| FAW Youth Cup 02:57 - Mar 20 with 5507 views | Giff |
Played Newport County in semi final this afternoon and won 1-0 (aet). Will play Cambrian & Clydach Vale in final.
Well done boys. |  | | |  |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:07 - Mar 21 with 4410 views | morningstar |
Pfft! Meanwhile Cardiff under 18's are taking on all comers.
Last six results.:
Cardiff City under 18's 0-7 Coventry City
Ipswich Town Under 18's 4 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18
Millwall Under 18's 3 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18's
Huddersfield Town Under 18's 6 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18's
Cardiff City Under 18's 2- 0 Coventry City Under 18's
Cardiff City Under 18's 0-4 Birmingham City under 18's
I know it's more about development than results at that age, but it really can't be good for their development either when they're getting smashed every week! |  |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 18:16 - Mar 21 with 4399 views | Kilkennyjack |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:07 - Mar 21 by morningstar |
Pfft! Meanwhile Cardiff under 18's are taking on all comers.
Last six results.:
Cardiff City under 18's 0-7 Coventry City
Ipswich Town Under 18's 4 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18
Millwall Under 18's 3 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18's
Huddersfield Town Under 18's 6 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18's
Cardiff City Under 18's 2- 0 Coventry City Under 18's
Cardiff City Under 18's 0-4 Birmingham City under 18's
I know it's more about development than results at that age, but it really can't be good for their development either when they're getting smashed every week! |
Amazing - they would put 6 on us home and away under tony pennock.
Albeit results are not important as you say. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| FAW Youth Cup on 18:28 - Mar 21 with 4375 views | morningstar |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:16 - Mar 21 by Kilkennyjack |
Amazing - they would put 6 on us home and away under tony pennock.
Albeit results are not important as you say. |
Results aren't important within development sides to a certain extent. On the other side of the coin though, when you're getting dicked like that game in game out, There's obviously something wrong with the coaching set up or the quality of youngsters they have at that level. | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 18:29 - Mar 21 with 4368 views | Loyal |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:28 - Mar 21 by morningstar |
Results aren't important within development sides to a certain extent. On the other side of the coin though, when you're getting dicked like that game in game out, There's obviously something wrong with the coaching set up or the quality of youngsters they have at that level. |
When your 16 and getting dicked every week ......
It hurts .... |  |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 18:30 - Mar 21 with 4365 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:07 - Mar 21 by morningstar |
Pfft! Meanwhile Cardiff under 18's are taking on all comers.
Last six results.:
Cardiff City under 18's 0-7 Coventry City
Ipswich Town Under 18's 4 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18
Millwall Under 18's 3 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18's
Huddersfield Town Under 18's 6 - 0 Cardiff City Under 18's
Cardiff City Under 18's 2- 0 Coventry City Under 18's
Cardiff City Under 18's 0-4 Birmingham City under 18's
I know it's more about development than results at that age, but it really can't be good for their development either when they're getting smashed every week! |
Our u18s have been pushed up to DVP level.
The u18 lineups have usually been u16 sides.
[Post edited 21 Mar 2017 18:34]
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| FAW Youth Cup on 18:37 - Mar 21 with 4347 views | morningstar |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:30 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
Our u18s have been pushed up to DVP level.
The u18 lineups have usually been u16 sides.
[Post edited 21 Mar 2017 18:34]
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Either way bluey, it's not working for the young lads is it? What 16 year old lad wants to play in a team that gets overrun by stronger older lads every game they play? That's not development as even if you have a style of play you wish to implement, they have no chance of doing so! | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 18:43 - Mar 21 with 4319 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:37 - Mar 21 by morningstar |
Either way bluey, it's not working for the young lads is it? What 16 year old lad wants to play in a team that gets overrun by stronger older lads every game they play? That's not development as even if you have a style of play you wish to implement, they have no chance of doing so! |
What's the alternative?
We had a generation of players who came through the academy. Had pro contracts. O'Sullivan, Wharton, that ilk. None threatened the first team. None shone when on loan at pro teams.
Bellamy was appointed to work with the academy, remit to drive players through towards the first team. First thing he did was get rid of over ten DVP players - players from 18-23 who weren't good enough yet blocked the progression of others.
Warnock is very much of the same mindset - he hates DVP. The point is, playing against similar age players just shows someone is good at that level. The test is when you play against better, more physical players. Sink / swim. Can you adapt?
We've had talented players who have never driven on and shown it at the level we're in. We've certainly produced players of Champ level or above before...
