| Linford Christie Stadium. 18:04 - Aug 9 with 137136 views | ted_hendrix |
That's where our new ground will be. |  |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:13 - Jul 19 with 3680 views | QPRConor2000 |
I personally dont think the problem is the capacity of the stadium, but the fact we cannot get non-matchday income.
I personally would settle for 20k capacity over a 30k one which is multi-purpose along with a modern conference facility.
I went to Swansea's ground a while back and I have to say that should be the blueprint for us. |  | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:19 - Jul 19 with 3656 views | Sonofpugwash |
The only way to develop LR it seems would be as a part of a redevelopment/regenaration area.This brings Compulsory Purchase into play.Massive amounts of compensation involved though. |  |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:32 - Jul 19 with 3608 views | derbyhoop |
Biggest problem with LR is the tiny footprint. 5 acres is about half what is needed for a modern stadium of 20k capacity, or more. |  |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:50 - Jul 19 with 3534 views | QPRConor2000 |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:32 - Jul 19 by derbyhoop |
Biggest problem with LR is the tiny footprint. 5 acres is about half what is needed for a modern stadium of 20k capacity, or more. |
Swansea's stadium takes about 8 acres of land, that holds somewhere in the region of 20,000 seats, so its potentially doable if we do buy the school and the houses behind ellerslie road.
I would demolish the existing stadium and rebuild it to a modern standard, this would mean though that we would have to groundshare temporarily. , which I dont think I would mind for a few seasons. | | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 01:38 - Jul 20 with 3217 views | Hoopsie |
QPR Loftus Road Stadium occupies 4.7 acres with a pitch size of 102 x 66 holding 18,439 capacity surrounded by residential houses adjoining 2 sides and a school/houses on one end
*Stadium building footprint only, does not include auxiliary areas like open car parking, open spaces and landscaping etc that belongs to land the stadium sits on)
Estadio do Bessa, Boavista home ground holds 28,263 seated, pitch size 105 x 68 - occupying about 5.7 acres roughly 3 km from Porto central district with no major adjacent buildings and an open field complex about the same size of the stadium adjoining it to the northeast
Swansea City's Swansea.com. Stadium has a seating capacity of 21,088, pitch size 105 x 68 in the outskirts of the city and has a stadium footprint of about 7.5 acres.
Assuming seating per acre to enable some form of comparison;
Loftus Road - 3923 per acre
Bessa - 4958 per acre
Swansea.com - 2812 acre
Bessa's density is higher and Swansea has a lower density. If Loftus Road adopts Bessa's density, the capacity is increased to 23303 (4958 x 4.7)
However, things are not so simple
Bessa's pitch is surrounded by 4 sides of double tier stands albeit minus seating on the 4 corners. The atmosphere i am sure is quite intimidating, reckon more so than LR because of the proximity of the stands to the pitch and the height towering over the field of play. Swansea's low seating number per acre can be explained by its sprawling site and the ample room allows the structure of the stadium to sit out of main building on 2 sides. No worry for a lack of space while both these stadiums have no issues with light or building mass intrusion to their immediate neighbouring structures, if any.
Loftus Road is quite different as we are limited to height and right to light issues on 2 sides (Loft End - Loftus Road houses and SB stand - Ellerslie Road houses) and the school end has limited capacity for expansion due partly to terrace houses on Imre Court and the uncertainty of the availability of the school land for purchase.
However, I believe the greatest obstacle to redeveloping LR is not about money or the lack of (we have rich* owners - Stadium improvement works not counting towards FFP), or egress or ingress to the stadium on match days, or size of the seating capacity, or non-match day uses, or a staged retrofitting of the stadium (renovate / build new stands in phases), or ground/civil engineering works (sewerage, water, gas, water table, our favourite "dig-down", electricity etc) - these are surmountable challenges (if there is a will there is a way) but the planning framework for the regeneration of the precinct in the H&F Council planning policy which states that any redevelopment of the Loftus Road Stadium area will be residential led with the (re)provision of open space for community/leisure use provides a dead end to this idea.
