| wee jimmy krankie 08:15 - Dec 23 with 76139 views | britferry |
I'm not a hypocrite, the English made me break my own rules, we demand another once in a lifetime vote
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| wee jimmy krankie on 18:12 - Nov 23 with 2150 views | johnlangy |
| wee jimmy krankie on 11:34 - Nov 23 by Togg |
Same in Wales. Very few interested in independence. |
It is correct to say that the majority don't want Independence in Wales. At the moment.
But, assuming that there are two million people in Wales eligible to vote (I haven't checked the actual number) then 500,000 being for Indy is hardly very few. That is based on recent opinion poll results. I imagine the question asked was 'What would your vote be if there was a referendum on Welsh Independence'.
I would be very interested to know what another Opinion poll would come up with if the following question was asked - 'What would your vote be if there was a referendum on Welsh Independence now that it's been shown by Professor John Doyle that an Independent Wales would have a budget deficit of £2.6 billion not the £13.5 billion always being quoted by the UK media ?'.
A bit long winded isn't it.
But i'm certain that a large number of the 75% who say no at the moment do so because they've been persuaded by the UK media who keep arguing that Wales can't afford Indy due to the enormous deficit they always quote, as mentioned above. | | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:20 - Nov 23 with 2136 views | Togg |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:12 - Nov 23 by johnlangy |
It is correct to say that the majority don't want Independence in Wales. At the moment.
But, assuming that there are two million people in Wales eligible to vote (I haven't checked the actual number) then 500,000 being for Indy is hardly very few. That is based on recent opinion poll results. I imagine the question asked was 'What would your vote be if there was a referendum on Welsh Independence'.
I would be very interested to know what another Opinion poll would come up with if the following question was asked - 'What would your vote be if there was a referendum on Welsh Independence now that it's been shown by Professor John Doyle that an Independent Wales would have a budget deficit of £2.6 billion not the £13.5 billion always being quoted by the UK media ?'.
A bit long winded isn't it.
But i'm certain that a large number of the 75% who say no at the moment do so because they've been persuaded by the UK media who keep arguing that Wales can't afford Indy due to the enormous deficit they always quote, as mentioned above. |
Interesting point John. I still think personally the majority in Wales are happy with being part of the United Kingdom and can see the benefits. However you always discuss this matter in an adult, intelligent way. As has been mentioned before. | | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:21 - Nov 23 with 2135 views | johnlangy |
| wee jimmy krankie on 11:59 - Nov 23 by union_jack |
The danger is complacency. If there’d been a better turnout for the devolution vote in 97 it would have gone a different way I believe. Too many couldn’t be bothered thinking it was a r@cing certainty it wouldn’t happen. And look at what did happ3n! |
It's equally reasonable to argue that a higher turnout may have resulted in a larger vote for devolution. None of us will ever know.
People often argue that the pro devolution result was a paper thin majority. I would argue that it was an incredible result. In the 1979 referendum the pro devolution vote was just 20%. To go from 20% to just over 50% in 18 years is a remarkable turnaround.
And then to go from just over 50% to 65% for greater devolution powers in the 2011 referendum, a gap of just 14 years from the 1997 ref, is also remarkable. | | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:27 - Nov 23 with 2131 views | johnlangy |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:20 - Nov 23 by Togg |
Interesting point John. I still think personally the majority in Wales are happy with being part of the United Kingdom and can see the benefits. However you always discuss this matter in an adult, intelligent way. As has been mentioned before. |
Fair enough Togg.
And isn't it always so much better when we discuss in an adult way rather than just slag others off for having a different opinion .  | | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:33 - Nov 23 with 2122 views | Catullus |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:05 - Nov 23 by Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
That caveat was agreed on for the first referendum but promptly ignored the day after the results. |
yes but there was no defined timescale, next time say 25 years! | |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 18:43 - Nov 23 with 2108 views | pencoedjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:20 - Nov 23 by Togg |
Interesting point John. I still think personally the majority in Wales are happy with being part of the United Kingdom and can see the benefits. However you always discuss this matter in an adult, intelligent way. As has been mentioned before. |
Indeed, there is a few Indys (1 in particular) on here who could learn a lot from you.
