| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:42 - Sep 1 with 1014 views | Heisenberg |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:20 - Sep 1 by Saintsforeverj |
Social worker visits house of tortured and soon to be murdered child. The money has been provided for that. Parents say child can't be seen as he has covid. Social worker agreed and leaves. Child is later murdered by the parents. Do you blame the government for this?
The government can take their blame for many things, but my point is that schools, social services have been taken over by health and safety, naive, inexperienced nuts, who no matter how.much money you throw at them, they are still getting decisions wrong because they are too soft, too naive brainwashed by the latest restorative meetings nonsense. |
The social worker concerned made mistakes no doubt. You fail to mention the huge cuts to under funded local authorities resulting in a shortage of staff leaving those left with huge caseloads they can no longer safely manage. Experienced social workers have left leaving newly qualified staff covering cases. Tory cuts have directly impacted on all services. Austerity has its price. |  |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:43 - Sep 1 with 1014 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:33 - Sep 1 by dirk_doone |
Social Services, like education, are run by the government. They can appoint whoever they want and implement any policies they like, which is what they've done. One of the main issues is that far too much of the limited budget is spent on government bureaucracy and not enough on frontline staff. Staff have to spend more time filling in reports than they do on face to face contact. We had this discussion about the staffing of the NHS. The overall staff numbers are there but they are mostly government bureaucrats, not doctors, dentists and nurses. |
Too much form filling - I definitely agree with that. My neighbours used to be foster carers. They gave up the job, as they had to fill out a lengthy form every single day about what the child was doing every single hour of the day. This form had to be sent off to social services. Every time a bit of Calpol was given, they had to fill out a lengthy form. They had social workers checking on them every week and would stay in their house for a good few hours. They were good foster carers who got fed up of being checked up on, when the child was clearly doing well as teachers confirmed. Meanwhile, they don't have enough staff to act when is child is being tortured and beaten to death. |  |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:44 - Sep 1 with 1010 views | franniesTache |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:39 - Sep 1 by Saintsforeverj |
Thing is , the family was flagged and checked. There were various social worker visits. They all failed to act. Nothing was done. I would suggest that they are naive people, fresh out of "what a wonderful world we live in" college, thinking that nobody could possible be like that. Meanwhile they have the money to have various costly meetings about 6 year olds changing their gender on the NHS. This wasn't in the government's manifesto and can't imagine it's a conservative thing to do. So why is this money being spent on things nobody voted for? |
the majority of legislation and public policy over the lifecycle of a government won't be in any manifesto, it's also often not as much about politic lean as most think.
A large amount of policy is devised by civil servants on the request of a minister who's either got an interest in, requirement for, or need to implement something.
Outside of the "headline" pieces policy creation is in fact extremely boring, and really more like an operational role in a company than what we're sold politics to be as in the media.
And i'm saying that as someone who worked in the commons doing research and saw how it worked from the inside. |  | | |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:45 - Sep 1 with 1004 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:42 - Sep 1 by Heisenberg |
The social worker concerned made mistakes no doubt. You fail to mention the huge cuts to under funded local authorities resulting in a shortage of staff leaving those left with huge caseloads they can no longer safely manage. Experienced social workers have left leaving newly qualified staff covering cases. Tory cuts have directly impacted on all services. Austerity has its price. |
In terms of experienced staff being replaced by inexperienced staff, perhaps you are right. It's the same in the schools and social services. | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:48 - Sep 1 with 991 views | franniesTache |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:43 - Sep 1 by Saintsforeverj |
Too much form filling - I definitely agree with that. My neighbours used to be foster carers. They gave up the job, as they had to fill out a lengthy form every single day about what the child was doing every single hour of the day. This form had to be sent off to social services. Every time a bit of Calpol was given, they had to fill out a lengthy form. They had social workers checking on them every week and would stay in their house for a good few hours. They were good foster carers who got fed up of being checked up on, when the child was clearly doing well as teachers confirmed. Meanwhile, they don't have enough staff to act when is child is being tortured and beaten to death. |
the form filling and checks you're talking about though would be a direct consequence of failures to catch abusers and safety in the past, in completing the forms and doing routine checks they're providing both accountability and traceability, and in theory better child protection.