That I think this put things to a grinding halt for our owners of any plans in redeveloping LR or selling / redeveloping the land for other uses for profit (private developers will not play top prices for land that must include significant community function - doesn't sounds profitable - I can see this as a joint council-developer venture, if it happens)
So where to now? |  |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 07:48 - Jul 20 with 3042 views | Rs_Holy |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 01:38 - Jul 20 by Hoopsie |
QPR Loftus Road Stadium occupies 4.7 acres with a pitch size of 102 x 66 holding 18,439 capacity surrounded by residential houses adjoining 2 sides and a school/houses on one end
*Stadium building footprint only, does not include auxiliary areas like open car parking, open spaces and landscaping etc that belongs to land the stadium sits on)
Estadio do Bessa, Boavista home ground holds 28,263 seated, pitch size 105 x 68 - occupying about 5.7 acres roughly 3 km from Porto central district with no major adjacent buildings and an open field complex about the same size of the stadium adjoining it to the northeast
Swansea City's Swansea.com. Stadium has a seating capacity of 21,088, pitch size 105 x 68 in the outskirts of the city and has a stadium footprint of about 7.5 acres.
Assuming seating per acre to enable some form of comparison;
Loftus Road - 3923 per acre
Bessa - 4958 per acre
Swansea.com - 2812 acre
Bessa's density is higher and Swansea has a lower density. If Loftus Road adopts Bessa's density, the capacity is increased to 23303 (4958 x 4.7)
However, things are not so simple
Bessa's pitch is surrounded by 4 sides of double tier stands albeit minus seating on the 4 corners. The atmosphere i am sure is quite intimidating, reckon more so than LR because of the proximity of the stands to the pitch and the height towering over the field of play. Swansea's low seating number per acre can be explained by its sprawling site and the ample room allows the structure of the stadium to sit out of main building on 2 sides. No worry for a lack of space while both these stadiums have no issues with light or building mass intrusion to their immediate neighbouring structures, if any.
Loftus Road is quite different as we are limited to height and right to light issues on 2 sides (Loft End - Loftus Road houses and SB stand - Ellerslie Road houses) and the school end has limited capacity for expansion due partly to terrace houses on Imre Court and the uncertainty of the availability of the school land for purchase.
However, I believe the greatest obstacle to redeveloping LR is not about money or the lack of (we have rich* owners - Stadium improvement works not counting towards FFP), or egress or ingress to the stadium on match days, or size of the seating capacity, or non-match day uses, or a staged retrofitting of the stadium (renovate / build new stands in phases), or ground/civil engineering works (sewerage, water, gas, water table, our favourite "dig-down", electricity etc) - these are surmountable challenges (if there is a will there is a way) but the planning framework for the regeneration of the precinct in the H&F Council planning policy which states that any redevelopment of the Loftus Road Stadium area will be residential led with the (re)provision of open space for community/leisure use provides a dead end to this idea.
That I think this put things to a grinding halt for our owners of any plans in redeveloping LR or selling / redeveloping the land for other uses for profit (private developers will not play top prices for land that must include significant community function - doesn't sounds profitable - I can see this as a joint council-developer venture, if it happens)
So where to now? |
excellent post ...
'the planning framework for the regeneration of the precinct in the H&F Council planning policy'.
Yep, Loftus Road is unique, completely different to scumford bridge or craven cottage. But H&F appear unaccommodating to us moving to a new stadium in the borough or it would appear improving Loftus Road? My earlier post (finding a way of doing up Loftus Road) was based on the scenario of the only 2 options we have now is
1. improving Loftus Road as much as is humanly possible or
2. Moving out of the borough.
I actually live around 10 miles west of Loftus Road so you'd think I would welcome a move somewhere off the M4 but I hate the idea. Ealing or Acton I can live with (although it doesn't look like there's a lot available there). But West Drayton, Slough, Uxbridge... no thanks. |  | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:06 - Jul 20 with 2826 views | QPRConor2000 |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 07:48 - Jul 20 by Rs_Holy |
excellent post ...
'the planning framework for the regeneration of the precinct in the H&F Council planning policy'.