Question.
I work in logistics for a large US company who ship to the NHS all over Britain (90% to England), if there was independence in Wales do you believe that most logistics companies we have in Wales would move there business to England to avoid crossing a border.
I know you are intelligent enough to know England would not allow us to have our cake & eat it to allow easy border crossings.
It would make no difference to me as Id already be retired if it ever happened (which I don't believe it will) |  | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:45 - Nov 23 with 2104 views | Catullus |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:21 - Nov 23 by johnlangy |
It's equally reasonable to argue that a higher turnout may have resulted in a larger vote for devolution. None of us will ever know.
People often argue that the pro devolution result was a paper thin majority. I would argue that it was an incredible result. In the 1979 referendum the pro devolution vote was just 20%. To go from 20% to just over 50% in 18 years is a remarkable turnaround.
And then to go from just over 50% to 65% for greater devolution powers in the 2011 referendum, a gap of just 14 years from the 1997 ref, is also remarkable. |
That 65% result, wasn't the turnout lower again? Does that back up my argument that most people weren't bothered so mostly only the most ardent devolutionists turned out?
What was the turnout in 1997....50.22% so basically about 26% of the electorate won devolution with the vast majrity not really bothered.
In 2011 just over 36% bothered to vote so that 65% actually represents 42,000 fewer yes votes than in 1997. That's hardly remarkable.
Isnt it more telling that after just 14 years around 20% who had previously voted couldnt be bothered? | |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 18:52 - Nov 23 with 2090 views | union_jack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:01 - Nov 23 by Catullus |
I disagree. I think those who wanted indy turned out and the others were commpaclacent or apathetic.
it's just like in Wales, the hard core labour voters turn out for the Senedd elections but most people don't care, a fact I maintain proves we care more about the Union and westminster because of the turnout for the GE.
Regardless I say give them the vote, but this time put the caveat in and make the outcome very well known. If you lose no more referendum on it for 25 years. Then, so it's not all negativity and scare mongering, make the most positive case for voting remain that you can, tell them very loudly why they'd be better off in the Union.
To be honest, if they voted leave I wouldn't be too upset. At least then we'd know the truth in all the arguments because I do wonder (after reading John Langy's posts) if the rest of us are such a drain on England, why are they so keen to keep the Union going? |
That was the point I was making. It’s those who are complacent (were so in ‘97) that allow minority opinions to prevail. I’d bet my house that with a 75%+ turnout, devolution wouldn’t have happened (I can’t prove it of course).
The feeling / passion for those wanting independence is greater than those who don’t in the main. So complacency on behalf of those who’d prefer to maintain the status quo can be dangerous. |  |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 19:03 - Nov 23 with 2078 views | Togg |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:27 - Nov 23 by johnlangy |
Fair enough Togg.
And isn't it always so much better when we discuss in an adult way rather than just slag others off for having a different opinion . |
Absolutely John. I have friends and family of all different beliefs. I might not agree with them but keep things civil and respect other points of view ...unless they are being utter dicks😂😅 | | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 19:07 - Nov 23 with 2077 views | Togg |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:43 - Nov 23 by pencoedjack |
Indeed, there is a few Indys (1 in particular) on here who could learn a lot from you.
Question.
I work in logistics for a large US company who ship to the NHS all over Britain (90% to England), if there was independence in Wales do you believe that most logistics companies we have in Wales would move there business to England to avoid crossing a border.
I know you are intelligent enough to know England would not allow us to have our cake & eat it to allow easy border crossings.
It would make no difference to me as Id already be retired if it ever happened (which I don't believe it will) |
I remember the Catalan illegal referendum some years back. I think it was Banco Sabadell ( I believe..maybe wrong a Catalan bank) said they would move their headquarters out of Catalonia if Independence occurred. [Post edited 23 Nov 2022 19:18]
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| wee jimmy krankie on 19:30 - Nov 23 with 2044 views | pencoedjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 19:07 - Nov 23 by Togg |
I remember the Catalan illegal referendum some years back. I think it was Banco Sabadell ( I believe..maybe wrong a Catalan bank) said they would move their headquarters out of Catalonia if Independence occurred. [Post edited 23 Nov 2022 19:18]
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Yep obviously companies would move to where the majority of their work was if they had to cross border controls or staff where working on English queries.
