| reading this forum and silence from official site, 19:28 - Mar 9 with 17601 views | Liberty |
Its looking more and more likely, Monk will not be manager permanently.
Is that the popular vote ?
Think Monk fans are accepting this at last.
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:19 - Mar 12 with 1475 views | Darran |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:12 - Mar 12 by llangyfelach |
Its a game. That's all it is. Its way down in the list of priorities in my life. I agree with you, Dar. Its all some people have in their lives, each to their own and all that, but if all I had to talk about and build my life around was a game of f*cking football then I'd have done myself in years ago |
It's not so much the talking because I'll talk about it all day it's how deeply people look into situations that disturbs me because as you said Mart it's a game,well it was once anyway. |  |
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:19 - Mar 12 with 1475 views | MattG |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:10 - Mar 12 by Spratty |
The post you quoted did not from my reading suggest that the comment had been "proven" to be a lie. It questioned if it could be and asked why.....
"could there be an untruth and if so, Why"
then from my reading went on to explore that hypothesis -
"but to say they were in such a bad state they had to come of and then we find out its not true"
To explore the possibility of its untruth given some potentially conflicting signals I suppose is fair enough. It is not saying it is proven to be a lie but questioning if it might be.
Just as us unquestioningly accepting it as the truth does not mean it is true.
Many football managers will spout anything that people might accept to cover up any short comings, especially if new and feel under pressure to achieve (aka Bren when first at Liverpool).
Personally I was willing to generally accept it even though Bony did not seem to want to come off and that seemed an otherwise baffling substitution (akin to bringing Leroy on at Everton instead of Bony). However I posted a potential tongue in cheek alternative reality in response to these comments and other comments about a player coup d'etat. This is indeed backed up to some extent by comments from Ash about him, Monk and Leon wanting to save the club. Potentially read 3 disaffected players not happy to toe the line and in a position of power with the ear of a Chairman (whose own critical newspaper articles at key times show he has a poor relationship with the then manager) . Monk has also made it clear that every player will be given a chance. Fair enough and presumably to achieve buy in from the whole team. But this could explain some of his substitutions (although not necessarily those against CP). |
The post I quoted also said "Why would the manager say that they were both very unwell when they weren't?". That reads as a statement of fact (or, at least, FACT) rather than any sort of hypothetical. Similarly, what you refer to as "exploring that hypothesis" also reads (to me, at least) as a statement of FACT.
Libertine's post suggests that Monk had been found out to have been lying about the illness, hence my question. If he hasn't, that's fine and I'll form my own opinions. |  | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:24 - Mar 12 with 1466 views | llangyfelach |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:19 - Mar 12 by Darran |
It's not so much the talking because I'll talk about it all day it's how deeply people look into situations that disturbs me because as you said Mart it's a game,well it was once anyway. |
Without wanting to sound like my learned friend Lohengrin, the game I fell in love with f*cked off years ago. This is a pale, watered down version of what it used to be |  |
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:25 - Mar 12 with 1463 views | Spratty |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:53 - Mar 12 by swanny |
Machiavellian in the extreme.....
If this was all down to certain disaffected players behaving like spoilt teenagers, then wouldn't that mean that Laudrup didn't have the necessary qualities required to 'man manage' the football team. As a Manager, shouldn't he have been able to deal with that sort of behaviour.
I know that there are those who think that we shouldn't have got rid of him, but even by your own admissions he wasn't managing certain players. |
Sorry you misunderstand me. I am not admitting anything m’lud I am just hypothesising based on comments raised by others.
I think Laudrup himself has said that there was no problem with the players. If this is correct and anything was going on then it was presumably behind his back. If the Chairman encouraged this then there is more than 1 person we should be asking questions about. However this is all conjecture aside from what is observed and comments made.
I have seen Ash put himself on the line many times on the field. I have however also seen him doing a lot of sulking when he should have been leading and (even under Monk) shouting at others for his own mistakes. Also continuing to hypothesise in relation to your point. Perhaps Laudrup attempted to remove player(s) but was prevented by a board who did not agree / wanted their men in there. Who knows? |  | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:28 - Mar 12 with 1460 views | MattG |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 08:53 - Mar 12 by libertine |
you didn't need to read it anywhere you have a brain and eyes and a tv on which to watch the welsh game and the interview after the palace game. (these are assumptions)
or is it just blind faith |
It's neither - I was simply questioning whether it was fact rather than FACT. It turns out to have just been your opinion - that's fine, you're entitled.
