| Garry Monk...... on 19:43 - Mar 28 with 1645 views | jack247 |
| Garry Monk...... on 19:21 - Mar 28 by Davillin |
Now that's several posters who praised Monk for his "won more games" season, while ignoring the next season when he brought us so close to relegation that, after Guidolin's and Curtis' stellar work, we're still not out of danger.
Nor do those same posters point out that in the "big" season, he used players and tactics that he inherited from a line of managers who built it, but almost took us down using his own preferred players and radically changed tactics.
"Apples and oranges" as a shorthand for "bad comparison" needs to be replaced with "Monk's big season" and "Monk's near disaster."
And I cannot be accused of not liking Monk or being biased against him.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinions, but no-one is entitled to his own facts." |
I don't think the people making that argument have realised he played a similar game to his four predecessors for the majority of that season.
I personally do like Monk, far more than Laudrup or Rodgers, just because of what he gave us as a player and the connection he had with the club. Doesn't change the fact he changed our style of play and it didn't work though. |  | |  |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:04 - Mar 28 with 1609 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Garry Monk...... on 18:06 - Mar 28 by Drizzy |
No he didn't. He kept, or wanted to keep, the good players. De Guzman was never ours, Hernandez always struggled with injuries and f*cked off to get a retirement payday, Chico surprisingly took the easy option and an early retirement payday and I believe he was in Monk's plans.
There are plenty of legitimate criticisms of Monk. There's no need to create a false narrative and make him a scapegoat for the club's decline this season. I'm certainly not going to lick the arse of those who unfairly criticised him from the moment he was appointed and claimed they were right all along when things turned sour. Nauseating d*cks, the lot of them. |
Hahahaha I thought you said Chico was sh*t! But because he was in Monk's plans he's now good enough again.
DeGuzman was Canadian too.
At least us nauseating dicks are f*cking consistent mate. |  |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:08 - Mar 28 with 1597 views | Drizzy |
| Garry Monk...... on 19:21 - Mar 28 by Davillin |
Now that's several posters who praised Monk for his "won more games" season, while ignoring the next season when he brought us so close to relegation that, after Guidolin's and Curtis' stellar work, we're still not out of danger.
Nor do those same posters point out that in the "big" season, he used players and tactics that he inherited from a line of managers who built it, but almost took us down using his own preferred players and radically changed tactics.
"Apples and oranges" as a shorthand for "bad comparison" needs to be replaced with "Monk's big season" and "Monk's near disaster."
And I cannot be accused of not liking Monk or being biased against him.
"Everyone is entitled to his own opinions, but no-one is entitled to his own facts." |
He didn't inherit any tactics in his "big" season. He had been working as de facto manager for months before the start of 14/15 and the squad lost several key players the summer before that season. That was his team so it's completely obtuse to discredit him for that season.
We had to change our style of play because everything revolved around Bony. The whole attack was built around him and when he left we didn't have an adequate replacement. Gomis conned us into believing he was good but Monk was changing his tactics based on a change in personnel.
He failed the only player brought in last summer that had any kind of impact was Ayew and even he disrupts the chemistry of the team. He didn't commit to either the 4-5-1 or the diamond formation and so we had a squad that didn't really suit either. |  |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:09 - Mar 28 with 1591 views | vetchonian |
| Garry Monk...... on 19:43 - Mar 28 by jack247 |
I don't think the people making that argument have realised he played a similar game to his four predecessors for the majority of that season.
I personally do like Monk, far more than Laudrup or Rodgers, just because of what he gave us as a player and the connection he had with the club. Doesn't change the fact he changed our style of play and it didn't work though. |
Isn't it time we stopped looking back and looked forwards.
All our previous managers contributed to success along on our journey,as well as having part in our recent " demise".
The board or our "Director of Football" has a piece of the blame too. Why can't we stop looking back w e can't can't change what has happened .
Yes Laudrup gave us our cup win and foray into Europe .....some great moments of football BUT he lost his way ,Monk restored some pride and gave us a our highest league finish BUT was out of his depth with no proper support HJ should have insisted on a better no2 but it's all history now.
