| David Davis + Boris on 08:17 - Jul 10 with 2821 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| David Davis + Boris on 20:57 - Jul 9 by Tonto |
"Only remainers have made noise"?
I can only assume you have been deaf to all the deafening noise made by the hard brexiteers then. Jacob Rhys Mogg alone has been spouting the hard Brexit matra loud enough to drown out a Metalicca concet! |
I mean the voters
It's only been remainers making all the noise so far. |  |
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| David Davis on 08:18 - Jul 10 with 2824 views | connell10 |
| David Davis on 12:34 - Jul 9 by paulparker |
Danny Dyer is a cretin , he seems to be everywhere at the moment and not in a good way either , the bloke is an embarrassment with that stupid mockney accent , |
Yeah but he is right Cameron is a T WAT! [Post edited 10 Jul 2018 9:51]
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| AND WHEN I DREAM , I DREAM ABOUT YOU AND WHEN I SCREAM I SCREAM ABOUT YOU!!!!! | | Poll: | best number 10 ever? |
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| David Davis on 08:40 - Jul 10 with 2760 views | Toast_R |
| David Davis on 08:18 - Jul 10 by connell10 |
Yeah but he is right Cameron is a T WAT! [Post edited 10 Jul 2018 9:51]
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Well lets have a second ref and this time be clear. Leave means leave as in Leave the EU not leave but still have one foot in there and remain mean's... well, remain?
Can I just say though that I won't be voting a second time. It's bollocks. |  | | |
| David Davis on 08:47 - Jul 10 with 2750 views | Antti_Heinola |
| David Davis on 08:59 - Jul 9 by paulparker |
if the Tories have any hope of winning the next Election they need to revolt and hoy the Useless May out NOW and carry out what 17.5 million people voted for which was the most important vote of our generation , the likes of Johnson, May , Cameron, Gove are pretty much worse than traitors IMO |
What did they vote for Paul? All the of them a hard brexit? All of then to leave the customs union? These questions were not on the ballot. Take away protest votes, people who regret their vote and those that on balance, especially now the reality of this expensive sht-storm is like, would’ve preferred sonething softer, and you’re probably talking about a decision less than 10m support. Insanity, really.
By the way, Sourhgate’s done all right for a yes man worh no balls to change anything hasn’t he?! |  |
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| David Davis + Boris on 08:48 - Jul 10 with 2751 views | Metallica_Hoop |
If only we'd have had that promised vote on Lisbon then none of this would probably have happened.
Trading Blocs don't need constitutions... |  |
| Beer and Beef has made us what we are - The Prince Regent |
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| David Davis on 09:13 - Jul 10 with 2704 views | ElHoop |
| David Davis on 03:53 - Jul 10 by PlanetHonneywood |
Hard to disagree! Lord knows if that which has been discussed here continued for two more pages, we'll probably arrive at the solution.
The growing worry post-Brexit, was that if this was the best we could do negotiating from a relatively strong position at the outset, then heaven help us when we got down to some real trade deals.
The world had become fixated with trade deals, and invariably its the workers who must face the squeeze to accommodate them, and the customers to pay for them.
None of the advantages of globalisation and digitalisation have been fairly shared. The banking crisis of 2008 and the resulting measures to fix it (not that we have) did not see anything like the burden to do so fairly spread, much less those responsible being held to account for creating the mess. Cider is right, 'globalisation' is at the root of a lot of peoples' angst whether they know it or not!
Although he might be a monstrous knob, Farage did say one thing that is hard to disagree with: there is nothing the EU does that a few well drafted and agreed trade deals would not achieve! Something that seems beyond this government.
#clusterfukscominghome |
Precisely.
The whole point of the referendum was to get rid of the EU as a single issue on our political scene, presumably through us deciding to remain. It would have shut up Farage and UKIP would have crawled back under its stone.
But the EU gave Cameron nothing. They hung him out to dry. They won't tell you wha tthe EU is going to be. They won't resolve the issue of how the Euro can work without a completely central EU government. They won't explain how those outside the Eurozone will cope when the Eurozone economy moves in a different direction to their own economies - immigration a particular problem in that scenario. The EU expects us to come up with 'suggestions' or 'plans' which everybody knows they won't accept. The whole negotiation process is a con. You can blame May or Boris or Cameron anyone you want but nobody could have got us through this mess - it's beyond our control.
