| Third Covid Wave 10:36 - Jul 16 with 67317 views | Sadoldgit |
Infection and hospital rates climbing rapidly. Death rates projected at 200 per day. Nearly 4m people at serious risk. New information coming out about the problems Covid cause the body if it doesn’t kill you. People laid up for the best part of a year with serious complications. Concern over the AstraZenica vaccine. Is it really wise to lift most of the restrictions on Monday? We have been told that we aren’t going back into another lockdown situation no matter what, but Whitty seems to think it might have to be on the cards. [Post edited 18 Jul 2021 9:29]
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| Third Covid Wave on 07:33 - Nov 9 with 1287 views | DorsetIan |
| Third Covid Wave on 06:29 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
Oh I see..they clearly state you will die or suffer from severe side effects don't they!!...I'm sure that's what was claimed earlier in the thread wasn't it.
But that slight porkie aside, I do feel its wrong to target children in any way...like using say Big Bird or Peppa Pig to encourage young children to take this vaccine..now that's on a completely different level than a few idiots passing out a few fliers about waiting until its fully approved in 2023 I'd say. |
"The mob targeted pupils as young as 11 at three secondary schools shouting that the Covid vaccine would also cause paralysis or give them autism."
Are paralysis or autism not severe enough for you?
As for children's TV, you yourself use the word 'encourage' which is very different to the sort of antics your friends at the secondary school are engaged in. Many children have irrational fears about being vaccinated (caused in no small part by that antics of you and your friends) so I don't have a problem with Big Bird or Tinky Winky trying to reassure them by telling them the truth. |  |
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| Third Covid Wave on 09:18 - Nov 9 with 1236 views | Sadoldgit |
11600 people taken into hospital for other complaints are said to have picked up the virus in the hospitals and died. No doubt our resident anti vaxxers will find another reason for their deaths but yet again poor management of the pandemic is shown to have increased the death rate. Infected people were placed into care homes. Non infected people were sent to place where the virus was rife. We built specialist hospitals to deal with Covid but they stood empty through lack of staff. Still, no need to worry as Covid isn’t a killer eh Saint68? | | | |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:03 - Nov 9 with 1203 views | saint68 |
| Third Covid Wave on 07:33 - Nov 9 by DorsetIan |
"The mob targeted pupils as young as 11 at three secondary schools shouting that the Covid vaccine would also cause paralysis or give them autism."
Are paralysis or autism not severe enough for you?
As for children's TV, you yourself use the word 'encourage' which is very different to the sort of antics your friends at the secondary school are engaged in. Many children have irrational fears about being vaccinated (caused in no small part by that antics of you and your friends) so I don't have a problem with Big Bird or Tinky Winky trying to reassure them by telling them the truth. |
Children simply don't require this vaccine Ian, they don't need it at all...it will serve no purpose medically other than to put them at risk of side effects or worse.
The vaccines don't stop transmission in any age group so thats a mute point too. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 11:15 - Nov 9 with 1195 views | GasGiant |
| Third Covid Wave on 15:46 - Nov 8 by saint68 |
I'm pretty sure that just last week, you alluded to not trusting our very own government's statistics..correct me if I'm wrong GG
There has been all kinds of under recording (Germany for one allegedly) and over recording (UK and US)
You say that the western world and others have a far better level of recording and publishing statistical information that is more bona-fide..maybe so..but we do see the UK and US really struggling to show up to date evidence on vaccine deaths and side effects..I think Christopher Chope is still waiting from his original request in late May ..just saying. |
No not exactly Saint68 but thanks for remembering. The statistics from ONS are highly accurate - I know one of the directors and we've talked about some of the methods used and they are beyond reproach. However the Government's principal scientific advisors interpret the statistics based on their own expertise (and their own credibility) and then the ministers themselves choose how to tell the country based on all kinds of external imperatives - public order, popularity etc etc . I'm just as annoyed as you at how "Covid related" deaths are treated as "Covid deaths", and how somebody's age or health is disregarded once they test positive but to my mind this is just an incompetent Health Minister unwilling to tell the truth because he thinks people will walk away from the vaccination programme unless deaths are reported in thousands rather than hundreds. They feared a public backlash similar to that over MMR, when in fact they have caused one by over-egging the Covid death data. I still think Covid vaccination is vital, necessary and socially responsible- just as I would for MMR, TB, Polio and all the rest - some of which are almost eradicated. But as for China, Russia, and I hate to say, India, there is no level comparison. [Post edited 9 Nov 2021 11:23]
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| Third Covid Wave on 11:20 - Nov 9 with 1194 views | DorsetIan |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:03 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
Children simply don't require this vaccine Ian, they don't need it at all...it will serve no purpose medically other than to put them at risk of side effects or worse.
