to play this, over hype the season.
A. When we don't reach the levels then Martin fails
B. We do well and say that I was right and/or Martin has changed things.
I am not going to cover angles just so I can come out of it looking roset or to have a knock at Martin. I am calling it one way and that's the way I see it logically, I am not chasing self satisfaction or wanting higher ground to make myself look like the oracle of all Swansea City forums, I am a bit more humble than that.
Stop trying to be silly, I have given my views and explained them but you are clearly as requested by the admin now not respecting my views and are trying to belittle me.
We don't agree, nothing wrong with that and I have explained why I think we won't be top 6th or top 8, that should be enough for you. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 10:45 - Jul 26 with 972 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 10:34 - Jul 26 by magicdaps10 |
My prediction is top half, between 10/12th.
Nookies vary in having us between 7th and 14th as we previously discussed so clearly in the word you use, that is the mantra.
I am not dumbing down expectations, I am just not clearly expecting the same outcome as yourself, could be argued that you are upping the expectations!
How do you want me to play this, over hype the season.
A. When we don't reach the levels then Martin fails
B. We do well and say that I was right and/or Martin has changed things.
I am not going to cover angles just so I can come out of it looking roset or to have a knock at Martin. I am calling it one way and that's the way I see it logically, I am not chasing self satisfaction or wanting higher ground to make myself look like the oracle of all Swansea City forums, I am a bit more humble than that.
Stop trying to be silly, I have given my views and explained them but you are clearly as requested by the admin now not respecting my views and are trying to belittle me.
We don't agree, nothing wrong with that and I have explained why I think we won't be top 6th or top 8, that should be enough for you. |
Who has us 14th? 
The average bookies position is 8th, you were told that before when you tried to make out the average was 10th.
I’m not upping expectations at all, mine are entirely aligned with reality and what the experts think and have projected.
I was expecting 10-12th last season as an acceptable season - that seemed to be what most were saying, this season we need to kick on from where we should have been last season - not where we ended up.
It’s very easy to deflect accountability at the time in order to push it away for a while, but when that time comes you have to back it up. Dumbing down expectations just won’t wash, and of course I predicted that would be the course of action months ago. Could see it a mile off.
Towards the end of last season you were arguing we shouldn’t play the kids because we could make the play offs. That was your aim with a handful of games left… in a season we wrote off remember.
You now are seemingly happy to come 12th or even 14th.
You are setting targets unrealistically low simply because you don’t want to trip over that bar and have to criticise the managers performance.
It’s as simple as that. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 11:26 - Jul 26 with 946 views | magicdaps10 |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 10:45 - Jul 26 by Dr_Parnassus |
Who has us 14th?
The average bookies position is 8th, you were told that before when you tried to make out the average was 10th.
I’m not upping expectations at all, mine are entirely aligned with reality and what the experts think and have projected.
I was expecting 10-12th last season as an acceptable season - that seemed to be what most were saying, this season we need to kick on from where we should have been last season - not where we ended up.
It’s very easy to deflect accountability at the time in order to push it away for a while, but when that time comes you have to back it up. Dumbing down expectations just won’t wash, and of course I predicted that would be the course of action months ago. Could see it a mile off.
Towards the end of last season you were arguing we shouldn’t play the kids because we could make the play offs. That was your aim with a handful of games left… in a season we wrote off remember.
You now are seemingly happy to come 12th or even 14th.
You are setting targets unrealistically low simply because you don’t want to trip over that bar and have to criticise the managers performance.
It’s as simple as that. |
Just as easy to call what is really expected and big it up to something that's not realistic, only to play on those realistic outcomes as failure.
You can tell myself and others as much as you like, its your opinion and not a solid requirement accept in your head as others have their own on their minds.
I have backed my thoughts up as you have, a few have agreed with you and some have the same mindset as myself as to where we will finish, the OP can even see the issues with the squad not looking too clever, maybe take it up with him aswell and try and get him to think the same as yourself or tell him that he is making excuses.
The proof in the pudding will be the outcome, you got last seasons finish wrong and I along with others called it.........if you are realistic you will have more chance in calling it, unrealistic then you will likely be wrong but you can always hedge your bets and find someone to blame to spare your blushes.
Quite simple really, if you can't see that you are kidding yourself then you will spend a lifetime thinking that you are kidding others. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 11:55 - Jul 26 with 918 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 11:26 - Jul 26 by magicdaps10 |
Just as easy to call what is really expected and big it up to something that's not realistic, only to play on those realistic outcomes as failure.
