| Club announcement pending 20:58 - Jul 20 with 40432 views | KeithHaynes |
Sorry we can’t bring any more than this at the moment, but it’s only fair we place on record we are told the club are about to make an announcement. It would be wrong to speculate any further at this time.
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| Club announcement pending on 09:03 - Jul 21 with 2211 views | vetchonian |
| Club announcement pending on 08:51 - Jul 21 by Dr_Winston |
Think the club are hoping to come to a "mutual consent" agreement which will be cheaper than paying him off, hence they're doing their very best to make it look like they're not pushing him out. |
Then all the more sense that he is on gardening leave whilst the matter is concluded...
If he leaves at the end of this week when the agreement is reached and he walks with no job to go to how does that look?
If this is the case it would be far better managed if Cooper et al are put on gardening leave with a statement " After discussions with Steve it has been mutually decided that now is a good time for a change in our coaching staff, we would like Steve and his staff for their service and commitment over the last seasons and wish them well for their futrures.Further announcements regrding a new coach will follow"
This could have been done 2 or even 3 weeks ago it would have the same outcome as if Cooper leaves today by "mutual consent"... and it would have prevented all the current rumour mongering and the unsettling of potential recruitment.....and guess what it doesnt look at all like they are not pushing him out.....its what you believe! |  |
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| Club announcement pending on 09:09 - Jul 21 with 2155 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Club announcement pending on 09:02 - Jul 21 by KeithHaynes |
180k are his earnings for the year if the rumours are to be believed. |
You see, that’s peanuts really isn’t it.
Do you happen to know where that puts him with regards to the rest of the league, out of interest?
£3.5k a week.
A manager that is twice knocking on the door to a £120m promotion to the richest league in the world and he’s on what I would imagine is a league 1 squad rotation player salary.
It’s no wonder he’s not looking too happy. [Post edited 21 Jul 2021 9:13]
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| Club announcement pending on 09:15 - Jul 21 with 2145 views | Whiterockin |
| Club announcement pending on 09:09 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
You see, that’s peanuts really isn’t it.
Do you happen to know where that puts him with regards to the rest of the league, out of interest?
£3.5k a week.
A manager that is twice knocking on the door to a £120m promotion to the richest league in the world and he’s on what I would imagine is a league 1 squad rotation player salary.
It’s no wonder he’s not looking too happy. [Post edited 21 Jul 2021 9:13]
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I imagine there would be a promotion bonus in place if it was achieved. I remember there was reportedly a £1M bonus in place for managers to keep us in the Premier League so it's safe to say there is a bonus in place to get us there. |  | | |
| Club announcement pending on 09:22 - Jul 21 with 2110 views | KeithHaynes |
| Club announcement pending on 09:09 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
You see, that’s peanuts really isn’t it.
Do you happen to know where that puts him with regards to the rest of the league, out of interest?
£3.5k a week.
A manager that is twice knocking on the door to a £120m promotion to the richest league in the world and he’s on what I would imagine is a league 1 squad rotation player salary.
It’s no wonder he’s not looking too happy. [Post edited 21 Jul 2021 9:13]
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At the bottom I would imagine. Or close to it. I would say he must have bonus clauses. | |
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| Club announcement pending on 09:28 - Jul 21 with 2072 views | vetchonian |
| Club announcement pending on 09:22 - Jul 21 by KeithHaynes |
At the bottom I would imagine. Or close to it. I would say he must have bonus clauses. |
IT probably is a very low salary for the role...I would imagine given his "inexperience" at club level management this would have been a factor when the salary given at appointment that said two season on he has delivered in terms of results and league table finish..
He may well have had bonus clauses but he may feel that given his "performance" his basic should be nore in line with "market value" as these other "higher" paid managers may have similar bonus clauses too | |
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| Club announcement pending on 09:30 - Jul 21 with 2058 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Club announcement pending on 09:22 - Jul 21 by KeithHaynes |
At the bottom I would imagine. Or close to it. I would say he must have bonus clauses. |
Yeah he must do.