The vaccines don't stop transmission in any age group so thats a mute point too. |
That's your stated opinion and the global medical community seems to think differently.
I'll go with them. Like me, and unlike you, they believe that Covid is real and that vaccines are highly effective. Unlike you, I also believe in the essential honesty of the scientists and doctors involved. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 11:20 - Nov 9 with 1194 views | Sadoldgit |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:03 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
Children simply don't require this vaccine Ian, they don't need it at all...it will serve no purpose medically other than to put them at risk of side effects or worse.
The vaccines don't stop transmission in any age group so thats a mute point too. |
Where do you get that nonsense about vaccination not preventing transmission? Studies show that it does help to prevent transmission. | | | |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:31 - Nov 9 with 1189 views | saint68 |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:20 - Nov 9 by Sadoldgit |
Where do you get that nonsense about vaccination not preventing transmission? Studies show that it does help to prevent transmission. |
Greatest rates of transmission are in the most heavily vaccinated countries..First it was Israel.. then its now the US and UK..
UK current cases 1.6m
US 9181725
Unvaccinated deaths in all 3 of the above countries are lower by percentage than that of fully vaccinated..which in Israel is up to 4 jabs now for some citizens...
There are pills now..so stop the vaccinations and use the pills and reopen everything without fear of lockdowns or ridiculous passport schemes..which are so illogical its farcical..(I have a passport but I'm still a spreader basically) how fukin stupid was that concept. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 11:36 - Nov 9 with 1187 views | saint68 |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:15 - Nov 9 by GasGiant |
No not exactly Saint68 but thanks for remembering. The statistics from ONS are highly accurate - I know one of the directors and we've talked about some of the methods used and they are beyond reproach. However the Government's principal scientific advisors interpret the statistics based on their own expertise (and their own credibility) and then the ministers themselves choose how to tell the country based on all kinds of external imperatives - public order, popularity etc etc . I'm just as annoyed as you at how "Covid related" deaths are treated as "Covid deaths", and how somebody's age or health is disregarded once they test positive but to my mind this is just an incompetent Health Minister unwilling to tell the truth because he thinks people will walk away from the vaccination programme unless deaths are reported in thousands rather than hundreds. They feared a public backlash similar to that over MMR, when in fact they have caused one by over-egging the Covid death data. I still think Covid vaccination is vital, necessary and socially responsible- just as I would for MMR, TB, Polio and all the rest - some of which are almost eradicated. But as for China, Russia, and I hate to say, India, there is no level comparison. [Post edited 9 Nov 2021 11:23]
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Thanks GG, I can always trust in you to respond with honesty and integrity. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 11:41 - Nov 9 with 1181 views | saint68 |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:20 - Nov 9 by DorsetIan |
That's your stated opinion and the global medical community seems to think differently.
I'll go with them. Like me, and unlike you, they believe that Covid is real and that vaccines are highly effective. Unlike you, I also believe in the essential honesty of the scientists and doctors involved. |
Well the JVCI made it clear that they were against it .so why do you persist in wanting something they advised against? [Post edited 9 Nov 2021 11:42]
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| Third Covid Wave on 11:59 - Nov 9 with 1169 views | DorsetIan |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:31 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
Greatest rates of transmission are in the most heavily vaccinated countries..First it was Israel.. then its now the US and UK..
UK current cases 1.6m
US 9181725
Unvaccinated deaths in all 3 of the above countries are lower by percentage than that of fully vaccinated..which in Israel is up to 4 jabs now for some citizens...