If you want to know if they're successful then you'd probably be better off looking at the raw stats for abuse before and after their implementation. | | | |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:49 - Sep 1 with 990 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:44 - Sep 1 by franniesTache |
the majority of legislation and public policy over the lifecycle of a government won't be in any manifesto, it's also often not as much about politic lean as most think.
A large amount of policy is devised by civil servants on the request of a minister who's either got an interest in, requirement for, or need to implement something.
Outside of the "headline" pieces policy creation is in fact extremely boring, and really more like an operational role in a company than what we're sold politics to be as in the media.
And i'm saying that as someone who worked in the commons doing research and saw how it worked from the inside. |
What I'm failing to understand or believe, is which right wing, Conservative minister wanted money spent on 6 year olds changing their gender, whether it was in the manifesto or not? Some of the stuff going on, I can't even see who has enacted it. The faceless person setting rules, bit like the faceless unknown person setting the rules in the Itchen North (health and safety nuts). So who are these people. Nobody voted for them | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:52 - Sep 1 with 985 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:48 - Sep 1 by franniesTache |
the form filling and checks you're talking about though would be a direct consequence of failures to catch abusers and safety in the past, in completing the forms and doing routine checks they're providing both accountability and traceability, and in theory better child protection.
If you want to know if they're successful then you'd probably be better off looking at the raw stats for abuse before and after their implementation. |
The point is, the form filling doesn't tell you anything. Anyone can write anything on a form right? An abuser could pretend and lie on the form couldn't they? Meanwhile whilst social workers are checking in on good foster carers for a few hours and looking at hours of paper work with an obviously happy child, a child is being tortured to death. Sorry I don't get it. Put resources where they are needed. [Post edited 1 Sep 2022 14:52]
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:55 - Sep 1 with 975 views | franniesTache |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:49 - Sep 1 by Saintsforeverj |
What I'm failing to understand or believe, is which right wing, Conservative minister wanted money spent on 6 year olds changing their gender, whether it was in the manifesto or not? Some of the stuff going on, I can't even see who has enacted it. The faceless person setting rules, bit like the faceless unknown person setting the rules in the Itchen North (health and safety nuts). So who are these people. Nobody voted for them |
I think you're probably confusing two things, the costly meetings on gender (have you got a link to that btw as i don't know much about it) would almost certainly come from a different funding pot to the money spent on the day to day running, vetting and checking of the ongoing service.
Also - and again i don't know much about these meetings you mention - i'd be fairly confident that any meetings on gender reassignment would be in the lower 0.* percentage points of cost compared to the running of service, to the extent it would be basically of numerical insignificance in the spending pot. | | | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:59 - Sep 1 with 969 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:55 - Sep 1 by franniesTache |
I think you're probably confusing two things, the costly meetings on gender (have you got a link to that btw as i don't know much about it) would almost certainly come from a different funding pot to the money spent on the day to day running, vetting and checking of the ongoing service.
Also - and again i don't know much about these meetings you mention - i'd be fairly confident that any meetings on gender reassignment would be in the lower 0.* percentage points of cost compared to the running of service, to the extent it would be basically of numerical insignificance in the spending pot. |
But you say the government are in charge. Which government minister has authorised it? That's my point, who are the people bringing in policies that none of.us voted for? I will find a link. | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 15:07 - Sep 1 with 959 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:55 - Sep 1 by franniesTache |
I think you're probably confusing two things, the costly meetings on gender (have you got a link to that btw as i don't know much about it) would almost certainly come from a different funding pot to the money spent on the day to day running, vetting and checking of the ongoing service.