Although it’s still pretty galling having the clauses be that you only get paid close to the market rate if you overachieve to such an unrealistic degree. Assuming they are promotion ones that is, they may not be I suppose.
Being taken on as somewhat of a risk with no club experience before, I don’t think it’s unreasonable that he was on such a salary. But after improving on the 10th place position that the previous manager achieved with a 6th and a 4th, you can see why there may be some animosity from his direction if the club continue to want to do things on the cheap.
I really do have a strong feeling this is a contract wrangle. It makes far more logical sense than the club wanting to get rid of a man they pay peanuts to who delivers such finishes, it really makes zero logical sense. | |
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| Club announcement pending on 09:30 - Jul 21 with 2064 views | jack247 |
| Club announcement pending on 08:56 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
Well it will depend what has gone on since then. Where we find ourselves today may not be where we were 4 weeks ago.
They may well have insisted his fee was £4.5m which scuppered his chance to manage it PL level and as a result of that has kicked up a fuss and started to make his position untenable.
We know absolutely nothing, and unless someone comes out and categorically lays it on the line, it’s unlikely anything that happens will tell us anything either.
The negativity is ridiculous. You aren’t blind to it, I’m sure you are well aware of what I’m talking about. |
If we’ve demanded £4.5m or anywhere near it, then he’s kicked off and we end up paying him off, then Winter doesn’t deserve to be anywhere near running a football club.
Not that I believe for a second that’s happened. My guess, and it’s nothing more than that, is we wanted him out, he wanted to go, Palace and Fulham sniffed around but didn’t want him, which has led us to where we are now.
The lack of comment from anyone all summer while he’s been speaking to other clubs tends to support that. | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 09:33 - Jul 21 with 2055 views | KeithHaynes |
| Club announcement pending on 09:30 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
Yeah he must do.
Although it’s still pretty galling having the clauses be that you only get paid close to the market rate if you overachieve to such an unrealistic degree. Assuming they are promotion ones that is, they may not be I suppose.
Being taken on as somewhat of a risk with no club experience before, I don’t think it’s unreasonable that he was on such a salary. But after improving on the 10th place position that the previous manager achieved with a 6th and a 4th, you can see why there may be some animosity from his direction if the club continue to want to do things on the cheap.
I really do have a strong feeling this is a contract wrangle. It makes far more logical sense than the club wanting to get rid of a man they pay peanuts to who delivers such finishes, it really makes zero logical sense. |
Without a doubt, numerous people are surprised this has taken so long and believe it’s just a legal matter. | |
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| Club announcement pending on 09:34 - Jul 21 with 2041 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Club announcement pending on 09:30 - Jul 21 by jack247 |
If we’ve demanded £4.5m or anywhere near it, then he’s kicked off and we end up paying him off, then Winter doesn’t deserve to be anywhere near running a football club.
Not that I believe for a second that’s happened. My guess, and it’s nothing more than that, is we wanted him out, he wanted to go, Palace and Fulham sniffed around but didn’t want him, which has led us to where we are now.
The lack of comment from anyone all summer while he’s been speaking to other clubs tends to support that. |
What logical reason would a club want a manager out that they pay 3k a week to who achieves play off finishes every year after being given less and less money to spend on the squad?
Just makes no sense on any level. It’s far more likely Cooper is asking for big money after going close to a move to a bigger club after proving himself year on year and the club don’t wish to pay him the amount he’s asking.
The relationship may well have broken down rapidly since the Palace talks. [Post edited 21 Jul 2021 9:35]
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| Club announcement pending on 09:54 - Jul 21 with 1938 views | guthrieintherain |
| Club announcement pending on 09:34 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
What logical reason would a club want a manager out that they pay 3k a week to who achieves play off finishes every year after being given less and less money to spend on the squad?
Just makes no sense on any level. It’s far more likely Cooper is asking for big money after going close to a move to a bigger club after proving himself year on year and the club don’t wish to pay him the amount he’s asking.