There are pills now..so stop the vaccinations and use the pills and reopen everything without fear of lockdowns or ridiculous passport schemes..which are so illogical its farcical..(I have a passport but I'm still a spreader basically) how fukin stupid was that concept. |
"Unvaccinated deaths in all 3 of the above countries are lower by percentage than that of fully vaccinated"
As you would expect given that the vast majority are vaccinated.
You keep repeating the same misinformation. Infantile maths seems to be the best you've got. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 12:08 - Nov 9 with 1166 views | DorsetIan |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:41 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
Well the JVCI made it clear that they were against it .so why do you persist in wanting something they advised against? [Post edited 9 Nov 2021 11:42]
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You are only interesting in things which you think supports your prejudice. You demonstrate no objectivity.
Global medical opinion seems OK about vaccinating children. It's pretty clear. They are more honest and more objective than you could ever be. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 12:24 - Nov 9 with 1153 views | saint68 |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:59 - Nov 9 by DorsetIan |
"Unvaccinated deaths in all 3 of the above countries are lower by percentage than that of fully vaccinated"
As you would expect given that the vast majority are vaccinated.
You keep repeating the same misinformation. Infantile maths seems to be the best you've got. |
Covid cases are highest in the most vaccined countries ...low vaccine uptake countries have markedly less transmission..how dense are you | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 13:34 - Nov 9 with 1143 views | DorsetIan |
| Third Covid Wave on 12:24 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
Covid cases are highest in the most vaccined countries ...low vaccine uptake countries have markedly less transmission..how dense are you |
What, so the vaccine is causing Covid now?
I think you may be genuinely mad. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 13:52 - Nov 9 with 1135 views | saint68 |
| Third Covid Wave on 13:34 - Nov 9 by DorsetIan |
What, so the vaccine is causing Covid now?
I think you may be genuinely mad. |
We had this discussion about 8 weeks ago, it was shown that Israel at that point had an extremely high number of cases and hospitalisations ..I said at that point in time the UK and US would mirror that in the weeks to follow..and it has happened....on the bright side Israels situation has changed for the better of late and now transmission is far far lower.
No bullshìt Ian..just facts. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 14:13 - Nov 9 with 1130 views | DorsetIan |
| Third Covid Wave on 13:52 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
We had this discussion about 8 weeks ago, it was shown that Israel at that point had an extremely high number of cases and hospitalisations ..I said at that point in time the UK and US would mirror that in the weeks to follow..and it has happened....on the bright side Israels situation has changed for the better of late and now transmission is far far lower.
No bullshìt Ian..just facts. |
Covid is real
Scientists and doctors are honest and are working hard to protect us
Vaccines work
If all your waffle is meant to prove that this is 'utter bullshit' then please try harder because you're not even making a dent.
Have a lie down would be my advice to you. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 14:31 - Nov 9 with 1117 views | saint901 |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:31 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
Greatest rates of transmission are in the most heavily vaccinated countries..First it was Israel.. then its now the US and UK..
UK current cases 1.6m
US 9181725
Unvaccinated deaths in all 3 of the above countries are lower by percentage than that of fully vaccinated..which in Israel is up to 4 jabs now for some citizens...
There are pills now..so stop the vaccinations and use the pills and reopen everything without fear of lockdowns or ridiculous passport schemes..which are so illogical its farcical..(I have a passport but I'm still a spreader basically) how fukin stupid was that concept. |
By the logic of this post, vaccination causes infections to rise?
I think the studies show that vaccinated people carry a lower virus load than unvaccinated and the logic therefore is that they are less likely to be a vector of the disease.
On the vaccination of children issue, this is voluntary. Further, the under 16's will have the final decision made for them by their parents/guardians. Some teenagers will have a greater influence upon that decision than others, but shouting at them over the school fence is targeting the wrong group.
I think there has been a fair degree of incompetence in Gov'y handling of the situation, messaging, use of scientific data for political purposes etc, and that we could and should be angry about that. However this is a real disease that is a danger to a significant part of our society and those of us privileged to be not in that part, have an obligation and responsibility toward them.
