Lotto News on 15:16 - May 23 with 2484 views | kel |
Lotto News on 15:05 - May 23 by Reedy | The few supporters who go out in all weathers to collect money from their members. We don’t do it for the money or the discontinued season ticket (as nice as these are) we do it out of love of the club. |
So those supporters are more loyal than other supporters then? | | | |
Lotto News on 15:55 - May 23 with 2417 views | Reedy |
Lotto News on 15:16 - May 23 by kel | So those supporters are more loyal than other supporters then? |
No, but those supporters deserve to be treated with respect by the club, something they most certainly aren’t. They go above and beyond week in, week out, and look at the thanks they get. | |
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Lotto News on 16:05 - May 23 with 2387 views | kel |
Lotto News on 15:55 - May 23 by Reedy | No, but those supporters deserve to be treated with respect by the club, something they most certainly aren’t. They go above and beyond week in, week out, and look at the thanks they get. |
I don’t disagree but your original point seemed to suggest they were more loyal than others but maybe I misread it. A Rochdale supporter is a Rochdale supporter irrespective of what they do or don’t do for the club. There is sometimes a snobbery on this board towards other supporters if they don’t attend as many games as others or they don’t do this, that or the other to help the club (not accusing you of that here by the way). I could reel off a list of people who think they are better fans than others for some bizarre reason when they are in fact no more or less important than anybody else. | | | |
Lotto News on 16:12 - May 23 with 2358 views | judd |
Lotto News on 16:05 - May 23 by kel | I don’t disagree but your original point seemed to suggest they were more loyal than others but maybe I misread it. A Rochdale supporter is a Rochdale supporter irrespective of what they do or don’t do for the club. There is sometimes a snobbery on this board towards other supporters if they don’t attend as many games as others or they don’t do this, that or the other to help the club (not accusing you of that here by the way). I could reel off a list of people who think they are better fans than others for some bizarre reason when they are in fact no more or less important than anybody else. |
It's just emotive language, Kel. Hopefully we won't lose sight of the real issues here. | |
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Lotto News on 16:22 - May 23 with 2337 views | kel |
Lotto News on 16:12 - May 23 by judd | It's just emotive language, Kel. Hopefully we won't lose sight of the real issues here. |
Aye, fair enough. | | | |
Lotto News on 16:22 - May 23 with 2337 views | Reedy |
Lotto News on 16:05 - May 23 by kel | I don’t disagree but your original point seemed to suggest they were more loyal than others but maybe I misread it. A Rochdale supporter is a Rochdale supporter irrespective of what they do or don’t do for the club. There is sometimes a snobbery on this board towards other supporters if they don’t attend as many games as others or they don’t do this, that or the other to help the club (not accusing you of that here by the way). I could reel off a list of people who think they are better fans than others for some bizarre reason when they are in fact no more or less important than anybody else. |
Not at all. It was more of a point that agents are amongst the most committed and crazy within our supporter base. I certainly don’t think I’m a better supporter than anyone else, but as I said above I except all agents to be treated with respect, which we haven’t. That’s the reason I’m so angry at the club! | |
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Lotto News on 16:29 - May 23 with 2328 views | kel |
Lotto News on 16:22 - May 23 by Reedy | Not at all. It was more of a point that agents are amongst the most committed and crazy within our supporter base. I certainly don’t think I’m a better supporter than anyone else, but as I said above I except all agents to be treated with respect, which we haven’t. That’s the reason I’m so angry at the club! |
Agree about the lack of respect. To read about it on here before receiving proper notification doesn’t reflect well on the club at all. Whoever made that decision has fooked up big time. I have nothing but respect for the agents as I certainly couldn’t find the time to do it and they/you deserve better than how it has come out. One would hope the club could at least apologise for that if no other goodwill gesture is forthcoming. | | | |
Lotto News on 17:46 - May 23 with 2266 views | Statzdale |
Lotto News on 16:29 - May 23 by kel | Agree about the lack of respect. To read about it on here before receiving proper notification doesn’t reflect well on the club at all. Whoever made that decision has fooked up big time. I have nothing but respect for the agents as I certainly couldn’t find the time to do it and they/you deserve better than how it has come out. One would hope the club could at least apologise for that if no other goodwill gesture is forthcoming. |
Unfortunately Kel to get an apology you have to have done something wrong. In the clubs opinion they probably think they have done nothing wrong | | | | Login to get fewer ads
Lotto News on 18:22 - May 23 with 2230 views | RAFCBLUE |
