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Come on it’s Christmas … 1. Louis 2.Ali 3.Marciano 4.Lennox Lewis 5.Jack Johnson 6 Dempsey 7.Larry Holmes 8.Mike Tyson 9.Joe Frazier 10. Evander Holyfield
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 19:50 - Dec 20 by howenjack
Here's another badass unheralded smallish heavyweight who would school the likes of Joshua , Chisora or White.
His brother Buddy Baer, who twice challenged Joe Louis for the heavyweight title, fought at the Vetch against Jack London, father of Brian London, and spoke fondly of his time in Swansea in his autobiography. He also beat Swansea's Jim Wilde in his previous fight at Harringay in London.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 21:10 - Dec 20 with 1225 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 20:25 - Dec 20 by Cleddau
His brother Buddy Baer, who twice challenged Joe Louis for the heavyweight title, fought at the Vetch against Jack London, father of Brian London, and spoke fondly of his time in Swansea in his autobiography. He also beat Swansea's Jim Wilde in his previous fight at Harringay in London.
Yes from a boxing family , half Jewish . He fought and beat Max Schmeling Hitler was not amused lol. Max died young of a heart attack . He was a joker who could have achieved more in the ring if he had trained a bit more seriously but he still had fearsome punch power and a killer instinct. He was in a a hotel in California when he had a heart attack I think he was only 50 odd at the time. He rang the front desk and was told they would send a house doctor up to his room. He replied " I need a people doctor not a house doctor !" Joking till the end .
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 22:02 - Dec 20 with 1214 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 21:10 - Dec 20 by howenjack
Yes from a boxing family , half Jewish . He fought and beat Max Schmeling Hitler was not amused lol. Max died young of a heart attack . He was a joker who could have achieved more in the ring if he had trained a bit more seriously but he still had fearsome punch power and a killer instinct. He was in a a hotel in California when he had a heart attack I think he was only 50 odd at the time. He rang the front desk and was told they would send a house doctor up to his room. He replied " I need a people doctor not a house doctor !" Joking till the end .
Great read He liked the ladies too He clowned around too much which wasted his tslent
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:44 - Dec 20 by SullutaCreturned
Again, if Marciano was around to fight these guys he may be mre than 13 stones, better training, better diet, better coaching too.
You cannot alter history then presume to know exactly what would happen.
But you are now producing what ifs we can only discuss how the guy fought and at what weight he was you saying a could have been heavier with a better diet etc but that could go either way maybe it could have slowed him down and made him cumbersome seeing as he did not have the biggest frame, so it is best to stick to facts and you guys believe a 13 st guy could beat an 18st guy with a better skill set which is simply ridiculous.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 20:49 - Dec 22 with 1127 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:09 - Dec 22 by shingle
But you are now producing what ifs we can only discuss how the guy fought and at what weight he was you saying a could have been heavier with a better diet etc but that could go either way maybe it could have slowed him down and made him cumbersome seeing as he did not have the biggest frame, so it is best to stick to facts and you guys believe a 13 st guy could beat an 18st guy with a better skill set which is simply ridiculous.
It’s a bit if fun. The rules under which Dempsey fought would see him destroy Tyson Fury,all 18 stone of him. Why.Because Dempsey was hungry,angry,remoreiess ,vicious and unrelenting . In today’s rules ,he would not have been able to fight him as he’d be a cruiserseight. Sheesh
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 20:49 - Dec 22 by onehunglow
It’s a bit if fun. The rules under which Dempsey fought would see him destroy Tyson Fury,all 18 stone of him. Why.Because Dempsey was hungry,angry,remoreiess ,vicious and unrelenting . In today’s rules ,he would not have been able to fight him as he’d be a cruiserseight. Sheesh
Fury is another who is vastly overrated but he would play with Dempsey simply way to big for him. there is a big difference between being relentless against small guys his own size or a little bigger than against 18st guys who are extremely good at what they do, again its logic and common sense you are just being very silly.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:39 - Dec 23 with 1059 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:18 - Dec 23 by shingle
Fury is another who is vastly overrated but he would play with Dempsey simply way to big for him. there is a big difference between being relentless against small guys his own size or a little bigger than against 18st guys who are extremely good at what they do, again its logic and common sense you are just being very silly.
Silly. Well,do me a favour and repost only this time using basic English grammar and syntax. I’ve already explained that ,if fighting today, Dempsey would be too light for a heavyweight. If the cretinous gypsy faced Dempsey ,as the 18 stone Willard did,in the blistering heat of Ohio,watched by 97000 ,outdoor, under the rules of the time,JD would have seen him off just as quick. It is indeed silly to equate class with Dempsey vis a vis Fury .