By all means be angry at how this has been handled, but don't think that every adverse thing that happens is because of Covid or is part of a conspiracy. | | | |
| Third Covid Wave on 14:38 - Nov 9 with 1106 views | Sadoldgit |
| Third Covid Wave on 11:31 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
Greatest rates of transmission are in the most heavily vaccinated countries..First it was Israel.. then its now the US and UK..
UK current cases 1.6m
US 9181725
Unvaccinated deaths in all 3 of the above countries are lower by percentage than that of fully vaccinated..which in Israel is up to 4 jabs now for some citizens...
There are pills now..so stop the vaccinations and use the pills and reopen everything without fear of lockdowns or ridiculous passport schemes..which are so illogical its farcical..(I have a passport but I'm still a spreader basically) how fukin stupid was that concept. |
Why are you so pro pills but anti vaccines? Surely it is easier to hide microchips or what ever else it is you are afraid of in a pill! A pill is a bunch of chemicals just as the vaccines are. What makes one acceptable and one not? | | | |
| Third Covid Wave on 15:27 - Nov 9 with 1082 views | saint68 |
| Third Covid Wave on 14:38 - Nov 9 by Sadoldgit |
Why are you so pro pills but anti vaccines? Surely it is easier to hide microchips or what ever else it is you are afraid of in a pill! A pill is a bunch of chemicals just as the vaccines are. What makes one acceptable and one not? |
The pill renders the vaccines redundant...life goes back to normal
No lockdowns
No mental health issues from the above
No GP or NHS backlogs for years and years to come
No economic derailment from more lockdowns or regulations/legislation
No passports
No kids being subjected to a vaccine they don't even require
You get ill you take the pill.
Life returns to normal..its not that hard to understand why I see these pills as a Hallelujah moment.
Well my intention was to get this thread to at least 30000..
And now I'm bowing out. | |
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| Third Covid Wave on 16:05 - Nov 9 with 1059 views | Poirot |
Big problems in numerous european countries and i expect that will again come to us at the end of the month into december. Anyone with a brain cell should be wearing a mask where possible esp if you have school kids. |  | | |
| Third Covid Wave on 16:07 - Nov 9 with 1061 views | Sadoldgit |
| Third Covid Wave on 15:27 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
The pill renders the vaccines redundant...life goes back to normal
No lockdowns
No mental health issues from the above
No GP or NHS backlogs for years and years to come
No economic derailment from more lockdowns or regulations/legislation
No passports
No kids being subjected to a vaccine they don't even require
You get ill you take the pill.
Life returns to normal..its not that hard to understand why I see these pills as a Hallelujah moment.
Well my intention was to get this thread to at least 30000..
And now I'm bowing out. |
You haven’t answered my question. Why do you support a pill and not a vaccine? The only dirtence between them is one is solid and one is liquid. | | | |
| Third Covid Wave on 19:20 - Nov 9 with 980 views | Bison |
| Third Covid Wave on 16:07 - Nov 9 by Sadoldgit |
You haven’t answered my question. Why do you support a pill and not a vaccine? The only dirtence between them is one is solid and one is liquid. |
Perhaps a Sugar Cube is the answer ? |  |
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| Third Covid Wave on 04:28 - Nov 10 with 914 views | Jellybaby |
| Third Covid Wave on 15:27 - Nov 9 by saint68 |
The pill renders the vaccines redundant...life goes back to normal
No lockdowns
No mental health issues from the above
No GP or NHS backlogs for years and years to come
No economic derailment from more lockdowns or regulations/legislation
No passports
No kids being subjected to a vaccine they don't even require
You get ill you take the pill.
Life returns to normal..its not that hard to understand why I see these pills as a Hallelujah moment.
Well my intention was to get this thread to at least 30000..
And now I'm bowing out. |
Oh no, don't leave me with this cacophony of covid compliance!
You have been a real tour de force on here when the only question most people are asking is how high should I jump. | |
| I wholly disapprove of what you say and will defend to the death your right to say it. |
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| Third Covid Wave on 05:05 - Nov 10 with 910 views | Jellybaby |
| Third Covid Wave on 14:13 - Nov 9 by DorsetIan |
Covid is real
Scientists and doctors are honest and are working hard to protect us
Vaccines work
If all your waffle is meant to prove that this is 'utter bullshit' then please try harder because you're not even making a dent.
