| tomorrow can't come quick enough 14:17 - Oct 16 with 2263578 views | batman |
Not for us, but for Bury.
i was credit checking a potential customer and decided to nosey onto
BFC's file and was (or maybe not) supprised to see a new CCJ for circa £22k lodged
only Wednesday this week.
looks like they are in need of a bumper crowd tomorrow to settle some bills |  | | |  |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 18:32 - Jun 4 with 4721 views | SuddenLad |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 18:10 - Jun 4 by Cleedale |
So, read that Adams is/has left.
Perhaps to conclude, can some who might be able to shed light on the potential outcomes of [ALL] this - (guessing that there's a mighty difference between administration and liquidation) - stick their necks out.
From reading stuff online it'd appears admin. can only be entered into by the major shareholder? Then a buyer can come in - eg FB - and agree under certain stipulations to meet some creditors over a period of time and that efl rulings break these down into % dependent on criteria? Attached or unattached debts?? Obv. points deductions which sound like 12 but possibly staying in L1. Sounds as though another points deduction would be enforced if payments were not kept to date.
On the other hand there's liquidation which sound like the end!
Who decides? Who is allowed to? What powers do the efl actually have?
Obv. not clued up on any of this but guess most of us have been through some sort of redundancy or worked for a firm that's been in trouble and then taken over but guess that for some football clubs...are there grey areas? |
Adams off to Northampton if the rumour mill is to be believed. Re-uniting with Keith Curle, his former manager at Carlisle..... |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 18:39 - Jun 4 with 4666 views | smaclad1 |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 18:10 - Jun 4 by Cleedale |
So, read that Adams is/has left.
Perhaps to conclude, can some who might be able to shed light on the potential outcomes of [ALL] this - (guessing that there's a mighty difference between administration and liquidation) - stick their necks out.
From reading stuff online it'd appears admin. can only be entered into by the major shareholder? Then a buyer can come in - eg FB - and agree under certain stipulations to meet some creditors over a period of time and that efl rulings break these down into % dependent on criteria? Attached or unattached debts?? Obv. points deductions which sound like 12 but possibly staying in L1. Sounds as though another points deduction would be enforced if payments were not kept to date.
On the other hand there's liquidation which sound like the end!
Who decides? Who is allowed to? What powers do the efl actually have?
Obv. not clued up on any of this but guess most of us have been through some sort of redundancy or worked for a firm that's been in trouble and then taken over but guess that for some football clubs...are there grey areas? |
The two links give the basics on administration and liquidation/winding up orders.
https://www.gov.uk/put-your-company-into-administration
https://www.gov.uk/wind-up-a-company-that-owes-you-money
They don't give all the options - for example, Blackpool were put into a court ordered administration as the Oystons had been dragging their feet selling up their assets to pay Belokon the £20m+ they had been ordered to pay him. bury's imminent court appearance is in connection with a winding up petition so liquidation seems the most logical outcome. On the other hand, the judge has been impressed once with the long and proud history of bury fc (obviously overlooking the not so proud financial shenanigans of recent years) so who know what he might come up with this time.
Does it matter either way? Obviously liquidation closes the company which will take the club with it. The ground will have been sold off so unless a potential benefactor has bought it any phoenix club would need to start looking for a ground. On the other hand, under administration the ground will probably have been sold off so unless a potential benefactor has bought it the club would need to start look for a ground.
So, no ground. Also, with no cash and -12 points from administration, they'll be heading for non-league in pretty short order. Which is much the same position as starting up a phoenix club.
All in all, give it 3 years or so and there might not be any difference between going into administration or liquidation over the next few weeks.