So we'll probably end up where we started, with Farage back at UKIP and UKIP on around 18% in the polls and the same single issue contaminating the political scene until the EU either expires or decides what it itself wants to be and gets on with it. [Post edited 10 Jul 2018 9:40]
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| David Davis on 09:17 - Jul 10 with 2692 views | robith |
| David Davis on 16:26 - Jul 9 by hopphoops |
Poor Boris, half an hour ago he was Foreign Secretary and now he's not even allowed his own thread. How the mighty fall. |
That's why you always quit first |  | | |
| David Davis on 09:23 - Jul 10 with 2676 views | paulparker |
| David Davis on 08:47 - Jul 10 by Antti_Heinola |
What did they vote for Paul? All the of them a hard brexit? All of then to leave the customs union? These questions were not on the ballot. Take away protest votes, people who regret their vote and those that on balance, especially now the reality of this expensive sht-storm is like, would’ve preferred sonething softer, and you’re probably talking about a decision less than 10m support. Insanity, really.
By the way, Sourhgate’s done all right for a yes man worh no balls to change anything hasn’t he?! |
People all had different reasons for voting out, mainly not being governed by a load of bureaucrats in Brussels and Britain being a stand a lone country , yes it would take time to get out and finalise and put into place trading plans etc but the way May has dealt with this and the last election shows she is way out of her depth and nothing more than a puppet for the civil service and big businesses she has no intention of carrying this thing out and never did , hard brexit, soft brexit, semi brexit its all made up bollox its all a mask to cover up the lies we have all been fed as for dropping 7.5 million voters from the original 17.5 million I don't know where your getting that info from ? did you pluck that from the air ?
Re southgate you must have missed the threads where I praised him and took my words back about him being a yes man and you must have missed the world cup thread about my prediction of us reaching the semi finals
must do better next time for a wind up me thinks |  |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| David Davis + Boris on 09:36 - Jul 10 with 2651 views | derbyhoop |
I despair of anybody saying it was going to be easy; or that we should just walk away, without a deal.
It was never going to be easy to untangle 45 years of legislation.
And if we walk away without a deal what are the consequences?
No deal = No withdrawal agreement, therefore anything agreed up to now on Citizens Rights goes out the window. That affects 3.2m EUinUK and 1.2m UKinEU.
Just in Time manufacturing relies on 4-8 hours of inventory. 10 minutes delay at customs while they check papers and production lines stop in days.
Cancer treatments require nuclear materials managed by Euratom. We are leaving Euratom and we haven't enough skilled people to replace the EU nationals employed by them.
EASA governs aircraft safety - pilots, cabin crew and maintenance. We haven't got a replacement, therefore no flights. CAA isnt up to the size of the task.
And that's without falling investment, companies relocating And the Irish border.
Last year the FT said We needed to renegotiate 759 deals with 160 countries Just to stand still. So far, i believe, the numbers concluded come to ZERO.
Of course, it's a shitstorm. It was always going to be. |  |
| "Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky |
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| David Davis on 10:07 - Jul 10 with 2582 views | hopphoops |
| David Davis on 09:23 - Jul 10 by paulparker |
People all had different reasons for voting out, mainly not being governed by a load of bureaucrats in Brussels and Britain being a stand a lone country , yes it would take time to get out and finalise and put into place trading plans etc but the way May has dealt with this and the last election shows she is way out of her depth and nothing more than a puppet for the civil service and big businesses she has no intention of carrying this thing out and never did , hard brexit, soft brexit, semi brexit its all made up bollox its all a mask to cover up the lies we have all been fed as for dropping 7.5 million voters from the original 17.5 million I don't know where your getting that info from ? did you pluck that from the air ?
Re southgate you must have missed the threads where I praised him and took my words back about him being a yes man and you must have missed the world cup thread about my prediction of us reaching the semi finals
must do better next time for a wind up me thinks |
As someone without a direct interest in the UK's economic prospects I sometimes think that hard Brexit (which I agree is what a majority of the referendum voters essentially voted for) and a few decades of the result is just what Britain needs, but then I have to face facts, that that majority of people will always find something to misdirect their anger at, and that Westminster will always find some alibi or folk devil to cover their own shortcomings.
The global view is that the EU will be fine without the UK, but that its global impact will be reduced somewhat; and that the UK will become more or less irrelevant overnight for its sheer lack of scale, with no prospect other than further decline.
