| Equality in football 17:54 - Jan 9 with 5049 views | GrandPrix |
How strange that Thomas Hitzlsperger had to wait for retirement to announce he is gay.
Michael Johnson then stepped down from his position on the Football Association’s Inclusion Advisory Board after footage emerged of him describing homosexuality as ‘detestable’.....he has hidden behind his religious beliefs....so Sky news say.
Johnson held a position on an inclusion advisory board but makes comments like that!!
Alex, who now plays for PSG is said to have told French channel Canal+, in a programme to be aired tonight on religion in football: "God created Adam and Eve, not Adam and Yves". in response to Hitzlsperger's announcement.
Long way to go for equality I think
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| Equality in football on 18:37 - Jan 9 with 2362 views | mark555 |
I cant see whats so bad about someone saying what they think, we used to have freedom of speech but that's not allowed now.
Bullying or physically hurting someone for being gay is wrong but whats so bad about someone saying they don't agree with it? |  | | |
| Equality in football on 18:59 - Jan 9 with 2324 views | Davillin |
First a disclaimer. I don't give a damm about anybody's sexual preferences as long as they don't hurt anyone else by it.
But I have great difficulty understanding why anyone thinks it is necessary for someone to announce his sexual preferences to the world. Even at my advanced age, I have never felt the need to make an announcement that I'm straight. Those who matter to me know that I am without being told, and that's enough for me.
Perhaps those who demand that gays self-identify demand it as self-justification for their own behaviour. And perhaps those who hold press conferences to announce their gaiety are seeking attention, or some kind of atonement.
Finally, in this maddening world, the old precept that we should "live and let live" has lost its place. Regrettably! |  |
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| Equality in football on 19:19 - Jan 9 with 2300 views | quiff |
| Equality in football on 18:37 - Jan 9 by mark555 |
I cant see whats so bad about someone saying what they think, we used to have freedom of speech but that's not allowed now.
Bullying or physically hurting someone for being gay is wrong but whats so bad about someone saying they don't agree with it? |
So what you're asking is what's wrong with homophobia? | |
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| Equality in football on 19:22 - Jan 9 with 2297 views | GrandPrix |
| Equality in football on 18:59 - Jan 9 by Davillin |
First a disclaimer. I don't give a damm about anybody's sexual preferences as long as they don't hurt anyone else by it.
But I have great difficulty understanding why anyone thinks it is necessary for someone to announce his sexual preferences to the world. Even at my advanced age, I have never felt the need to make an announcement that I'm straight. Those who matter to me know that I am without being told, and that's enough for me.
Perhaps those who demand that gays self-identify demand it as self-justification for their own behaviour. And perhaps those who hold press conferences to announce their gaiety are seeking attention, or some kind of atonement.
Finally, in this maddening world, the old precept that we should "live and let live" has lost its place. Regrettably! |
Nor do I, I have gay family and friends who are happy, a majority of Jacks around Swansea realise it is up to the person how they feel and act.
It is not bothering them that we are straight so why should it bother us that they are gay.
Ive never seen a straight man being beaten up because he is straight, I have never seen "anti-Straight' graffiti or horrendous comments about straight people either.....so I am guessing they feel like a minority.
The reason Its been announced is to try and find acceptance, weather this works or not I do not know.
Like all walks of life there are attention seekers in every race/gender/religion/sexual preference......the list keeps growing! | |
| Good times become good memories......bad times become lessons |
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| Equality in football on 19:51 - Jan 9 with 2250 views | Davillin |
| Equality in football on 19:19 - Jan 9 by quiff |
So what you're asking is what's wrong with homophobia? |
"homophobia" is a misnomer of immense degree. "phobia" means "fear." The implication of that word - created by gays - is that straight people "fear" homosexuality, and the further implication is that straight people fear that they themselves are gay.
Nonsense.
If people who live one sexual life-style have the right to consider their life-style acceptable, why do people who live another life-style not have a right to consider the other life-style unacceptable - to them? I've never figured that one out.
It gets even wackier when people who don't praise the other life-style are made out to be bad people. Live and let live, for heaven's sake! | |
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| Equality in football on 19:55 - Jan 9 with 2246 views | exiledclaseboy |
| Equality in football on 18:59 - Jan 9 by Davillin |
First a disclaimer. I don't give a damm about anybody's sexual preferences as long as they don't hurt anyone else by it.
But I have great difficulty understanding why anyone thinks it is necessary for someone to announce his sexual preferences to the world. Even at my advanced age, I have never felt the need to make an announcement that I'm straight. Those who matter to me know that I am without being told, and that's enough for me.
Perhaps those who demand that gays self-identify demand it as self-justification for their own behaviour. And perhaps those who hold press conferences to announce their gaiety are seeking attention, or some kind of atonement.