We face difficulties you don't. Any talent will get snapped up by Cat 1 academies - minimal compensation, something the Prem League forced through. Rabbi Motondo, 15. Man Citeh signed him up recently. Offered family a house, gave dad a job. We can't compete with that. Sion Spence on the other hand turned them down to stay with us. He's someone who has played well at u18 level. I'd not be surprised if he is on the subs bench towards the end of the year.
EDIT: Our 3-1 win vs QPR was missing from the list of results btw ;)
EDIT2: DVP results haven't been as bad.
Millwall, 1 - 1 draw
Crystal Palace, 3-0 loss
Burnley, 2-1 win
QPR 2-0 loss
Blackburn 2-1 loss
Watford 7-1 win
Bolton 3-1 loss [Post edited 21 Mar 2017 18:49]
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| FAW Youth Cup on 19:06 - Mar 21 with 4286 views | morningstar |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:43 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
What's the alternative?
We had a generation of players who came through the academy. Had pro contracts. O'Sullivan, Wharton, that ilk. None threatened the first team. None shone when on loan at pro teams.
Bellamy was appointed to work with the academy, remit to drive players through towards the first team. First thing he did was get rid of over ten DVP players - players from 18-23 who weren't good enough yet blocked the progression of others.
Warnock is very much of the same mindset - he hates DVP. The point is, playing against similar age players just shows someone is good at that level. The test is when you play against better, more physical players. Sink / swim. Can you adapt?
We've had talented players who have never driven on and shown it at the level we're in. We've certainly produced players of Champ level or above before...
We face difficulties you don't. Any talent will get snapped up by Cat 1 academies - minimal compensation, something the Prem League forced through. Rabbi Motondo, 15. Man Citeh signed him up recently. Offered family a house, gave dad a job. We can't compete with that. Sion Spence on the other hand turned them down to stay with us. He's someone who has played well at u18 level. I'd not be surprised if he is on the subs bench towards the end of the year.
EDIT: Our 3-1 win vs QPR was missing from the list of results btw ;)
EDIT2: DVP results haven't been as bad.
Millwall, 1 - 1 draw
Crystal Palace, 3-0 loss
Burnley, 2-1 win
QPR 2-0 loss
Blackburn 2-1 loss
Watford 7-1 win
Bolton 3-1 loss [Post edited 21 Mar 2017 18:49]
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It's a difficult balance with the problems you face i agree. But moving a whole age group up two years, could mean that some players who are ready for the move up will be dragged back by playing in an inferior group. It's a difficult age where confidence in your ability is crucial. Being within a group of players who are getting slaughtered in most games certainly doesn't help that. Bye the way i copied and pasted the results from CCMB. | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 19:09 - Mar 21 with 4275 views | Swanjaxs |
Any cardiff side getting humiliated at any level is fine by me 🤘 |  |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 19:21 - Mar 21 with 4233 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 19:06 - Mar 21 by morningstar |
It's a difficult balance with the problems you face i agree. But moving a whole age group up two years, could mean that some players who are ready for the move up will be dragged back by playing in an inferior group. It's a difficult age where confidence in your ability is crucial. Being within a group of players who are getting slaughtered in most games certainly doesn't help that. Bye the way i copied and pasted the results from CCMB. |
The point was though, we had players already in the DVP who weren't going to play first team for us. That meant it blocked development for others coming through.
Players who play at a level where the game is easy for them means they just stagnate. It becomes so easy they think they've made it, think they can then coast. For me, yes there are always late bloomers in football by players at age 20-21 not pushing for first team squad status generally need to find another club.
Players who have been pushed up from u18 ( and in some cases u16 level ) to play in DVP have actually played pretty well ( if not always winning ) against DVP sides, up to 5 years or so older. That'll stand them in good stead for the future.
I got my results from CCFC website ;) | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 19:24 - Mar 21 with 4228 views | morningstar |
| FAW Youth Cup on 19:09 - Mar 21 by Swanjaxs |
Any cardiff side getting humiliated at any level is fine by me 🤘 |
I agree to a certain extent, but we should be looking at teams like Cardiff as a feeder club, so it's in our best interests that they look after the better players they have in their youth set up in order they can make the step up into our development sides. | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 19:28 - Mar 21 with 4215 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 19:24 - Mar 21 by morningstar |
I agree to a certain extent, but we should be looking at teams like Cardiff as a feeder club, so it's in our best interests that they look after the better players they have in their youth set up in order they can make the step up into our development sides. |
Won't happen.