A soft Brexit will still be Brexit with some of the deals already in place that will otherwise negotiated later; but unless a version of soft Brexit can be found that gets wide acceptance the hard Brexiters will get their way. |  |
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| David Davis + Boris on 10:08 - Jul 10 with 2579 views | BklynRanger |
At this point, when they desperately need to get on with it, this debacle in the Tories is completely ridiculous. Everyone in that cabinet will have known May's leanings pre-Brexit and have had a very good idea of where she was heading since then, so the mutinee now is basically pantomime. Particularly on the part of Boris who will always put his own interests ahead of anyone else's, especially and including the country's. It's fine for them to grandstand on points of principle when they can retreat to lucrative roles in the private sector but most people don't have the luxury. |  | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 10:26 - Jul 10 with 2544 views | GloryHunter |
| David Davis + Boris on 09:36 - Jul 10 by derbyhoop |
I despair of anybody saying it was going to be easy; or that we should just walk away, without a deal.
It was never going to be easy to untangle 45 years of legislation.
And if we walk away without a deal what are the consequences?
No deal = No withdrawal agreement, therefore anything agreed up to now on Citizens Rights goes out the window. That affects 3.2m EUinUK and 1.2m UKinEU.
Just in Time manufacturing relies on 4-8 hours of inventory. 10 minutes delay at customs while they check papers and production lines stop in days.
Cancer treatments require nuclear materials managed by Euratom. We are leaving Euratom and we haven't enough skilled people to replace the EU nationals employed by them.
EASA governs aircraft safety - pilots, cabin crew and maintenance. We haven't got a replacement, therefore no flights. CAA isnt up to the size of the task.
And that's without falling investment, companies relocating And the Irish border.
Last year the FT said We needed to renegotiate 759 deals with 160 countries Just to stand still. So far, i believe, the numbers concluded come to ZERO.
Of course, it's a shitstorm. It was always going to be. |
David Davies said before the referendum, "striking a Brexit deal with the EU will be one of the easiest deals in human history, and creating free trade deals outside of Europe will be a piece of cake".
Then after the referendum he said, "Nobody said leaving the EU would be easy". |  | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 10:35 - Jul 10 with 2522 views | GloryHunter |
Don't any of you Leave voters remember what it used to be like coming home from holiday through customs in the 1970s? There was the red channel where you had to tell them what you'd bought, and pay duty on it if it was over a certain limit. And the green channel where you always felt you were going to get pulled and searched, even if you had nothing to declare.
And don't you remember getting parcels from Europe, with the green customs stickers on them, and the postman with his hand out, asking you to pay the duty?
If the UK is not in a customs union, that's what we'll be going back to. Is that what all the 52% voted for? | | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 11:00 - Jul 10 with 2488 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| David Davis + Boris on 10:35 - Jul 10 by GloryHunter |
Don't any of you Leave voters remember what it used to be like coming home from holiday through customs in the 1970s? There was the red channel where you had to tell them what you'd bought, and pay duty on it if it was over a certain limit. And the green channel where you always felt you were going to get pulled and searched, even if you had nothing to declare.
And don't you remember getting parcels from Europe, with the green customs stickers on them, and the postman with his hand out, asking you to pay the duty?
If the UK is not in a customs union, that's what we'll be going back to. Is that what all the 52% voted for? |
Feck me that's scary shite
How many Billions do we give the EU not to go back to that
Also did not stop Billions of £ going to Spain spent on holidays
Most holiday resorts in Spain where built on the GBP in the 70's
Will the EU want to make it harder for Brits to go there?
Spain the new Greece [Post edited 10 Jul 2018 11:06]
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| David Davis on 11:37 - Jul 10 with 2418 views | robith |
| David Davis on 09:23 - Jul 10 by paulparker |
People all had different reasons for voting out, mainly not being governed by a load of bureaucrats in Brussels and Britain being a stand a lone country , yes it would take time to get out and finalise and put into place trading plans etc but the way May has dealt with this and the last election shows she is way out of her depth and nothing more than a puppet for the civil service and big businesses she has no intention of carrying this thing out and never did , hard brexit, soft brexit, semi brexit its all made up bollox its all a mask to cover up the lies we have all been fed as for dropping 7.5 million voters from the original 17.5 million I don't know where your getting that info from ? did you pluck that from the air ?
Re southgate you must have missed the threads where I praised him and took my words back about him being a yes man and you must have missed the world cup thread about my prediction of us reaching the semi finals
must do better next time for a wind up me thinks |
Your response gets to what Antti was alluding to though pp - because the question was vague due to Cameron's arrogance that everyone if filling the void with their own thoughts because we don't really have a direction. The answer was leave but there's about 90 different ways and outcomes of how that could be done - for example Dan Hannan advocated the Norwegian model throughout the referendum, yet now advocates leaving without any deal at all! It's a massive mess made more so by no one wanting to stick their neck out and take the flack if it goes wrong | | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 11:57 - Jul 10 with 2379 views | Phildo |
What both sides are saying is true.