Have a lie down would be my advice to you. |
Your posts have lacked nuance all the way through this thread -" I'm right and the sceptics are nutters". This sledgehammer approach will never convince your opponents., so I am not sure what you are trying to achieve other than to be agent of Covid conformity and to push a totalitarian agenda.
Your latest mantra is typical of your approach;
Covid is real
Scientists and doctors are honest and are working hard to protect us
Vaccines work
Covid is real - yes there has been a nasty respiratory illness, but the reaction has been hysterical and we will take a generation probably to recover mentally, emotionally and financially from the extreme draconian measures brought in when focussed protection for the vulnerable would have served us so much better.
Scientists and doctors are honest and are working hard to protect us - Of course most are honest and hard working, but some are probably dishonest and some are lazy. Some scientists and doctors are covid sceptics, some of these have been "cancelled", some have spoken out and lost their job or their funding, some have been warned to keep quiet or risk losing their position and income.
Vaccines work - presumably you mean the covid jab - Maybe they work, maybe they don't - we always had to get to herd immunity. Vaccinating young people who have virtually no chance of dying from covid does not pass the logic test if we are honest. The coercion around the jab continues to be divisive and is leading to a medical apartheid. | |
| I wholly disapprove of what you say and will defend to the death your right to say it. |
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| Third Covid Wave on 07:35 - Nov 10 with 878 views | cocklebreath |
| Third Covid Wave on 16:05 - Nov 9 by Poirot |
Big problems in numerous european countries and i expect that will again come to us at the end of the month into december. Anyone with a brain cell should be wearing a mask where possible esp if you have school kids. |
They are behind us, we’re through this wave and with boosters speeding up and over 80% of kids having had covid we are not going to be following them. The media’s scaremongering lately has been ridiculous, the BBC has turned into the Daily Express |  |
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| Third Covid Wave on 07:42 - Nov 10 with 873 views | DorsetIan |
| Third Covid Wave on 05:05 - Nov 10 by Jellybaby |
Your posts have lacked nuance all the way through this thread -" I'm right and the sceptics are nutters". This sledgehammer approach will never convince your opponents., so I am not sure what you are trying to achieve other than to be agent of Covid conformity and to push a totalitarian agenda.
Your latest mantra is typical of your approach;
Covid is real
Scientists and doctors are honest and are working hard to protect us
Vaccines work
Covid is real - yes there has been a nasty respiratory illness, but the reaction has been hysterical and we will take a generation probably to recover mentally, emotionally and financially from the extreme draconian measures brought in when focussed protection for the vulnerable would have served us so much better.
Scientists and doctors are honest and are working hard to protect us - Of course most are honest and hard working, but some are probably dishonest and some are lazy. Some scientists and doctors are covid sceptics, some of these have been "cancelled", some have spoken out and lost their job or their funding, some have been warned to keep quiet or risk losing their position and income.
Vaccines work - presumably you mean the covid jab - Maybe they work, maybe they don't - we always had to get to herd immunity. Vaccinating young people who have virtually no chance of dying from covid does not pass the logic test if we are honest. The coercion around the jab continues to be divisive and is leading to a medical apartheid. |
My point in repeating those three statements is that they are right at the heart of everything any sensible person believes about Covid, and yet your erstwhile colleague 68 described them as 'utter bullshit'.
You have now provided some kind of mealy-mouthed acknowledgement of the truth of those statements but with your usual caveats.
No caveats are required.
Covid is real and a serious global problem - nobody is over-egging it.
Not all scientists are perfect, but the vast vast majority are honest and trying to help us.
They have developed a vaccine which is saving livings.
The only way you step outside this completely uncontroversial view is if you believe that there is something else going on. Some global conspiracy persuading us that Covid is more serious than it is. Some global conspiracy forcing scientists to do dishonest things which may harm us. Some global conspiracy forcing us to manufacture and take vaccines that we don't nee.
There is no global conspiracy. There are just imperfect people going about their business, but the truth remains:
Covid is real
Scientists are honest
Vaccines work | |
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