| What is the objective? 19:41 - Jan 3 with 4657 views | Welsh_Ranger |
Just a thought to hopefully spark debate.
My understanding is that the board would like QPR to be pushing for promotion whilst developing and selling talent as has been the desire to replicate other models like Brentford et al.
Now, i'm not stupid and read this board and contribute when i feel its worth it and love the discussions! We as Clive said are standing on the precipice with FFP so can't really afford to spend money on quick fixes and loans....
I guess what i'm trying to say is at this point of the season is it worth sending our loans back and actually playing our players and our youth team players and accepting that their might be some bumps in the road but that they'll either be good enough or not?
Give the likes of Armstrong, SDM, Kelman, Lloyd and start blooding the youth players some with cameos off the bench and see where we go?
We had two encouraging youth games of which posters on here were praising those youngsters. Derby did it last season when they had their financial problems and my lovely national side did it back in the day with Toshack. |  | | |  |
| What is the objective? on 19:59 - Jan 3 with 4582 views | PunteR |
The problem I have with us atm is we're not really seeing much progress to reach our objective. Every season for the past 6-7 years seem exactly the same. When we sort one issue out another pops up in a different area of the pitch or dug out. We seem to just run on 50% of our full potential.
Would I send loans back? I don't think we could even chance that until we know we can't mathematically go down. |  |
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| What is the objective? on 20:25 - Jan 3 with 4514 views | Welsh_Ranger |
I don't necessarily disagree, maybe not send them back but give more opportunities to our players, Os over Laird, Amos over Tim and anyone over Roberts. I've said on another thread how demoralizing it must be for those who are ours to be behind loans. | | | |
| What is the objective? on 20:57 - Jan 3 with 4420 views | Toast_R |
Out of 21 seasons in the Championship since 1996 we've only made the play offs once and that was because we cheated. Shocking really.
Teams with lesser or similar budgets to our have done it regular, why can't this club? |  | | |
| What is the objective? on 21:05 - Jan 3 with 4408 views | baz_qpr |
| What is the objective? on 20:57 - Jan 3 by Toast_R |
Out of 21 seasons in the Championship since 1996 we've only made the play offs once and that was because we cheated. Shocking really.
Teams with lesser or similar budgets to our have done it regular, why can't this club? |
To be fair for about 15 of those we've been in the financial shite one way or another and the ones where we have had success either in promotion, top 6 or close we've thrown money at it. |  | | |
| What is the objective? on 21:20 - Jan 3 with 4390 views | Toast_R |
| What is the objective? on 21:05 - Jan 3 by baz_qpr |
To be fair for about 15 of those we've been in the financial shite one way or another and the ones where we have had success either in promotion, top 6 or close we've thrown money at it. |
You know, when we won the Championship and were preparing for life in the Premier League again, Luton had just lost the play-off final to get back in the football league. The money that's come through the respective clubs since then is staggeringly in our favour, yet there we were, getting our tummies tickled. Unforgivable really. [Post edited 3 Jan 2023 21:26]
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| What is the objective? on 21:31 - Jan 3 with 4348 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
Priority has to be getting into the Premier League, trying to consolidate and using the money to grow the club. If you're relegated, rinse and repeat.
By all means develop and sell players, but that will occur automatically when you have a successful team.
In theory they could still get into the play-offs this season but they'll have to play like they did last night, rather than the Luton game.
But you can't look at what the likes of Brentford, Brighton and Fulham are achieving this season and not aim to replicate that. | | | |
| What is the objective? on 21:59 - Jan 3 with 4289 views | davman |
| What is the objective? on 21:31 - Jan 3 by Wegerles_Stairs |
Priority has to be getting into the Premier League, trying to consolidate and using the money to grow the club. If you're relegated, rinse and repeat.
By all means develop and sell players, but that will occur automatically when you have a successful team.
In theory they could still get into the play-offs this season but they'll have to play like they did last night, rather than the Luton game.
But you can't look at what the likes of Brentford, Brighton and Fulham are achieving this season and not aim to replicate that. |
Pretty obvious really especially now that the bottom has fallen out of the buy > develop > sell > buy > develop > sell > repeat market. The only the way this is going to work is to fluke a promotion then stay there somehow.
As a fan base, we'll only be happy when they gamble and will go apoplectic when that fails and we tumble back down the leagues.
Luton are in a great place right now, but the next season or two will be the real test for them. Preston, Derby, Sheff W - examples of teams that poked around the playoffs for a few seasons and then fell away when they couldn't quite get over the line... |  |
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| What is the objective? on 22:04 - Jan 3 with 4261 views | stevec |
Do the owners of the club actually have a directive, something specific, it doesn’t feel like it.
What do they demand from the youth set up, what puts those jobs on the line, again it seems far too cosy. When you can say ‘results are not important’ and walk away from that comment with your job intact, what message does that send to the entire organisation?