Finally, in this maddening world, the old precept that we should "live and let live" has lost its place. Regrettably! |
The idea behind encouraging high profile homosexuals to "come out" as such is designed to make it easier for others who may be struggling with coming to terms with their own sexuality to do so. I'd have thought that was self-evident. These people still of course face hostility, suspicion and in many cases worse so if someone who commands some public attention can make the process easier then I'm all for it. Straight people don't face the same hostility and derision, which is probably why you never felt the need to announce your rampant heterosexuality. No one should be forced to announce their sexuality but I can completely understand why some do and why some encourage others to.
I've no idea why homosexuals should be seeking "self-justification" for their "behaviour", unless of course you feel that homosexual behaviour needs to be justified. |  |
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| Equality in football on 20:00 - Jan 9 with 2234 views | C_jack |
I do find it strange how he's being praised for his bravery for coming out now, the bravest thing would have been to do it when he was still playing, but alas we're still waiting for someone to 'surrender' themselves, the others will follow along like buses then.
What is honestly the worst that these people are expecting to happen? a few bad chants? |  |
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| Equality in football on 20:16 - Jan 9 with 2209 views | Davillin |
| Equality in football on 19:55 - Jan 9 by exiledclaseboy |
The idea behind encouraging high profile homosexuals to "come out" as such is designed to make it easier for others who may be struggling with coming to terms with their own sexuality to do so. I'd have thought that was self-evident. These people still of course face hostility, suspicion and in many cases worse so if someone who commands some public attention can make the process easier then I'm all for it. Straight people don't face the same hostility and derision, which is probably why you never felt the need to announce your rampant heterosexuality. No one should be forced to announce their sexuality but I can completely understand why some do and why some encourage others to.
I've no idea why homosexuals should be seeking "self-justification" for their "behaviour", unless of course you feel that homosexual behaviour needs to be justified. |
I understand your first paragraph and think it's more accurate than not. Where we don't exactly agree is that I have no idea why anyone "who may be struggling with coming to terms with their own sexuality" needs to "come out" in the first place. And "I would have thought that that was self-evident."
However, my intention in the sense of your final paragraph is that, in fact, some homosexuals are concerned about how their lifestyle is perceived - regardless of how they come to that conclusion. Perhaps "many." Even if the rest are not, some of them still believe that they have to justify it to an unsympathetic world.
The extreme in that belief is in the groups - like GLAAD in the U.S. - who do more than self-justify, but publicly attack anyone who expresses disagreement. The problem is compounded by the fact that, in my opinion, most of the rest of us don't care, but don't want even to say that for fear of being included in the attacks.
That is the extreme in "political correctness" unleashed.
Live and let live. [Post edited 9 Jan 2014 20:17]
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| Equality in football on 20:20 - Jan 9 with 2187 views | macthejack |
| Equality in football on 19:55 - Jan 9 by exiledclaseboy |
The idea behind encouraging high profile homosexuals to "come out" as such is designed to make it easier for others who may be struggling with coming to terms with their own sexuality to do so. I'd have thought that was self-evident. These people still of course face hostility, suspicion and in many cases worse so if someone who commands some public attention can make the process easier then I'm all for it. Straight people don't face the same hostility and derision, which is probably why you never felt the need to announce your rampant heterosexuality. No one should be forced to announce their sexuality but I can completely understand why some do and why some encourage others to.
I've no idea why homosexuals should be seeking "self-justification" for their "behaviour", unless of course you feel that homosexual behaviour needs to be justified. |
ECB bang on as usual, and very well put as usual. |  | | |
| Equality in football on 22:04 - Jan 9 with 2024 views | MrSwerve |
Well we've had people calling him Thomas 'hitzleturdburglar' on this forum already... |  |
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| Equality in football on 23:00 - Jan 9 with 1973 views | Free_Willy |
The main problems with this is the crowd chanting and the football banter between players.
Crowd chanting can be dealt with relatively easily (at least in northern europe) as its pretty similar to racist chanting, so I don't personally see a problem with that side. However, in eastern and southern Europe may be problematic as it is with racist chanting.
Football banter as well as general attitudes to homosexuality in footballers on the other hand is something I would love to be studied to be commissioned by the PFA that properly breaks down players attitude by country of origin, age and attitudes to homosexuality, faith etc.
Because I think UK born players will be found to be more homo ambivalent as is our society. The only thing I find annoying is that gay people are stereotyped as being flaming queens, who I find are load and incredibly annoying thrusting their sexuality in your face. The 2 gay friends I have are normal people, who don't thrust their sexuality in your face.
Maybe having a gay footballer may change that stereotype hopefully, but I don't care where he sticks John Thomas period it's his personal life. All I care is how he performs on the pitch, if he likes men, women, cushions is irrelevant. |  | | |
| Equality in football on 23:05 - Jan 9 with 1968 views | yescomeon |
Wouldn't be the first German to be feared in the showers |  |
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| Equality in football on 23:27 - Jan 9 with 1938 views | jackportis |
| Equality in football on 18:59 - Jan 9 by Davillin |
First a disclaimer. I don't give a damm about anybody's sexual preferences as long as they don't hurt anyone else by it.