Unless, unless...did someone mention a loan? | | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 19:08 - Jun 4 with 4561 views | Cleedale |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 18:39 - Jun 4 by smaclad1 |
The two links give the basics on administration and liquidation/winding up orders.
https://www.gov.uk/put-your-company-into-administration
https://www.gov.uk/wind-up-a-company-that-owes-you-money
They don't give all the options - for example, Blackpool were put into a court ordered administration as the Oystons had been dragging their feet selling up their assets to pay Belokon the £20m+ they had been ordered to pay him. bury's imminent court appearance is in connection with a winding up petition so liquidation seems the most logical outcome. On the other hand, the judge has been impressed once with the long and proud history of bury fc (obviously overlooking the not so proud financial shenanigans of recent years) so who know what he might come up with this time.
Does it matter either way? Obviously liquidation closes the company which will take the club with it. The ground will have been sold off so unless a potential benefactor has bought it any phoenix club would need to start looking for a ground. On the other hand, under administration the ground will probably have been sold off so unless a potential benefactor has bought it the club would need to start look for a ground.
So, no ground. Also, with no cash and -12 points from administration, they'll be heading for non-league in pretty short order. Which is much the same position as starting up a phoenix club.
All in all, give it 3 years or so and there might not be any difference between going into administration or liquidation over the next few weeks.
Unless, unless...did someone mention a loan? |
Thanks for all that smaclad1.
See what you're getting at in there, whereas I'd seen admin. as a type of cop-out but as you rightly say...what's the difference down the line.
From a personal point-of-view bury was always a first fixture to look for. It also meant abt. double the gate and valuable Dale income. On t'other hand it seems that a lot of teams are getting away with '@£$%' which most definitely makes clubs with good book-keeping almost an irrelevance. | | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 19:59 - Jun 4 with 4416 views | aleanddale |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 18:39 - Jun 4 by smaclad1 |
The two links give the basics on administration and liquidation/winding up orders.
https://www.gov.uk/put-your-company-into-administration
https://www.gov.uk/wind-up-a-company-that-owes-you-money
They don't give all the options - for example, Blackpool were put into a court ordered administration as the Oystons had been dragging their feet selling up their assets to pay Belokon the £20m+ they had been ordered to pay him. bury's imminent court appearance is in connection with a winding up petition so liquidation seems the most logical outcome. On the other hand, the judge has been impressed once with the long and proud history of bury fc (obviously overlooking the not so proud financial shenanigans of recent years) so who know what he might come up with this time.
Does it matter either way? Obviously liquidation closes the company which will take the club with it. The ground will have been sold off so unless a potential benefactor has bought it any phoenix club would need to start looking for a ground. On the other hand, under administration the ground will probably have been sold off so unless a potential benefactor has bought it the club would need to start look for a ground.
So, no ground. Also, with no cash and -12 points from administration, they'll be heading for non-league in pretty short order. Which is much the same position as starting up a phoenix club.
All in all, give it 3 years or so and there might not be any difference between going into administration or liquidation over the next few weeks.
Unless, unless...did someone mention a loan? |
Thanks for that.
The only curve ball is administration will mean a thorough audit and IF any of the funding has been "dirty" that's the last type of investigation SD1 and SD2 will want.
That leaves liquidation so they can continue to pick the bones and cash in.
Its a sorry state of affairs that's for sure. | | | |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 20:48 - Jun 4 with 4292 views | judd |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 19:59 - Jun 4 by aleanddale |
Thanks for that.
The only curve ball is administration will mean a thorough audit and IF any of the funding has been "dirty" that's the last type of investigation SD1 and SD2 will want.
That leaves liquidation so they can continue to pick the bones and cash in.
Its a sorry state of affairs that's for sure. |
Why, what's gone on? |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:10 - Jun 4 with 4126 views | RAFCBLUE |
And a second question for this evening:
Do we think Steve Dale will be attending the upcoming two day annual EFL conference in Portugal this week?
A bit of sunshine and good weather might do him the power of good..... |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:14 - Jun 4 with 4101 views | judd |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:10 - Jun 4 by RAFCBLUE |
And a second question for this evening:
Do we think Steve Dale will be attending the upcoming two day annual EFL conference in Portugal this week?
