| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... 12:32 - Oct 13 with 10904 views | Hadders |
A fascinating, well-researched and beautifully written article in today's Guardian, by one of our own, Michael Hann. Well done Hanny my son! As an aside, as he suggests at the end, our supporters are surely as guilty as any: being an empathetic and fair-minded sort of chap, I often feel for refs and linos at Loftus Road. https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/oct/13/football-ref-hostile-players-ir [Post edited 13 Oct 2018 21:32]
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 14:43 - Oct 13 with 9129 views | Esox_Lucius |
Most times they are their own worst enemy due to inconsistency... throughout the leagues. |  |
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 14:51 - Oct 13 with 9120 views | Hadders |
The stats Hann quotes about the accuracy of decisions at the higher levels suggest they are way more consistent than anyone else on the pitch. And nothing excuses the abuse they get. Only corruption might justify it, and that is so rare in this country as to be unworthy of mention; in fact, most of the abuse is due to them being the only impartial people for miles around. [Post edited 13 Oct 2018 14:51]
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 15:02 - Oct 13 with 9105 views | Esox_Lucius |
| Who'd Be a Ref? on 14:51 - Oct 13 by Hadders |
The stats Hann quotes about the accuracy of decisions at the higher levels suggest they are way more consistent than anyone else on the pitch. And nothing excuses the abuse they get. Only corruption might justify it, and that is so rare in this country as to be unworthy of mention; in fact, most of the abuse is due to them being the only impartial people for miles around. [Post edited 13 Oct 2018 14:51]
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"Yes, we’ll get things wrong, and some officials might be incompetent,..." and that is why you'll never stop fans from abusing refs. Anyone who ever saw Gurnam Singh reffing a game will never forget how awful he truly was. Niggling little trifles like Smith being wrestled to the ground time after time without any official blowing up is the sort of things that rile QPR fans and I am sure that every fan of any other club will be able to quote similar instances. Not clamping down on time wasting is another reason they get abused, and rightly so IMO, the laws are there to prevent it, so use them! | |
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 15:07 - Oct 13 with 9103 views | colinallcars |
I often leave the ground railing against the ref, but in the cold light of day realise just how hard it is for them. The level of cheating amongst the players makes the refs' job only harder.
I'd like to see them clamp down on time wasting, and ungentlemanly conduct including ref-baiting. The trouble is, they would need to start sending players off as a last resort. They would then be accused of “ruining the game as a spectacle” It might take a long time for the players to fall into line.
The trouble is, also, that the managers condone the cheating and so do a lot of fans as long as it's their team that are doing it. |  | | |
| Who'd Be a Ref? on 15:11 - Oct 13 with 9093 views | Hadders |
Of course they make mistakes, but surely it's the players and managers who are most at fault for that kind of crap. If you've just read that article and still think refs deserve abuse mate, fine. I assume you don't justify the threats of and actual violence he mentions. [Post edited 13 Oct 2018 15:12]
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 15:28 - Oct 13 with 9071 views | Esox_Lucius |
You assume correctly. ALL rational people will stop short of that behaviour. Officials just need to be aware that there will be some drug addled psychotics at games and up their game to prevent that sort of thing occurring. | |
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 15:38 - Oct 13 with 9068 views | colinallcars |
| Who'd Be a Ref? on 15:28 - Oct 13 by Esox_Lucius |
You assume correctly. ALL rational people will stop short of that behaviour. Officials just need to be aware that there will be some drug addled psychotics at games and up their game to prevent that sort of thing occurring. |
Drug addled psychotics ? at Queen's Park Rangers ? Our crowd is composed entirely of sober, gentlemanly, erudite and civilised exemplars ! | | | |
| Who'd Be a Ref? on 16:00 - Oct 13 with 9049 views | DavieQPR |
For some Refs it's the old thing about little men doing it purely for the power it gives them. |  | | |
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 16:12 - Oct 13 with 9041 views | Esox_Lucius |
| Who'd Be a Ref? on 15:38 - Oct 13 by colinallcars |
Drug addled psychotics ? at Queen's Park Rangers ? Our crowd is composed entirely of sober, gentlemanly, erudite and civilised exemplars ! |
You've never been in R block then?  | |
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 18:08 - Oct 13 with 8991 views | smegma |
Who'd be a ref? I was at the FA Vase game at North Greenford United ground between St Panteleimon and Cray Valley PM. 10 minutes into extra time the game was abandoned with the Saints keeper unconscious in the goalmouth . Cray Valley fans were moaning 'surely there should be a replay at our ground as the game is almost over?'. This was after the ref explained the FA will decide as to what happens next? I told them they were a bunch of C U Next Tuesdays as not one of them had considered the condition of the keeper. The game was 1-1 at the time | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 15:32 - Oct 14 with 8659 views | derbyhoop |
Football - a game played by 22 players and refereed by 22,000. Who can all do the job better than the appointed official. |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 16:39 - Oct 14 with 8615 views | loftboy |
Did it for the best part of 20 years, had a bottle thrown at me, sat in a dressing room with my foot against the door stopping the players from getting in, an attempted head butt. But overall did some fantastic games, especially in the Chiswick league LBlock will have a good story from one of my games reffing Acton and Ealing Whistlers. |  |
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| Who'd Be a Ref? on 17:09 - Oct 15 with 8255 views | PinnerPaul |
| Who'd Be a Ref? on 14:51 - Oct 13 by Hadders |
The stats Hann quotes about the accuracy of decisions at the higher levels suggest they are way more consistent than anyone else on the pitch. And nothing excuses the abuse they get. Only corruption might justify it, and that is so rare in this country as to be unworthy of mention; in fact, most of the abuse is due to them being the only impartial people for miles around. [Post edited 13 Oct 2018 14:51]
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Yep, spot on!