For what it's worth, I don't necessarily accept that having a sickness bug on the Sunday should necessarily stop you playing again on the Tuesday - illness like that can disappear very quickly. If you also factor in that both players managed around an hour on the Sunday, it suggests that it wasn't exactly life-threatening. Of course, if Ash hadn't been well enough to play at all on Sunday and then turned out for Wales on the Tuesday, that would be a different matter. | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:42 - Mar 12 with 1446 views | Spratty |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:19 - Mar 12 by MattG |
The post I quoted also said "Why would the manager say that they were both very unwell when they weren't?". That reads as a statement of fact (or, at least, FACT) rather than any sort of hypothetical. Similarly, what you refer to as "exploring that hypothesis" also reads (to me, at least) as a statement of FACT.
Libertine's post suggests that Monk had been found out to have been lying about the illness, hence my question. If he hasn't, that's fine and I'll form my own opinions. |
Certainly not as far as I know and if Ash was throwing up on the pitch think it was pretty self evident for him at least. | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:43 - Mar 12 with 1442 views | MattG |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:42 - Mar 12 by Spratty |
Certainly not as far as I know and if Ash was throwing up on the pitch think it was pretty self evident for him at least. |
From where I was sat (North West corner) he certainly looked to be throwing up (or something close to it) fairly early in the second half although it was over the other side of the field so not 100%. | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:43 - Mar 12 with 1442 views | Dr_Winston |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:42 - Mar 12 by Spratty |
Certainly not as far as I know and if Ash was throwing up on the pitch think it was pretty self evident for him at least. |
Ash was chucking up on the pitch. Saw him do it. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:51 - Mar 12 with 1431 views | Spratty |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:43 - Mar 12 by MattG |
From where I was sat (North West corner) he certainly looked to be throwing up (or something close to it) fairly early in the second half although it was over the other side of the field so not 100%. |
Didn't notice myself but didn't doubt it as a few people had said. Think the one that was questioned by a few was Bony as he seemed to be surprised at going off. That is not to say he didn't have a stomach bug. | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 15:13 - Mar 12 with 1405 views | WarwickHunt |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 13:51 - Mar 12 by Spratty |
Didn't notice myself but didn't doubt it as a few people had said. Think the one that was questioned by a few was Bony as he seemed to be surprised at going off. That is not to say he didn't have a stomach bug. |
Exactly. I don't think anyone thinks that Ash was taken off for tactical reasons. He looked OK on TV and didn't limp off so there was understandably quite a bit of WTF? at the time.
Bony looked a different matter. Even if he was ill, Lita is the last person you want to come on in his place and try to close a defence down.
Vazquez couldn't score on freebie night in a brothel at the moment but at least he runs about a bit...
Giving everyone a chance? F*ck me, it's an end of the season relegation battle not a 5 a side kickabout after school. [Post edited 12 Mar 2014 15:25]
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 16:29 - Mar 12 with 1371 views | Shaky |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 15:13 - Mar 12 by WarwickHunt |
Exactly. I don't think anyone thinks that Ash was taken off for tactical reasons. He looked OK on TV and didn't limp off so there was understandably quite a bit of WTF? at the time.
Bony looked a different matter. Even if he was ill, Lita is the last person you want to come on in his place and try to close a defence down.
Vazquez couldn't score on freebie night in a brothel at the moment but at least he runs about a bit...
Giving everyone a chance? F*ck me, it's an end of the season relegation battle not a 5 a side kickabout after school. [Post edited 12 Mar 2014 15:25]
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"Giving everyone a chance? F*ck me, it's an end of the season relegation battle not a 5 a side kickabout after school. "
No, no, no -- that was urgent situation **before** Laudrup sacked!
Now every tactical mistake, dubious substitution and white flag team selection represents valuable nuggets of experience and life lessons to be chalked up on debit side of Monk's fledgling management ledger.
He's got all the time in the world, obviously until such a time as he f*cks up spectacularly, after which time probabilities suggest his management career will be over.