A bit of sunshine and good weather might do him the power of good..... |
Isn't he bedridden, poor lamb, erm, bear? | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:20 - Jun 4 with 4081 views | RAFCBLUE |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:14 - Jun 4 by judd |
Isn't he bedridden, poor lamb, erm, bear? |
His reported health might be a bit grizzly but I am sure the EFL would welcome him, as they do other EFL club owners and make his stay as bearable as possible. | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:32 - Jun 4 with 4029 views | judd |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:20 - Jun 4 by RAFCBLUE |
His reported health might be a bit grizzly but I am sure the EFL would welcome him, as they do other EFL club owners and make his stay as bearable as possible. |
Seems bi-polar. | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:38 - Jun 4 with 4005 views | DaleiLama |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:32 - Jun 4 by judd |
Seems bi-polar. |
No wonder he's got cold feet |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:59 - Jun 4 with 3929 views | D_Alien |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 22:38 - Jun 4 by DaleiLama |
No wonder he's got cold feet |
Not as cold as Grizzly Adams |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:08 - Jun 5 with 3628 views | James1980 |
Are the players classed as assets on the balance sheet?
If the club is found to be in breach of contract re not paying the players. Can they leave for free, thus writing their value off? | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:19 - Jun 5 with 3602 views | aleanddale |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:08 - Jun 5 by James1980 |
Are the players classed as assets on the balance sheet?
If the club is found to be in breach of contract re not paying the players. Can they leave for free, thus writing their value off? |
The players cannot be shown as assets on a balance sheet no.
Only player sales can be added to the incoming column when they happen.
I am not 100% sure but I think contracts are breached after the second month non payment so they can walk away for nowt.
I am amazed Adams is the only one so far to publically say he is off.
Bury just don't play by everybody else's rules we know that.
No released list
2018 Accounts 4 months late
no paying any staff ( No cash )
Circa £10 000 000 in debt in a tangled web of lies and cheap shots. ( 2018 accounts still pending ).
somehow I just think they will continue playing the "famous old club card" and squirm there way out via the second admin in recent times.
Pathetic way to run any football club its a shame they have absolutely no regard for the football league or the rest of its members. [Post edited 5 Jun 2019 9:21]
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:26 - Jun 5 with 3580 views | James1980 |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:19 - Jun 5 by aleanddale |
The players cannot be shown as assets on a balance sheet no.
Only player sales can be added to the incoming column when they happen.
I am not 100% sure but I think contracts are breached after the second month non payment so they can walk away for nowt.
I am amazed Adams is the only one so far to publically say he is off.
Bury just don't play by everybody else's rules we know that.
No released list
2018 Accounts 4 months late
no paying any staff ( No cash )
Circa £10 000 000 in debt in a tangled web of lies and cheap shots. ( 2018 accounts still pending ).
somehow I just think they will continue playing the "famous old club card" and squirm there way out via the second admin in recent times.
Pathetic way to run any football club its a shame they have absolutely no regard for the football league or the rest of its members. [Post edited 5 Jun 2019 9:21]
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If they do go into administration surely a points deduction of more than 12 points is warranted. Otherwise more clubs will carry out the sort of financial finagling Bury have. | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:30 - Jun 5 with 3463 views | SuddenLad |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 09:26 - Jun 5 by James1980 |
If they do go into administration surely a points deduction of more than 12 points is warranted. Otherwise more clubs will carry out the sort of financial finagling Bury have. |
I was of the opinion that any second (or subsequent) term of administration attracted a bigger penalty than the first one. Such as -12 for a first one and -20 for a second and so on.
They must be due a -20 start.
If the SFO get their teeth into things as has been suggested by the Bury MP, then the punishment meted out, may make Luton Towns' punishment look like a slap on the wrist....... | |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:50 - Jun 5 with 3406 views | James1980 |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:30 - Jun 5 by SuddenLad |
I was of the opinion that any second (or subsequent) term of administration attracted a bigger penalty than the first one. Such as -12 for a first one and -20 for a second and so on.