I was on Ladies (Level 4) match the other night and (losing) manager comes in dressing room afterwards (He DID ask first!) and says he felt 'most of the 50/50s went against us'
Now his team were from Herts, oppo was a London team and ref came from Essex.
Clearly ref, me and the other AR couldn't give a t*** who won the game - what are you supposed to say to that?! | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 17:11 - Oct 15 with 8251 views | hopphoops |
Like Middle East negotiations, if all Parties feel hard done by and blame you, you might just have got it right. |  |
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| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 19:14 - Oct 15 with 8151 views | OutWestR |
I’ve had to do linesman duties for one of my kids in an under 11s match on a few occasions. Truly horrific experience. Like in the article, just keeping up with play was hard enough and then the comments from the parents to top it off. Fair play to anyone that does that at any level. |  | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 17:36 - Oct 16 with 7992 views | PinnerPaul |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 19:14 - Oct 15 by OutWestR |
I’ve had to do linesman duties for one of my kids in an under 11s match on a few occasions. Truly horrific experience. Like in the article, just keeping up with play was hard enough and then the comments from the parents to top it off. Fair play to anyone that does that at any level. |
I mostly AR and it isn't easy to do properly.
Ball close to your own line is the hardest part as article says - trying to watch 3 things at once isn't easy! | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 17:41 - Oct 16 with 7985 views | extratimeR |
Rob Styles | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 22:13 - Oct 16 with 7934 views | HamptonR |
I have "Run the line" on many occasions.
The better refs tell you before the game what to give, which is normally throws and offside, they handle all the fouls and dives etc.
The players are not told this beforehand so when they scream for a penalty they are generally screaming at me because I am close by, but my opinion doesn't count, its up to the ref.
I have been called a cheat by youth and senior players but my all time favourite encounter was with a supporter who was an elderly gentleman.
It was during an U18 game and one of the players was standing in an offside position, the elderly gent shouted to him,
"Kell, Kell, you're offside" Kell wasn't listening.
Once again, "Kell, Kell, move onside you're off".
A few seconds later the ball was played through to Kell who was still offside and I duly put my flag up.
The elderly gentleman then screamed
"For Fecks Sake Lino he's onside, you fecking cheat" | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 08:14 - Oct 17 with 7890 views | daveB |
great article that, I had to ref one my sons games a year or so ago as we had no ref, this was an under 9's match and was bloody terrifying, I'd never volunteer again I got so much wrong it was embarrassing, |  | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 12:58 - Oct 17 with 7818 views | PinnerPaul |
From 'Ref Chat' - something else to mull over
Saw this and thought this is probably a fair assessment.
Copied and pasted, so not my own writing.
I read something recently, and wish I kept the link, that a match was analysed (apparently watched several times for accuracy) and a referee made approximately 400 decisions (that is whether to give a foul or not to give a foul, to caution/send off or not to card at all, how to restart play with direction of throw in, corner or goal kick etc)
He got about 5 wrong, in the opinion of the viewer.
But the media jumped on 2 of those 5 wrong. 1 was a penalty that should have been awarded. It seems the referees angle was not better than a tv angle.
Apparently a keeper made about 100 judgements in that game (and they included whether he should have come out for the ball or stayed in his area, releasing ball slowly or quickly, over hitting/throwing a ball released, fouling (that penalty not given) and whether the keeper should have caught or punched/palm the ball away).The viewer said the keeper made about 40 wrong decisions. But they were never picked up on by the media, despite one that should have been a penalty, and one goal being scored because of a poor clearance by the keeper.
