| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. 01:16 - May 12 with 4249 views | Swanjaxs |
For me it has to be Cassius Marcellus Clay Jr
Undoubtedly the greatest ever sporting icon in my lifetime
[Post edited 12 May 2020 1:20]
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 17:58 - May 12 with 782 views | Fergal |
Lennox Lewis. |  | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 18:00 - May 12 with 780 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 17:52 - May 12 by Highjack |
Serena and Martina are/were phenomenal and this is not belittling their amazing achievements but the fact is they are/were playing at a far lower standard than the men’s game. Serena was asked if she’d ever play Andy Murray and she replied “I doubt I’d win a single point”. |
But that’s irrelevant. As they were not playing men’s tennis.
They weren’t playing their sport at a lower standard.
It then comes down to preference which version of the sport you prefer. Each has been better at different periods. Sometimes the men’s game and sometimes the women’s.
I’d far rather watch McEnroe or Martina though than either Federer or Serena.
Tennis is far more dull in general than it used to be. The technology has killed it for me. | | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 18:03 - May 12 with 779 views | Best_loser |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 09:20 - May 12 by monmouth |
Federer tops the tennis list by miles mun if we are just talking greatest at the sport. Ali only comes second to Alan Curtis because we are talking the whole package.
Pele also has to challenge Ali. In fact I'd say they are absolutely on a par.
Otherwise it's just a game of 'what's your favourite sport' [Post edited 12 May 2020 9:21]
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https://www.oxfordstudent.com/2020/02/09/why-novak-djokovic-is-the-greatest-male |  | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 18:15 - May 12 with 756 views | Glossolalia |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 15:19 - May 12 by londonlisa2001 |
If we are only talking tennis, Serena and Martina before her both have very strong cases for being regarded as the greatest player of all time. |
That's true when looking at the hard facts. However, I have far less interest in women's tennis. Also. I wasn't really aware of Navratilova as I'm too young, and I find Williams to be a petulant disgrace on times. I admire her skill and power, and that she plays doubles a lot.
A legend has to make you feel a special way, not just win a load of titles. As it stands, Williams has far fewer titles than Federer anyway (73 to 100+), and has she had sustained rivalries from other truly gifted players like Nadal, Djokovic and Murray?
Besides, if we're pooling both male and female together in terms of outright ability, there is no contest. Is this too harsh? Federer can serve at 130mph+ and crunch 90mph+ shots on both wings, and he does it with such rare grace and serenity when at his best. Sport is about the fastest, fittest, strongest. Men dominate this sphere as they dominate these physical superlatives.
As for the greatest between Nadal, Djokovic and Federer, who cares. They are all incredible and have brought the best out of each other. I like all three but a Federer in full flight has that certain je ne sais quoi. [Post edited 12 May 2020 18:18]
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 18:33 - May 12 with 738 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 18:15 - May 12 by Glossolalia |
That's true when looking at the hard facts. However, I have far less interest in women's tennis. Also. I wasn't really aware of Navratilova as I'm too young, and I find Williams to be a petulant disgrace on times. I admire her skill and power, and that she plays doubles a lot.
A legend has to make you feel a special way, not just win a load of titles. As it stands, Williams has far fewer titles than Federer anyway (73 to 100+), and has she had sustained rivalries from other truly gifted players like Nadal, Djokovic and Murray?
Besides, if we're pooling both male and female together in terms of outright ability, there is no contest. Is this too harsh? Federer can serve at 130mph+ and crunch 90mph+ shots on both wings, and he does it with such rare grace and serenity when at his best. Sport is about the fastest, fittest, strongest. Men dominate this sphere as they dominate these physical superlatives.
As for the greatest between Nadal, Djokovic and Federer, who cares. They are all incredible and have brought the best out of each other. I like all three but a Federer in full flight has that certain je ne sais quoi. [Post edited 12 May 2020 18:18]
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“ if we're pooling both male and female together in terms of outright ability, there is no contest. Is this too harsh? Federer can serve at 130mph+ and crunch 90mph+ shots on both wings,”
It’s not ability, it’s physical differences. That’s like comparing a player now, male or female, with all the nutrition, genetics, technology with a player in the 1970s. It’s not an ability change.
I like Federer as a person btw, but I find him dull as hell as a player. All of them are these days.