Priority is retain PL status and then ensure next season we do not find ourselves in a Villa, Newcastle or Sunderalnd scenario.we can all pontificate for hours on the whys and wherefores but it aintgoingto change what happened let's hope our board get it right this summer. | |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:11 - Mar 28 with 1586 views | Drizzy |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:04 - Mar 28 by Brynmill_Jack |
Hahahaha I thought you said Chico was sh*t! But because he was in Monk's plans he's now good enough again.
DeGuzman was Canadian too.
At least us nauseating dicks are f*cking consistent mate. |
Unless you're actually implying that Garry Monk had an agenda against Spaniards I thought it would be more pertinent to discuss players that were brought in by and because of Laudrup. Nationality has nothing to do with and it's a lazy and childish tool to bash Monk with. Par for the course with you, mind.
I've never stated Chico was sh*t stop with the straw men. He was an average defender with good technical ability. Never anywhere near good enough for the Spain squad as some would suggest. | |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:12 - Mar 28 with 1579 views | JJJack |
| Garry Monk...... on 22:25 - Mar 27 by Brynmill_Jack |
Monk's intransigence could have sent us into a Leeds style freefall if it had been left unchecked.
The way he stabbed Laudrup in the back quoting the "erosion of the club's footballing philosophy" and then proceeded to wreck everything we had built over the years, including a much admired (worldwide) footballing style has nothing to do with improving year on year ad infinitum. How ridiculously out of context your post is , as well as being deliberatley obtuse. |
Yawn, keep spouting your bile as you usually do. "Stabbed in the back", "Leeds style freefall" , "admired worldwide".
How ridiculously out of context your post is BJ. |  | | |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:19 - Mar 28 with 1561 views | Starsky |
| Garry Monk...... on 17:56 - Mar 28 by exiledclaseboy |
Ooh Phil, you were so right all along.
Was he bollocks. Nauseating. |
It does sound nauseating when I read it back.
Unfortunately, Monk turned into a right Kant didn't he? |  |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:21 - Mar 28 with 1551 views | jack247 |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:09 - Mar 28 by vetchonian |
Isn't it time we stopped looking back and looked forwards.
All our previous managers contributed to success along on our journey,as well as having part in our recent " demise".
The board or our "Director of Football" has a piece of the blame too. Why can't we stop looking back w e can't can't change what has happened .
Yes Laudrup gave us our cup win and foray into Europe .....some great moments of football BUT he lost his way ,Monk restored some pride and gave us a our highest league finish BUT was out of his depth with no proper support HJ should have insisted on a better no2 but it's all history now.
Priority is retain PL status and then ensure next season we do not find ourselves in a Villa, Newcastle or Sunderalnd scenario.we can all pontificate for hours on the whys and wherefores but it aintgoingto change what happened let's hope our board get it right this summer. |
Good comment in all fairness | | | |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:22 - Mar 28 with 1550 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:19 - Mar 28 by Starsky |
It does sound nauseating when I read it back.
Unfortunately, Monk turned into a right Kant didn't he? |
First sentence - yes it does. Man up.
Second sentence - no. He was a football manager who made mistakes which ultimately and rightly cost him his job. Why that has to lead to you or anyone else abusing one of our longest serving and most successful players as well as a successful manager in that way is completely beyond me. And beneath you. [Post edited 28 Mar 2016 20:23]
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:29 - Mar 28 with 1528 views | Starsky |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:22 - Mar 28 by exiledclaseboy |
First sentence - yes it does. Man up.
Second sentence - no. He was a football manager who made mistakes which ultimately and rightly cost him his job. Why that has to lead to you or anyone else abusing one of our longest serving and most successful players as well as a successful manager in that way is completely beyond me. And beneath you. [Post edited 28 Mar 2016 20:23]
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It was because, he more than anyone knew what this club was all about and despite this, slowly started dismantling it, player by player. Tactic by tactic.
He knew it all and pushed Curtis into the background at the expense of the likes of KOL dfs.
He fecking blew it by turning down help at Huw's suggestion and his ego eventually was his undoing.
He's probably about £3million better off now too. | |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:39 - Mar 28 with 1507 views | vetchonian |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:29 - Mar 28 by Starsky |
It was because, he more than anyone knew what this club was all about and despite this, slowly started dismantling it, player by player. Tactic by tactic.