Dempsey name is still preceminent over a century after his fights. Are you telling me people will nudge Fury in this light.
Dempsey was iconic and the first boxer to transcend sport . The first superstar ..
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:18 - Dec 23 by shingle
Fury is another who is vastly overrated but he would play with Dempsey simply way to big for him. there is a big difference between being relentless against small guys his own size or a little bigger than against 18st guys who are extremely good at what they do, again its logic and common sense you are just being very silly.
Logic and common sense unfortunately never won boxing matches . There is an old saying " It's not the size of the dog in the fight it's the size of the fight in the dog" . No one ever played with Dempsey either . he wasn't a man you could take liberties with . They even named a tropical fish after him on account of its aggressive nature and it attacking other fish in the topical tank . Dempsey was hewn from an age where you had to fight for survival literally in his case - just before the great depression era . To understand what made him tick you have to study the times the culture what he went through . He travelled from town to town doing manual work and making extra money from visiting the local saloon and challenging the local bully . Money in the hat winner takes all. He was doing this from the age of 16 + and fighting grown men . Sometimes he came unstuck as he says in his autobiography but it was all part of the learning curve. This was his apprenticeship - bareknuckle duels earning enough so he could eat that night and have a bed to sleep on . As he said in his book " If you haven't eaten for 2 days you will understand". He would ride the rods to a different town rinse and repeat. He would cut down trees with an axe and wash his face in brine to toughen the skin so it wouldn't cut so easily and punch bare knuckled downwards into a bucket of warm asphalt to toughen his hands . He would chew pine resin to strengthen his jaw muscles and perform neck rolls ( copied by Tyson ) to better absorb head punches and punch flour sacks till they burst. Technically he became very good using techniques like the 3 knuckle landing the powerline , the drop step and the famous Dempsey roll to close the range and set up the ko punch. Early in his career he was mean and hungry but the millions earned softened him - court cases involving women and bitter ex managers didn't help.along with long periods of inactivity out of the ring. To have any chance of beating Fury it would have to be the early version of Dempsey the one that fought Tunney was past his best . Dempsey would have to close the range to have any chance and Fury would have to keep him at range and hold and smother close in . A young Dempsey in his prime would be super fit not an ounce of fat just solid muscle lean and built for speed . Fury would not need to go forward as Dempsey would immediately go on the attack probing , feinting , rolling , looking for the opening to unload. If he got the opportunity it would be taken in an instant and Fury would certainly know about it. Fury would have the advantage close in but Dempsey was also a master of infighting and could throw an uppercut even in a very restricted space because of his explosive strength . Dempsey funnily enough had more success fighting large men than the smaller ones . Simply because of the size differential I would say it's improbable Dempsey would win but not impossible . He has the puncher's chance. I would say he would hit as hard as Wilder so if he caught Fury and he wobbled then Dempsey would swarm all over him and you would have to fear for Fury then . Fury would win by keeping Dempsey at range but that's what Willard tried to do . Opinions eh ? Who would have them ?
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 21:28 - Dec 23 with 1032 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 21:00 - Dec 23 by howenjack
Logic and common sense unfortunately never won boxing matches . There is an old saying " It's not the size of the dog in the fight it's the size of the fight in the dog" . No one ever played with Dempsey either . he wasn't a man you could take liberties with . They even named a tropical fish after him on account of its aggressive nature and it attacking other fish in the topical tank . Dempsey was hewn from an age where you had to fight for survival literally in his case - just before the great depression era . To understand what made him tick you have to study the times the culture what he went through . He travelled from town to town doing manual work and making extra money from visiting the local saloon and challenging the local bully . Money in the hat winner takes all. He was doing this from the age of 16 + and fighting grown men . Sometimes he came unstuck as he says in his autobiography but it was all part of the learning curve. This was his apprenticeship - bareknuckle duels earning enough so he could eat that night and have a bed to sleep on . As he said in his book " If you haven't eaten for 2 days you will understand". He would ride the rods to a different town rinse and repeat. He would cut down trees with an axe and wash his face in brine to toughen the skin so it wouldn't cut so easily and punch bare knuckled downwards into a bucket of warm asphalt to toughen his hands . He would chew pine resin to strengthen his jaw muscles and perform neck rolls ( copied by Tyson ) to better absorb head punches and punch flour sacks till they burst. Technically he became very good using techniques like the 3 knuckle landing the powerline , the drop step and the famous Dempsey roll to close the range and set up the ko punch. Early in his career he was mean and hungry but the millions earned softened him - court cases involving women and bitter ex managers didn't help.along with long periods of inactivity out of the ring. To have any chance of beating Fury it would have to be the early version of Dempsey the one that fought Tunney was past his best . Dempsey would have to close the range to have any chance and Fury would have to keep him at range and hold and smother close in . A young Dempsey in his prime would be super fit not an ounce of fat just solid muscle lean and built for speed . Fury would not need to go forward as Dempsey would immediately go on the attack probing , feinting , rolling , looking for the opening to unload. If he got the opportunity it would be taken in an instant and Fury would certainly know about it. Fury would have the advantage close in but Dempsey was also a master of infighting and could throw an uppercut even in a very restricted space because of his explosive strength . Dempsey funnily enough had more success fighting large men than the smaller ones . Simply because of the size differential I would say it's improbable Dempsey would win but not impossible . He has the puncher's chance. I would say he would hit as hard as Wilder so if he caught Fury and he wobbled then Dempsey would swarm all over him and you would have to fear for Fury then . Fury would win by keeping Dempsey at range but that's what Willard tried to do . Opinions eh ? Who would have them ?