McEnroe, Becker, Connors, Edberg any time for me as a spectacle. And I’ve less admiration for a player that doesn’t play doubles... | | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 19:02 - May 12 with 718 views | Glossolalia |
I have to disagree, be it a semantic level or otherwise. Courtesy of their physical differences, men are able to do thing women simply cannot, or at least to a greater degree. As for the physical differences you talk of: male players from the '70s would be just as genetically capable of responding to advances in science and nutrition as their modern counterparts.
Anyway, we are comparing males and females because of your view on this. Both have equal access to all the benefits of scientific progress. So what's your point? Your simile is utterly spurious to me.
As for your finding Federer boring, go watch 2017 China Open final against Nadal. The shot-making, aggressiveness and soft hands are simply astounding. Clean winners off both wings; a willingness to come to the net; sumptuous inside-out forehand in particular. I can't fathom how one could find this boring. And regarding Federer, he has a tennis doubles Olympic gold medal.
[Post edited 12 May 2020 21:35]
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 19:39 - May 12 with 686 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 19:02 - May 12 by Glossolalia |
I have to disagree, be it a semantic level or otherwise. Courtesy of their physical differences, men are able to do thing women simply cannot, or at least to a greater degree. As for the physical differences you talk of: male players from the '70s would be just as genetically capable of responding to advances in science and nutrition as their modern counterparts.
Anyway, we are comparing males and females because of your view on this. Both have equal access to all the benefits of scientific progress. So what's your point? Your simile is utterly spurious to me.
As for your finding Federer boring, go watch 2017 China Open final against Nadal. The shot-making, aggressiveness and soft hands are simply astounding. Clean winners off both wings; a willingness to come to the net; sumptuous inside-out forehand in particular. I can't fathom how one could find this boring. And regarding Federer, he has a tennis doubles Olympic gold medal.
[Post edited 12 May 2020 21:35]
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Tennis is a boring shite sport for posh people.
Of course men and women deserve equal pay.
Tiger Tim sums it all up - the fecking useless toff.
Murray and the Williams sisters are the only plus points.
The end. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 19:57 - May 12 with 681 views | Glossolalia |
 Well I'm hardly posh and tennis is my favourite sport to follow! Shame Murray had his hip problems, but 2 Olympic golds, three slams, 40+ titles in this era is a great return. | | | |
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 20:06 - May 12 with 676 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 18:00 - May 12 by londonlisa2001 |
But that’s irrelevant. As they were not playing men’s tennis.
They weren’t playing their sport at a lower standard.
It then comes down to preference which version of the sport you prefer. Each has been better at different periods. Sometimes the men’s game and sometimes the women’s.
I’d far rather watch McEnroe or Martina though than either Federer or Serena.
Tennis is far more dull in general than it used to be. The technology has killed it for me. |
While accepting your general point I don’t agree with that last sentence. Tennis is way more entertaining now than it was in Borg et al’s heyday. |  |
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 21:25 - May 12 with 649 views | Johnw102 |
Being a bit older than most here I will go for Gary Sobers in my opinion the best all rounder of all time.Not just Batsman but 3 types of bowler, medium pace orthodox and unorthodox spin. |  |
| Never knew getting old would happen so quick! |
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 22:50 - May 12 with 618 views | Darran |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 19:39 - May 12 by Kilkennyjack |
Tennis is a boring shite sport for posh people.
Of course men and women deserve equal pay.
Tiger Tim sums it all up - the fecking useless toff.
Murray and the Williams sisters are the only plus points.
The end. |
Great post. Women’s football is shit too. |  |
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:00 - May 12 with 608 views | longlostjack |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 22:50 - May 12 by Darran |
Great post. Women’s football is shit too. |
Bollocks. Woman’s professional football is and always has been far more forward thinking. |  |
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:02 - May 12 with 605 views | Darran |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:00 - May 12 by longlostjack |
Bollocks. Woman’s professional football is and always has been far more forward thinking. |
It’s utter bilge. | |
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:05 - May 12 with 598 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 19:02 - May 12 by Glossolalia |
I have to disagree, be it a semantic level or otherwise. Courtesy of their physical differences, men are able to do thing women simply cannot, or at least to a greater degree. As for the physical differences you talk of: male players from the '70s would be just as genetically capable of responding to advances in science and nutrition as their modern counterparts.
Anyway, we are comparing males and females because of your view on this. Both have equal access to all the benefits of scientific progress. So what's your point? Your simile is utterly spurious to me.
As for your finding Federer boring, go watch 2017 China Open final against Nadal. The shot-making, aggressiveness and soft hands are simply astounding. Clean winners off both wings; a willingness to come to the net; sumptuous inside-out forehand in particular. I can't fathom how one could find this boring. And regarding Federer, he has a tennis doubles Olympic gold medal.
