| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! 19:32 - Sep 23 with 3832 views | Ljames93 |
Anyone that wants Martin out needs their head checked.
- We're playing in the best league in the world. Any newly promoted team is likely to get relegated, it's a fact. Teams tipped to come 15th/16th such as Forest have a front four of Elanga, Gibbs-White, Hudson-Odoi and Wood.
- 7 of our 11 against Ipswich were considered new signings or at least new to our first team (Dibling). Again, newly promoted teams will always have more changed/disruptions to their squad. Relationships and understandings on the pitch take time, it doesn't happen after a game or two.
Martin gave us so much joy last season and staying up this season is going to be tough regardless of
A) The style of Play
B) The manager we have.
I personally think gradually adapting our style of play like we've done (Look at Ramsdale going long far more frequently than McCarthy against Newcastle), as well as quickly working out our best 11 will give us the best possible shot of staying up, which includes having RM at the helm.
The grass isn't always greener, we witnessed that last time we got relegated.
You need to wake up and acknowledge how hard this league is! [Post edited 23 Sep 20:13]
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 22:26 - Sep 23 with 1350 views | grumpy |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 21:59 - Sep 23 by Ljames93 |
The cult jumping on my thread, thought this would happen, bless you lot.
I watched everyone moan about RM at the start of last season and then again before the playoffs and both times proved to be stupid.
Can't wait to come back on here in a month or two, it will be the same people calling RM out saying things like "finally he's playing ....and we're winning like we said".
17th this season is a massive success and I have no reason YET to think RM can't achieve that. [Post edited 23 Sep 22:08]
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You watched everyone moan at the start of last season and you never came on and said anything? yeh! Right đ |  | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 22:28 - Sep 23 with 1349 views | Ljames93 |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 22:18 - Sep 23 by Butty101 |
Itâs not entitlement. Last season Promotion was the minimum requirement. We had resources the other dreams could only dream of. Most of the time the football was plain boring.
How many other championship clubs got to spend 20mil on 2 players? 2 players I should add had little impact on the season. |
There were 3 very very good Championship standard squad/teams.
Leicester, us and Leeds. Ipswich had a hel of season which spoilt the party for one side and it wasn't us.
I'm not saying last year was perfect, I think we had the joint second best team in the league but it was a success. Anyone that can't acknowledge promotion, even if through the playoffs wasn't a successful season. Same as staying up, 17th is a success. | | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 22:46 - Sep 23 with 1290 views | Butty101 |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 22:28 - Sep 23 by Ljames93 |
There were 3 very very good Championship standard squad/teams.
Leicester, us and Leeds. Ipswich had a hel of season which spoilt the party for one side and it wasn't us.
I'm not saying last year was perfect, I think we had the joint second best team in the league but it was a success. Anyone that can't acknowledge promotion, even if through the playoffs wasn't a successful season. Same as staying up, 17th is a success. |
RMâs last 4 full seasons as a
Manger, has culminated in his teams conceding 257 goals! You would think being a defender he could at least set a team. |  |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 23:03 - Sep 23 with 1279 views | Ifonly |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 21:59 - Sep 23 by Ljames93 |
The cult jumping on my thread, thought this would happen, bless you lot.
I watched everyone moan about RM at the start of last season and then again before the playoffs and both times proved to be stupid.
Can't wait to come back on here in a month or two, it will be the same people calling RM out saying things like "finally he's playing ....and we're winning like we said".
17th this season is a massive success and I have no reason YET to think RM can't achieve that. [Post edited 23 Sep 22:08]
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I guess you could say I was "moaning" about RM since he was appointed (am I part of this "cult" you mention? Sounds thrilling). As I've said since the beginning he's not the right long term choice because trying to play an even more possession heavy approach than Man City is not the right long term choice if we want to survive in the PL. We don't have the money to make it work and we never will.
Everything I've seen since we've been promoted has confirmed that view. RM's successes at the business end of last season, and this season (such as they are), have come when he has backed off from his purist possession approach. He's said that he won't compromise his principles, but the truth is that he has, and the further away we've got from his preferred style, the better we've done.
Could he compromise his style enough for us to survive in the PL? I guess it's possible, but we know that if that happens, he'll revert back as soon as he gets the chance. That's what he did at the start of this season. As soon as he felt he had a bit of breathing room it was back to telling McCarthy to play with his feet, even though we all knew that was ridiculous.