Also - and again i don't know much about these meetings you mention - i'd be fairly confident that any meetings on gender reassignment would be in the lower 0.* percentage points of cost compared to the running of service, to the extent it would be basically of numerical insignificance in the spending pot. |
There is lots on this. This is just one example of courts deciding, not the government. Money or morality, who voted for it? Why are the courts dictating on things like this? I though we were in a democracy. Here is one, there are loads of articles on this. My point is, why is there money for things no ody has ever voted for, but it's not there for children being tortured to death. I would suggest that there are a load do gooder busybodies focussing on the wrong things.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2020/jan/05/high-court- | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 15:07 - Sep 1 with 958 views | Bazza |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 14:49 - Sep 1 by Saintsforeverj |
What I'm failing to understand or believe, is which right wing, Conservative minister wanted money spent on 6 year olds changing their gender, whether it was in the manifesto or not? Some of the stuff going on, I can't even see who has enacted it. The faceless person setting rules, bit like the faceless unknown person setting the rules in the Itchen North (health and safety nuts). So who are these people. Nobody voted for them |
I think a major part of the issue is the woke civil service that is over staffed and underworked ie hugely increased numbers because of covid not yet reduced and still mostly working at home but slow to respond yet threatening strikes. Be the same until some new government takes it to task but normally ministerial jobs change hands too often to restructure meaningfully. | | | |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 15:09 - Sep 1 with 958 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 15:07 - Sep 1 by Bazza |
I think a major part of the issue is the woke civil service that is over staffed and underworked ie hugely increased numbers because of covid not yet reduced and still mostly working at home but slow to respond yet threatening strikes. Be the same until some new government takes it to task but normally ministerial jobs change hands too often to restructure meaningfully. |
Yep
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/thousands-civil-serva
There is lots going on that isn't right. | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 16:27 - Sep 1 with 930 views | franniesTache |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 15:07 - Sep 1 by Saintsforeverj |
There is lots on this. This is just one example of courts deciding, not the government. Money or morality, who voted for it? Why are the courts dictating on things like this? I though we were in a democracy. Here is one, there are loads of articles on this. My point is, why is there money for things no ody has ever voted for, but it's not there for children being tortured to death. I would suggest that there are a load do gooder busybodies focussing on the wrong things.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/society/2020/jan/05/high-court- |
If I understand that right that’s a legal test of the application and “letter of” a law that’s been in place since a precedence was set under case law in the 80s. It would have no governmental involvement as it sits outside the jurisdiction of the government and inside the legal understanding of the courts.
So in that specific case government money isn’t being spent on it directly (though obviously the courts are indirectly funded by the public purse), and could’ve been raised if labour, the tories or even the monster raving looney party were in power.
It might however force the creation of a new law depending on the result which would take up parliamentary and ministerial time. | | | |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 16:56 - Sep 1 with 891 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 16:27 - Sep 1 by franniesTache |
If I understand that right that’s a legal test of the application and “letter of” a law that’s been in place since a precedence was set under case law in the 80s. It would have no governmental involvement as it sits outside the jurisdiction of the government and inside the legal understanding of the courts.
So in that specific case government money isn’t being spent on it directly (though obviously the courts are indirectly funded by the public purse), and could’ve been raised if labour, the tories or even the monster raving looney party were in power.
It might however force the creation of a new law depending on the result which would take up parliamentary and ministerial time. |
There seems to be lots going on and money being spent, that doesn't have public consent. Courts seem to be getting involved in lots of issues, no matter what the voting public think. The Rwanda immigration policy had public consent. The courts stopped it. I have no opinion on whether that was the right or wrong policy, just that the government was unable to do it, when actually it had majority public consent and they were democratically voted in to carry out such a policy. So how much power does the government actually have?
At the end of the day, the problems we are seeing Imo is because of a lack of discipline in schools, a lack of police power and again discipline on the streets, professionals of all sorts tied up with paper work, instead of actually doing the job (which isn't actually preventing the things it is meant to protect anyway as most sensible people know that forms can be forged), and a focus on the wrong things such as whether or not good foster carers are writing an essay on what a child was doing at 9am.on a Tuesday. These things were also happening under the Labour government, in terms of paper work and bureacracy. Again nobody voted for it. There is a lot wrong with lots of things at the present time, for which the government may take some blame but many things going on that the government have no power over, it seems.
