| General Election Thread 17:46 - May 22 with 243589 views | loftboy |
This will be the first election that I have no idea who to vote for, will never vote Tory again after the lies during covid where my dad lost his life, don’t trust starmer, would never vote for a bunch of racists like reform , anyone give me a clue?
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| General Election Thread on 12:01 - Jul 12 with 1160 views | Watford_Ranger |
| General Election Thread on 11:43 - Jul 12 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Small price to pay for a great system IMO. |
Making people healthier in general is a great investment even ignoring the non-financial reasons for doing so. Fewer beds taken up in hospitals, less work absence, better productivity, smaller waiting lists meaning problems don’t worsen as much and become more expensive to treat if they can be treated at all. All that guff about whether or not to fund school meals but that small investment saves a fortune down the line in avoiding malnourishment. Health really is wealth. |  | | |
| General Election Thread on 12:22 - Jul 12 with 1114 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| General Election Thread on 12:01 - Jul 12 by Watford_Ranger |
Making people healthier in general is a great investment even ignoring the non-financial reasons for doing so. Fewer beds taken up in hospitals, less work absence, better productivity, smaller waiting lists meaning problems don’t worsen as much and become more expensive to treat if they can be treated at all. All that guff about whether or not to fund school meals but that small investment saves a fortune down the line in avoiding malnourishment. Health really is wealth. |
The NHS is a failure!! Odd thing to say given how reliant I have been of it, and the excellent service it provided both my parents.
However, it is a failure and the reason is that everyone has forgotten what it was set up for after WW2. The realisation that Britain was unhealthy became apparent, and it was set up to improve the health of the nation. As I understand it: It was seen as a short-term boost, and was not meant to be a long-term institution.
Whether that is true or not, the reality is that Britain is extremely unhealthy and the NHS has become too focused on 'reacting' to health issues, and not being 'proactive' as say, Finland. The NHS and thus, the public purse, is bogged down in lifestyle related illnesses/treatments, and frankly, it, the government, and people in general, need to get on the front foot and shift focus.
But, as long as big pharma rule the roost, prescribing expensive medicines will be the order of the day. But as we get older, less fit and healthy as a nation, there will be an exponential cost to keeping the NHS operating to the incredibly high levels it has. Plus, we're in a race with many other western nations for healthcare workers from developing nations, at the same time as we continue to resist developing our own recruits because it's cheaper to bring in then train and develop your own nationals. Which is what Finland has been doing: being proactive, encouraging wellness, and reducing the burden on the health system, especially in terms of needing healthcare workers.
However, recruiting from overseas is not sustainable. Britain, like mostly all western nations, need to get on the front foot, and become more proactive in their approach, and get people to be more healthy from the outset. Ultimately, it will allow people to live better lives, and save them and the country a 'kin lot of wedge.