Lotto News on 14:10 - May 23 by judd | I've received nothing, neither. I will be visiting all my customers this week with a copy of the website article just to make sure they have contact from the club. I should imagine I will be capable of social distancing as I explain why the club thinks so little of us and them. These customers have been besieged with requests to switch to DD and they have steadfastly refused to budge. I suppose the shoddy removal of the collector will now see them fill in mandates in their droves. Hiding behind the pandemic is a pathetic act of cowardice by the instigator in all this. Someone mentioned the Trust earlier. Just 6 months ago the Trust issued lengthy and detailed minutes of a meeting with the club about the lottery. I am baffled by the silence of the Trust on this issue, not even an acknowledgement of the decision and that they intend/do not intend to respond. |
The club have lost the ability to communicate the message as well, judd. Each collector will present their view on what has happened but as an advert for the club it's a bad do. Either the subscriber will have read the website and will ask for some more details or more likely, not have seen anything about it and be left, well puzzled. The irony is that should the subscriber want to convert to a standing order then save for The Trust being AWOL on this issue is a bit shocking really given the February announcement which ends: "We are aware that many trust members are agents of the Dale Lotto and many other fans are agents too, and most walk the streets each week collecting the weekly income, at no time do we want to detract from those valiant few that do this and do not wish to take any patrons away from them, but if your new to the scheme or need to change for whatever reason then the Dale Trust will arrange for you to join." https://www.daletrust.co.uk/2020/02/dale-lotto-news-for-agents/ What is the Trust for if it isn't for things like this? | |
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Lotto News on 19:00 - May 23 with 2188 views | kel |
Lotto News on 18:22 - May 23 by RAFCBLUE | The club have lost the ability to communicate the message as well, judd. Each collector will present their view on what has happened but as an advert for the club it's a bad do. Either the subscriber will have read the website and will ask for some more details or more likely, not have seen anything about it and be left, well puzzled. The irony is that should the subscriber want to convert to a standing order then save for The Trust being AWOL on this issue is a bit shocking really given the February announcement which ends: "We are aware that many trust members are agents of the Dale Lotto and many other fans are agents too, and most walk the streets each week collecting the weekly income, at no time do we want to detract from those valiant few that do this and do not wish to take any patrons away from them, but if your new to the scheme or need to change for whatever reason then the Dale Trust will arrange for you to join." https://www.daletrust.co.uk/2020/02/dale-lotto-news-for-agents/ What is the Trust for if it isn't for things like this? |
With the current Covid situation I’d imagine it’s quite difficult for the trust board to all be available at the same time to have some kind of meeting online to discuss this. Without wanting to look like a trust apologist I’m fairly certain they are aware of the situation and will be busy deciding how to approach the issue. Let’s give them a chance eh? | | | |
Lotto News on 19:14 - May 23 with 2164 views | judd |
Lotto News on 19:00 - May 23 by kel | With the current Covid situation I’d imagine it’s quite difficult for the trust board to all be available at the same time to have some kind of meeting online to discuss this. Without wanting to look like a trust apologist I’m fairly certain they are aware of the situation and will be busy deciding how to approach the issue. Let’s give them a chance eh? |
You make a very fair point about a detailed response Kel. But a brief note to state the situation is or isn't being considered would be useful, given the work done 6 months ago in addressing agents concerns with the club back then. | |
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Lotto News on 19:17 - May 23 with 2163 views | dawlishdale | I'd hope that the person who has made this error of judgement (at best) is brought to task by the Trust, but unless members actually contact them directly, the old excuse of "we can't act on messageboard information alone" will come to the fore. It's well known that the CEO reads this board avidly, together with several Trust Board members, some of whom post on here. I'd imagine the CEO is shaking his head in disbelief at what he believes is a non story; trouble shaken up by the usual few who dislike him.....well it's worse than that. It's a serious question being raised on your abilities to make timely decisions, and communicate them in the correct manner, and with every poorly administered decision , the numbers of people who have concerns regarding your actions are growing. I'd guess that, unless action is taken within the next few days, the Lotto will be dead within a year, and the club will have lost the goodwill of many longstanding agents, and a valuable connection with the community it is supposed to serve. All this at a time when we need each and every person in the area to be fully behind the club, and willing to help in any way they can. I feel sorry for the agents, and also for the people who worked so damned hard to set up what was once one of the most successful lotteries in the country. Their legacy has been squandered away. I've cancelled my membership, and suspect many others will do the same. | | | |