Any real talent will be hoovered up by the likes of Chelsea, Man Citeh.
You won't offer parents jobs or give houses. | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 19:35 - Mar 21 with 4199 views | morningstar |
| FAW Youth Cup on 19:21 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
The point was though, we had players already in the DVP who weren't going to play first team for us. That meant it blocked development for others coming through.
Players who play at a level where the game is easy for them means they just stagnate. It becomes so easy they think they've made it, think they can then coast. For me, yes there are always late bloomers in football by players at age 20-21 not pushing for first team squad status generally need to find another club.
Players who have been pushed up from u18 ( and in some cases u16 level ) to play in DVP have actually played pretty well ( if not always winning ) against DVP sides, up to 5 years or so older. That'll stand them in good stead for the future.
I got my results from CCFC website ;) |
That situation is no different from any club bluey, that's the way it works. However, being developed in a side that is getting smashed every week is not good development as they have no opportunity to install a a type of play for the benefit of the club as they are obviously being over run by bigger older stronger players. It's great for a 16yr olds confidence being moved up to 18 yr olds. Not so good for them when they're all moved and getting whacked every game, not good for the group and even worse for the individual....unless they're all shite anyway! | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 19:43 - Mar 21 with 4179 views | morningstar |
| FAW Youth Cup on 19:28 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
Won't happen.
Any real talent will be hoovered up by the likes of Chelsea, Man Citeh.
You won't offer parents jobs or give houses. |
Yes we can!  | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 19:58 - Mar 21 with 4151 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 19:35 - Mar 21 by morningstar |
That situation is no different from any club bluey, that's the way it works. However, being developed in a side that is getting smashed every week is not good development as they have no opportunity to install a a type of play for the benefit of the club as they are obviously being over run by bigger older stronger players. It's great for a 16yr olds confidence being moved up to 18 yr olds. Not so good for them when they're all moved and getting whacked every game, not good for the group and even worse for the individual....unless they're all shite anyway! |
The DVP aren't being whacked every game. Have been competitive in games, hell smashed a very good, older, more physical Watford side 7-1. That's with u18s playing.
Reality is we're fast tracking those who it's felt are good enough to make the adjustment. At u18 level, sure, some bad results. At DVP level, far better results and performances. Swings and roundabouts. | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 20:03 - Mar 21 with 4140 views | plasjack |
| FAW Youth Cup on 19:58 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
The DVP aren't being whacked every game. Have been competitive in games, hell smashed a very good, older, more physical Watford side 7-1. That's with u18s playing.
Reality is we're fast tracking those who it's felt are good enough to make the adjustment. At u18 level, sure, some bad results. At DVP level, far better results and performances. Swings and roundabouts. |
What fantasy world do you live on, your club has failed a lot of young players and will rue the decision for years to come. |  | | |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:10 - Mar 21 with 4126 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:03 - Mar 21 by plasjack |
What fantasy world do you live on, your club has failed a lot of young players and will rue the decision for years to come. |
What fantasy planet are you on... a lot of players have come through the ranks highly touted ( see Tommy O'Sullivan ) yet have blown chances given when on loan elsewhere.
Players being "stars" at u12 level doesn't always translate to becoming a successful pro in the football league... some never have the mentality.
Of the current batch of youngsters we released, a few have gone to Colchester. Other than that... it's mostly been non-league. Players we couldn't even, for the most part, loan out.
Results were poor this season at youth level before Warnock came in, before Bellamy came in. It's been recognised there's been a problem bringing players through so they are doing something about it.
We're rueing the fact that the last few seasons quite a few players haven't achieved their potential. That's the point. | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 20:14 - Mar 21 with 4122 views | plasjack |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:10 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
What fantasy planet are you on... a lot of players have come through the ranks highly touted ( see Tommy O'Sullivan ) yet have blown chances given when on loan elsewhere.
Players being "stars" at u12 level doesn't always translate to becoming a successful pro in the football league... some never have the mentality.
Of the current batch of youngsters we released, a few have gone to Colchester. Other than that... it's mostly been non-league. Players we couldn't even, for the most part, loan out.
Results were poor this season at youth level before Warnock came in, before Bellamy came in. It's been recognised there's been a problem bringing players through so they are doing something about it.