He knew it all and pushed Curtis into the background at the expense of the likes of KOL dfs.
He fecking blew it by turning down help at Huw's suggestion and his ego eventually was his undoing.
He's probably about £3million better off now too. |
Which shows how HJ lost the plot. When Brendan and Laudrup were appointed Curt (along with Pascoe originally) came as a condition of employment .....so what changed ? Did this then give Garry delusions of grandeur.
We will never know but he doesn't deserve some of the vitriol he now receives,BUT let's all move on and look forwards and hope this summer we get it right or next season we could be in Newcastles shoes or at worst Villa's then we will have something to be upset about. | |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:50 - Mar 28 with 1492 views | swancity |
Monk was appointed Manager at a time when we were sliding down the league and immediately saw a huge improvement
His next and only full season, and this is important, saw us finish in 8th position with 56 points. We started the current season incredibly well but by October, our results were poor and our style of play had changed.
He lost his job. It was a difficult but arguably right decision.
But, his situation just summed up the precarious world of professional football management as he went from being a potential England manager to not being good enough to lead a side in League Two, in the opinion of some. The truth is this. He is a bright, intelligent, strong minded individual with vast experience in all four divisions. He is a natural leader of men with a hard working mentality and honesty who will come back stronger from his experiences and I wouldn't mind betting that he will do well at a Championship club next and take them up.
The absolute crap that I have just read about a legendary Ex Swan astounds me. All Monk has done is work hard for our Club. Making good and bad decisions along the way. As do all managers. The loss of Bony was his main down fall. At least not adequately being able to replace him.
Best of luck in the future YJB | |
| Only an idiot would eat a turkey curry on Christmas day |
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| Garry Monk...... on 20:54 - Mar 28 with 1485 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:50 - Mar 28 by swancity |
Monk was appointed Manager at a time when we were sliding down the league and immediately saw a huge improvement
His next and only full season, and this is important, saw us finish in 8th position with 56 points. We started the current season incredibly well but by October, our results were poor and our style of play had changed.
He lost his job. It was a difficult but arguably right decision.
But, his situation just summed up the precarious world of professional football management as he went from being a potential England manager to not being good enough to lead a side in League Two, in the opinion of some. The truth is this. He is a bright, intelligent, strong minded individual with vast experience in all four divisions. He is a natural leader of men with a hard working mentality and honesty who will come back stronger from his experiences and I wouldn't mind betting that he will do well at a Championship club next and take them up.
The absolute crap that I have just read about a legendary Ex Swan astounds me. All Monk has done is work hard for our Club. Making good and bad decisions along the way. As do all managers. The loss of Bony was his main down fall. At least not adequately being able to replace him.
Best of luck in the future YJB |
What he said. | |
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| Garry Monk...... on 21:03 - Mar 28 with 1462 views | raynor94 |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:50 - Mar 28 by swancity |
Monk was appointed Manager at a time when we were sliding down the league and immediately saw a huge improvement
His next and only full season, and this is important, saw us finish in 8th position with 56 points. We started the current season incredibly well but by October, our results were poor and our style of play had changed.
He lost his job. It was a difficult but arguably right decision.
But, his situation just summed up the precarious world of professional football management as he went from being a potential England manager to not being good enough to lead a side in League Two, in the opinion of some. The truth is this. He is a bright, intelligent, strong minded individual with vast experience in all four divisions. He is a natural leader of men with a hard working mentality and honesty who will come back stronger from his experiences and I wouldn't mind betting that he will do well at a Championship club next and take them up.
The absolute crap that I have just read about a legendary Ex Swan astounds me. All Monk has done is work hard for our Club. Making good and bad decisions along the way. As do all managers. The loss of Bony was his main down fall. At least not adequately being able to replace him.
Best of luck in the future YJB |
Excellent post |  |
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| Garry Monk...... on 21:17 - Mar 28 with 1431 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:22 - Mar 28 by exiledclaseboy |
First sentence - yes it does. Man up.