We put the onus on one man, the incumbent manager, to somehow right all these wrongs, only he gets to pay for failure.
Critchley has got an almighty and in all likelihood, thankless task much like his predecessors. Somehow he has to galvanise his first team squad and shut them off from the overall club culture, not an ideal situation. |  | | |
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| What is the objective? on 22:12 - Jan 3 with 4241 views | Dorse |
If we can avoid gob-bummings more often, I think we have got a better than average chance of the play-offs. I don't think that would be unreasonable or unrealistic with the players / squad we've got.
I know I (correctly) bang on about the great Dom Ball but this year's side is better than the 2022 vintage. For me, it looks like the leadership are betting we'll have a shot at the top 6. It'd be great to see more of our young lads come through but I just don't see it. |  |
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| What is the objective? on 22:24 - Jan 3 with 4207 views | NorthantsHoop |
After supporting QPR for nearly 50 years I have never really seen us as anything more than a 2nd tier club, other than under Jago, Sexton, Venables and Smith when we started to punch above our weight and competed in the old first division. Once we really lost our Premier status in the mid 90s, we have again become a 2nd tier club, flirting with League 1 for a couple of season and a brief return to the Premier League but failing to gain a foothold and wasting the opportunity due to poor ownership decisions, wasteful journeymen managers and overpaid players.
I sort of feel now we are actually forging a decent future as a competitive Championship side, but we are still hampered by the Premiership failures and the ffp legacy. We should take heart from the new training facility and infrastructure spend on this as it will help attract new younger players. Just need to keep faith with the project and hope the club can maintain competitiveness in the Championship and at some time in the future the stars will align and we can progress to properly challenge for a place in the premiership and then maintain a decent few seasons there. |  | | |
| What is the objective? on 23:30 - Jan 3 with 4069 views | PunteR |
| What is the objective? on 22:24 - Jan 3 by NorthantsHoop |
After supporting QPR for nearly 50 years I have never really seen us as anything more than a 2nd tier club, other than under Jago, Sexton, Venables and Smith when we started to punch above our weight and competed in the old first division. Once we really lost our Premier status in the mid 90s, we have again become a 2nd tier club, flirting with League 1 for a couple of season and a brief return to the Premier League but failing to gain a foothold and wasting the opportunity due to poor ownership decisions, wasteful journeymen managers and overpaid players.
I sort of feel now we are actually forging a decent future as a competitive Championship side, but we are still hampered by the Premiership failures and the ffp legacy. We should take heart from the new training facility and infrastructure spend on this as it will help attract new younger players. Just need to keep faith with the project and hope the club can maintain competitiveness in the Championship and at some time in the future the stars will align and we can progress to properly challenge for a place in the premiership and then maintain a decent few seasons there. |
Owning a training ground is surely a minimum requirement for a football club like QPR. I know it's great that we've finally got one but with the millions if not billions of pounds that goes through the bank accounts of people who own our football club ,some changing rooms and pitches shouldn't be too much of a stretch.
It's an improvement on what we currently have and a step in the right direction.,of course.
Just on your point regarding following QPR since the 70s. When I started supporting QPR In about 82 we were a top London club, always in Division 1 so maybe I have a slightly warped sense of entitlement and where I feel we should be as a club, I dunno? Looking back in the cold light of day we probably over achieved during those times but I can't help feeling we're not doing things to the best of our resources and capabilities atm. [Post edited 3 Jan 2023 23:49]
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| What is the objective? on 01:28 - Jan 4 with 3967 views | VancouverHoop |
Arguably we didn't win yesterday because our bench strength wasn't close to matching Utd's.
We have players who are as good as any in the division, but not enough of them. Injuries, international call ups etc., hurt us more than most clubs who have ambitions beyond this division.
For the past few seasons we've had an upper echelon team, for about half of it, the other half we're struggling to be competitive.
We need depth. How and where we get that from is above my pay grade, but until we do 'rinse and repeat' is where we're at. | | | |
| What is the objective? on 05:35 - Jan 4 with 3904 views | Match82 |
| What is the objective? on 20:25 - Jan 3 by Welsh_Ranger |
I don't necessarily disagree, maybe not send them back but give more opportunities to our players, Os over Laird, Amos over Tim and anyone over Roberts. I've said on another thread how demoralizing it must be for those who are ours to be behind loans. |
Might have dreamt this, but is there a clause in any of these contracts which means we pay more if they DON'T play when fit? |  | | |
| What is the objective? on 06:20 - Jan 4 with 3872 views | SirNose |
| What is the objective? on 22:24 - Jan 3 by NorthantsHoop |
After supporting QPR for nearly 50 years I have never really seen us as anything more than a 2nd tier club, other than under Jago, Sexton, Venables and Smith when we started to punch above our weight and competed in the old first division. Once we really lost our Premier status in the mid 90s, we have again become a 2nd tier club, flirting with League 1 for a couple of season and a brief return to the Premier League but failing to gain a foothold and wasting the opportunity due to poor ownership decisions, wasteful journeymen managers and overpaid players.
