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Rotherham and Sheff Wednesday aren't much cop, which probably means we need to finish above one more team. Now that Ainsworth has gone, I'm confident we'll do that. You've got to be pretty awful to get relegated from this league.
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 23:06 - Nov 14 with 9274 views
Look at how much better we are after just two games under MC. Give him time and I think we’ll probably be looking pretty good in the back half of the season
We need to get the gap down to 1 or 2 points asap. That will firm belief that we can catch and pass the teams above. We still have good players and now what seems like a proper manager and that gives me hope.
I think sometimes its better to know you're in trouble early doors rather than get sucked in later in the season when it can be hard to stop the momentum.
[Post edited 15 Nov 2023 0:03]
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 06:37 - Nov 15 with 8992 views
OP seems about right. We probably need to win 8 home games, having won 1 in last year. Wednesday, Rotherham and Huddersfield are all poor but where are our goals going to come from?
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 07:02 - Nov 15 with 8964 views
The club has got used to losing, it’s a habit…. Two or three years now There’s no standards at deep rooted levels and output well below mediocre has become acceptable; scandalously to lots of fans as well. The tools available are at best blunt and I just don’t see them being sharpened or replaced.
Dont see any seismic shift being possible
Stated above we need to find a third club to finish above. Okay. Look at the table and tell me who you see that being in the bottom half?
Shame but was always coming
Cherish and enjoy life.... this ain't no dress rehearsal
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 07:46 - Nov 15 with 8916 views
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 07:02 - Nov 15 by Lblock
If Marti keeps this lot up I’ll be amazed
The club has got used to losing, it’s a habit…. Two or three years now There’s no standards at deep rooted levels and output well below mediocre has become acceptable; scandalously to lots of fans as well. The tools available are at best blunt and I just don’t see them being sharpened or replaced.
Dont see any seismic shift being possible
Stated above we need to find a third club to finish above. Okay. Look at the table and tell me who you see that being in the bottom half?
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 07:02 - Nov 15 by Lblock
If Marti keeps this lot up I’ll be amazed
The club has got used to losing, it’s a habit…. Two or three years now There’s no standards at deep rooted levels and output well below mediocre has become acceptable; scandalously to lots of fans as well. The tools available are at best blunt and I just don’t see them being sharpened or replaced.
Dont see any seismic shift being possible
Stated above we need to find a third club to finish above. Okay. Look at the table and tell me who you see that being in the bottom half?
Shame but was always coming
Birmingham; Rooney in charge and people like Roberts and Laird in the trenches.
I've gone for the heroic no (orange) because ideally we'd have seen a win in one of those last two games. But I'm hopeful. Just the fact that we've got a game plan that involves us actually having the ball is cause for quiet optimism.
Stefan Moore, Stefan Moore running down the wing. Stefan Moore, Stefan Moore running down the wing. He runs like a cheetah, his crosses couldn't be sweeter. Stefan Moore. Stefan Moore. Stefan Moore.
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 09:38 - Nov 15 with 8690 views
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 07:02 - Nov 15 by Lblock
If Marti keeps this lot up I’ll be amazed
The club has got used to losing, it’s a habit…. Two or three years now There’s no standards at deep rooted levels and output well below mediocre has become acceptable; scandalously to lots of fans as well. The tools available are at best blunt and I just don’t see them being sharpened or replaced.
Dont see any seismic shift being possible
Stated above we need to find a third club to finish above. Okay. Look at the table and tell me who you see that being in the bottom half?
Shame but was always coming
I agree. To turn around some of the worst form in the football league to what will be mid-table form with a side with almost no goals in it is a monumental task. I like what I’ve a seen already from Marti so hope we can stick with him and build again should be get relegated.
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 10:01 - Nov 15 with 8574 views
If we had a player capable of scoring ten goals in a season I would be confident of reaching the 46 points that is normally enough.
I suspect that we will need 30 points from the second half of the season, which is doable. But only if we manage to find someone to put the ball in the net.