[Post edited 12 May 2020 21:35]
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He plays sod all doubles,
As you well know if you’re a fan of his. Very few players do both these days.
And men don’t have more ability that women, they are just a completely different physique.
It’s like saying a heavyweight boxer has more ability than a featherweight.
Anyway - as I say, it’s just preference. | | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:07 - May 12 with 598 views | longlostjack |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:02 - May 12 by Darran |
It’s utter bilge. |
They‘ve had hyped televised matches held in empty stadiums for years mun. Men‘s football is just starting to catch up. | |
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:08 - May 12 with 595 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 20:06 - May 12 by exiledclaseboy |
While accepting your general point I don’t agree with that last sentence. Tennis is way more entertaining now than it was in Borg et al’s heyday. |
Connors and McEnroe in the men’s and Martina and Chrissie or Steffi in the women’s. Nothing like that today.
But it’s all just personal taste. | | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:25 - May 12 with 583 views | Glossolalia |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:05 - May 12 by londonlisa2001 |
He plays sod all doubles,
As you well know if you’re a fan of his. Very few players do both these days.
And men don’t have more ability that women, they are just a completely different physique.
It’s like saying a heavyweight boxer has more ability than a featherweight.
Anyway - as I say, it’s just preference. |
On average, and at the extreme, men are able to run faster, lift more weight, hit harder. This is all owing to an increased muscle to body weight ratio, regardless of weight. So again, your use of analogy is appallingly inaccurate.
Anyhow, a featherweight boxer would have qualities of dexterity and speed that a heavyweight couldn't possess. And if you placed similarly-weighted males and females in a ring, the men would nearly always triumph. Because they are able to carry more muscle in relation to their body weight, along with increased testosterone etc.
What is so hard to comprehend? You are wrongly making two distinctions from one truth. Physique and ability are intrinsically linked, and when you mention physique, you don't appreciate or mention other genetic advantages that men possess, as I mentioned. | | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:30 - May 12 with 571 views | Banosswan |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:05 - May 12 by londonlisa2001 |
He plays sod all doubles,
As you well know if you’re a fan of his. Very few players do both these days.
And men don’t have more ability that women, they are just a completely different physique.
It’s like saying a heavyweight boxer has more ability than a featherweight.
Anyway - as I say, it’s just preference. |
Of course men have more ability in certain areas. Just as women have more ability in certain areas. |  |
| Ever since my son was... never conceived, because I've never had consensual sex without money involved... I've always kind of looked at you as... a thing, that I could live next to... in accordance with state laws. | | Poll: | How do you like your steak? |
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:35 - May 12 with 560 views | longlostjack |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:30 - May 12 by Banosswan |
Of course men have more ability in certain areas. Just as women have more ability in certain areas. |
We don’t need to go there Banos ! [Post edited 12 May 2020 23:47]
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:37 - May 12 with 556 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:25 - May 12 by Glossolalia |
On average, and at the extreme, men are able to run faster, lift more weight, hit harder. This is all owing to an increased muscle to body weight ratio, regardless of weight. So again, your use of analogy is appallingly inaccurate.
Anyhow, a featherweight boxer would have qualities of dexterity and speed that a heavyweight couldn't possess. And if you placed similarly-weighted males and females in a ring, the men would nearly always triumph. Because they are able to carry more muscle in relation to their body weight, along with increased testosterone etc.
What is so hard to comprehend? You are wrongly making two distinctions from one truth. Physique and ability are intrinsically linked, and when you mention physique, you don't appreciate or mention other genetic advantages that men possess, as I mentioned. |
Yes they are.
That doesn’t make them more able in the sense that you first used the word ‘ability’ in this thread, as a talent or skill,
Anyway, I genuinely can’t be arsed.
Federer is still boring ... | | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:46 - May 12 with 552 views | Glossolalia |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:37 - May 12 by londonlisa2001 |
Yes they are.
That doesn’t make them more able in the sense that you first used the word ‘ability’ in this thread, as a talent or skill,
Anyway, I genuinely can’t be arsed.
Federer is still boring ... |
You know full well that my definition of 'ability' was wholly within a sporting context. We're on a sport forum, talking about sportsmen and women. How about being arsed and explaining how an advantage in natural physique plays no role in ability.