Wonderful posting As I say,it would have been all about rules at the time. Given the leeway in those days gone by ,I would maintain ,JD would simply crawl all over Fury and cut him down . Imagine Fury in 100 degree sun outside with a crowd of almost 100,000 around. Dempsey was and does still stand out
I’ve mentioned before a good chum of mine s tale of his chum meeting JD at his restaurant in NYC. Even in late middle age ,he said Dempsey looked really intimidating l Funnily enough, two tried to mug him when he wa in his 70s and both were knocked out . What a target to choose.
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 21:28 - Dec 23 by onehunglow
Wonderful posting As I say,it would have been all about rules at the time. Given the leeway in those days gone by ,I would maintain ,JD would simply crawl all over Fury and cut him down . Imagine Fury in 100 degree sun outside with a crowd of almost 100,000 around. Dempsey was and does still stand out
I’ve mentioned before a good chum of mine s tale of his chum meeting JD at his restaurant in NYC. Even in late middle age ,he said Dempsey looked really intimidating l Funnily enough, two tried to mug him when he wa in his 70s and both were knocked out . What a target to choose.
Yes I read about the mugging incident . Dempsey was on his way to the first Ali Frazier fight in 1971. Two guys came out of nowhere and as you say he flattened them both . He was 76 at the time. Another ex pro was Billy Conn he flattened a store robber in his home city of Pittsburgh.
Here he is in an epic vs. Joe Louis 13th round k.o
There was a brilliant quote by Louis - Conn asked him jokingly - "Joe why don't you let me win next time then I could be heavyweight champion until you win it back again from me . Louis replied - " Billy you already held it for 12 rounds and you didn't know what to do with it" .... Brilliant.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 08:25 - Dec 24 with 993 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:09 - Dec 22 by shingle
But you are now producing what ifs we can only discuss how the guy fought and at what weight he was you saying a could have been heavier with a better diet etc but that could go either way maybe it could have slowed him down and made him cumbersome seeing as he did not have the biggest frame, so it is best to stick to facts and you guys believe a 13 st guy could beat an 18st guy with a better skill set which is simply ridiculous.
No, what we are saying is that at the time he was fighting he was the best and his record makes him worthy of a high ranking.
You can only fight thse people who are in your timeline and you can only be judged on that.
For example, pick an all time Swansea football team and there will be disagreements about who gets in because people will say a player from the 50's would never live with modern fitness levels but would a modern player live with the ball used back then, or the boots, the kit...would ivor Allchurch be able to skip past Alexander-Arnold?
Marciano's record makes him one of the GOAT's.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 12:40 - Dec 24 with 949 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 08:25 - Dec 24 by SullutaCreturned
No, what we are saying is that at the time he was fighting he was the best and his record makes him worthy of a high ranking.
You can only fight thse people who are in your timeline and you can only be judged on that.
For example, pick an all time Swansea football team and there will be disagreements about who gets in because people will say a player from the 50's would never live with modern fitness levels but would a modern player live with the ball used back then, or the boots, the kit...would ivor Allchurch be able to skip past Alexander-Arnold?
Marciano's record makes him one of the GOAT's.
Ivor wins on his wonderful ‘Golden Boy of Welsh Football’ nickname alone.