Finally, having visited an old friend at Northwick Park when I returned following my mum's passing, I was saying to my wife as we strolled up to the hospital, how, the last time I was here with my mum about 10 years earlier, there were a few patients outside, on drips, smoking. Well guess what: there were more of them outside smoking away...I mean FFS!!! |  |
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| General Election Thread on 12:38 - Jul 12 with 1068 views | BazzaInTheLoft |
| General Election Thread on 12:01 - Jul 12 by Watford_Ranger |
Making people healthier in general is a great investment even ignoring the non-financial reasons for doing so. Fewer beds taken up in hospitals, less work absence, better productivity, smaller waiting lists meaning problems don’t worsen as much and become more expensive to treat if they can be treated at all. All that guff about whether or not to fund school meals but that small investment saves a fortune down the line in avoiding malnourishment. Health really is wealth. |
Exactly. It is a moral obligation. |  | | |
| General Election Thread on 12:46 - Jul 12 with 1929 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| General Election Thread on 12:38 - Jul 12 by BazzaInTheLoft |
Exactly. It is a moral obligation. |
Upon whom? | |
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| General Election Thread on 14:09 - Jul 12 with 1814 views | StJude82 |
Labour have come up with a fantastic solution to our overcrowded prison system. Let a load of criminals out early!! EASY PEASY!! Their solution to mass illegal immigration will almost certainly be....wait for it........A MASS AMNESTY AND NATURALISATION!! There you are, Job done. | | | |
| General Election Thread on 14:13 - Jul 12 with 1806 views | stowmarketrange |
| General Election Thread on 14:09 - Jul 12 by StJude82 |
Labour have come up with a fantastic solution to our overcrowded prison system. Let a load of criminals out early!! EASY PEASY!! Their solution to mass illegal immigration will almost certainly be....wait for it........A MASS AMNESTY AND NATURALISATION!! There you are, Job done. |
They’re doing exactly what the tories already planned on doing to ease the prison overcrowding problem.They can’t suddenly magic prison places out of thin air,and it’s pretty difficult to build a new prison in 7 days. |  | | |
| General Election Thread on 14:14 - Jul 12 with 1804 views | StJude82 |
| General Election Thread on 12:44 - Jul 11 by Esox_Lucius |
OK, I wasn't clear about my comment re Fossil fuel. In the short term it is very necessary as the resources to abandon it will require it in their production and installation. Analogous to Steam boats and trains still in use whilst other alternatives were introduced.
Notwithstanding the report is by a company with a vested interest; this report gives a fairly up to date view on where technology is with marine power generation and some speculative costings.
https://ore.catapult.org.uk/media-centre/press-releases/new-industry-leading-rep
Wind turbine life is varied between 20-30 years dependent on a number of factors but at the end of their life they are recycled and the UK already is installing recycled wind turbines. It may not be a perfect solution but there is no nuclear waste disposal issues and environmental impact is less than that of a coal fired power station.
I believe it will take a strong government to fully capitalise on the move to cleaner power but I have little faith that we will ever have a government in my lifetime who will spurn the bribery and make such a change.
As a slight aside in the lifespan of wind turbines there is research taking place to make it more ecologically viable wrt the actual turbine blades themselves.
https://www.ucdavis.edu/climate/news/a-sustainable-solution-wind-turbine-blades# [Post edited 11 Jul 12:47]
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what are these synthetic oils synthesised from and what powers the synthesizing process? | | | |
| General Election Thread on 14:23 - Jul 12 with 1784 views | StJude82 |
| General Election Thread on 14:13 - Jul 12 by stowmarketrange |
They’re doing exactly what the tories already planned on doing to ease the prison overcrowding problem.They can’t suddenly magic prison places out of thin air,and it’s pretty difficult to build a new prison in 7 days. |
I do agree that the Tories have left things in poor shape that is why they got their arses shredded but this is not a long term solution. What they could do is decriminalise TV licence evasion and pardon everyone inside for that for starters. They think in straight lines rather than laterally which is why they will fail. | | | |
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| General Election Thread on 14:26 - Jul 12 with 1777 views | Rangersw12 |
| General Election Thread on 14:09 - Jul 12 by StJude82 |
Labour have come up with a fantastic solution to our overcrowded prison system. Let a load of criminals out early!! EASY PEASY!! Their solution to mass illegal immigration will almost certainly be....wait for it........A MASS AMNESTY AND NATURALISATION!! There you are, Job done. |
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| General Election Thread on 14:42 - Jul 12 with 1752 views | R_from_afar |
| General Election Thread on 12:22 - Jul 12 by PlanetHonneywood |
The NHS is a failure!! Odd thing to say given how reliant I have been of it, and the excellent service it provided both my parents.
However, it is a failure and the reason is that everyone has forgotten what it was set up for after WW2. The realisation that Britain was unhealthy became apparent, and it was set up to improve the health of the nation. As I understand it: It was seen as a short-term boost, and was not meant to be a long-term institution.
Whether that is true or not, the reality is that Britain is extremely unhealthy and the NHS has become too focused on 'reacting' to health issues, and not being 'proactive' as say, Finland. The NHS and thus, the public purse, is bogged down in lifestyle related illnesses/treatments, and frankly, it, the government, and people in general, need to get on the front foot and shift focus.