The paper work minister, who are they??? [Post edited 1 Sep 2022 17:04]
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 17:06 - Sep 1 with 881 views | franniesTache |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 16:56 - Sep 1 by Saintsforeverj |
There seems to be lots going on and money being spent, that doesn't have public consent. Courts seem to be getting involved in lots of issues, no matter what the voting public think. The Rwanda immigration policy had public consent. The courts stopped it. I have no opinion on whether that was the right or wrong policy, just that the government was unable to do it, when actually it had majority public consent and they were democratically voted in to carry out such a policy. So how much power does the government actually have?
At the end of the day, the problems we are seeing Imo is because of a lack of discipline in schools, a lack of police power and again discipline on the streets, professionals of all sorts tied up with paper work, instead of actually doing the job (which isn't actually preventing the things it is meant to protect anyway as most sensible people know that forms can be forged), and a focus on the wrong things such as whether or not good foster carers are writing an essay on what a child was doing at 9am.on a Tuesday. These things were also happening under the Labour government, in terms of paper work and bureacracy. Again nobody voted for it. There is a lot wrong with lots of things at the present time, for which the government may take some blame but many things going on that the government have no power over, it seems.
The paper work minister, who are they??? [Post edited 1 Sep 2022 17:04]
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The courts cannot stop things unless those things are illegal. The Rwanda experiment was in breach of our own laws - you can blame that on a poorly written rushed piece of legislation by this government - this one was testing a law written in the 1980s about access to abortion medicine for under 16s.
Fundamentally the application of the law will almost always be defined by courts and case history, especially as we have no written constitution. We cannot get angry at judges for doing their jobs, that’s a far more slippery slope than anything else as it ends up with government intervention in the courts and we all know how that ends.
In the long run the output of this will be new laws are made that can be applied to the realities of the modern world, instead of using old case law and applying it to new circumstances. | | | |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 17:14 - Sep 1 with 877 views | DorsetIan |
Cameron gets the first Tory majority in ages and the first thing he does is throw the country into a divisive Brexit diversion.
May take his majority and reduces it down and then spends most of her time trying to deal with Brexit and internal party wrangling.
Johnson with a whopping majority can't conform to even the most basic standards of propriety in public office and appoints a bunch of Brexit supporting, loyal, but inadequate ministers to run the country. (Priti Patel for Home Secretary anyone?)
Is it any wonder that f*ck all has been achieved in all this time and we're in the state we're in?
And immigration is still high, those small boats keep on coming, and when we want to leave the country we're now even more beholden to the EU! | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 17:33 - Sep 1 with 864 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 17:14 - Sep 1 by DorsetIan |
Cameron gets the first Tory majority in ages and the first thing he does is throw the country into a divisive Brexit diversion.
May take his majority and reduces it down and then spends most of her time trying to deal with Brexit and internal party wrangling.
Johnson with a whopping majority can't conform to even the most basic standards of propriety in public office and appoints a bunch of Brexit supporting, loyal, but inadequate ministers to run the country. (Priti Patel for Home Secretary anyone?)
Is it any wonder that f*ck all has been achieved in all this time and we're in the state we're in?