So, long term he is not the answer and I think a lot of people now share that view. These people then say, if he isn't the long term answer, then we should change manager now. Perhaps you could explain why you so confidently say this view is stupid and clueless, and maybe you could do it in a less aggressive way than you have so far. | | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 07:16 - Sep 24 with 1099 views | TripleNiemi |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 22:05 - Sep 23 by Ljames93 |
Put it this way, if Martin was sacked I think I could confidently say the players would strongly disagree with it. |
You âthinkâ you could âconfidentlyâ say the players would be unhappy? (By the way, I happen to agree with you on this point though) [Post edited 24 Sep 7:21]
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| Ready and waiting to mop up those European places...... |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 07:53 - Sep 24 with 1044 views | City_boy |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 21:59 - Sep 23 by Ljames93 |
The cult jumping on my thread, thought this would happen, bless you lot.
I watched everyone moan about RM at the start of last season and then again before the playoffs and both times proved to be stupid.
Can't wait to come back on here in a month or two, it will be the same people calling RM out saying things like "finally he's playing ....and we're winning like we said".
17th this season is a massive success and I have no reason YET to think RM can't achieve that. [Post edited 23 Sep 22:08]
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wow, you sound like a very angry man. Perhaps having a rest for a month or 2 might do you good, and accept there are other views which have some merit and not everyone needs their head checked. [Post edited 24 Sep 7:56]
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 07:55 - Sep 24 with 1035 views | saintwizzler |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 07:16 - Sep 24 by TripleNiemi |
You âthinkâ you could âconfidentlyâ say the players would be unhappy? (By the way, I happen to agree with you on this point though) [Post edited 24 Sep 7:21]
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If Martin was to go, as Iâve said he deserves the 11 games at least up to the November break, then it depends on who replaces him.
If another Jones comes in the players are going to think WTF!?
If a manager who has the respect of the millionaires is appointed then I canât see it being a problem. |  |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 08:16 - Sep 24 with 1014 views | TripleNiemi |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 07:55 - Sep 24 by saintwizzler |
If Martin was to go, as Iâve said he deserves the 11 games at least up to the November break, then it depends on who replaces him.
If another Jones comes in the players are going to think WTF!?
If a manager who has the respect of the millionaires is appointed then I canât see it being a problem. |
Wasnât gonna come straight out and say this as I didnât want to antagonise the O/P any further, but just because the players might be unhappy in my mind speaks volumes. When Strachan came to the club does anyone think he came in with a view to ensuring the players were âhappyâ? No his first thoughts were to improve their fitness levels and had them out running in the depths of the New Forest in a bid to get them fit, and try to prevent us conceding late goals. One of the last things on his mind was keeping the players happy per se. Of course harmony with the players is vital, but not to the point of having favourites shoehorned in to the team (ok not the best case / argument as someone might quote Mr Telfer).
As you said earlier, itâs a results business so what the O/P, myself, or others on a mong board say will have little impact on whether the club pull the trigger. [Post edited 24 Sep 8:21]
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| Ready and waiting to mop up those European places...... |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 08:33 - Sep 24 with 985 views | saintwizzler |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 08:16 - Sep 24 by TripleNiemi |
Wasnât gonna come straight out and say this as I didnât want to antagonise the O/P any further, but just because the players might be unhappy in my mind speaks volumes. When Strachan came to the club does anyone think he came in with a view to ensuring the players were âhappyâ? No his first thoughts were to improve their fitness levels and had them out running in the depths of the New Forest in a bid to get them fit, and try to prevent us conceding late goals. One of the last things on his mind was keeping the players happy per se. Of course harmony with the players is vital, but not to the point of having favourites shoehorned in to the team (ok not the best case / argument as someone might quote Mr Telfer).
As you said earlier, itâs a results business so what the O/P, myself, or others on a mong board say will have little impact on whether the club pull the trigger. [Post edited 24 Sep 8:21]
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Imagine Alex Ferguson or Mourinhoâs take on Ariboâs feeble attempt on a block for Ipswichâs equaliser!! | |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 09:41 - Sep 24 with 934 views | StAnt |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 08:16 - Sep 24 by TripleNiemi |
Wasnât gonna come straight out and say this as I didnât want to antagonise the O/P any further, but just because the players might be unhappy in my mind speaks volumes. When Strachan came to the club does anyone think he came in with a view to ensuring the players were âhappyâ? No his first thoughts were to improve their fitness levels and had them out running in the depths of the New Forest in a bid to get them fit, and try to prevent us conceding late goals. One of the last things on his mind was keeping the players happy per se. Of course harmony with the players is vital, but not to the point of having favourites shoehorned in to the team (ok not the best case / argument as someone might quote Mr Telfer).