Yep, Loftus Road is unique, completely different to scumford bridge or craven cottage. But H&F appear unaccommodating to us moving to a new stadium in the borough or it would appear improving Loftus Road? My earlier post (finding a way of doing up Loftus Road) was based on the scenario of the only 2 options we have now is
1. improving Loftus Road as much as is humanly possible or
2. Moving out of the borough.
I actually live around 10 miles west of Loftus Road so you'd think I would welcome a move somewhere off the M4 but I hate the idea. Ealing or Acton I can live with (although it doesn't look like there's a lot available there). But West Drayton, Slough, Uxbridge... no thanks. |
I suggested a while back that we look at teaming up with Eailing Trailfinders who are a rugby union team to build a new stadium on their existing site.
They need to get a 10k capacity stadium in order to get into the Premiership and I think us and Ealing could easily form a joint-partnership in order to build a new 20k capacity venue.
The site they are on is just off the A40 and there is crossrail nearby so it could be doable. | | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:38 - Jul 20 with 2761 views | dmm |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:06 - Jul 20 by QPRConor2000 |
I suggested a while back that we look at teaming up with Eailing Trailfinders who are a rugby union team to build a new stadium on their existing site.
They need to get a 10k capacity stadium in order to get into the Premiership and I think us and Ealing could easily form a joint-partnership in order to build a new 20k capacity venue.
The site they are on is just off the A40 and there is crossrail nearby so it could be doable. |
I seem to remember when Wasps were playing at LR the pitch took a terrible battering. Perhaps today's pitch technology, like our Deso one, would stand up to the wear and tear of a football and rugby being played on it? |  | | |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:48 - Jul 20 with 2626 views | QPR_Jim |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:06 - Jul 20 by QPRConor2000 |
I suggested a while back that we look at teaming up with Eailing Trailfinders who are a rugby union team to build a new stadium on their existing site.
They need to get a 10k capacity stadium in order to get into the Premiership and I think us and Ealing could easily form a joint-partnership in order to build a new 20k capacity venue.
The site they are on is just off the A40 and there is crossrail nearby so it could be doable. |
I think Twyford Avenue would be a better option, Crossrail, Central Line, District and Piccadilly lines all within a mile of the site. Enough space for a stadium and separate rugby facilities.
Unless a load of buildings get condemned on the white city estate, I can't see any large areas of land opening up nearby.
Can't see any developments on this front for a while. |  | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:54 - Jul 20 with 2592 views | Bakes |
I often drive past a derelict site on the eastbound of the A40 near Greenford, it has a orange sign saying “Avenue park stadium, Home of the London Tigers”
Does anyone know anything about it? Looking on google earth it has a bit of land around it. |  |
| With Faith And Courage Comes Glory |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:05 - Jul 20 with 2530 views | CamberleyR |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 16:54 - Jul 20 by Bakes |
I often drive past a derelict site on the eastbound of the A40 near Greenford, it has a orange sign saying “Avenue park stadium, Home of the London Tigers”
Does anyone know anything about it? Looking on google earth it has a bit of land around it. |
According to Wiki it's the former home of Viking Greenford FC who folded 20 years ago. London Tigers played there from 2012-2017 but now play in Amersham. |  |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:22 - Jul 20 with 2493 views | Esox_Lucius |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:05 - Jul 20 by CamberleyR |
According to Wiki it's the former home of Viking Greenford FC who folded 20 years ago. London Tigers played there from 2012-2017 but now play in Amersham. |
It was our old training ground around the Gavin Maguire, Peter Hucker, Clive Walker era. |  |
| The grass is always greener. |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:44 - Jul 20 with 2428 views | QPRConor2000 |
What about that land next door to North Action train station? its being used by HS2, but I suspect once phase 1 is done, it could become available for relatively cheap as they would have no need for it once its done.
Its an 8.5 acre site and its only 1.5miles away from Loftus Road, so surely its worth considering? [Post edited 20 Jul 2023 17:45]
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:48 - Jul 20 with 2415 views | LazyFan |
If we do not get a brand-new stadium that can be used for other events, then we are dead.