The relationship may well have broken down rapidly since the Palace talks. [Post edited 21 Jul 2021 9:35]
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Big money we would be mad to pay it.
Cooper needs to get on with the job he agreed to do for 3 years on the contract terms he signed.
To throw his toys out because they won't give him a pay rise is out of order.
Nobody forced him to sign the contract he is on.
And the football is dull as dishwater.
Get on with the job or resign. | |
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| Club announcement pending on 10:02 - Jul 21 with 1908 views | Thornburyswan |
| Club announcement pending on 09:09 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
You see, that’s peanuts really isn’t it.
Do you happen to know where that puts him with regards to the rest of the league, out of interest?
£3.5k a week.
A manager that is twice knocking on the door to a £120m promotion to the richest league in the world and he’s on what I would imagine is a league 1 squad rotation player salary.
It’s no wonder he’s not looking too happy. [Post edited 21 Jul 2021 9:13]
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If he is on £3.5K per week until next June sacking him plus full severance would ‘only’ be £168K (plus lower amounts for any of his team we need/want to exit) & whilst clearly every £ matters in our position there is a balance between battling on to save a few quid & the club/players/potential players being impacted. | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 10:05 - Jul 21 with 1895 views | jack247 |
| Club announcement pending on 09:34 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
What logical reason would a club want a manager out that they pay 3k a week to who achieves play off finishes every year after being given less and less money to spend on the squad?
Just makes no sense on any level. It’s far more likely Cooper is asking for big money after going close to a move to a bigger club after proving himself year on year and the club don’t wish to pay him the amount he’s asking.
The relationship may well have broken down rapidly since the Palace talks. [Post edited 21 Jul 2021 9:35]
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My view on him is that he’s on a downward trajectory, he certainly was towards the end of the season, maybe our board feel the same.
If we demanded top dollar from Palace and didn’t envisage him being unhappy or wanting more from us, then again, Winter isn’t fit for purpose. Far more likely is Palace just didn’t want him.
He’s not stupid, it would make no sense to kick off to the extent that we part ways when he’s got nowhere to go. Far better for his career and reputation to see his contract out.
If anything, it shows ambition from the club, either they don’t think he can repeat the playoffs, or in terms of playing style. If all they want is stability, he’s certainly not going to get us relegated. | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 10:07 - Jul 21 with 1879 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Club announcement pending on 09:54 - Jul 21 by guthrieintherain |
Big money we would be mad to pay it.
Cooper needs to get on with the job he agreed to do for 3 years on the contract terms he signed.
To throw his toys out because they won't give him a pay rise is out of order.
Nobody forced him to sign the contract he is on.
And the football is dull as dishwater.
Get on with the job or resign. |
Depends what was agreed verbally between them, I think it’s entirely logical that they sold it as a starting salary where he would get more as he proves he can do the job successfully. That’s often what happens in the work place.
The issue we have is what was potentially verbally agreed under previous chairmanship may not stand under this one. Again this is speculation but it seems to be the likely source of any animosity as opposed to the club wanting a successful manager out that we pay peanuts to.
He’s on one of the lowest salaries in the league whilst being one of the top performing managers. It would be irrational to think there wouldn’t be any animosity with that situation as it’s true in every other job position within football. | |
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| Club announcement pending on 10:24 - Jul 21 with 1816 views | Whiterockin |
| Club announcement pending on 10:02 - Jul 21 by Thornburyswan |
If he is on £3.5K per week until next June sacking him plus full severance would ‘only’ be £168K (plus lower amounts for any of his team we need/want to exit) & whilst clearly every £ matters in our position there is a balance between battling on to save a few quid & the club/players/potential players being impacted. |
I think the sticking point on the severance payment could well be any bonuses he may or may not have achieved. This could dwarf his low basic salary. | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 10:25 - Jul 21 with 1794 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Club announcement pending on 10:05 - Jul 21 by jack247 |
My view on him is that he’s on a downward trajectory, he certainly was towards the end of the season, maybe our board feel the same.