Leaving while staying in the SM/CU (or a rebadged version of them) does reduce the UK to vassal status. Rule taker not a rule maker.
Leaving without a deal will cause a sudden and painful economic period of turmoil the likes of which have never been seen. May and her fudge is trying to avoid that as they have been told at this stage by a number of massive employers what is going to happen in the event of no deal. this does not mention what is going to happen to the city 9% of our tax revenue there alone.
We have already signed up to a backstop in December which guarantees if nothing else that Northern Ireland is staying in the customs union. The DUP will not accept this.
Staying in as it is does not respect the votes of the 17m.
There is no time for a second vote to try and legitimise a climbdown without the global humiliation of asking the EU to extend the article 50 period.
It is a circle that cannot be squared. The UK needs the EU to spontaneously self-combust to solve this riddle.
Something really complicated and technically beyond the comprehension of basically everyone was reduced to a binary yes no emotive vote which became tied up with nationality and immigration. It is alright though as Dave Cameron has a new shepherds hut in which to write he memoir 'the UK - my part in its downfall'. |  | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 12:13 - Jul 10 with 2342 views | robith |
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| David Davis + Boris on 12:15 - Jul 10 with 2334 views | LythamR |
| David Davis + Boris on 08:17 - Jul 10 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
I mean the voters
It's only been remainers making all the noise so far. |
Have you ever seen an attempted suicide, or even a film enacting one?
its not the jumper making a racket, its everone else shouting "don't do it" |  | | |
| David Davis + Boris on 13:04 - Jul 10 with 2271 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| David Davis + Boris on 12:15 - Jul 10 by LythamR |
Have you ever seen an attempted suicide, or even a film enacting one?
its not the jumper making a racket, its everone else shouting "don't do it" |
Do you think the leave voters will say nothing if it does not happen. | |
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| David Davis on 13:22 - Jul 10 with 2248 views | Antti_Heinola |
| David Davis on 09:23 - Jul 10 by paulparker |
People all had different reasons for voting out, mainly not being governed by a load of bureaucrats in Brussels and Britain being a stand a lone country , yes it would take time to get out and finalise and put into place trading plans etc but the way May has dealt with this and the last election shows she is way out of her depth and nothing more than a puppet for the civil service and big businesses she has no intention of carrying this thing out and never did , hard brexit, soft brexit, semi brexit its all made up bollox its all a mask to cover up the lies we have all been fed as for dropping 7.5 million voters from the original 17.5 million I don't know where your getting that info from ? did you pluck that from the air ?
Re southgate you must have missed the threads where I praised him and took my words back about him being a yes man and you must have missed the world cup thread about my prediction of us reaching the semi finals
must do better next time for a wind up me thinks |
HA Ha, i did miss those mate, well done for owning up to it! If I’m ever wrong I’ll do the same.
We’ll never agree on the rest. I’d vote remain purely on the billions it cost us in lawyer fees to leave. The chances of us genuinely making back the cost of leaving within our childrens times is remote. It’s a waste of time. You talk about plans, but Brexiteers have offered nothing - not a sausage - pn how to break from the EU properly, beyond half witted simplwtons saying ‘just leave and tell them to stick it and let the world queue up for trade deals.’ These people live in a fantasy land - all mouth, no actual ideas or plans. | |
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| David Davis on 13:55 - Jul 10 with 2174 views | R_from_afar |
| David Davis on 09:23 - Jul 10 by paulparker |
People all had different reasons for voting out, mainly not being governed by a load of bureaucrats in Brussels and Britain being a stand a lone country , yes it would take time to get out and finalise and put into place trading plans etc but the way May has dealt with this and the last election shows she is way out of her depth and nothing more than a puppet for the civil service and big businesses she has no intention of carrying this thing out and never did , hard brexit, soft brexit, semi brexit its all made up bollox its all a mask to cover up the lies we have all been fed as for dropping 7.5 million voters from the original 17.5 million I don't know where your getting that info from ? did you pluck that from the air ?
Re southgate you must have missed the threads where I praised him and took my words back about him being a yes man and you must have missed the world cup thread about my prediction of us reaching the semi finals
must do better next time for a wind up me thinks |
"People all had different reasons for voting out, mainly not being governed by a load of bureaucrats in Brussels".