I actually feel a bit sorry for the poor sod, who seems to be on a hiding to nothing; stitched up like a kipper, if you'll pardon the mixed metaphors. |  |
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 17:18 - Mar 12 with 1343 views | libertine |
it does appear that our shaky has got it right,
didn't garry say that he hoped chris would give ash a break as he was very ill and had badly bruised toes.
therefore we have 2 different opinions of the same condition, one correct and one incorrect.
Its madness to ask Garry to take on such an important role without any managerial experience in the most prestigious league in the world. There is no doubt in his commitment and his ability to get the players going, but be honest its unfair on the guy.
To use Tim Spurs as a parallel is ridiculous as his experience is vast in comparison.
i really want to be talking out of my arsss and hope i am.
Its a pity that Michael and Garry could not have teamed up, we would have gained massively as a club.
When i made the comment that our Garry had made decisions not just by himself it was not meant as a negative comment but a point that maybe he was not solely responsible for the sub decisions |  | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 18:04 - Mar 12 with 1330 views | Plasticman |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 09:16 - Mar 12 by libertine |
Just a thought but does anyone think that Our Garry actually made the sub decisions all by himself or were there other people who he discussed this with ( i am not at all suggesting that garry has any mental disorders), does he have autonomy. |
I guess a headset were used to send directives from the chairman to 'his guy' near the manager to pass on the instructions. See we're more advanced than Cardiff, we use wireless technology rather than send paper notes.
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 18:15 - Mar 12 with 1320 views | Jackfath |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 18:04 - Mar 12 by Plasticman |
I guess a headset were used to send directives from the chairman to 'his guy' near the manager to pass on the instructions. See we're more advanced than Cardiff, we use wireless technology rather than send paper notes.
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I am aware that Mr Monk does own one of these.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Apollo-Invisible-Earpiece-Wireless-Hidden-Earphone/dp/B0  |  |
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 19:24 - Mar 12 with 1303 views | Phil_S |
Two great things on this thread
"Monk asked for advice before making a sub" - fuk me Roberto's sub decisions were largely suggested by Graeme Jones but all of them were after consultation with each other
"Laudrup said there was no problem with the players" - well he is hardly likely to admit they all hated him now is he?
What the seeker seeks the prover proves |  | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 22:00 - Mar 12 with 1261 views | Catullus |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 16:29 - Mar 12 by Shaky |
"Giving everyone a chance? F*ck me, it's an end of the season relegation battle not a 5 a side kickabout after school. "
No, no, no -- that was urgent situation **before** Laudrup sacked!
Now every tactical mistake, dubious substitution and white flag team selection represents valuable nuggets of experience and life lessons to be chalked up on debit side of Monk's fledgling management ledger.
He's got all the time in the world, obviously until such a time as he f*cks up spectacularly, after which time probabilities suggest his management career will be over.
I actually feel a bit sorry for the poor sod, who seems to be on a hiding to nothing; stitched up like a kipper, if you'll pardon the mixed metaphors. |
I don't agree and at least one of your opinions is dead wrong, managers f*ck up all the time but in football, failure is no gurantee of never working again. many managers have proved time and again they aren't up to much, but still get chances!! Actually, it's the same for the pundits too. |  |
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 22:09 - Mar 12 with 1252 views | WarwickHunt |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 19:24 - Mar 12 by Phil_S |
Two great things on this thread
"Monk asked for advice before making a sub" - fuk me Roberto's sub decisions were largely suggested by Graeme Jones but all of them were after consultation with each other
"Laudrup said there was no problem with the players" - well he is hardly likely to admit they all hated him now is he?
What the seeker seeks the prover proves |
Perhaps he consulted Graeme Jones because he was the assistant manager.
I'm guessing, obviously.
Pep Clotet is the "academy consultant". Slight difference.
As you were. | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 01:08 - Mar 13 with 1200 views | Liberty |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 22:09 - Mar 12 by WarwickHunt |
Perhaps he consulted Graeme Jones because he was the assistant manager.
I'm guessing, obviously.
Pep Clotet is the "academy consultant". Slight difference.
As you were. |
This
What team has Monk got supporting him, advising him, scouting.
Short term, getting by on Laudrups coat tails.
Everything going wrong at moment is Laudrups fault, everything right ( we beat 2nd from bottom Cardiff, knocked out of FA cup, Europa ) is Monks motivational skills.