If we demanded top dollar from Palace and didn’t envisage him being unhappy or wanting more from us, then again, Winter isn’t fit for purpose. Far more likely is Palace just didn’t want him.
He’s not stupid, it would make no sense to kick off to the extent that we part ways when he’s got nowhere to go. Far better for his career and reputation to see his contract out.
If anything, it shows ambition from the club, either they don’t think he can repeat the playoffs, or in terms of playing style. If all they want is stability, he’s certainly not going to get us relegated. |
Unlikely, periods of form are part and parcel of the game. We have improved every year under Cooper, it’s undeniable.
10th - Potter
6th and a play off semi - Cooper
4th and a play off final - Cooper
I would say there is almost zero chance that a club paying someone 3k a week to achieve the above would want him out for footballing reasons.
The only reason that would logically happen is if there has been a breakdown in relationship. Going from what Keith has said regarding his salary, that would be the clear and obvious starting point.
If you took our form from January to the end of the season we would be 6th. It seems incredibly unlikely that is the source of any issues that may or may not be there. | |
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| Club announcement pending on 10:40 - Jul 21 with 1737 views | Prettyvisitor |
| Club announcement pending on 10:25 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
Unlikely, periods of form are part and parcel of the game. We have improved every year under Cooper, it’s undeniable.
10th - Potter
6th and a play off semi - Cooper
4th and a play off final - Cooper
I would say there is almost zero chance that a club paying someone 3k a week to achieve the above would want him out for footballing reasons.
The only reason that would logically happen is if there has been a breakdown in relationship. Going from what Keith has said regarding his salary, that would be the clear and obvious starting point.
If you took our form from January to the end of the season we would be 6th. It seems incredibly unlikely that is the source of any issues that may or may not be there. |
Exactly this, you have to question the intentions of Winter wanting rid of a manager who's so successful on a decreasing budget, literally makes no sense.
I don't even think it's purely financial, i think Winter probably wanted rid of him from the get go. Cooper publicly challenging him on the selling of Peterson behind his back was an early indication of how things were going to go.
Just feel he probably wants to install his own yes man, someone who'll stay quiet and not question any outgoings or lack of a budget. | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 10:46 - Jul 21 with 1692 views | Thornburyswan |
| Club announcement pending on 10:24 - Jul 21 by Whiterockin |
I think the sticking point on the severance payment could well be any bonuses he may or may not have achieved. This could dwarf his low basic salary. |
Could be WR but you’d think any bonuses would have related to promotion being achieved, play-off position & maybe play-off final qualification - all of which relate to last season so any accrued bonus would have been earned & presumably paid (if not paid we have more problems than Cooper!).
Doubt any bonuses would link to making it to the final year of the contract but what do I know! | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 10:49 - Jul 21 with 1678 views | Whiterockin |
| Club announcement pending on 10:40 - Jul 21 by Prettyvisitor |
Exactly this, you have to question the intentions of Winter wanting rid of a manager who's so successful on a decreasing budget, literally makes no sense.
I don't even think it's purely financial, i think Winter probably wanted rid of him from the get go. Cooper publicly challenging him on the selling of Peterson behind his back was an early indication of how things were going to go.
Just feel he probably wants to install his own yes man, someone who'll stay quiet and not question any outgoings or lack of a budget. |
There is no way Winter would jeopardise the club for personal pride. He is answerable to the board and and would soon be out the door if they thought it would compromise their investment. | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 10:56 - Jul 21 with 1631 views | Whiterockin |
| Club announcement pending on 10:46 - Jul 21 by Thornburyswan |
Could be WR but you’d think any bonuses would have related to promotion being achieved, play-off position & maybe play-off final qualification - all of which relate to last season so any accrued bonus would have been earned & presumably paid (if not paid we have more problems than Cooper!).