I sort of feel now we are actually forging a decent future as a competitive Championship side, but we are still hampered by the Premiership failures and the ffp legacy. We should take heart from the new training facility and infrastructure spend on this as it will help attract new younger players. Just need to keep faith with the project and hope the club can maintain competitiveness in the Championship and at some time in the future the stars will align and we can progress to properly challenge for a place in the premiership and then maintain a decent few seasons there. |
So QPR should know their place which is the level of Millwall, Luton, Blackpool, Reading or Preston and except the fact Norwich, Burnley, West Brom, Blades, Stoke, and Watford etc etc are way bigger than QPR could ever strive to be? We aren’t developing and selling players, that’s a pipe dream. Football business isn’t an aristocracy its pure free market capitalism! [Post edited 4 Jan 2023 6:24]
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| What is the objective? on 11:28 - Jan 4 with 3648 views | Welsh_Ranger |
| What is the objective? on 05:35 - Jan 4 by Match82 |
Might have dreamt this, but is there a clause in any of these contracts which means we pay more if they DON'T play when fit? |
Sounds about right. I'm not anti loans but i do think at times it defeats the object of the exercise. In an ideal world we would be fielding a team of our own with a mixture of seasoned pros and prospects from the youth and then rinsing and repeating.
To slightly contradict myself i think if we identify a loan that can improve the team without blocking the pathway of emerging talent then great but if it stifles the opportunities for our players then not good.
Nix mentioned on another thread that FIFA etc are changing the laws on loans in order that the big clubs can't stockpile players which longterm could be good. | | | |
| What is the objective? on 11:45 - Jan 4 with 3629 views | nix |
It's a proposal Welsh re the loan players. I'm not sure it's been passed yet or will be passed. Fingers crossed! |  | | |
| What is the objective? on 12:51 - Jan 4 with 3564 views | terryb |
| What is the objective? on 06:20 - Jan 4 by SirNose |
So QPR should know their place which is the level of Millwall, Luton, Blackpool, Reading or Preston and except the fact Norwich, Burnley, West Brom, Blades, Stoke, and Watford etc etc are way bigger than QPR could ever strive to be? We aren’t developing and selling players, that’s a pipe dream. Football business isn’t an aristocracy its pure free market capitalism! [Post edited 4 Jan 2023 6:24]
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Of the clubs that you mention, Blackpool, Norwich, Burnley, West Brom, Stoke & Preston have spent more years playing in the top division than Queens Park Rangers have. Of course, a lot of this is historical.
Does that mean that they are bigger clubs than us? Not in my opinion, but it doesn't mean that Reading, Millwall etc. should be regarded as being "smaller" either!
I certainly would never presume to say that we are a bigger club than others that play in our division or lower. Ipswich & Sheffield Wednesday would certainly disagree.
I think the question should be - How big a club are Queens Park Rangers & where would you place them in the 92 Premier/EFL clubs? [Post edited 4 Jan 2023 13:27]
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| What is the objective? on 13:12 - Jan 4 with 3512 views | Juzzie |
| What is the objective? on 06:20 - Jan 4 by SirNose |
So QPR should know their place which is the level of Millwall, Luton, Blackpool, Reading or Preston and except the fact Norwich, Burnley, West Brom, Blades, Stoke, and Watford etc etc are way bigger than QPR could ever strive to be? We aren’t developing and selling players, that’s a pipe dream. Football business isn’t an aristocracy its pure free market capitalism! [Post edited 4 Jan 2023 6:24]
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It’s not entirely free-market capitalism as FFP has throttled that. |  | | |
| What is the objective? on 13:23 - Jan 4 with 3487 views | WestonsuperR |
| What is the objective? on 20:57 - Jan 3 by Toast_R |
Out of 21 seasons in the Championship since 1996 we've only made the play offs once and that was because we cheated. Shocking really.
Teams with lesser or similar budgets to our have done it regular, why can't this club? |
It is very true that there are many examples of clubs with less budget achieving promotion/playoffs but equally a lot of larger clubs that ours that have struggled, Ipswich, Sheff W and Sunderland have much bigger supporter base and have spent plenty of time in League One between them.
We could definitely do better but when you consider the general size of the club we should be realistic and understand we are a mid/low Championship club and no more than that. |  | | |
| What is the objective? on 16:20 - Jan 4 with 3392 views | NorthantsHoop |
| What is the objective? on 23:30 - Jan 3 by PunteR |
Owning a training ground is surely a minimum requirement for a football club like QPR. I know it's great that we've finally got one but with the millions if not billions of pounds that goes through the bank accounts of people who own our football club ,some changing rooms and pitches shouldn't be too much of a stretch.