As someone posted, Monk and Laudrup could have been a good team.
Laudrup truly shafted by his Captain and player power. Thats no captain in my eyes.
Laudrup has gone, but why temp manager and some players keep knocking him, pitiful. Grow some balls, you were captain / playing on pitch, what- we didn't play our best because we didn't get a cuddle, train in afternoons, had a day off.
If Laudrup had let them go to races he would have been slaughtered. Double standards are embarrassing.
Out of 2 cups and 1 win against s poor team, get real.
Monk no better, prob worse than Laudrup as far ad results are concerned.
If he says its all about performance, not results once more.......... seriously. Give me results any day, thats the proof of a good performance.
Talked the talk, now walk the walk over next few fixtures. Wba, win or bust. If we don't win this, then seriously. Some would still blame Laudrup for something he said or did.
Team need to man up. If they keep blaming past for failings and keep praising new regime for improvement, early days yet, why didn't they play for shirt b4, none of them come out if this looking good. [Post edited 13 Mar 2014 2:22]
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 06:35 - Mar 13 with 1142 views | Phil_S |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 22:09 - Mar 12 by WarwickHunt |
Perhaps he consulted Graeme Jones because he was the assistant manager.
I'm guessing, obviously.
Pep Clotet is the "academy consultant". Slight difference.
As you were. |
Not really surely as any manager you would seek advice from those around you
If it was Pep then maybe Garry has asked him to help him out in the meantime, surely we don't need a massive announcement on the official site to announce it?
So in theory there is no difference at all. Unless of course you want to seek things that make things look wrong? | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 08:32 - Mar 13 with 1105 views | WarwickHunt |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 06:35 - Mar 13 by Phil_S |
Not really surely as any manager you would seek advice from those around you
If it was Pep then maybe Garry has asked him to help him out in the meantime, surely we don't need a massive announcement on the official site to announce it?
So in theory there is no difference at all. Unless of course you want to seek things that make things look wrong? |
I'm not blaming Monk for getting advice from Pep, I'm blaming the board for how they dealt with the removal of Laudrup and how they handled his succession.
The result is a rookie asking the academy consultant for advice on substitutions.
In a relegation six-pointer. With an old fox like Pulis on the other bench.
Hardly any difference at all really....
If you're happy with that then crack on. Your naivety is touching. | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:16 - Mar 13 with 1064 views | Phil_S |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 08:32 - Mar 13 by WarwickHunt |
I'm not blaming Monk for getting advice from Pep, I'm blaming the board for how they dealt with the removal of Laudrup and how they handled his succession.
The result is a rookie asking the academy consultant for advice on substitutions.
In a relegation six-pointer. With an old fox like Pulis on the other bench.
Hardly any difference at all really....
If you're happy with that then crack on. Your naivety is touching. |
In the same way a rookie like Martinez asked jones for advice? Or would it be ok if we called him assistant manager?
As for removal of laudrup no comment | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:22 - Mar 13 with 1055 views | WarwickHunt |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:16 - Mar 13 by Phil_S |
In the same way a rookie like Martinez asked jones for advice? Or would it be ok if we called him assistant manager?
As for removal of laudrup no comment |
We weren't in the PL when Martinez was a rookie.
Duh! | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:29 - Mar 13 with 1048 views | Uxbridge |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:22 - Mar 13 by WarwickHunt |
We weren't in the PL when Martinez was a rookie.
Duh! |
Or in a relegation battle. The situations aren't really that comparable IMO.
It's a massive risk to appoint someone with little coaching experience to that role at this time. Suspect the board know that though. |  |
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| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:34 - Mar 13 with 1045 views | Phil_S |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:22 - Mar 13 by WarwickHunt |
We weren't in the PL when Martinez was a rookie.
Duh! |
So is the point that we don't want monk or we don't want monk without a good number 2? | | | |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:36 - Mar 13 with 1041 views | WarwickHunt |
| reading this forum and silence from official site, on 10:29 - Mar 13 by Uxbridge |
Or in a relegation battle. The situations aren't really that comparable IMO.
It's a massive risk to appoint someone with little coaching experience to that role at this time. Suspect the board know that though. |
Thank you, old chap. I did mention the relegation battle bit above but that was conveniently ignored.
Perhaps PS actually stands for Planet Stepford... | | | |
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