Doubt any bonuses would link to making it to the final year of the contract but what do I know! |
The big bonus would be for promotion. If it was me I would argue after play offs then play off final a progression to promotion is entirely feasible. So sacked before given the chance to achieve that within the terms of my contract I should be reimbursed. | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 11:06 - Jul 21 with 1565 views | jack247 |
| Club announcement pending on 10:25 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
Unlikely, periods of form are part and parcel of the game. We have improved every year under Cooper, it’s undeniable.
10th - Potter
6th and a play off semi - Cooper
4th and a play off final - Cooper
I would say there is almost zero chance that a club paying someone 3k a week to achieve the above would want him out for footballing reasons.
The only reason that would logically happen is if there has been a breakdown in relationship. Going from what Keith has said regarding his salary, that would be the clear and obvious starting point.
If you took our form from January to the end of the season we would be 6th. It seems incredibly unlikely that is the source of any issues that may or may not be there. |
Someone on £3k a week isn’t going to be expensive to pay off. I’m not sure why that’s accepted as fact either, it only seems to have surfaced this morning.
We’re also not going to replace him with anyone expensive. I expect Toshack would be among the early favourites.
Again, if we’ve demanded top dollar from Palace and then mugged him off, a breakdown in relations wouldn’t be hard to predict. You’d think we’d have considered that before any compensation talk with them. | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 11:11 - Jul 21 with 1541 views | vetchonian |
| Club announcement pending on 11:06 - Jul 21 by jack247 |
Someone on £3k a week isn’t going to be expensive to pay off. I’m not sure why that’s accepted as fact either, it only seems to have surfaced this morning.
We’re also not going to replace him with anyone expensive. I expect Toshack would be among the early favourites.
Again, if we’ve demanded top dollar from Palace and then mugged him off, a breakdown in relations wouldn’t be hard to predict. You’d think we’d have considered that before any compensation talk with them. |
IF we have priced him out of the Palace job and then not been prepared to up his salary then he would have a strong case for constructive dismissal surely | |
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| Club announcement pending on 11:15 - Jul 21 with 1517 views | Whiterockin |
| Club announcement pending on 11:11 - Jul 21 by vetchonian |
IF we have priced him out of the Palace job and then not been prepared to up his salary then he would have a strong case for constructive dismissal surely |
No a chance.
All we have done is stuck to the compensation in the contract and asked him to fulfil his current contract | | | |
| Club announcement pending on 11:19 - Jul 21 with 1473 views | Dr_Parnassus |
| Club announcement pending on 11:06 - Jul 21 by jack247 |
Someone on £3k a week isn’t going to be expensive to pay off. I’m not sure why that’s accepted as fact either, it only seems to have surfaced this morning.
We’re also not going to replace him with anyone expensive. I expect Toshack would be among the early favourites.
Again, if we’ve demanded top dollar from Palace and then mugged him off, a breakdown in relations wouldn’t be hard to predict. You’d think we’d have considered that before any compensation talk with them. |
That’s my point, if they wanted him gone then they would have paid him off long ago when they still have time to get a replacement in. There is literally no logical reason whatsoever for the narrative that is being painted (footballing reasons).
Knowing our budget to replace the manager is going to be so low it makes even less sense that we would want him gone knowing there would unlikely be another manager out there willing to accept such an amount and give the club such returns.
We have no idea what’s gone on behind the scenes with Palace, the club or Cooper. What we can say with relative safety is that wanting such a manager out who is on so little salary that achieves what he does is almost a non starter, on a football front anyway.
A feeling of underachievement? Almost certainly not.
A clash of personalities? Maybe, but unlikely.
A wrangle over finances which has created a massive rift? The most likely by an absolute country mile from the information we have. [Post edited 21 Jul 2021 11:30]
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| Club announcement pending on 11:28 - Jul 21 with 1422 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Something is afoot...
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| Club announcement pending on 11:44 - Jul 21 with 1343 views | vetchonian |
| Club announcement pending on 11:28 - Jul 21 by Dr_Parnassus |
Something is afoot...
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16 minutes and counting or will it be "High Noon" | |
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