Lotto News on 19:34 - May 23 with 2130 views | 442Dale | In response to points made, this was posted elsewhere recently: <<Fully expect the Trust to both share thoughts around issues brought up in recent days and for them to seek clarification from the club, especially as their previous updates were acknowledged as being very effective in easing supporter concerns. That is, of course, if the club don’t already intend to do this, which they themselves have been equally as consistent around in the last couple of months. Either way, that clarity is both necessary and undoubtedly bound to be forthcoming based on what we have come to expect.>> If there’s no movement on either front by Tuesday, happy to contact the Trust and request information around when their next planned meeting is with the club and whether they will be asking for supporters’ questions - the latter being particularly important as there will be a lot of people who will want to know about different aspects of their club during this time. | |
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Lotto News on 20:47 - May 23 with 2064 views | D_Alien |
Lotto News on 19:17 - May 23 by dawlishdale | I'd hope that the person who has made this error of judgement (at best) is brought to task by the Trust, but unless members actually contact them directly, the old excuse of "we can't act on messageboard information alone" will come to the fore. It's well known that the CEO reads this board avidly, together with several Trust Board members, some of whom post on here. I'd imagine the CEO is shaking his head in disbelief at what he believes is a non story; trouble shaken up by the usual few who dislike him.....well it's worse than that. It's a serious question being raised on your abilities to make timely decisions, and communicate them in the correct manner, and with every poorly administered decision , the numbers of people who have concerns regarding your actions are growing. I'd guess that, unless action is taken within the next few days, the Lotto will be dead within a year, and the club will have lost the goodwill of many longstanding agents, and a valuable connection with the community it is supposed to serve. All this at a time when we need each and every person in the area to be fully behind the club, and willing to help in any way they can. I feel sorry for the agents, and also for the people who worked so damned hard to set up what was once one of the most successful lotteries in the country. Their legacy has been squandered away. I've cancelled my membership, and suspect many others will do the same. |
There's an alternative explanation to the CEO shaking his head in disbelief If you look at the sequence of actual events since he became CEO, it's possible to detect a deliberate, albeit covert, disengagement with the fanbase Starting with the attempt to subvert the end of season awards, right through to disbanding Goldbond, and plenty in between Why? Well, why does anyone try to manipulate an established situation? All those who hold shares in Dale should be asking themselves the same question | |
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Lotto News on 21:07 - May 23 with 2032 views | RAFCBLUE |
Lotto News on 20:47 - May 23 by D_Alien | There's an alternative explanation to the CEO shaking his head in disbelief If you look at the sequence of actual events since he became CEO, it's possible to detect a deliberate, albeit covert, disengagement with the fanbase Starting with the attempt to subvert the end of season awards, right through to disbanding Goldbond, and plenty in between Why? Well, why does anyone try to manipulate an established situation? All those who hold shares in Dale should be asking themselves the same question |
Why does anyone want to manipulate an established situation DA? Any allegation towards the CEO about deliberate, covert disengagenent is a very serious accusation. | |
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Lotto News on 21:20 - May 23 with 2002 views | D_Alien |
Lotto News on 21:07 - May 23 by RAFCBLUE | Why does anyone want to manipulate an established situation DA? Any allegation towards the CEO about deliberate, covert disengagenent is a very serious accusation. |
There's no accusation, i'm posing a scenario that would fit the events I've described For that matter, what's your interest? I'm just a fan [Post edited 23 May 2020 21:21]
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Lotto News on 22:09 - May 23 with 1941 views | rochdaleriddler |
Lotto News on 19:17 - May 23 by dawlishdale | I'd hope that the person who has made this error of judgement (at best) is brought to task by the Trust, but unless members actually contact them directly, the old excuse of "we can't act on messageboard information alone" will come to the fore. It's well known that the CEO reads this board avidly, together with several Trust Board members, some of whom post on here. I'd imagine the CEO is shaking his head in disbelief at what he believes is a non story; trouble shaken up by the usual few who dislike him.....well it's worse than that. It's a serious question being raised on your abilities to make timely decisions, and communicate them in the correct manner, and with every poorly administered decision , the numbers of people who have concerns regarding your actions are growing. I'd guess that, unless action is taken within the next few days, the Lotto will be dead within a year, and the club will have lost the goodwill of many longstanding agents, and a valuable connection with the community it is supposed to serve. All this at a time when we need each and every person in the area to be fully behind the club, and willing to help in any way they can. I feel sorry for the agents, and also for the people who worked so damned hard to set up what was once one of the most successful lotteries in the country. Their legacy has been squandered away. I've cancelled my membership, and suspect many others will do the same. |