Anyway, you jumped on my selection of Federer as my greatest sport legend, talking about women's tennis. To me, this is an inferior version of tennis, as I really enjoy flat, hard hitters like Wawkinka, Del Potro and Federer. Keep finding him boring. I find that more staggering than your inability to grasp fundamental biological concepts.
Now there, I used ability in a non-sporting sense.  [Post edited 12 May 2020 23:46]
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 00:01 - May 13 with 534 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 23:46 - May 12 by Glossolalia |
You know full well that my definition of 'ability' was wholly within a sporting context. We're on a sport forum, talking about sportsmen and women. How about being arsed and explaining how an advantage in natural physique plays no role in ability.
Anyway, you jumped on my selection of Federer as my greatest sport legend, talking about women's tennis. To me, this is an inferior version of tennis, as I really enjoy flat, hard hitters like Wawkinka, Del Potro and Federer. Keep finding him boring. I find that more staggering than your inability to grasp fundamental biological concepts.
Now there, I used ability in a non-sporting sense. [Post edited 12 May 2020 23:46]
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Obviously it was in a sporting context. I didn’t suggest it wasn’t.
But you used the term as a measure of comparison of achievement.
And I didn’t jump on your selection of Federer. I didn’t mention your post. I replied to Monnie (my reply being tongue in cheek) saying Federer was the greatest tennis player by miles by saying that was only something that could be true if one only considered the men’s game. ‘Tennis‘ as a description does not, by definition, only related to men’s tennis. (If you don’t believe me, ask Murray. He frequently corrects those who use similarly lazy shorthand).
You can prefer whatever you like. Preference is fine. As is other people having a different preference. I’m quite capable btw of grasping fundamental biological concepts. And also of differentiating biology and skill. You seem to think that Serena Williams having different physical attributes to a male player means she has less ability. I disagree in the context of your usage of the word. | | | |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 00:13 - May 13 with 525 views | Glossolalia |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 00:01 - May 13 by londonlisa2001 |
Obviously it was in a sporting context. I didn’t suggest it wasn’t.
But you used the term as a measure of comparison of achievement.
And I didn’t jump on your selection of Federer. I didn’t mention your post. I replied to Monnie (my reply being tongue in cheek) saying Federer was the greatest tennis player by miles by saying that was only something that could be true if one only considered the men’s game. ‘Tennis‘ as a description does not, by definition, only related to men’s tennis. (If you don’t believe me, ask Murray. He frequently corrects those who use similarly lazy shorthand).
You can prefer whatever you like. Preference is fine. As is other people having a different preference. I’m quite capable btw of grasping fundamental biological concepts. And also of differentiating biology and skill. You seem to think that Serena Williams having different physical attributes to a male player means she has less ability. I disagree in the context of your usage of the word. |
Feck me this is getting tedious. If Serena was a man, she'd have more ability, yes. She herself mentioned that she wouldn't beat any professional male player. If she can't beat them, she has less ability than the men. So men and women are separated in sport for that reason. She's an incredible athlete but given her sex, isn't as able as fellow male pros. What the hell other word can I use? 
Fair enough, I presumed you responded to me. I was incorrect. But of course Federer is better than every woman player to ever pick up a raquet. Need this be explained?
And do keep in mind, I just enjoy a good argument. I'm just teasing here and there, between the verbosity.  [Post edited 13 May 2020 0:14]
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| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 00:40 - May 13 with 509 views | Glossolalia |
| Greatest Sporting Legend in your lifetime... only one pick. on 00:25 - May 13 by londonlisa2001 |
I genuinely don’t understand why any talk of Serena always turns to whether she could beat a man.
Of course she couldn’t. She’s a woman. I can’t imagine how boring it must be for her to have an endless procession of blokes that frankly couldn’t last ten seconds with her on a court point out that she couldn’t win a game from a professional male player.
That doesn’t give rise to any valid appraisal of her achievements or her abilities. |
I completely agree regarding her achievements and ability. I'm not diminishing that at all. Of course she's unable to beat male pros; the point wasn't made in complete seriousness.
This talk arises from those who insist men and woman are so incredibly alike. As a result, fatuous questions follow. To compare her to a man, and by doing so belittling what she's done, is stupid. But again this only arises when people don't accept the chasm in performance between elite sports men and women! Appreciate the differences and get over it.
Male and female tennis are different sports in my eyes, even with different governing bodies. I and a lot of other people won't consider women as greatest sport legends because in essence, they don't participate in sports we follow. [Post edited 13 May 2020 0:44]
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