Trent who ? 🤷♂️
Beware of the Risen People
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:15 - Dec 24 with 914 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 21:00 - Dec 23 by howenjack
Logic and common sense unfortunately never won boxing matches . There is an old saying " It's not the size of the dog in the fight it's the size of the fight in the dog" . No one ever played with Dempsey either . he wasn't a man you could take liberties with . They even named a tropical fish after him on account of its aggressive nature and it attacking other fish in the topical tank . Dempsey was hewn from an age where you had to fight for survival literally in his case - just before the great depression era . To understand what made him tick you have to study the times the culture what he went through . He travelled from town to town doing manual work and making extra money from visiting the local saloon and challenging the local bully . Money in the hat winner takes all. He was doing this from the age of 16 + and fighting grown men . Sometimes he came unstuck as he says in his autobiography but it was all part of the learning curve. This was his apprenticeship - bareknuckle duels earning enough so he could eat that night and have a bed to sleep on . As he said in his book " If you haven't eaten for 2 days you will understand". He would ride the rods to a different town rinse and repeat. He would cut down trees with an axe and wash his face in brine to toughen the skin so it wouldn't cut so easily and punch bare knuckled downwards into a bucket of warm asphalt to toughen his hands . He would chew pine resin to strengthen his jaw muscles and perform neck rolls ( copied by Tyson ) to better absorb head punches and punch flour sacks till they burst. Technically he became very good using techniques like the 3 knuckle landing the powerline , the drop step and the famous Dempsey roll to close the range and set up the ko punch. Early in his career he was mean and hungry but the millions earned softened him - court cases involving women and bitter ex managers didn't help.along with long periods of inactivity out of the ring. To have any chance of beating Fury it would have to be the early version of Dempsey the one that fought Tunney was past his best . Dempsey would have to close the range to have any chance and Fury would have to keep him at range and hold and smother close in . A young Dempsey in his prime would be super fit not an ounce of fat just solid muscle lean and built for speed . Fury would not need to go forward as Dempsey would immediately go on the attack probing , feinting , rolling , looking for the opening to unload. If he got the opportunity it would be taken in an instant and Fury would certainly know about it. Fury would have the advantage close in but Dempsey was also a master of infighting and could throw an uppercut even in a very restricted space because of his explosive strength . Dempsey funnily enough had more success fighting large men than the smaller ones . Simply because of the size differential I would say it's improbable Dempsey would win but not impossible . He has the puncher's chance. I would say he would hit as hard as Wilder so if he caught Fury and he wobbled then Dempsey would swarm all over him and you would have to fear for Fury then . Fury would win by keeping Dempsey at range but that's what Willard tried to do . Opinions eh ? Who would have them ?
When you say no one played with Dempsey well does it really go over your head they were of similar weight no matter how tough he was he does not get anywhere against a man 5 stone heavier with a better skill set, he gets obliterated within a few rounds are you guys taking the piddle here, if this debate was on a Boxing forum clued up boxing guys would think you are all bonkers lol
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:55 - Dec 24 with 906 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:39 - Dec 23 by onehunglow
Silly. Well,do me a favour and repost only this time using basic English grammar and syntax. I’ve already explained that ,if fighting today, Dempsey would be too light for a heavyweight. If the cretinous gypsy faced Dempsey ,as the 18 stone Willard did,in the blistering heat of Ohio,watched by 97000 ,outdoor, under the rules of the time,JD would have seen him off just as quick. It is indeed silly to equate class with Dempsey vis a vis Fury .
Dempsey name is still preceminent over a century after his fights. Are you telling me people will nudge Fury in this light.
Dempsey was iconic and the first boxer to transcend sport . The first superstar ..
Just fxxxxxng daft ,not silly
Are so you are starting to see a little sense admitting Dempsey would have been to light to compete with 18 st heavyweights if you said that earlier as you say then i missed it, an 18 st Fury dismantles a 13 st Dempsey within 5 rds someone like Foreman who hits a lot harder than Fury knocks a 5 or six stone lighter Dempsey or Marciano for that matter into the twilight zone within a couple of rounds and that is simply common sense, however if they were fighting light heavyweights then i would certainly rate them near the top as Ezzard Charles is a top all time great light heavyweight and a couple of Marciano's best wins were against him, Dempsey fighting someone like Bob Foster would have been a great match up as well and a tough one to pick a winner from.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 20:45 - Dec 24 with 890 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:55 - Dec 24 by shingle
Are so you are starting to see a little sense admitting Dempsey would have been to light to compete with 18 st heavyweights if you said that earlier as you say then i missed it, an 18 st Fury dismantles a 13 st Dempsey within 5 rds someone like Foreman who hits a lot harder than Fury knocks a 5 or six stone lighter Dempsey or Marciano for that matter into the twilight zone within a couple of rounds and that is simply common sense, however if they were fighting light heavyweights then i would certainly rate them near the top as Ezzard Charles is a top all time great light heavyweight and a couple of Marciano's best wins were against him, Dempsey fighting someone like Bob Foster would have been a great match up as well and a tough one to pick a winner from.