Second sentence - no. He was a football manager who made mistakes which ultimately and rightly cost him his job. Why that has to lead to you or anyone else abusing one of our longest serving and most successful players as well as a successful manager in that way is completely beyond me. And beneath you. [Post edited 28 Mar 2016 20:23]
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Most respected and long serving player yes. 60 million pound block? Absolutely.
But you judge a manager by his successes but also his failures. The shape he left us in allows people to justly criticize him. His last few weeks were a kick in the teeth to the club that gave HIM a fair bit too. | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Garry Monk...... on 21:23 - Mar 28 with 1423 views | swancity |
| Garry Monk...... on 21:17 - Mar 28 by Brynmill_Jack |
Most respected and long serving player yes. 60 million pound block? Absolutely.
But you judge a manager by his successes but also his failures. The shape he left us in allows people to justly criticize him. His last few weeks were a kick in the teeth to the club that gave HIM a fair bit too. |
Personally I believe that we would have stayed up if Monk was allowed to continue but can understand why the change was made. Our position wasn't as disastrous as you seem to be implying. Certainly a few months of poor results cannot detract from 12 years of incredible service and 18 months as a manager when he and our Club excelled. | |
| Only an idiot would eat a turkey curry on Christmas day |
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| Garry Monk...... on 21:36 - Mar 28 with 1404 views | Kilkennyjack |
| Garry Monk...... on 21:23 - Mar 28 by swancity |
Personally I believe that we would have stayed up if Monk was allowed to continue but can understand why the change was made. Our position wasn't as disastrous as you seem to be implying. Certainly a few months of poor results cannot detract from 12 years of incredible service and 18 months as a manager when he and our Club excelled. |
We would have gone down if Monk had stayed in charge. Sir Huwbert had to act. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Garry Monk...... on 21:56 - Mar 28 with 1366 views | swancity |
| Garry Monk...... on 21:36 - Mar 28 by Kilkennyjack |
We would have gone down if Monk had stayed in charge. Sir Huwbert had to act. |
May be. May be not. It's only your opinion. We will never know. That may be a source of frustration to Monk especially given his previous ability to turn around our fortunes when results weren't good enough ie when he first took over. We all know though that results almost always improve initially when a new manager arrives. And that's happened again. | |
| Only an idiot would eat a turkey curry on Christmas day |
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| Garry Monk...... on 22:07 - Mar 28 with 1340 views | jasper_T |
"All Monk has done is work hard for our Club"
Someone hasn't read Garry's book. | | | |
| Garry Monk...... on 23:09 - Mar 28 with 1276 views | Davillin |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:29 - Mar 28 by Starsky |
It was because, he more than anyone knew what this club was all about and despite this, slowly started dismantling it, player by player. Tactic by tactic.
He knew it all and pushed Curtis into the background at the expense of the likes of KOL dfs.
He fecking blew it by turning down help at Huw's suggestion and his ego eventually was his undoing.
He's probably about £3million better off now too. |
Right on the button. |  |
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| Garry Monk...... on 23:15 - Mar 28 with 1265 views | Davillin |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:39 - Mar 28 by vetchonian |
Which shows how HJ lost the plot. When Brendan and Laudrup were appointed Curt (along with Pascoe originally) came as a condition of employment .....so what changed ? Did this then give Garry delusions of grandeur.
We will never know but he doesn't deserve some of the vitriol he now receives,BUT let's all move on and look forwards and hope this summer we get it right or next season we could be in Newcastles shoes or at worst Villa's then we will have something to be upset about. |
It's strange how two people can look at the same thing and come to two different conclusions.
"Which shows how HJ lost the plot." Huw did almost the same things he did with his previous managers, to the best of our view of that "inside" story. It's Monk who lost the plot, which, I believe no-one can deny, as has been repeatedly pointed out with clarity.