The tax office in Cardiff is one of the largest & does not just do Welsh peoples taxes same goes for the DVLA.
Some believe flogging water to our English friends would make up the shortfall. | | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 19:55 - Nov 23 with 2024 views | Kilkennyjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:05 - Nov 23 by Joesus_Of_Narbereth |
That caveat was agreed on for the first referendum but promptly ignored the day after the results. |
It was not part of the process.
It was said, of course, like many many others things but it was not part of the process. |  |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 20:00 - Nov 23 with 2021 views | Kilkennyjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:20 - Nov 23 by Togg |
Interesting point John. I still think personally the majority in Wales are happy with being part of the United Kingdom and can see the benefits. However you always discuss this matter in an adult, intelligent way. As has been mentioned before. |
What benefits ?
The UK govt have bombed the entire economy and UK national debt remains at unmanageable levels. | |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 20:03 - Nov 23 with 2016 views | Kilkennyjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 18:43 - Nov 23 by pencoedjack |
Indeed, there is a few Indys (1 in particular) on here who could learn a lot from you.
Question.
I work in logistics for a large US company who ship to the NHS all over Britain (90% to England), if there was independence in Wales do you believe that most logistics companies we have in Wales would move there business to England to avoid crossing a border.
I know you are intelligent enough to know England would not allow us to have our cake & eat it to allow easy border crossings.
It would make no difference to me as Id already be retired if it ever happened (which I don't believe it will) |
On that logic you would be against Brexit. Well done. | |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 20:09 - Nov 23 with 2009 views | Kilkennyjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 19:30 - Nov 23 by pencoedjack |
Yep obviously companies would move to where the majority of their work was if they had to cross border controls or staff where working on English queries.
The tax office in Cardiff is one of the largest & does not just do Welsh peoples taxes same goes for the DVLA.
Some believe flogging water to our English friends would make up the shortfall. |
No - as John has told you previously civil service jobs would be swapped.
Many English based civil service jobs service Wales.
It works both ways of course.
Flogging water would help, its quite important for life.
Like energy …
Also Wales needs no army so we save a lot as well.
Just like the Irish model, its not hard.
We would almost certainly join the EU, a far bigger market than just England.
Although no doubt a deal would be done. | |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 20:13 - Nov 23 with 2004 views | pencoedjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 20:03 - Nov 23 by Kilkennyjack |
On that logic you would be against Brexit. Well done. |
I know you are thick but I said 80% of the shipments are to England I’m sure even you can work out where the rest goes too.
To help unfortunately as you are aware Wales has the highest waiting list for orthopaedic surgery.
Normally I can’t even be bothered to reply to you but can you enlighten me on what border controls came into place after Brexit for shipping goods to England from Wales?
Try leaving a decent Indy talk about independence & crawl back into your cave. [Post edited 23 Nov 2022 20:15]
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| wee jimmy krankie on 20:50 - Nov 23 with 1976 views | Dr_Winston |
| wee jimmy krankie on 19:30 - Nov 23 by pencoedjack |
Yep obviously companies would move to where the majority of their work was if they had to cross border controls or staff where working on English queries.
The tax office in Cardiff is one of the largest & does not just do Welsh peoples taxes same goes for the DVLA.
Some believe flogging water to our English friends would make up the shortfall. |
90-95% of DVLA staff would see their jobs relocated to England in the advent of an independence vote. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 20:59 - Nov 23 with 1961 views | pencoedjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 20:50 - Nov 23 by Dr_Winston |
90-95% of DVLA staff would see their jobs relocated to England in the advent of an independence vote. |
Yep.
In fairness the shite show that it currently is we’d probably be better off shipping it lock stock & barrel to England & pay them to run it for us. | | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 23:15 - Nov 23 with 1906 views | Kilkennyjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 20:59 - Nov 23 by pencoedjack |
Yep.
In fairness the shite show that it currently is we’d probably be better off shipping it lock stock & barrel to England & pay them to run it for us. |
Everything English is better than anything welsh, eh ?
You are Dic Sion Dafydd and i claim my £5.