If we get this mythical expensive stadium, if it's large enough, we could be set up infrastructure-wise to be of Prem class.
If it bring in the monies outside of football, at that point, we would be able to beat FFP and get in the Prem easier. Once in, we could stay for a while as long it's not Bungled.
Getting a new stadium would be a make or break for this club.
We must have it and very soon. |  |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 19:40 - Jul 20 with 2270 views | QPRConor2000 |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:48 - Jul 20 by LazyFan |
If we do not get a brand-new stadium that can be used for other events, then we are dead.
If we get this mythical expensive stadium, if it's large enough, we could be set up infrastructure-wise to be of Prem class.
If it bring in the monies outside of football, at that point, we would be able to beat FFP and get in the Prem easier. Once in, we could stay for a while as long it's not Bungled.
Getting a new stadium would be a make or break for this club.
We must have it and very soon. |
Im just reading up more about the Jack Tizzard School and it does make for some interesting reading.
The School itself only has 71 students, which is below average in the borough, and ive seen a lot of schools being closed because they have become too small to maintain, especially with costs increasing and the fact that the population is decreasing
So the chances are that the school potentially may well close in the future, so therefore the land becomes available. | | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 19:47 - Jul 20 with 2245 views | QPR_Jim |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 19:40 - Jul 20 by QPRConor2000 |
Im just reading up more about the Jack Tizzard School and it does make for some interesting reading.
The School itself only has 71 students, which is below average in the borough, and ive seen a lot of schools being closed because they have become too small to maintain, especially with costs increasing and the fact that the population is decreasing
So the chances are that the school potentially may well close in the future, so therefore the land becomes available. |
I think the idea of buying the school was a reaction to the head teacher (or someone high up at the school) saying they were looking for an alternative site. | | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 20:51 - Jul 20 with 2170 views | CamberleyR |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 17:44 - Jul 20 by QPRConor2000 |
What about that land next door to North Action train station? its being used by HS2, but I suspect once phase 1 is done, it could become available for relatively cheap as they would have no need for it once its done.
Its an 8.5 acre site and its only 1.5miles away from Loftus Road, so surely its worth considering? [Post edited 20 Jul 2023 17:45]
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Is this the site that I've mentioned before in Horn Lane? | |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 20:53 - Jul 20 with 2153 views | QPRConor2000 |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 20:51 - Jul 20 by CamberleyR |
Is this the site that I've mentioned before in Horn Lane? |
I think its on Chase Road but your not far off.
Its right next door to North Acton Tube Station | | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 21:07 - Jul 20 with 2103 views | CamberleyR |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 20:53 - Jul 20 by QPRConor2000 |
I think its on Chase Road but your not far off.
Its right next door to North Acton Tube Station |
I honestly think that we should chuck our lot in with H & F as it appears they're not interested in working together and seem happy enough with Fulham and North Battersea and look to work with a borough like Ealing in trying to find a site.
Ealing seemed very co-operative and receptive to us in the whole Warren Farm thing. | |
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 22:16 - Jul 20 with 1960 views | QPRConor2000 |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 21:07 - Jul 20 by CamberleyR |
I honestly think that we should chuck our lot in with H & F as it appears they're not interested in working together and seem happy enough with Fulham and North Battersea and look to work with a borough like Ealing in trying to find a site.
Ealing seemed very co-operative and receptive to us in the whole Warren Farm thing. |
The thing we could all is actively write to the club and all the other relevant stakeholders in this to support the club more and to stop delaying progress.
[Post edited 20 Jul 2023 22:39]
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| Linford Christie Stadium. on 22:54 - Jul 20 with 1904 views | nadera78 |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:06 - Jul 20 by QPRConor2000 |
I suggested a while back that we look at teaming up with Eailing Trailfinders who are a rugby union team to build a new stadium on their existing site.
They need to get a 10k capacity stadium in order to get into the Premiership and I think us and Ealing could easily form a joint-partnership in order to build a new 20k capacity venue.