Ah, so we can blame the introduction of Universal Credit on Brussels? It was them, not the UK government, clearly.
Come on, we are not "governed" by Brussels. If we were, we'd be buying our season tickets in Euros.
A lot of lies have been peddled about the EU and lies can have dangerous consequences, so it's lucky no harm has been done. Oh...  
It's high time we all saw through the hidden agendas of newspapers and opportunist politicians.
RFA |  |
| "Things had started becoming increasingly desperate at Loftus Road but QPR have been handed a massive lifeline and the place has absolutely erupted. it's carnage. It's bedlam. It's 1-1." |
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| David Davis + Boris on 13:55 - Jul 10 with 2173 views | bob566 |
I'm no economist. I'm not even British. But surely anybody could have seen that the EU held the bargaining cards post brexit. What has the UK got to offer apart from a population of 55mill. Norway got special deals because they've got a shed load of oil and gas that they haven't exhausted yet. Mays hands are tied. She was sold a pup by Boris and co and Cameron been over confident in the public vote. Boris has f***ed off under his rock to maintain his political ego. Its going to be a decade of tough times for the UK I reckon unless they wind their necks in and go back on Brexit. I'd say if the people were given a second vote they wouldn't be listening to UKIP and Boris now and it would be a resounding stay.
Ive read nothing but doom and gloom stories on brexit. I'm not reading any positive ones apart from you'll control your own borders. You will but Asda, Sainsburys and Tescos all came out last week saying you better get ready for a much more expensive shop. Are they scaremongering? Possibly. Like I said I'm no economist but the stories in the Irish media don't read well for a UK brexit. |  | | |
| David Davis on 14:17 - Jul 10 with 2128 views | paulparker |
| David Davis on 13:22 - Jul 10 by Antti_Heinola |
HA Ha, i did miss those mate, well done for owning up to it! If I’m ever wrong I’ll do the same.
We’ll never agree on the rest. I’d vote remain purely on the billions it cost us in lawyer fees to leave. The chances of us genuinely making back the cost of leaving within our childrens times is remote. It’s a waste of time. You talk about plans, but Brexiteers have offered nothing - not a sausage - pn how to break from the EU properly, beyond half witted simplwtons saying ‘just leave and tell them to stick it and let the world queue up for trade deals.’ These people live in a fantasy land - all mouth, no actual ideas or plans. |
For me the main points of Brexit was that we become an independent Sovereign nation who would be free to trade with whoever we wanted through out the world , we would be free to deal with china, india without another eu country poking there nose in that we would also have control of our borders and that our fisherman get access to our waters before an Eu fisherman,
coming out would cost millions but long term I believe we would/will be better off this is a country of 60 million we would prosper
what we needed was a strong leader and a strong Government to implement the best deals for us as a country, unfortunately we are stuck with May, Gove, Johnson and co who cant even get the tories united let alone serve the British public its all been about egos and dick swinging the only one who comes out with any credit is Davies , labour must be licking their lips as they know they are in next and will be for a very long time (although I think corbyn and chums don't really want the gig ) | |
| And Bowles is onside, Swinburne has come rushing out of his goal , what can Bowles do here , onto the left foot no, on to the right foot
That’s there that’s two, and that’s Bowles
Brian Moore
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| David Davis + Boris on 14:26 - Jul 10 with 2099 views | Toast_R |
| David Davis + Boris on 13:55 - Jul 10 by bob566 |
I'm no economist. I'm not even British. But surely anybody could have seen that the EU held the bargaining cards post brexit. What has the UK got to offer apart from a population of 55mill. Norway got special deals because they've got a shed load of oil and gas that they haven't exhausted yet. Mays hands are tied. She was sold a pup by Boris and co and Cameron been over confident in the public vote. Boris has f***ed off under his rock to maintain his political ego. Its going to be a decade of tough times for the UK I reckon unless they wind their necks in and go back on Brexit. I'd say if the people were given a second vote they wouldn't be listening to UKIP and Boris now and it would be a resounding stay.
Ive read nothing but doom and gloom stories on brexit. I'm not reading any positive ones apart from you'll control your own borders. You will but Asda, Sainsburys and Tescos all came out last week saying you better get ready for a much more expensive shop. Are they scaremongering? Possibly. Like I said I'm no economist but the stories in the Irish media don't read well for a UK brexit. |
I'll continue to use Aldi and Lidls | | | |
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