As you said earlier, itâs a results business so what the O/P, myself, or others on a mong board say will have little impact on whether the club pull the trigger. [Post edited 24 Sep 8:21]
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Agree with this and especially points about Strachan. One of RM's biggest problems is that he wants to be best friends with all the players, he wants to be their mates. This is not the way to manage footballers and he would be better off distancing himself from them as much as possible. Yes, he has to have a good working relationship with them but he also needs to avoid letting personal feelings cloud his judgement and his ability to hand out brutal home truths and bollickings where necessary. | | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 15:41 - Sep 24 with 841 views | saint901 |
I completely understand why some "fans" want a change in manager (boring play, obstinate tactics, playing players out of position, bizarre substitutions) and I also completely understand that it's not going to happen.
RM wanted to play PL football in the Champ in the belief that it would get us promoted. In my view it did not. We got promoted because we changed the playing style to be bit more direct following a run of poor results in the last half dozen games of the season.
How much of that was done on manager's orders and how much was it the players deciding for themselves? Who knows.
We made promotion by luck. WBA and Leeds hit a bad patch at the wrong time.
Then we see the same style adopted in the PL - and the same errors being made only now they result in a goal against as the PL strikers are better. Loyalty to players has been suggested as a reason we started so poorly. Personally I think it's RM trying to show everybody that he was right all along.
In the last game we see us creeping back to that more direct style and frankly we were unlucky not to win. However Ipswich will be bottom 5 in May next year and a draw at home is not ideal.
RM should have had the newer players playing sooner. Loyalty be damned - if they're better than what we have, play them.
And this is where for me, he lacks something. Either he is stubborn to an unreasonable degree or he is limited and out of his depth.
Doesn't really matter for now because the Board will back him and unless/until we are relegared he is here to stay. | | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 16:04 - Sep 24 with 813 views | PatfromPoole |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 15:41 - Sep 24 by saint901 |
I completely understand why some "fans" want a change in manager (boring play, obstinate tactics, playing players out of position, bizarre substitutions) and I also completely understand that it's not going to happen.
RM wanted to play PL football in the Champ in the belief that it would get us promoted. In my view it did not. We got promoted because we changed the playing style to be bit more direct following a run of poor results in the last half dozen games of the season.
How much of that was done on manager's orders and how much was it the players deciding for themselves? Who knows.
We made promotion by luck. WBA and Leeds hit a bad patch at the wrong time.
Then we see the same style adopted in the PL - and the same errors being made only now they result in a goal against as the PL strikers are better. Loyalty to players has been suggested as a reason we started so poorly. Personally I think it's RM trying to show everybody that he was right all along.
In the last game we see us creeping back to that more direct style and frankly we were unlucky not to win. However Ipswich will be bottom 5 in May next year and a draw at home is not ideal.
RM should have had the newer players playing sooner. Loyalty be damned - if they're better than what we have, play them.
And this is where for me, he lacks something. Either he is stubborn to an unreasonable degree or he is limited and out of his depth.
Doesn't really matter for now because the Board will back him and unless/until we are relegared he is here to stay. |
Completely agree with all of this. |  |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 16:32 - Sep 24 with 802 views | DorsetIan |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 15:41 - Sep 24 by saint901 |
I completely understand why some "fans" want a change in manager (boring play, obstinate tactics, playing players out of position, bizarre substitutions) and I also completely understand that it's not going to happen.
RM wanted to play PL football in the Champ in the belief that it would get us promoted. In my view it did not. We got promoted because we changed the playing style to be bit more direct following a run of poor results in the last half dozen games of the season.
How much of that was done on manager's orders and how much was it the players deciding for themselves? Who knows.
We made promotion by luck. WBA and Leeds hit a bad patch at the wrong time.
Then we see the same style adopted in the PL - and the same errors being made only now they result in a goal against as the PL strikers are better. Loyalty to players has been suggested as a reason we started so poorly. Personally I think it's RM trying to show everybody that he was right all along.
In the last game we see us creeping back to that more direct style and frankly we were unlucky not to win. However Ipswich will be bottom 5 in May next year and a draw at home is not ideal.
RM should have had the newer players playing sooner. Loyalty be damned - if they're better than what we have, play them.