The referee was ridiculed for not giving a penalty but the keeper was not talked about for his clumsiness to commit the foul in the first place. The referee made about 1.25% decisions wrong. The keeper made 40% decisions wrong.
Again this is just the view of the person who analysed it.
But the referee hit the media and not the keeper (player).
Players make much more wrong decisions in the heat of the moment than a referee does | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 15:07 - Oct 17 with 7785 views | derbyhoop |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 12:58 - Oct 17 by PinnerPaul |
From 'Ref Chat' - something else to mull over
Saw this and thought this is probably a fair assessment.
Copied and pasted, so not my own writing.
I read something recently, and wish I kept the link, that a match was analysed (apparently watched several times for accuracy) and a referee made approximately 400 decisions (that is whether to give a foul or not to give a foul, to caution/send off or not to card at all, how to restart play with direction of throw in, corner or goal kick etc)
He got about 5 wrong, in the opinion of the viewer.
But the media jumped on 2 of those 5 wrong. 1 was a penalty that should have been awarded. It seems the referees angle was not better than a tv angle.
Apparently a keeper made about 100 judgements in that game (and they included whether he should have come out for the ball or stayed in his area, releasing ball slowly or quickly, over hitting/throwing a ball released, fouling (that penalty not given) and whether the keeper should have caught or punched/palm the ball away).The viewer said the keeper made about 40 wrong decisions. But they were never picked up on by the media, despite one that should have been a penalty, and one goal being scored because of a poor clearance by the keeper.
The referee was ridiculed for not giving a penalty but the keeper was not talked about for his clumsiness to commit the foul in the first place. The referee made about 1.25% decisions wrong. The keeper made 40% decisions wrong.
Again this is just the view of the person who analysed it.
But the referee hit the media and not the keeper (player).
Players make much more wrong decisions in the heat of the moment than a referee does |
Good analysis.
Perhaps us fans ought to cut the officials a bit more slack than we do.
When a team is playing well, the refs rarely get things wrong, but, according to the fans, the ref is always to blame when the team doesn't play well.
I'd still like to see more done to stop the wrestling matches that go on at every set piece in the professional game. And very few refs seem to clamp down on the time-wasting. | |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 15:39 - Oct 17 with 7774 views | PinnerPaul |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 15:07 - Oct 17 by derbyhoop |
Good analysis.
Perhaps us fans ought to cut the officials a bit more slack than we do.
When a team is playing well, the refs rarely get things wrong, but, according to the fans, the ref is always to blame when the team doesn't play well.
I'd still like to see more done to stop the wrestling matches that go on at every set piece in the professional game. And very few refs seem to clamp down on the time-wasting. |
On your last point - I agree - that's an easy one for the ref I think - so I'm always screaming about it at LR.
That's from a referee's perspective of course - fans, understandably, see things differently.
I don't think there are many offsides - for and against 'us' that I haven't seen shouted about at LR.
Reason for that of course is that, as you would expect, us fans are following the ball. As article says - judging offsides is so much more complicated than that! | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 15:43 - Oct 17 with 7767 views | PinnerPaul |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 08:14 - Oct 17 by daveB |
great article that, I had to ref one my sons games a year or so ago as we had no ref, this was an under 9's match and was bloody terrifying, I'd never volunteer again I got so much wrong it was embarrassing, |
I would do the course if I were you Dave.
Don't be hard on yourself, on my course - filled with football 'nuts' as you would expect - every session contained something about the laws that many of us couldn't believe!
Seriously, although I'm bigging it up for us refs, you would do a much better job and know more than everyone there if you did the course.
Although I warn you - that's how I started - reffing my son's games when no one else would- and now 16 years after qualifying I'm still doing it!
Tend not to do much 'grassroots' youth football now though! | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 20:30 - Oct 17 with 7706 views | daveB |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 15:43 - Oct 17 by PinnerPaul |
I would do the course if I were you Dave.
Don't be hard on yourself, on my course - filled with football 'nuts' as you would expect - every session contained something about the laws that many of us couldn't believe!
Seriously, although I'm bigging it up for us refs, you would do a much better job and know more than everyone there if you did the course.
Although I warn you - that's how I started - reffing my son's games when no one else would- and now 16 years after qualifying I'm still doing it!
Tend not to do much 'grassroots' youth football now though! |
The bit I got stuck on was the different rules in kids football such as opposition in the other half at a goal kick and not being able to kick out from hands, i ignored it every time and had both managers going mad at me. Hardest bit was getting in the right position to see everything. They've not asked me to do it again since | | | |
| Who'd be a ref? He's one of our own... on 09:54 - Oct 18 with 7637 views | Dorse |
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