But, as long as big pharma rule the roost, prescribing expensive medicines will be the order of the day. But as we get older, less fit and healthy as a nation, there will be an exponential cost to keeping the NHS operating to the incredibly high levels it has. Plus, we're in a race with many other western nations for healthcare workers from developing nations, at the same time as we continue to resist developing our own recruits because it's cheaper to bring in then train and develop your own nationals. Which is what Finland has been doing: being proactive, encouraging wellness, and reducing the burden on the health system, especially in terms of needing healthcare workers.
However, recruiting from overseas is not sustainable. Britain, like mostly all western nations, need to get on the front foot, and become more proactive in their approach, and get people to be more healthy from the outset. Ultimately, it will allow people to live better lives, and save them and the country a 'kin lot of wedge.
Finally, having visited an old friend at Northwick Park when I returned following my mum's passing, I was saying to my wife as we strolled up to the hospital, how, the last time I was here with my mum about 10 years earlier, there were a few patients outside, on drips, smoking. Well guess what: there were more of them outside smoking away...I mean FFS!!! |
"But, as long as big pharma rule the roost, prescribing expensive medicines will be the order of the day".
I'm sorry but as someone who is married to a pharmacist who has worked for the NHS for over 35 years, I can't let that go 
Big pharna does not rule the roost. They court NHS workers but thanks to the way NHS services are interconnected, if treatment other than pills, e.g. physio, is more likely to work, the patient will be referred accordingly. Alternatively, the best way forward might be a mixture of medicine and complementary services.
Phmarmacists actually serve to prevent big pharma from having an undue influence. |  |
| "Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1." |
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| General Election Thread on 14:43 - Jul 12 with 1752 views | stowmarketrange |
| General Election Thread on 14:23 - Jul 12 by StJude82 |
I do agree that the Tories have left things in poor shape that is why they got their arses shredded but this is not a long term solution. What they could do is decriminalise TV licence evasion and pardon everyone inside for that for starters. They think in straight lines rather than laterally which is why they will fail. |
I very much doubt that there are many people in prison for not paying the tv licence.We all know that it’s not a long term solution,but what alternative is there in the short term?The courts would not be able to sentence some serious criminals if there were no room in prisons to put them. | | | |
| General Election Thread on 17:29 - Jul 12 with 1619 views | QPR_John |
How long does a new government have before blaming all its problems on the outgoing government becomes unsustainable. | | | |
| General Election Thread on 17:37 - Jul 12 with 1603 views | Ranger_Things |
| General Election Thread on 17:29 - Jul 12 by QPR_John |
How long does a new government have before blaming all its problems on the outgoing government becomes unsustainable. |
The last lot were still mentioning the joke “no money” letter when campaigning last week ,so I’m guessing much longer now there really is no money. |  | | |
| General Election Thread on 17:48 - Jul 12 with 1595 views | Esox_Lucius |
| General Election Thread on 14:14 - Jul 12 by StJude82 |
what are these synthetic oils synthesised from and what powers the synthesizing process? |
Group IV polyalphaolefin (PAO) base oils |  |
| The grass is always greener. |
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| General Election Thread on 18:40 - Jul 12 with 1529 views | hubble |
| General Election Thread on 14:42 - Jul 12 by R_from_afar |
"But, as long as big pharma rule the roost, prescribing expensive medicines will be the order of the day".
I'm sorry but as someone who is married to a pharmacist who has worked for the NHS for over 35 years, I can't let that go
Big pharna does not rule the roost. They court NHS workers but thanks to the way NHS services are interconnected, if treatment other than pills, e.g. physio, is more likely to work, the patient will be referred accordingly. Alternatively, the best way forward might be a mixture of medicine and complementary services.