And immigration is still high, those small boats keep on coming, and when we want to leave the country we're now even more beholden to the EU! |
Some true points about what has gone on over the last few years. But schools could still deal with bullies appropriately, more harshly, couldn't they and social workers could visit houses of abused children and maybe not just walk away believing the child has covid because their monster of a parent said so.? I mean we can't blame the government for that. Parents could still discipline their children properly, for beating up other kids and filming it? Perhaps the thousands of civil servants still working form home could get back to work. The Government tried to provide a disincentive for immigrants travelling the Channel, which had majority public approval, but it was blocked by the courts. On the ground, there are things going on that just involves common sense. Not a lot people have that nowadays. Decisions on the ground, don't need some government minister to make the decisions for them surely. [Post edited 1 Sep 2022 17:36]
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 18:22 - Sep 1 with 834 views | DorsetIan |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 17:33 - Sep 1 by Saintsforeverj |
Some true points about what has gone on over the last few years. But schools could still deal with bullies appropriately, more harshly, couldn't they and social workers could visit houses of abused children and maybe not just walk away believing the child has covid because their monster of a parent said so.? I mean we can't blame the government for that. Parents could still discipline their children properly, for beating up other kids and filming it? Perhaps the thousands of civil servants still working form home could get back to work. The Government tried to provide a disincentive for immigrants travelling the Channel, which had majority public approval, but it was blocked by the courts. On the ground, there are things going on that just involves common sense. Not a lot people have that nowadays. Decisions on the ground, don't need some government minister to make the decisions for them surely. [Post edited 1 Sep 2022 17:36]
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So many people are just on their f*cking knees.
We have let the b*stards grind us down.
(And if you think a few flights to Rwanda would have made any difference, you haven’t been looking at the graph of the increasing numbers coming. Priti Patel has failed to stem the flow - well knock me down with a feather!!) | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 18:57 - Sep 1 with 811 views | Bazza |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 18:22 - Sep 1 by DorsetIan |
So many people are just on their f*cking knees.
We have let the b*stards grind us down.
(And if you think a few flights to Rwanda would have made any difference, you haven’t been looking at the graph of the increasing numbers coming. Priti Patel has failed to stem the flow - well knock me down with a feather!!) |
Fair comment the Rwanda issue but do you have a solution? The flood of asylum seekers is costing a fortune and will have a knock effect on the nhs, schools etc | | | |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 23:03 - Sep 1 with 747 views | DorsetIan |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 18:57 - Sep 1 by Bazza |
Fair comment the Rwanda issue but do you have a solution? The flood of asylum seekers is costing a fortune and will have a knock effect on the nhs, schools etc |
No, but to be fair it’s not my job to find a solution.
Setting yourself at odds with the French didn’t strike me as a helpful approach.
Neither was shutting down pretty much all legal routes to the UK for asylum seekers.
For me, this govt has only ever been about posturing. Have they found an actual workable solution to anything? | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 00:08 - Sep 2 with 734 views | Bazza |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 23:03 - Sep 1 by DorsetIan |
No, but to be fair it’s not my job to find a solution.
Setting yourself at odds with the French didn’t strike me as a helpful approach.
Neither was shutting down pretty much all legal routes to the UK for asylum seekers.
For me, this govt has only ever been about posturing. Have they found an actual workable solution to anything? |
Just like my wife you answer a question with another question! So I can conclude the immigration question is too tricky for you too. | | | |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 11:42 - Sep 2 with 685 views | dwayne_dibley |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 09:18 - Sep 1 by SonicBoom |
Seriously what the hell is wrong with this generation? Filming themselves beating other kids and sharing it online?
And there are plenty of parents that don't care what their kids are doing. To drive a car you have to at least take a test. Any low life retard can have kids. |
so allow kids to carry mace and pepper spray, even better laser pens.
Blind thugs are easier to stomp on |  |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 11:51 - Sep 2 with 682 views | DorsetIan |
| Time to take the law into our own hands on 00:08 - Sep 2 by Bazza |
Just like my wife you answer a question with another question! So I can conclude the immigration question is too tricky for you too. |
To be honest, I'm focusing on solving the cost of living crisis at the moment. I've then got inflation, a collapsing NHS, policing, and energy independence to look at.
I reckon I'll have time to look at the small boats issue by the middle of October.
I've got some ideas and I'll let you know when I've properly worked out the plan. | |
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| Time to take the law into our own hands on 12:06 - Sep 2 with 676 views | geezershoong1 |
There's a vacuum left behind from retreat of religion.
Also, lack of decent father figures to guide young men. Feel greatly for single Mothers now, competing with the Internet to raise their kids! |  |
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