I won’t be signing up, and the prize money has dropped | |
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Lotto News on 23:34 - May 23 with 1885 views | judd |
Lotto News on 20:47 - May 23 by D_Alien | There's an alternative explanation to the CEO shaking his head in disbelief If you look at the sequence of actual events since he became CEO, it's possible to detect a deliberate, albeit covert, disengagement with the fanbase Starting with the attempt to subvert the end of season awards, right through to disbanding Goldbond, and plenty in between Why? Well, why does anyone try to manipulate an established situation? All those who hold shares in Dale should be asking themselves the same question |
Whichever way we look at it there is a common theme of assault on established tradition since the current CE/CEO became a director. The Gala Dinner failed in spectacular fashion and now we have this cowardly pre-determined move cloaking a business decision in the deathly shroud of a pandemic. A 30 year successful tradition vaporized in the stroke of an ego. If we continue to allow the club to be deconstructed in this man's vision I would expect the standing enclosure to be renamed the Randy Lame End. | |
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Lotto News on 07:12 - May 24 with 1801 views | smaclad1 | It's not taken long has it. It's only been a week or so since the Board were being praised on the guiding of the club through the current crisis and comments made that this Bottomley chap might not be as bad as some first thought. One 'wrong' move and the ills of the world are being placed on his shoulders again. Is there any truth in the rumour he visited China on holiday last November/December? | | | |
Lotto News on 07:36 - May 24 with 1785 views | D_Alien |
Lotto News on 07:12 - May 24 by smaclad1 | It's not taken long has it. It's only been a week or so since the Board were being praised on the guiding of the club through the current crisis and comments made that this Bottomley chap might not be as bad as some first thought. One 'wrong' move and the ills of the world are being placed on his shoulders again. Is there any truth in the rumour he visited China on holiday last November/December? |
It's not just one, it's a whole litany Praised by some, and he's working hard at developing a certain profile, but others aren't easily convinced | |
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Lotto News on 09:52 - May 24 with 1693 views | DaleiLama | So we have no source of income or the likelihood of fans schlepping up at the COA with their £s for the foreseeable, we are in the worst recession since the dinosaurs died out and corporate/sponsorship would be expected to suffer when footy does resume and we are crippling a revenue stream? Things that make you go hmmmm. [Post edited 24 May 2020 10:54]
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Lotto News on 13:14 - May 24 with 1606 views | NorthernDale | The question is how many people will bother to set up a direct debit to pay for the Dale lotto, many of the members may not be Dale fans and so may not bother with a direct debit. Whereas the agent approach was more personal and built a link between the club and the wider population of the town. This approach could cost the club money and the goodwill of many people, I feel the virus was the excuse they had been looking for to end the role of the agents. I feel that there is a slight breakdown in relations between the fans and the club, the reason for this is open to debate and I hope the club and the directors appreciate this, that for many Dale fans the club is very close to our hearts and our concerns for the future of the club. | | | |
Lotto News on 14:26 - May 24 with 1562 views | Brierls | Maybe the Goldbond, or the agent led Dale Lotto, had genuinely run its course. No conspiracy theories, no one man mission to see it dead, just a collective decision by the board of directors. Only seeing the numbers would prove that one way or the other, and a single line of a balance sheet doesn’t give enough detail. I think the club have handled it terribly regrading comms. There are many agents out there that have been doing this for years and they deserved better than finding out via social media. I dare say that the news would have broken shortly after the first letter was received anyway, resulting in a similar uproar, but the official statement should have been made later at least giving a chance for snail mail to filter through. Comments (self) proclaiming to be the loyalist of fans aren’t helpful and quite frankly just get my back up. The cringey ‘lap of honour’ has completely puddled Reedy’s brain. I don’t buy the “doing it for the love of the club” to describe all; a quick look at the replies on the story on Facebook showed comments like “how do I get my commission paid?”. The love of the club hardly at the forefront of the mind. Let’s have it right, if it was for the love of the club these loyalist of supporters would be turning down their 15% commission, heavily discounted season ticket and free ‘refreshments” (in the past) at the agents do. I’m not saying agents should have done it for free, far from it, but they’ll not be thanking Reedy’s attitude. The Goldbond was beneficial for some agents too; they took on a round because they’d get a heavily discounted season ticket, as it was the only way they could afford one. They took on a round because of the regular 15% commission income. It’s a sad end to what has been a fantastic earner for the club in the past. The fact that’s it sad doesn’t mean it wasn’t the right thing to do. [Post edited 24 May 2020 14:31]