Phmarmacists actually serve to prevent big pharma from having an undue influence. |
Just to back up your post Rfar, if it wasn't for the NHS and big pharma, I'd probably be dead. I'm on an advanced 'biologic' to help curb a severe immune disorder. It was developed by big pharma, and the NHS pays for it, so that I can live, pretty much for the first time as an adult without extreme and debilitating pain and stigma.
That is not to say that I in any way applaud the way much of big pharma's model is based on creating reliance and addiction, as opposed to actually curing people. But as you can see, it's not a black and white issue. To say the NHS is a failure is absurd. It's certainly in a real mess, but it still serves an incredibly important purpose in millions of people's lives. |  |
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| General Election Thread on 19:17 - Jul 12 with 1481 views | Watford_Ranger |
| General Election Thread on 14:43 - Jul 12 by stowmarketrange |
I very much doubt that there are many people in prison for not paying the tv licence.We all know that it’s not a long term solution,but what alternative is there in the short term?The courts would not be able to sentence some serious criminals if there were no room in prisons to put them. |
There’s a massive court backlog too. Cases being given dates in 2027. Basically everything is broken and it’s going to take some extreme measures to start to fix them in just about every area. I very much doubt Labour/Starmer want to be doing this. | | | |
| General Election Thread on 19:37 - Jul 12 with 1444 views | R_from_afar |
| General Election Thread on 18:40 - Jul 12 by hubble |
Just to back up your post Rfar, if it wasn't for the NHS and big pharma, I'd probably be dead. I'm on an advanced 'biologic' to help curb a severe immune disorder. It was developed by big pharma, and the NHS pays for it, so that I can live, pretty much for the first time as an adult without extreme and debilitating pain and stigma.
That is not to say that I in any way applaud the way much of big pharma's model is based on creating reliance and addiction, as opposed to actually curing people. But as you can see, it's not a black and white issue. To say the NHS is a failure is absurd. It's certainly in a real mess, but it still serves an incredibly important purpose in millions of people's lives. |
Glad the treatment is keeping you with us, rooting for you  | |
| "Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1." |
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| General Election Thread on 19:44 - Jul 12 with 1431 views | PlanetHonneywood |
| General Election Thread on 18:40 - Jul 12 by hubble |
Just to back up your post Rfar, if it wasn't for the NHS and big pharma, I'd probably be dead. I'm on an advanced 'biologic' to help curb a severe immune disorder. It was developed by big pharma, and the NHS pays for it, so that I can live, pretty much for the first time as an adult without extreme and debilitating pain and stigma.
That is not to say that I in any way applaud the way much of big pharma's model is based on creating reliance and addiction, as opposed to actually curing people. But as you can see, it's not a black and white issue. To say the NHS is a failure is absurd. It's certainly in a real mess, but it still serves an incredibly important purpose in millions of people's lives. |
I think you've kind of proved my point regarding big pharma. Given the huge subsidies/tax breaks etc. it never ceases to amaze me how much gets charged for medicines we've paid for. But hey-ho.
As i say: for what i understand the original principles behind its creation, I think its failed because GB is becoming increasingly unhealthy. As a doctor once said to me, 'we're living longer, but we're not living better' I think he was right, and i did speak of the 'incredibly high levels' the NHS operates at, and the excellence my family has experienced in terms of treatment for matters out of our control in many respects.
The point being, which i think was evident in my post, however, for the avoudance of doubt: people need to take more responsibility for the health which they can control. While accepting pharmaceuticals are often required, the oxycontin scandal, though an extreme example, is what we're often dealing with here. | |
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| General Election Thread on 19:54 - Jul 12 with 1420 views | Esox_Lucius |
| General Election Thread on 17:29 - Jul 12 by QPR_John |
How long does a new government have before blaming all its problems on the outgoing government becomes unsustainable. |
Based on the amount of people I have read blaming what happened under the Tories on the state Blair and Brown left the country in, I would guess at 15-20 years. | |
| The grass is always greener. |
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| General Election Thread on 20:25 - Jul 12 with 1382 views | Wilkinswatercarrier |
| General Election Thread on 19:54 - Jul 12 by Esox_Lucius |
Based on the amount of people I have read blaming what happened under the Tories on the state Blair and Brown left the country in, I would guess at 15-20 years. |
And every lefty has been blaming Thatcher for everything for the past 40 years!