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 10:35 - Nov 15 with 8506 views
I think Plymouth will be down there. Their home record is reasonably decent but away from home they look pretty ropey, one of three not to have won away yet. They've scored a mad amount of home goals so far (20 in 8 games but also conceded a few as well) but this scoring won't continue you'd think and they'll need to pick up some away points.
Bookies give us a 2 in 3 chance of going down which is fair IMO.
I don’t think it’s inconceivable we lose at least one of Chair/Field in the window. We might somehow find some change down the sofa from paying off Ainsworth for a Swedish gem but that’s a long shot. We might get Willock playing a bit. We might get another Dykes purple patch.
Then again lose Cook/Field/Chair/Begovic for a prolonged period or entirely and we’re probably toast.
Will our better players be here and fit for enough games to get another 40 points? Head says no for me.
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 10:42 - Nov 15 with 8475 views
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 06:37 - Nov 15 by derbyhoop
OP seems about right. We probably need to win 8 home games, having won 1 in last year. Wednesday, Rotherham and Huddersfield are all poor but where are our goals going to come from?
Marti seems pretty modern in approach so I think you’ll see goals from several places including full backs and midfield. Look at Spurs under Ange since they lost Kane. No main focal point of a big centre forward but constant movement and interchangeable positions. The modern version of Dutch total football. This is the way forward
I’ve seen enough organisation and improvement in the last two games to suggest we can if the players want to. What hasn’t been mentioned is the great improvement our defence has made too.
As everyone else has said, lack of an individual goalscorer is a problem, but I don’t think that 5 each from Chair, Willock, Dykes, Armstrong, Smyth is out of the question or unreasonable. Goals just need to be shared around.
I see a route out, mostly involving luck and collapse of other teams.
That said if we do go down, there is a lot of new grounds to see, so from that selfish perspective I don’t care too much, assuming the finances hold out.
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 11:26 - Nov 15 with 8354 views
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 10:53 - Nov 15 by BazzaInTheLoft
I’ve seen enough organisation and improvement in the last two games to suggest we can if the players want to. What hasn’t been mentioned is the great improvement our defence has made too.
As everyone else has said, lack of an individual goalscorer is a problem, but I don’t think that 5 each from Chair, Willock, Dykes, Armstrong, Smyth is out of the question or unreasonable. Goals just need to be shared around.
I see a route out, mostly involving luck and collapse of other teams.
That said if we do go down, there is a lot of new grounds to see, so from that selfish perspective I don’t care too much, assuming the finances hold out.
You seem to have changed your view entirely.
I’m not disagreeing with what you have said by the way, but only a few weeks ago you were banging the Ainsworth drum louder than most and went so far as to say no point in changing the Manager because nobody can save us – based on an away draw with Rotherham and a home draw with Bristol City you've now totally changed your mindset?
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 11:32 - Nov 15 with 8335 views
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 10:38 - Nov 15 by Watford_Ranger
Bookies give us a 2 in 3 chance of going down which is fair IMO.
I don’t think it’s inconceivable we lose at least one of Chair/Field in the window. We might somehow find some change down the sofa from paying off Ainsworth for a Swedish gem but that’s a long shot. We might get Willock playing a bit. We might get another Dykes purple patch.
Then again lose Cook/Field/Chair/Begovic for a prolonged period or entirely and we’re probably toast.
Will our better players be here and fit for enough games to get another 40 points? Head says no for me.
Hmm, I'm perhaps slightly more positive - 4-6on is a fair price for where we WERE, however with the improvements we're starting to see, important players back fit, the possibility, as you say, of one or two career resurrections, Andre Gray (or is it Ashley Fletcher?) coming in Jan (okay, I'm joking now) - we're better than evens to stay up, for my money.
I agree it takes quite a lot to go right, and only a few to go wrong, but that £300 sitting at 1.66 on Betfair looks like a lay-all-day opportunity (full disclosure, I've had £9 of it...).
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 11:41 - Nov 15 with 8279 views
I sometimes wonder if we too often say "this team has no goals in it" as if that can't be fixed.
Two weeks ago this team had no functioning defence, midfield or attack. We look now as if we might fix the first two prolems. I don't see why the third should be insurmountable.