We're rueing the fact that the last few seasons quite a few players haven't achieved their potential. That's the point. |
Given your expertise why did Bellamy get the job?. | | | |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:16 - Mar 21 with 4119 views | morningstar |
| FAW Youth Cup on 19:58 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
The DVP aren't being whacked every game. Have been competitive in games, hell smashed a very good, older, more physical Watford side 7-1. That's with u18s playing.
Reality is we're fast tracking those who it's felt are good enough to make the adjustment. At u18 level, sure, some bad results. At DVP level, far better results and performances. Swings and roundabouts. |
It's not swings and roundabouts bluey is it. It's a very sad state of affairs. The way you're set up, you could destroy young players, whilst kids who do manage too shine will run away as fast as they can. It's a very poor set up all round i'm afraid. I don't even think we would want you as a feeder club anyway the way things are going there at the moment. | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 20:18 - Mar 21 with 4109 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:14 - Mar 21 by plasjack |
Given your expertise why did Bellamy get the job?. |
Can't afford me.
I'm no expert, but can see the logic.
Our u16s were winning games. It became too easy for some of them at that level. Once the change came in mid season, they got pushed up the level and started losing. We'll see who sinks, who swims. Some will thrive, some won't but they are being put on positions that will maximise their development.
We've already had Mark Harris come through and be on the first team bench - granted through injuries - we should see some DVPers potentially play in the last few games of the season. | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 20:22 - Mar 21 with 4098 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:16 - Mar 21 by morningstar |
It's not swings and roundabouts bluey is it. It's a very sad state of affairs. The way you're set up, you could destroy young players, whilst kids who do manage too shine will run away as fast as they can. It's a very poor set up all round i'm afraid. I don't even think we would want you as a feeder club anyway the way things are going there at the moment. |
I disagree.
As I said, u16s were winning games handily. What do you learn from that, how do you develop? Moved to u18 level,now players against player older, more experienced. You learn more from those games than you do just turning up and easily winning games.
I disagree players will run away. Players will stay in an environment that aids their development, gives them opportunities to shine.
You'll get some leaving like Matondo going to Man Citeh, sure. You think it'll drive players away seeing Mark Harris being on the bench? Other young players training with first team squad, being involved with match day squads even if not named in match day squad?
EDIT: The point is, we did things the way you seem to want. it hasn't worked, we've had players playing well within their comfort zones, being happy enough to play that way. None have got close to the first team squad. [Post edited 21 Mar 2017 20:23]
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| FAW Youth Cup on 20:22 - Mar 21 with 4097 views | stevethejack |
| FAW Youth Cup on 18:29 - Mar 21 by Loyal |
When your 16 and getting dicked every week ......
It hurts .... |
Past experience in Champers for you? |  | | |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:22 - Mar 21 with 4096 views | plasjack |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:18 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
Can't afford me.
I'm no expert, but can see the logic.
Our u16s were winning games. It became too easy for some of them at that level. Once the change came in mid season, they got pushed up the level and started losing. We'll see who sinks, who swims. Some will thrive, some won't but they are being put on positions that will maximise their development.
We've already had Mark Harris come through and be on the first team bench - granted through injuries - we should see some DVPers potentially play in the last few games of the season. |
The logic is surely financial, and that is very shortsighted, even with FFP constraints. | | | |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:24 - Mar 21 with 4093 views | Swanjaxs |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:10 - Mar 21 by blueytheblue |
What fantasy planet are you on... a lot of players have come through the ranks highly touted ( see Tommy O'Sullivan ) yet have blown chances given when on loan elsewhere.
Players being "stars" at u12 level doesn't always translate to becoming a successful pro in the football league... some never have the mentality.
Of the current batch of youngsters we released, a few have gone to Colchester. Other than that... it's mostly been non-league. Players we couldn't even, for the most part, loan out.
Results were poor this season at youth level before Warnock came in, before Bellamy came in. It's been recognised there's been a problem bringing players through so they are doing something about it.
We're rueing the fact that the last few seasons quite a few players haven't achieved their potential. That's the point. |
Oooo Tommy O'Sullivan!! ..... really supprised he didnt go all the way!! 😮 | |
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| FAW Youth Cup on 20:25 - Mar 21 with 4090 views | blueytheblue |
| FAW Youth Cup on 20:22 - Mar 21 by plasjack |
The logic is surely financial, and that is very shortsighted, even with FFP constraints. |
The logic isn't financial, it's about giving players every opportunity to show if they can raise their game rather than being in comfort zones.
Does it make sense to keep 21, 22, 23 yr olds on small wages around when they have zero chance of getting close to the first team, irrespective of FFP? | |
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