And so it goes on............ | | | |
| General Election Thread on 21:10 - Jul 12 with 1335 views | Esox_Lucius |
| General Election Thread on 20:25 - Jul 12 by Wilkinswatercarrier |
And every lefty has been blaming Thatcher for everything for the past 40 years!
And so it goes on............ |
I think anyone with a scrap of decency in them would blame Thatcher for what has happened to this country. | |
| The grass is always greener. |
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| General Election Thread on 21:10 - Jul 12 with 1333 views | PlanetHonneywood |
Out of interest, what were the plans to deal with prison overcrowding of the Tories and Lib Dems?
Private jails are not the simple answer. It needs a more holistic approach, which will take years to implement, and simply building more jails - while more are needed - isn't going to happen overnight and recruiting and training the staff will be equally challenging, especially if you haven't got sufficiently experienced staff to take up key positions.
Our penal system is and has been a mess for decades, and we need to avoid mirroring the disastrous US system. | |
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| General Election Thread on 21:27 - Jul 12 with 1313 views | CiderwithRsie |
| General Election Thread on 14:23 - Jul 12 by StJude82 |
I do agree that the Tories have left things in poor shape that is why they got their arses shredded but this is not a long term solution. What they could do is decriminalise TV licence evasion and pardon everyone inside for that for starters. They think in straight lines rather than laterally which is why they will fail. |
Of course it's not a long-term solution and no-one thinks it is.
The whole point is that the last government was so monumentally incompetent that long-term, medium term or even short-term solutions won't do, what is needed is emergency action to allow the Police to be able to a arrest anyone at all in about two months time.
Of course the TV licence should be decriminalised, but the offence does not carry. prison sentence, merely a fine and the only people jailed are those who don't (or can't) pay the fine - a tiny number which would make no significant difference at all (especially as a lot of them are women, and there actually isn't a crisis in women's jails yet.)
The situation is a f*cking disgrace and anyone who is pointing fingers at the incoming government rather than the ones who have been in charge for 14 years wants to have a word with themselves. Conservative head of the Police and Crime Commissioner's body was on the radio today saying the govt was doing about the only thing possible and sounding mighty relieved to have someone in charge who was actually listening to what the PCCs were saying.
At least the previous Minister of Justice lost his seat in the election and bloody right too. | | | |
| General Election Thread on 21:38 - Jul 12 with 1282 views | CiderwithRsie |
This, incidentally, is from a fact-checking site, in answer to a statement by our former esteemed PM that "too many women have ended up in prison for non-payment" of the V Licence:
"There are a number of problems with this claim. You cannot be sent to prison for failing to pay a TV licence fee, only for failing to pay a court-imposed fine in connection with a conviction for not paying the fee. Being imprisoned for this offence is rare—the latest available figures for England and Wales show no one was jailed in 2020 or 2021, and no more than two people were in 2019."
So two people - count 'em folks, you'll need at least one hand - in three years. | | | |
| General Election Thread on 22:01 - Jul 12 with 1240 views | Lblock |
Why are prisons overcrowded?
For me it’s due to the soft fcukrs going easy on crime for the last 30 years
There’s no fear of the police or consequences anymore and the do gooders must surely take a stand back now and say to themselves “oh fcuk, maybe I wasn’t helping with all my talking and understanding ballox”
If incarceration was feared there’d be less crime
Sending these lawless knuts on safari and “talking therapy” has got us nowhere apart from this mess.
Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime was the biggest joke of a strapline ever
Don’t get me started on the dissolving of police powers alongside the reduction of frontline officers (which the outgoing tvvats actually accelerated).
Country has crumbled and is now in ruins
I cannot see any government with the gumption to sort it no matter what side of the spectrum they’re from |  |
| Cherish and enjoy life.... this ain't no dress rehearsal |
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