And this is where for me, he lacks something. Either he is stubborn to an unreasonable degree or he is limited and out of his depth.
Doesn't really matter for now because the Board will back him and unless/until we are relegared he is here to stay. |
This might seem like a trite point, but last season RM was the manager and we were promoted.
For me it's very basic. Most of the time, the manager carries the can for a team's failures. The quid pro quo is that the poor b@stard gets some credit if the team does well.
We had a record-breaking run last season. RM gets the credit for that. And for getting us promoted.
There's enough nonsense in modern football already without trying to theorise away managerial successes too. | |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 16:55 - Sep 24 with 766 views | Bazza |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 16:32 - Sep 24 by DorsetIan |
This might seem like a trite point, but last season RM was the manager and we were promoted.
For me it's very basic. Most of the time, the manager carries the can for a team's failures. The quid pro quo is that the poor b@stard gets some credit if the team does well.
We had a record-breaking run last season. RM gets the credit for that. And for getting us promoted.
There's enough nonsense in modern football already without trying to theorise away managerial successes too. |
But Saints were favourites for promotion and only scraped through via the play-offs albeit cheered by us all. | | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 19:20 - Sep 24 with 697 views | Southamptonfan |
Whatever is said on here, Russel Martin is generally popular in the stadium. A large number of fans were singing Russel Martin's red army, and many cheered him as he lapped the pitch at the end of the Ipswich game. It is seriously a much different atmosphere to the Nathan Jones days. There is an appreciation of the joy that Wembley final brought us all. The Ipswich game was a decent performance. The players and manager were clapped for their performance.
I am definitely in the RM in camp at the moment. Give him a bit of time. The grass isn't greener. If the last few years haven't taught Saints fans that the grass isn't greener, then I am not sure what would. Pellegrino to Hughes, Hughes to Ralph, Ralph to Jones, Jones to Selles. Has changing the manager improved things? Most of us with any sense know that the PL is a really tough league, it's difficult as a newly promoted side and we have lesser players. RM needs more time. | |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 21:57 - Sep 24 with 614 views | kernow |
Good points . | | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 11:44 - Sep 25 with 397 views | DorsetIan |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 16:55 - Sep 24 by Bazza |
But Saints were favourites for promotion and only scraped through via the play-offs albeit cheered by us all. |
We didn't win the league or go up automatically, so he doesn't get credit for that.
But he got us promoted, so he gets credit for that, whether or not we were favorites.
Had we failed to get promoted when we were favourites, he could have been criticised for that, but that wasn't the case.
I appreciate that I am taking a very simplistic view but I just think managers are generally on a hiding to nothing (leaving aside how much they might be paid) so they should get credit for any success. | |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 11:57 - Sep 25 with 382 views | kingolaf |
Martin out. Tactics and substitutions are horrendous.
When Bally was appointed, there werenât many that gave us much hope, yet he got a tune out of the team.
We need someone to get a tune out of this squad. That is not Martin. Potter and Moyes are available, get one in or weâre going down with a whimper. | | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 12:50 - Sep 25 with 334 views | DorsetIan |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 11:57 - Sep 25 by kingolaf |
Martin out. Tactics and substitutions are horrendous.
When Bally was appointed, there werenât many that gave us much hope, yet he got a tune out of the team.
We need someone to get a tune out of this squad. That is not Martin. Potter and Moyes are available, get one in or weâre going down with a whimper. |
His subs and team selections are not half as crazy as Hassenhutl's were. | |
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 13:20 - Sep 25 with 286 views | kingolaf |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 12:50 - Sep 25 by DorsetIan |
His subs and team selections are not half as crazy as Hassenhutl's were. |
Not Branfoot, but I wouldnât want him in charge either. | | | |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 13:20 - Sep 25 with 285 views | grumpy |
| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 12:50 - Sep 25 by DorsetIan |
His subs and team selections are not half as crazy as Hassenhutl's were. |
Very difficult,Martin has to have our respect for getting us promotion and itâs probably too early to be looking elsewhere but his insistence on ridiculous tactics is trying a lot saints fans patience. [Post edited 25 Sep 13:30]
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| 'Martin Out' fans are clueless! on 13:42 - Sep 25 with 255 views | Berber |
â Anyone that wants Martin out needs their head checked.â
Your opening statement and introduction to the board, where differing views are discussed routinely by contributors of all ages and backgrounds. Rather than wait a month before coming back, why not make it a year or two and give yourself a chance to grow up. |  |
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