Forget forty points, nobody eats an elephant that looks that big. In thirty games, we need to get two more points than Rotherham and six more points than Huddersfield. That seems very doable to me.
"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 11:26 - Nov 15 by PhilmyRs
You seem to have changed your view entirely.
I’m not disagreeing with what you have said by the way, but only a few weeks ago you were banging the Ainsworth drum louder than most and went so far as to say no point in changing the Manager because nobody can save us – based on an away draw with Rotherham and a home draw with Bristol City you've now totally changed your mindset?
Well, apart from the fact that it’s healthy to change your view in light of something new, that absolutely wasn’t what I said.
I said I didn’t think it was worth sacking Ainsworth because nobody ‘available’ would save us. I didn’t realise that MC or another progressive manager was on the hook.
I also just said ‘if the players want to’. This is my biggest concern and the caveat that survival depends on.
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 13:31 - Nov 15 with 8009 views
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 12:10 - Nov 15 by BazzaInTheLoft
Well, apart from the fact that it’s healthy to change your view in light of something new, that absolutely wasn’t what I said.
I said I didn’t think it was worth sacking Ainsworth because nobody ‘available’ would save us. I didn’t realise that MC or another progressive manager was on the hook.
I also just said ‘if the players want to’. This is my biggest concern and the caveat that survival depends on.
Come on. You defended Ainsworth to the hilt. To quote from one of the Ainsworth threads: “personally, barring a miracle, I think we will be relegated. I want Ainsworth in charge of that scenario on the basis of his record of lower league promotions”…. To be clear, I don’t think he can turn it around either. I also think no one else can. The problem is terminal’.
2 draws later, one against a relegation rival, you’re now thinking we’ll be ok? Nothing wrong with changing opinions, but come on, that's some mentality change - You must really rate Marty boy.
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 14:04 - Nov 15 with 7901 views
I think there should be a sweepstake on what other teams may get point deductions this season? That seems to be our default escape route.
I think Marti will get us playing football again and be better organised but without two players who can regularly put the ball in the net it is a massively tall order this season.
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 13:31 - Nov 15 by PhilmyRs
Come on. You defended Ainsworth to the hilt. To quote from one of the Ainsworth threads: “personally, barring a miracle, I think we will be relegated. I want Ainsworth in charge of that scenario on the basis of his record of lower league promotions”…. To be clear, I don’t think he can turn it around either. I also think no one else can. The problem is terminal’.
2 draws later, one against a relegation rival, you’re now thinking we’ll be ok? Nothing wrong with changing opinions, but come on, that's some mentality change - You must really rate Marty boy.
I still defend Ainsworth. That hasn’t changed. We aren’t second bottom because of him.
All I’ve said in this thread is that I see a route out, it’s up to the players , and that I’m encouraged. Do I still think we’ll be relegated? Yeah probably.
Is that so far removed?
I think what you want from me is some kind of recompense for sticking up for Ainsworth. That’s not going to happen Jack, and it’s a bit joyless to want me to as well.
I do rate Marti boy on the little I’ve seen of him for what it’s worth but he’s not the messiah etc.
[Post edited 15 Nov 2023 14:52]
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Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 14:20 - Nov 15 with 7839 views
Will we stay up? (We need c. 40 points from 30 games.) on 11:32 - Nov 15 by elnombre
Hmm, I'm perhaps slightly more positive - 4-6on is a fair price for where we WERE, however with the improvements we're starting to see, important players back fit, the possibility, as you say, of one or two career resurrections, Andre Gray (or is it Ashley Fletcher?) coming in Jan (okay, I'm joking now) - we're better than evens to stay up, for my money.
I agree it takes quite a lot to go right, and only a few to go wrong, but that £300 sitting at 1.66 on Betfair looks like a lay-all-day opportunity (full disclosure, I've had £9 of it...).
Yeah I think I’d rather lay than back it. Sheff Wed are a longer price to go down (I haven’t checked BF but Oddschecker make them 4/7 against our 1/2) which is odd to me. I guess I’m just not getting my hopes up after two draws against two pretty rank sides. Get four points from Norwich and Stoke and I’ll believe a bit.
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