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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:31 - Jan 10 by MrSheen
It’s very weird. Apparently the last Japanese PoWs weren’t allowed home until 1993! There were also a lot of Korean slave forestry workers on Sakhalin island when the Soviets invaded. They were allowed to go back to Korea, but only to the North. Some refused and stayed on. A few finally went back to the South in the 1990s.
Good god.
That's it! I'm finished with the Russians. I promise I won't even fancy Keri Russell in The Americans anymore.
"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:35 - Jan 10 by BrianMcCarthy
Good god.
That's it! I'm finished with the Russians. I promise I won't even fancy Keri Russell in The Americans anymore.
I only learned about from reading Max Hasting's book Nemesis, about the last year of the Japanese war. As luck would have it, he gives away the chapter on the lead-up to the atomic bombs as a freebie.
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:33 - Jan 10 by BazzaInTheLoft
I’d love to hear what your dad thinks about Mossadegh who was the last elected Head of State in Iran, and who nationalised the petro industry there.
Definately an inaccurate portrayal of Jeremy. He was paid by Press TV after being invited on. He’s been very critical of the Iranian government but sadly this isn’t newsworthy. I’ve seen plenty of right wing MPs speak on Al Jazeera for example but no one seems to want to ask questions about links to the Qataris or Saudis 🤷â€â™‚ï¸
I hope your family are well over there.
[Post edited 10 Jan 2020 14:57]
Al Jazeera doesn't have any links to the Saudis. They have asked the Qataris to close it.
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:54 - Jan 10 with 1297 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:43 - Jan 10 by MrSheen
Al Jazeera doesn't have any links to the Saudis. They have asked the Qataris to close it.
I know, and was the basis for their sanctions but my point was in general we don’t ask questions of our relationship with them, despite an undoubtably worse record on human rights and destabilisation in the region.
Both are tremendous funders of terrorism.
[Post edited 10 Jan 2020 15:21]
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:56 - Jan 10 with 1285 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:06 - Jan 10 by joe90
I just want to say, I'm not an expert on this topic and don't want to present myself as one. It's free open, discussion all views should be welcome.
For context, my Dad came to the UK sometime in the early 60'S and has now lived here longer than he has in Iran. He has been very critical of the revolution and does not support current regime at all.
When discussing Iran, I do think he has a blind spot, and the only way I can explain this is to compare it to brexit. If someone from abroad only spoke to a Londoner about the state of the country and brexit they would most likely get a very particular view which would be different to one they'd get from someone who's from a northern brexit voting town.
Being from Tehran, my Dad could be seen as being part of a metropolitan elite who did well under the Shah and is in no way representative of the country as whole.
Strangely enough, I had family that went back to Iran after the revolution which shows that even within a family views can be very different.
Personally I do not view the Shah with rose tinted glass's and I don't support the current regime. But the reality is, the brutal war with Iraq in the 80's allowed the regime to kill off a lot of internal agitators and breed a young, battle hardened generation that views the west with great distrust.
The Israel situation is significant because it's an ideal quasi religious cause the regime can anchor it's foreign policy around. But it's also a bit of smokescreen because in my view it's more about self preservation than an actual hatred of Israel.
I don't believe Iran has the capability of building nuclear weapons, I think this has been created by the regime as a bargaining chip which other countries have lapped. Having 'peaceful negotiations' makes everyone look good but makes little to no meaningful change.
I don't think Trump is smart enough to have thought through a cunning strategy for this attack, but inadvertently his simple world view and approach might actually work?
As the west becomes less dependent on oil, the main regional players(Iran, Turkey and Israel) will ultimately decide the fate of the Middle East.
Regarding Corbyn, it seems to me he dislikes the US/UK more than he cares about the people of the Middle East. He has taken money from the Iranian regime which is an endorsement and is a very problematic issue if we're to take him seriously.
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:31 - Jan 10 by MrSheen
It’s very weird. Apparently the last Japanese PoWs weren’t allowed home until 1993! There were also a lot of Korean slave forestry workers on Sakhalin island when the Soviets invaded. They were allowed to go back to Korea, but only to the North. Some refused and stayed on. A few finally went back to the South in the 1990s.
Covered on US tv (probably in ‘93), heard / read the occasionally comment since.
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:54 - Jan 10 by BazzaInTheLoft
I know, and was the basis for their sanctions but my point was in general we don’t ask questions of our relationship with them, despite an undoubtably worse record on human rights and destabilisation in the region.
Both are tremendous funders of terrorism.
[Post edited 10 Jan 2020 15:21]
The Qataris have a worse record on human rights and destabilisation than the Iranians?
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 15:35 - Jan 10 with 1216 views
They sent 10,000 troops to Yemen to fight the Huthis. Major player in the Sunni / Shiite / Saudi / Iran proxy wars.