"...he doesn't deserve some of the vitriol he now receives." What you see as "vitriol," I see as remarkably objective analysis" over all. | |
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| Garry Monk...... on 23:20 - Mar 28 with 1245 views | Brynmill_Jack |
| Garry Monk...... on 21:56 - Mar 28 by swancity |
May be. May be not. It's only your opinion. We will never know. That may be a source of frustration to Monk especially given his previous ability to turn around our fortunes when results weren't good enough ie when he first took over. We all know though that results almost always improve initially when a new manager arrives. And that's happened again. |
TINFOIL HAT ALERT!!!!!! | |
| Each time I go to Bedd - au........................ |
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| Garry Monk...... on 23:25 - Mar 28 with 1237 views | Davillin |
| Garry Monk...... on 20:08 - Mar 28 by Drizzy |
He didn't inherit any tactics in his "big" season. He had been working as de facto manager for months before the start of 14/15 and the squad lost several key players the summer before that season. That was his team so it's completely obtuse to discredit him for that season.
We had to change our style of play because everything revolved around Bony. The whole attack was built around him and when he left we didn't have an adequate replacement. Gomis conned us into believing he was good but Monk was changing his tactics based on a change in personnel.
He failed the only player brought in last summer that had any kind of impact was Ayew and even he disrupts the chemistry of the team. He didn't commit to either the 4-5-1 or the diamond formation and so we had a squad that didn't really suit either. |
Why is it that some posters, like yourself, need to treat a differing opinion as requiring name-calling and deprecation.
Regarding that sentence, then, it cannot be seen as "obtuse" when the clearest evidence -- pointed out on here by several -- that he sat several of our best players for about half-a-season so that he could play his preferred players. Nor can it be gainsaid that those preferred players didn't have the stuff and were largely, if not completely, responsible for the crash. Nor can it be gainsaid that first Curt, then Guidolin, restored them to the first team, along with dumping his tactics and returning to our years-long way.
It is not "obtuse" to differ.
Well, perhaps I can comfort myself with your not using vulgarity to show my inferiority. Thanks for that. | |
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| Garry Monk...... on 23:56 - Mar 28 with 1201 views | Drizzy |
| Garry Monk...... on 23:25 - Mar 28 by Davillin |
Why is it that some posters, like yourself, need to treat a differing opinion as requiring name-calling and deprecation.
Regarding that sentence, then, it cannot be seen as "obtuse" when the clearest evidence -- pointed out on here by several -- that he sat several of our best players for about half-a-season so that he could play his preferred players. Nor can it be gainsaid that those preferred players didn't have the stuff and were largely, if not completely, responsible for the crash. Nor can it be gainsaid that first Curt, then Guidolin, restored them to the first team, along with dumping his tactics and returning to our years-long way.
It is not "obtuse" to differ.
Well, perhaps I can comfort myself with your not using vulgarity to show my inferiority. Thanks for that. |
You're a pompous arse, Tone. Some posters have the decency to be overt with their insults rather than resorting to patronising sanctimony.
Who exactly did he sit? Britton? Monk dropped him for Cork who was playing well. Other core players like Rangel are past their best and should only be used as backups. Anyway, you have completely failed to address any specific points about football in my post. All you're doing is talking in abstract terms of "preferred players" who "didn't have the stuff". What does that even mean?
I'll happily engage with a response from you that discusses the failure to replace Bony, the problems with relying on Taylor and Naughton to provide width in the diamond or why he alienated Gylfi for the sake of Shelvey. I won't hold my breath, mind.
Stick to gridiron and graphs, Anthony. | |
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| Garry Monk...... on 00:38 - Mar 29 with 1166 views | UplandsJack |
| Garry Monk...... on 22:07 - Mar 28 by jasper_T |
"All Monk has done is work hard for our Club"
Someone hasn't read Garry's book. |
Spot on!!!
People go on about GM as a legend but why?
He spent a fair amount of time on the injury table.
Yes we are all grateful for "that block", though had Taylor not got his red i doubt he'd even have played as he'd been out of the team with a back injury if memory serves es me right...
Let's not forget he was a back-stabbing, self centered player. He admitted as much in his own book. Then did the same to Laudrup not once, but twice. He even feigned injury to avoid going on loan to brizzle city as he feared Laudrup would never have him back. (told me this himself)
No he was a solid long serving player who made a good living and lived the dream of getting to / playing in the Premier League when probably his skill/ ability wasn't at that level. I don't begrudge him that, but to call him a legend after playing just 260 games and scoring 7 goals over 11 years is a joke and frankly insulting to those that really are. #Curtis. # Britton [Post edited 29 Mar 2016 1:05]
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