It's an improvement on what we currently have and a step in the right direction.,of course.
Just on your point regarding following QPR since the 70s. When I started supporting QPR In about 82 we were a top London club, always in Division 1 so maybe I have a slightly warped sense of entitlement and where I feel we should be as a club, I dunno? Looking back in the cold light of day we probably over achieved during those times but I can't help feeling we're not doing things to the best of our resources and capabilities atm. [Post edited 3 Jan 2023 23:49]
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You make a really valid point, we just have to look at other London clubs that operate in the Prem and Championship, we are stuck in a ground without any development for over 40 years, we know reasons why. Other comparable clubs around us Brentford, Fulham, Chelsea, West Ham, Milwall, Palace and Watford have either moved to new grounds or have massively upgraded their sites in recent years, yet we are stuck for a whole host of reasons in a stadium that is in some ways harking back to an era when football lets face it was not the global money making TV brand it is today. [Post edited 4 Jan 2023 16:21]
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| What is the objective? on 18:10 - Jan 4 with 3296 views | stanistheman |
| What is the objective? on 16:20 - Jan 4 by NorthantsHoop |
You make a really valid point, we just have to look at other London clubs that operate in the Prem and Championship, we are stuck in a ground without any development for over 40 years, we know reasons why. Other comparable clubs around us Brentford, Fulham, Chelsea, West Ham, Milwall, Palace and Watford have either moved to new grounds or have massively upgraded their sites in recent years, yet we are stuck for a whole host of reasons in a stadium that is in some ways harking back to an era when football lets face it was not the global money making TV brand it is today. [Post edited 4 Jan 2023 16:21]
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This is what is holding the club back.
What is going on with the LC stadium. If H&F council can’t decide soon then the Board have to walk away from this and find somewhere else to build a new stadium even if it means leaving the borough. Until we move we will struggle.
As for the loans, I think we brought Laird in because we have seen over the last few seasons that Kakay is not a top half full back.
Iroegbenum because we needed a box to box midfielder and neither Dozzell or Amos fit the bill , but also as cover for Field.
Roberts was somehow thought of as a possible centre forward, but whoever it was clearly had not really seen him play. He is more like a number 10, but with Willock and Chair I don’t think he is needed.
Richard still as a view to replace either of our current number 10s.
I would if possible send Roberts back but keep the others and apart from Richards play them as starters.
I would also if allowed bring others in as we don’t seem to be able to buy them due to the spending rules.
I think we need two new strikers and cover for Johansen as I don’t think Dozzell is good enough. I would like to sell him if any clubs want him. | | | |
| What is the objective? on 19:01 - Jan 4 with 3232 views | derbyhoop |
| What is the objective? on 12:51 - Jan 4 by terryb |
Of the clubs that you mention, Blackpool, Norwich, Burnley, West Brom, Stoke & Preston have spent more years playing in the top division than Queens Park Rangers have. Of course, a lot of this is historical.
Does that mean that they are bigger clubs than us? Not in my opinion, but it doesn't mean that Reading, Millwall etc. should be regarded as being "smaller" either!
I certainly would never presume to say that we are a bigger club than others that play in our division or lower. Ipswich & Sheffield Wednesday would certainly disagree.
I think the question should be - How big a club are Queens Park Rangers & where would you place them in the 92 Premier/EFL clubs? [Post edited 4 Jan 2023 13:27]
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| What is the objective? on 09:35 - Jan 5 with 3000 views | Wegerles_Stairs |
| What is the objective? on 16:20 - Jan 4 by NorthantsHoop |
You make a really valid point, we just have to look at other London clubs that operate in the Prem and Championship, we are stuck in a ground without any development for over 40 years, we know reasons why. Other comparable clubs around us Brentford, Fulham, Chelsea, West Ham, Milwall, Palace and Watford have either moved to new grounds or have massively upgraded their sites in recent years, yet we are stuck for a whole host of reasons in a stadium that is in some ways harking back to an era when football lets face it was not the global money making TV brand it is today. [Post edited 4 Jan 2023 16:21]
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Which is why we need to move. I love the place but while we stay there, we are severely disadvantaged in an era of FFP.
The problem is the owners want a free ground from the council so they can redevelop Loftus Road as housing to recoup their losses. Stalemate. | | | |
| What is the objective? on 11:52 - Jan 5 with 2920 views | robith |
Given where football seems to be going, I'd say our objective for the next 3-4 years is to avoid points deductions whilst staying in the Championship. I see the existence of many clubs getting quite hairy in the foreseeable |  | | |
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