The rest of the Arabian Peninsula might be undergoing a economic war with Qatar but they are very much on the same page in Syria, Lebanon, Libya, and Yemen.
They sent 10,000 troops to Yemen to fight the Huthis. Major player in the Sunni / Shiite / Saudi / Iran proxy wars.
The rest of the Arabian Peninsula might be undergoing a economic war with Qatar but they are very much on the same page in Syria, Lebanon, Libya, and Yemen.
The first article quotes the Israeli ambassador to the UN, complaining about Qatari funding of Hamas (other friends include Iran and Jeremy Corbyn), the other says Qatar sent 1,000 troops to Yemen, not 10,000. Still, clearly only a right-wing lunatic would be shameless enough to go on Terrorist TV, aka Al Jazeera.
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 16:24 - Jan 10 with 1149 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 15:51 - Jan 10 by MrSheen
The first article quotes the Israeli ambassador to the UN, complaining about Qatari funding of Hamas (other friends include Iran and Jeremy Corbyn), the other says Qatar sent 1,000 troops to Yemen, not 10,000. Still, clearly only a right-wing lunatic would be shameless enough to go on Terrorist TV, aka Al Jazeera.
1) Apologies, I was referring to the 10,000 coalition troops (including a handful of our experts) of which Qatar supplied 1000.
2) Jeremy Corbyn has condemned Hamas. When calling them ‘friends’ it was at a peace conference in which the Israeli government also attended and were called friends. If you consider the balance of dead bodies, ordinance and military deployed Hamas are a distant second to Israel who remain free of the terrorist label despite pounding Gaza for many decades before Hama even existed.
3) I have no issue with anyone going on RT, Al Jazeera, Press TV, or CBeebies. But if you condemn one (JC) then condemn them all including the Right. They are still state run by a funder of terrorism. Many in the world including myself would argue the BBC are in the same boat.
[Post edited 10 Jan 2020 16:32]
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 16:30 - Jan 10 with 1132 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 16:24 - Jan 10 by BazzaInTheLoft
1) Apologies, I was referring to the 10,000 coalition troops (including a handful of our experts) of which Qatar supplied 1000.
2) Jeremy Corbyn has condemned Hamas. When calling them ‘friends’ it was at a peace conference in which the Israeli government also attended and were called friends. If you consider the balance of dead bodies, ordinance and military deployed Hamas are a distant second to Israel who remain free of the terrorist label despite pounding Gaza for many decades before Hama even existed.
3) I have no issue with anyone going on RT, Al Jazeera, Press TV, or CBeebies. But if you condemn one (JC) then condemn them all including the Right. They are still state run by a funder of terrorism. Many in the world including myself would argue the BBC are in the same boat.
[Post edited 10 Jan 2020 16:32]
Fair enough. I don’t dispute that Qatar is a destabilising force (along with everyone else), just that they are more so than Iran. I only raised JC on AJ-TV because you counterposed right wing MPs on it to JC on Press TV. I don’t care where he (or they) pops up either.
That’s enough from me.
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 16:37 - Jan 10 with 1113 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 14:33 - Jan 10 by BazzaInTheLoft
I’d love to hear what your dad thinks about Mossadegh who was the last elected Head of State in Iran, and who nationalised the petro industry there.
Definately an inaccurate portrayal of Jeremy. He was paid by Press TV after being invited on. He’s been very critical of the Iranian government but sadly this isn’t newsworthy. I’ve seen plenty of right wing MPs speak on Al Jazeera for example but no one seems to want to ask questions about links to the Qataris or Saudis 🤷â€â™‚ï¸
I hope your family are well over there.
[Post edited 10 Jan 2020 14:57]
Mossadegh, he's an interesting one! I've not met an Iranian who doesn't think highly of him, but I haven't met most Iranians, so that's not saying much, haha
I don't know exactly what my Dad thinks of him, and I wouldn't want to speak on his behalf, but he would have been fairly young when the coup happened and the few times he's been mentioned it's been positive.
We can only speculate as to how things would be had the coup not happened.
Judging from your avatar I'm guessing you're left leaning...
Do you know much about the persecution of communists/socialist in Iran and the Soviet sponsored uprising that was thwarted?
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 17:13 - Jan 10 with 1061 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 16:37 - Jan 10 by joe90
Mossadegh, he's an interesting one! I've not met an Iranian who doesn't think highly of him, but I haven't met most Iranians, so that's not saying much, haha
I don't know exactly what my Dad thinks of him, and I wouldn't want to speak on his behalf, but he would have been fairly young when the coup happened and the few times he's been mentioned it's been positive.
We can only speculate as to how things would be had the coup not happened.
Judging from your avatar I'm guessing you're left leaning...
Do you know much about the persecution of communists/socialist in Iran and the Soviet sponsored uprising that was thwarted?
That’s great. I hope things come down one day and you are able to go if you want to.