Hey Shings. Decent riposte1. Bob Foster being 6-3 would have found JD burrowing in and snapping him with body punches. Jack did demolish much bigger men as others have pointed out . Forget weights. Imagine,as a say, an overweight lump like Fury in 100 degree heat in blazing sun up against a super fit alb3it smaller man whose upbringing dwarfed the “ tough” one gypsy boy had.
Anyway,best wishes from west Wirral for festive time
Keep it up in the New Year.
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Bob Foster possessed a great left-hook and was one of the most murderous punching light-heavyweights in history. His KOs of Tiger, Rondon and Quarry in world title fights are some of the most brutal one-punch knock-outs you will ever see. Yet, whenever he was matched with a ranked heavyweight, he couldn't put a dent in them, nearly always being knocked out himself. Personally, I think Dempsey would be a terrible match-up for Foster.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 07:01 - Dec 25 with 851 views
Great period piece! The penalty for London was a 3 months ban and a fine of £1000 (around £28K in today's money). I can't imagine that a boxer would get off that lightly now!
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:15 - Dec 24 by shingle
When you say no one played with Dempsey well does it really go over your head they were of similar weight no matter how tough he was he does not get anywhere against a man 5 stone heavier with a better skill set, he gets obliterated within a few rounds are you guys taking the piddle here, if this debate was on a Boxing forum clued up boxing guys would think you are all bonkers lol
I thought you didn't like "what ifs" but then you produce a what if he fought a man 5 stone heavier with a better skill set, if you're doing what if then they can all apply. So what if he had better training, better diet and better coaching?
We are judging them on their record in their time and it's purely our own opinions, it's not us taking the piddle.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 11:05 - Dec 25 with 820 views
That's London's older brother, jack Jr, trying to deck everyone in the ring, himself a good domestic level light-heavyweight. The rotund balding chap is London's father, former British heavyweight champion, Jack London. London's son-in-law, Stewart Lithgo, was Commonwealth Cruiserweight champion.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:13 - Dec 25 with 796 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 11:05 - Dec 25 by SullutaCreturned
I thought you didn't like "what ifs" but then you produce a what if he fought a man 5 stone heavier with a better skill set, if you're doing what if then they can all apply. So what if he had better training, better diet and better coaching?
We are judging them on their record in their time and it's purely our own opinions, it's not us taking the piddle.
There is no what if when it comes to a 13st guy fighting a 18st with a better skill set the 13 st guy gets obliterated no what if about it, now as far your better diet and better coaching remarks may make 13 st guy may be better at his fighting weight but a total what if when adding 5 st to a small frame, you really have no idea in what you are saying and are a Boxing casual of epic proportions.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 19:22 - Dec 25 with 779 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 18:13 - Dec 25 by shingle
There is no what if when it comes to a 13st guy fighting a 18st with a better skill set the 13 st guy gets obliterated no what if about it, now as far your better diet and better coaching remarks may make 13 st guy may be better at his fighting weight but a total what if when adding 5 st to a small frame, you really have no idea in what you are saying and are a Boxing casual of epic proportions.
I am a boxing casual but in sport there is always a what if.
What if Hereford beat Arsenal or even in boxing, what if leonard beat hagler, what if Foreman beat Moorer, what if Braddock beat Baer, what if Douglas beat Tyson.
Sport, all sports carry a what if and even the biggest underdog can win. What if the Swans beat Chelsea and go n to win the Carabao.
History is filled with great underdog wins so saying something coud never happen is a bit, well no doubt you'll disagree so I won't say it but others can decide and I'll eave you with Andy Ruiz v joshua.
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Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 19:39 - Dec 25 with 778 views
Boxing GOATs (Heavyweights ) on 11:05 - Dec 25 by Cleddau
That's London's older brother, jack Jr, trying to deck everyone in the ring, himself a good domestic level light-heavyweight. The rotund balding chap is London's father, former British heavyweight champion, Jack London. London's son-in-law, Stewart Lithgo, was Commonwealth Cruiserweight champion.
I remember Brian London being interviewed after his defeat against Ali, he was asked what his advice would be to anyone wishing to fight Ali, he replied, “ Don’t bother.” 😄
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