Annibyniaeth. | |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 23:25 - Nov 23 with 1901 views | Kilkennyjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 20:13 - Nov 23 by pencoedjack |
I know you are thick but I said 80% of the shipments are to England I’m sure even you can work out where the rest goes too.
To help unfortunately as you are aware Wales has the highest waiting list for orthopaedic surgery.
Normally I can’t even be bothered to reply to you but can you enlighten me on what border controls came into place after Brexit for shipping goods to England from Wales?
Try leaving a decent Indy talk about independence & crawl back into your cave. [Post edited 23 Nov 2022 20:15]
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John is just as indy as me.
You are trying to treat him like a poodle.
Beware the dog.
Shirley even you can understand that uk leaving the EU would create a Brexit border.
Just like Scotland indy would create a border.
The Brexit border imposition you supported.
The indy Scotland border terrifies you.
The uk will move on from Johnsons idiot promises of rainbow unicorns etc and do a workable deal with the EU.
That same deal will apply for Scotland to England border, as Scotland will be back in the EU pronto.
You wont understand, so please ask a responsible adult to help you. 👠| |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 00:01 - Nov 24 with 1891 views | raynor94 |
| wee jimmy krankie on 23:25 - Nov 23 by Kilkennyjack |
John is just as indy as me.
You are trying to treat him like a poodle.
Beware the dog.
Shirley even you can understand that uk leaving the EU would create a Brexit border.
Just like Scotland indy would create a border.
The Brexit border imposition you supported.
The indy Scotland border terrifies you.
The uk will move on from Johnsons idiot promises of rainbow unicorns etc and do a workable deal with the EU.
That same deal will apply for Scotland to England border, as Scotland will be back in the EU pronto.
You wont understand, so please ask a responsible adult to help you. 👠|
You can be as Indy as you like, it's all academic.
The break up of the Union has been greatly exaggerated, put to bed nicely today |  |
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| wee jimmy krankie on 07:10 - Nov 24 with 1856 views | pencoedjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 23:25 - Nov 23 by Kilkennyjack |
John is just as indy as me.
You are trying to treat him like a poodle.
Beware the dog.
Shirley even you can understand that uk leaving the EU would create a Brexit border.
Just like Scotland indy would create a border.
The Brexit border imposition you supported.
The indy Scotland border terrifies you.
The uk will move on from Johnsons idiot promises of rainbow unicorns etc and do a workable deal with the EU.
That same deal will apply for Scotland to England border, as Scotland will be back in the EU pronto.
You wont understand, so please ask a responsible adult to help you. 👠|
As I said you are thick as once again you failed to answer the question asked.
You are nothing like John he can put a point across & answers questions in an adult like manner.
Anyway back to laughing at your childish posts & watching people poking fun at you. | | | |
| wee jimmy krankie on 07:42 - Nov 24 with 1846 views | Togg |
| wee jimmy krankie on 23:25 - Nov 23 by Kilkennyjack |
John is just as indy as me.
You are trying to treat him like a poodle.
Beware the dog.
Shirley even you can understand that uk leaving the EU would create a Brexit border.
Just like Scotland indy would create a border.
The Brexit border imposition you supported.
The indy Scotland border terrifies you.
The uk will move on from Johnsons idiot promises of rainbow unicorns etc and do a workable deal with the EU.
That same deal will apply for Scotland to England border, as Scotland will be back in the EU pronto.
You wont understand, so please ask a responsible adult to help you. 👠|
You come across as angry and bitter. With a huge grievance against England and English people.
John discusses thing in an intelligent, articulate well thought out manor. Using a description as Poodle' is highly patronising. [Post edited 24 Nov 2022 7:43]
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| wee jimmy krankie on 08:47 - Nov 24 with 1821 views | Kilkennyjack |
| wee jimmy krankie on 07:42 - Nov 24 by Togg |
You come across as angry and bitter. With a huge grievance against England and English people.
John discusses thing in an intelligent, articulate well thought out manor. Using a description as Poodle' is highly patronising. [Post edited 24 Nov 2022 7:43]
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Who died and made you judge and jury ?
I will post what i want.
If the truth is too hard for you to handle then you might be better logging off for a year or two. | |
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