I grew up with an elderly Iranian couple next door to me in Kilburn who fled in 1979 so I’ve always had a interest. I used to test the old adage that Persians are the most hospitable people in the world I can tell you! Always found it to be true though.
I am left leaning but my Avatar is just there to wind up some of the posters on here to be honest.
I read a book about Turkish communism last year and how Iran under the Shahs were a major player in crushing it and lobbying for the missiles to be installed that started the Cuban missile crisis. I guess Iran was and is no different to the rest of us when it comes to McCarthyesque Paranoia about Reds under the bed. Would love to know more!
[Post edited 10 Jan 2020 17:15]
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 18:02 - Jan 10 with 1016 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 12:26 - Jan 10 by BazzaInTheLoft
Don’t know the exact details, but I presume Joe90s dad has been pushed out by this horrendous regime like most of the Iranian exiles that arrived in 1979. His dad has my sincerest sympathy and I’d imagine that the crisis in his homeland is quite upsetting.
Probably wrong of me to lecture while Joe90 is in the forum, and maybe he can correct me but the current regime is our creation. The Shahs who we installed were hated by a lot of people and killed 50,000 protesters in the run up to the revolution. We installed the Shahs because they were willing to privatise the previously nationalised oil and let BP run it.
yeah, we knew an anglo-iranian family in chelmsford.
used to love going round there place - really nice people and wonderful food!
She was fascinating on the revolution - the despised shah and his terrifying secret police, the desire for change and then the awful realisation of what that change led to, and finally fleeing for the UK.
It seems to me that 'our' military forays in the middle-east rarely if ever achieve positive results for the people who live there - only for the short term objectives of the leader sanctioning the strikes, and, of course, the permanent war economy.
America's oil-related interest in Iran may well be as much to do with iran moving away from selling oil by the dollar as with physically controlling iran's oil supplies.
We've helped, in varying degrees, to recruit, train and arm the taliban, al queda and isis. Who next?
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 18:11 - Jan 10 with 1004 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 18:02 - Jan 10 by distortR
yeah, we knew an anglo-iranian family in chelmsford.
used to love going round there place - really nice people and wonderful food!
She was fascinating on the revolution - the despised shah and his terrifying secret police, the desire for change and then the awful realisation of what that change led to, and finally fleeing for the UK.
It seems to me that 'our' military forays in the middle-east rarely if ever achieve positive results for the people who live there - only for the short term objectives of the leader sanctioning the strikes, and, of course, the permanent war economy.
America's oil-related interest in Iran may well be as much to do with iran moving away from selling oil by the dollar as with physically controlling iran's oil supplies.
We've helped, in varying degrees, to recruit, train and arm the taliban, al queda and isis. Who next?
It’s about opening up other markets as well, as Hunter mentioned.
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 19:39 - Jan 10 with 921 views
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 18:02 - Jan 10 by distortR
yeah, we knew an anglo-iranian family in chelmsford.
used to love going round there place - really nice people and wonderful food!
She was fascinating on the revolution - the despised shah and his terrifying secret police, the desire for change and then the awful realisation of what that change led to, and finally fleeing for the UK.
It seems to me that 'our' military forays in the middle-east rarely if ever achieve positive results for the people who live there - only for the short term objectives of the leader sanctioning the strikes, and, of course, the permanent war economy.
America's oil-related interest in Iran may well be as much to do with iran moving away from selling oil by the dollar as with physically controlling iran's oil supplies.
We've helped, in varying degrees, to recruit, train and arm the taliban, al queda and isis. Who next?
Who’s next ? Venezuela. What in the name of God only knows does Iran and Venezuela have in common ? Phone a friend ?
Strong and stable my arse.
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It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 21:20 - Jan 10 with 854 views
Pheonix magazine, which is Ireland's version of Private Eye, is tonight reporting that since the assassination the U.S. have escalated traffic through Shannon airport with a steady stream of troops and arms to the Middle East.
"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 00:14 - Jan 11 by Boston
That would be the deployment of troops mentioned a couple of days ago.
Ya, it would be standard enough anyway in times of uncertainty, I'd imagine. Doesn't mean war, or anything like it.
Still hard to believe that Ireland lets troops of any other Country through our airspace and one of our airports. I used to live near Shannon, it's depressing.
"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
I do find it slightly amusing, all the clinton voters congratulating themselves. Now trump* has apparently started a war, clinton wouldn't of waited 4 years.
It's all gone off in Iran / Iraq..... on 00:23 - Jan 11 by Miss_Terraces
I do find it slightly amusing, all the clinton voters congratulating themselves. Now trump* has apparently started a war, clinton wouldn't of waited 4 years.
* I can't stand trump or clinton
No amusement at the god knows how much military action in Libya at the behest of our last President? What was it Mrs Clinton said as she slipped into hysterical laughter, “we came, we saw, we killed him”.
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