The site they are on is just off the A40 and there is crossrail nearby so it could be doable. |
Trailfinders average attendance is about 800, a much bigger club nearby in London Irish has gone bust, in a sport that has seen multiple teams go bust in the past year, the rugby union premiership doesn't want them and is edging towards franchising, and the man who bankrolls the club is 84 years old. They simply don't need, and will never build, anything bigger than the ground they currently play in. | | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 23:00 - Jul 20 with 1892 views | Northernr |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 14:06 - Jul 20 by QPRConor2000 |
I suggested a while back that we look at teaming up with Eailing Trailfinders who are a rugby union team to build a new stadium on their existing site.
They need to get a 10k capacity stadium in order to get into the Premiership and I think us and Ealing could easily form a joint-partnership in order to build a new 20k capacity venue.
The site they are on is just off the A40 and there is crossrail nearby so it could be doable. |
Lived next to there for a brief time in the recent past. Been there with Hull FC to see them play London Broncos. I don't think anybody who has ever lived, visited, walked past that site would pin it as suitable for even the ground it's got now. 1,500 visiting fans turning up for Super League games when they played one of the Hulls, Leeds, Wigan etc was... an issue.
It's also surrounded by reasonably posh and now very expensive houses who would rejoice in a long, drawn out planning enquiry ending up with the suggestion being (rightly) laughed out of the room. |  | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 00:01 - Jul 21 with 3263 views | CateLeBonR |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 23:00 - Jul 20 by Northernr |
Lived next to there for a brief time in the recent past. Been there with Hull FC to see them play London Broncos. I don't think anybody who has ever lived, visited, walked past that site would pin it as suitable for even the ground it's got now. 1,500 visiting fans turning up for Super League games when they played one of the Hulls, Leeds, Wigan etc was... an issue.
It's also surrounded by reasonably posh and now very expensive houses who would rejoice in a long, drawn out planning enquiry ending up with the suggestion being (rightly) laughed out of the room. |
Agreed Clive. I know this area very well and think it would be unsuitable but it's not entirely true that the surrounding area is all posh. Gurnell Grove and Copley Close anyone?!
I thought I read somewhere that the rules might be relaxed in future about stadium size for Rugby Union, as it's creating a two tier system which just isn't working. Following the problems with London Irish I'd imagine Ealing Trailfinders would be more likely to link up with Brentford than anyone. Or just stay as they are.
If there's anywhere in central Ealing i'd love to see us try for it's the old Barclays ground that we used to train at by the North Circular. I think it's metropolitan open land now similar to warren farm so almost definitely a non starter.
Quite an interesting article about local planning in London in the Evening Standard today. I'm not sure what Ben Judah's agenda is but pretty certain it doesn't include finding a new stadium for Queen's Park Rangers. However I do agree that the balance of power is all wrong.
https://www.standard.co.uk/comment/london-growth-local-councils-b1095675.html#co |  | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 00:12 - Jul 21 with 3214 views | loftupper |
I fear that the biggest reason for not looking at upgrading Loftus Road is the fact that it would never produce a return on the investment required.
Just don't understand why the club continually get it so wrong when dealing with H&F Council. Seems to be a common misconception that all negotiations require playing hard ball. | | | |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 00:35 - Jul 21 with 3168 views | Loyalitat |
| Linford Christie Stadium. on 23:00 - Jul 20 by Northernr |
Lived next to there for a brief time in the recent past. Been there with Hull FC to see them play London Broncos. I don't think anybody who has ever lived, visited, walked past that site would pin it as suitable for even the ground it's got now. 1,500 visiting fans turning up for Super League games when they played one of the Hulls, Leeds, Wigan etc was... an issue.
It's also surrounded by reasonably posh and now very expensive houses who would rejoice in a long, drawn out planning enquiry ending up with the suggestion being (rightly) laughed out of the room. |
Totally agree. It's a non-starter.
There's no chance that the residents would ever allow ground expansion in that area for rugby union, let alone for association football.
Went there regularly when London Broncos were based there, they weren't overly receptive to rugby league being played there. | | | |
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