They must be due a -20 start.
If the SFO get their teeth into things as has been suggested by the Bury MP, then the punishment meted out, may make Luton Towns' punishment look like a slap on the wrist....... |
20 points and a transfer embargo, not that they can afford any new players. However will Bury swerve a hefty points deduction due to Dale claiming. The bulk of the current issues were not of his making and the last administration was under previous ownership. [Post edited 5 Jun 2019 10:53]
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:53 - Jun 5 with 3401 views | D_Alien |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:30 - Jun 5 by SuddenLad |
I was of the opinion that any second (or subsequent) term of administration attracted a bigger penalty than the first one. Such as -12 for a first one and -20 for a second and so on.
They must be due a -20 start.
If the SFO get their teeth into things as has been suggested by the Bury MP, then the punishment meted out, may make Luton Towns' punishment look like a slap on the wrist....... |
And not just bury fc
It's unlikely, but it'd be a fitting end to this whole saga if SD1 were to find himself banged up as a result of a SFO investigation
In general, it can't be right that so-called businessmen can operate in the way he does with impunity from the law. If nothing he's done is found to be illegal, that in itself would be a disgrace
[Post edited 5 Jun 2019 10:54]
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:54 - Jun 5 with 3398 views | SuddenLad |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:50 - Jun 5 by James1980 |
20 points and a transfer embargo, not that they can afford any new players. However will Bury swerve a hefty points deduction due to Dale claiming. The bulk of the current issues were not of his making and the last administration was under previous ownership. [Post edited 5 Jun 2019 10:53]
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That won't wash. It's the club that will be punished, regardless of the current regime. It's been going on for years and the EFL know very well what a fiasco it has been. | |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:03 - Jun 5 with 3367 views | James1980 |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:54 - Jun 5 by SuddenLad |
That won't wash. It's the club that will be punished, regardless of the current regime. It's been going on for years and the EFL know very well what a fiasco it has been. |
The question is why have the EFL allowed it to continue for so long though. | |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:08 - Jun 5 with 3351 views | deeplishblue |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 10:30 - Jun 5 by SuddenLad |
I was of the opinion that any second (or subsequent) term of administration attracted a bigger penalty than the first one. Such as -12 for a first one and -20 for a second and so on.
They must be due a -20 start.
If the SFO get their teeth into things as has been suggested by the Bury MP, then the punishment meted out, may make Luton Towns' punishment look like a slap on the wrist....... |
Not sure that our illustrious neighbours have ever been docked points for going into administration. They are not on the list.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Administration_(British_football)
Did they go into admin last time or did they avoid this with the 10p in the £ CVA ? |  |
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:16 - Jun 5 with 3315 views | James1980 |
In a situation of insolvency, the "football creditors rule" means that debts to other clubs or players are prioritised and must be paid in full before the club is eligible to compete again in the league.
We know they owe players money how about other clubs? [Post edited 5 Jun 2019 11:17]
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:17 - Jun 5 with 3306 views | SuddenLad |
Not entirely sure, but reading some threads on their site, they seem to be implying that admin was their previous 'get-out of jail card'. | |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:26 - Jun 5 with 3277 views | SuddenLad |
| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:03 - Jun 5 by James1980 |
The question is why have the EFL allowed it to continue for so long though. |
Because, presumably, if they were still paying wages and outgoings (from whatever source and by whatever means) there wouldn't be a need to get involved. Guilty by neglect when it was obvious to everyone else. | |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| tomorrow can't come quick enough on 11:30 - Jun 5 with 3261 views | EllDale |
Surely there must also be grounds for investigating Bury's auditors?
I know that the latest accounts haven't materialised but they must have signed off the accounts for 2017?
Or did they qualify them? | | | |
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