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Lotto News on 14:59 - May 24 with 1523 views | Reedy |
Lotto News on 14:26 - May 24 by Brierls | Maybe the Goldbond, or the agent led Dale Lotto, had genuinely run its course. No conspiracy theories, no one man mission to see it dead, just a collective decision by the board of directors. Only seeing the numbers would prove that one way or the other, and a single line of a balance sheet doesn’t give enough detail. I think the club have handled it terribly regrading comms. There are many agents out there that have been doing this for years and they deserved better than finding out via social media. I dare say that the news would have broken shortly after the first letter was received anyway, resulting in a similar uproar, but the official statement should have been made later at least giving a chance for snail mail to filter through. Comments (self) proclaiming to be the loyalist of fans aren’t helpful and quite frankly just get my back up. The cringey ‘lap of honour’ has completely puddled Reedy’s brain. I don’t buy the “doing it for the love of the club” to describe all; a quick look at the replies on the story on Facebook showed comments like “how do I get my commission paid?”. The love of the club hardly at the forefront of the mind. Let’s have it right, if it was for the love of the club these loyalist of supporters would be turning down their 15% commission, heavily discounted season ticket and free ‘refreshments” (in the past) at the agents do. I’m not saying agents should have done it for free, far from it, but they’ll not be thanking Reedy’s attitude. The Goldbond was beneficial for some agents too; they took on a round because they’d get a heavily discounted season ticket, as it was the only way they could afford one. They took on a round because of the regular 15% commission income. It’s a sad end to what has been a fantastic earner for the club in the past. The fact that’s it sad doesn’t mean it wasn’t the right thing to do. [Post edited 24 May 2020 14:31]
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It can’t have run it’s course if people still went out every week to collect though? There’s demand there, so it makes no sense to say it’s run it’s course. Your probably right about people being unhappy if we were informed first, however we weren’t and I (and others) still haven’t. Do you honestly think it’s worth going out 50 weeks of the year for a couple of quid and a £30 season ticket? Because it’s really, really not. It has been beneficial to me, no doubt, but if I took on a different job for two hours paying minimum wage, I would be considerably better off. Your point about the season ticket may have been true a few years ago, but the price of season tickets has come down substantially in the past few years, and over 100 agents are still collecting from there members. My attitude is that I want to carry on collecting from my members because I enjoy it, and more importantly I know virtually none of my members will sign up via direct debit, so the club will be losing a lot of money just off my round, never mind all the others. It’s not just a massive own goal in terms of communication with supporters, agents and members, it’s also a massive own goal financially, and wherever you stand on the issue, that’s very, very worrying. | |
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Lotto News on 15:04 - May 24 with 1509 views | judd |
Lotto News on 14:26 - May 24 by Brierls | Maybe the Goldbond, or the agent led Dale Lotto, had genuinely run its course. No conspiracy theories, no one man mission to see it dead, just a collective decision by the board of directors. Only seeing the numbers would prove that one way or the other, and a single line of a balance sheet doesn’t give enough detail. I think the club have handled it terribly regrading comms. There are many agents out there that have been doing this for years and they deserved better than finding out via social media. I dare say that the news would have broken shortly after the first letter was received anyway, resulting in a similar uproar, but the official statement should have been made later at least giving a chance for snail mail to filter through. Comments (self) proclaiming to be the loyalist of fans aren’t helpful and quite frankly just get my back up. The cringey ‘lap of honour’ has completely puddled Reedy’s brain. I don’t buy the “doing it for the love of the club” to describe all; a quick look at the replies on the story on Facebook showed comments like “how do I get my commission paid?”. The love of the club hardly at the forefront of the mind. Let’s have it right, if it was for the love of the club these loyalist of supporters would be turning down their 15% commission, heavily discounted season ticket and free ‘refreshments” (in the past) at the agents do. I’m not saying agents should have done it for free, far from it, but they’ll not be thanking Reedy’s attitude. The Goldbond was beneficial for some agents too; they took on a round because they’d get a heavily discounted season ticket, as it was the only way they could afford one. They took on a round because of the regular 15% commission income. It’s a sad end to what has been a fantastic earner for the club in the past. The fact that’s it sad doesn’t mean it wasn’t the right thing to do. [Post edited 24 May 2020 14:31]
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Who says Goldbond has ended? It hasn't.. Just the way the cash is collected. | |
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