You can tell myself and others as much as you like, its your opinion and not a solid requirement accept in your head as others have their own on their minds.
I have backed my thoughts up as you have, a few have agreed with you and some have the same mindset as myself as to where we will finish, the OP can even see the issues with the squad not looking too clever, maybe take it up with him aswell and try and get him to think the same as yourself or tell him that he is making excuses.
The proof in the pudding will be the outcome, you got last seasons finish wrong and I along with others called it.........if you are realistic you will have more chance in calling it, unrealistic then you will likely be wrong but you can always hedge your bets and find someone to blame to spare your blushes.
Quite simple really, if you can't see that you are kidding yourself then you will spend a lifetime thinking that you are kidding others. |
Again, my expectations align with what the experts, data analysts and bookmakers think. Nothing unrealistic about that at all.
Last season you expected mid table and were also championing a play off push. This in a season you were banging on about transition and it being simply a building season.
Now you expect us to buy that after all that your expectations are the same or even lower than last season?
Not fooling me Daps. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 12:02 - Jul 26 with 910 views | magicdaps10 |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 11:55 - Jul 26 by Dr_Parnassus |
Again, my expectations align with what the experts, data analysts and bookmakers think. Nothing unrealistic about that at all.
Last season you expected mid table and were also championing a play off push. This in a season you were banging on about transition and it being simply a building season.
Now you expect us to buy that after all that your expectations are the same or even lower than last season?
Not fooling me Daps. |
Quite clearly fooled yourself then. | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 12:05 - Jul 26 with 904 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 12:02 - Jul 26 by magicdaps10 |
Quite clearly fooled yourself then. |
I don’t get fooled.
I predicted what you would be doing months ago, you are playing exactly the cards I thought you would.
I see you have avoided the charity football bet like the plague as have all the other members of the gang, how predictable. When it comes to the crunch, the usual mob get their running shoes on… | |
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 12:12 - Jul 26 with 901 views | Kerouac |
| The Squad 2022-2023 on 11:26 - Jul 26 by magicdaps10 |
Just as easy to call what is really expected and big it up to something that's not realistic, only to play on those realistic outcomes as failure.
You can tell myself and others as much as you like, its your opinion and not a solid requirement accept in your head as others have their own on their minds.
I have backed my thoughts up as you have, a few have agreed with you and some have the same mindset as myself as to where we will finish, the OP can even see the issues with the squad not looking too clever, maybe take it up with him aswell and try and get him to think the same as yourself or tell him that he is making excuses.
The proof in the pudding will be the outcome, you got last seasons finish wrong and I along with others called it.........if you are realistic you will have more chance in calling it, unrealistic then you will likely be wrong but you can always hedge your bets and find someone to blame to spare your blushes.
Quite simple really, if you can't see that you are kidding yourself then you will spend a lifetime thinking that you are kidding others. |
I am the OP and I am holding Martin responsible for not addressing weak areas of the squad, he has had a whole season, we are in his third window.
He is not developing youngsters, he puts players in positions they are unsuited to...I am all for adapting the squads by asking players to learn new positions (for example, Naughton could do a good job as a DM, Joseph could be a decent RWB, Wood might be able to help us at LWB)...but this is not what Martin is doing.
His 'plan' is incoherent, much like his defenders.
What Dr. P says is also true, on paper in key areas, he has quality that is not available to other managers in this division...the fact that he produces a team and a squad that is more likely to struggle than gain promotion is squarely on his shoulders.
He is meant to play to the squad's strengths and hide/work on the weaknesses, he is meant to shape the squad so we have options.
...and I should also add, that after the defence of Martin put up here last season, the one where we were told results weren't important, "he is building for next season"...then yes, he has to deliver. [Post edited 26 Jul 2022 12:15]
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| The Squad 2022-2023 on 12:13 - Jul 26 with 899 views | vetchonian |
Its all about opinions, we have lost Wolf who was shoe horned into the left WB slot and Christie on the right otherwise we have supposedly strengthened with Darling and Wood, Allen replaces Downes, those others leaving Bennet who didnt feature much, Korey Smith.
Congrave is breaking through we have lots in Pato, Obafemi and Piroe its where the manager should be working utiilising the resources to their best strengths rather than trying to play to a system no other manager or team attempts.
We brought in Ogebeta who with the small appearances he has made looks as if he has something yet for whatever reason still to be explained MArtin doesnt like him |  |
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