But I have great difficulty understanding why anyone thinks it is necessary for someone to announce his sexual preferences to the world. Even at my advanced age, I have never felt the need to make an announcement that I'm straight. Those who matter to me know that I am without being told, and that's enough for me.
Perhaps those who demand that gays self-identify demand it as self-justification for their own behaviour. And perhaps those who hold press conferences to announce their gaiety are seeking attention, or some kind of atonement.
Finally, in this maddening world, the old precept that we should "live and let live" has lost its place. Regrettably! |
When you say about sexual preferences not hurting anyone else by it... i recon its gotta hurt taking it up the rear. |  |
| Jackportis the brand. “A gifted posterâ€, “planet swans have a real talent on their hands in the name of Jackportis†sky sports 2018. . JP fully supports posters of LBG, mx orientation and ethnic minority groups. Update - now fully supporting the pansexual community. |
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| Equality in football on 01:50 - Jan 10 with 1888 views | Lohengrin |
| Equality in football on 22:04 - Jan 9 by MrSwerve |
Well we've had people calling him Thomas 'hitzleturdburglar' on this forum already... |
Fair play, I think the bloke himself would laugh at that. |  |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Equality in football on 02:12 - Jan 10 with 1879 views | Lohengrin |
| Equality in football on 18:59 - Jan 9 by Davillin |
First a disclaimer. I don't give a damm about anybody's sexual preferences as long as they don't hurt anyone else by it.
But I have great difficulty understanding why anyone thinks it is necessary for someone to announce his sexual preferences to the world. Even at my advanced age, I have never felt the need to make an announcement that I'm straight. Those who matter to me know that I am without being told, and that's enough for me.
Perhaps those who demand that gays self-identify demand it as self-justification for their own behaviour. And perhaps those who hold press conferences to announce their gaiety are seeking attention, or some kind of atonement.
Finally, in this maddening world, the old precept that we should "live and let live" has lost its place. Regrettably! |
You're spot on, Dav. Why there has to be such a song and dance baffles me. I can't see for the life of me why this chap "had to wait" until he'd retired to announce his proclivities or indeed why he felt the compunction to tell complete strangers at all?
I'm all for gay footballers, personally. What the Hell! It's Saturday afternoon entertainment at the end of the day and my enjoyment of the spectacle would be enhanced ten-fold come February if one of Cardiff's defenders emerges from the tunnel dressed as Ethel Merman...  | |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Equality in football on 08:18 - Jan 10 with 1782 views | 1jack |
| Equality in football on 23:27 - Jan 9 by jackportis |
When you say about sexual preferences not hurting anyone else by it... i recon its gotta hurt taking it up the rear. |
How old? |  | | |
| Equality in football on 08:21 - Jan 10 with 1779 views | Lord_Bony |
Remember justin Fashanu of Notts Forest...great player at the time he was only one of two professional players ever to come out and admit their gay.
15 years later he hanged himself because of the pressure.
This is no joke.
professional footballers cannot come out until they retire...FACT. |  |
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| Equality in football on 08:58 - Jan 10 with 1760 views | Lohengrin |
| Equality in football on 08:21 - Jan 10 by Lord_Bony |
Remember justin Fashanu of Notts Forest...great player at the time he was only one of two professional players ever to come out and admit their gay.
15 years later he hanged himself because of the pressure.
This is no joke.
professional footballers cannot come out until they retire...FACT. |
Like I said earlier in the thread why "come out" at all. Where does this desire to open up your private life to complete strangers come from? | |
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| Equality in football on 09:14 - Jan 10 with 1750 views | Free_Willy |
Unfortunately Footballers are now celebrities so now we must know every detail of their so called amazing lives. 90 minutes on the pitch and that's it for me don't care about wags manbags or what car they drive. | | | |
| Equality in football on 09:53 - Jan 10 with 1727 views | jackb |
says it all really!! |  | | |
| Equality in football on 10:00 - Jan 10 with 1722 views | perchrockjack |
Sad and maybe not necessary to announce a coming out but the fact is many are still not in the 21st century and the fact that some are born with genes making them homosexual.
Its not a big deal really but it is to some clearly and something to ridicule or be disgusted about | |
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| Equality in football on 10:09 - Jan 10 with 1715 views | Lohengrin |
| Equality in football on 09:53 - Jan 10 by jackb |
says it all really!! |
Indeed it does. He comes across as the creepy, whinging, detachedly odd poster boy for lefties everywhere. He so desperately wanted to be regarded as the cool, cerebral outsider it must have sent him home crying into his Camus every night when the Chelsea lads wouldn't play along.
I especially liked the passage where Andy Townsend told him The Guardian was a crap paper for sport and the boys on the bus all laughed......oh! the heartless brutes.
Cracking full-back in his time though, in fairness. | |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Equality in football on 10:23 - Jan 10 with 1692 views | Uxbridge |
| Equality in football on 08:21 - Jan 10 by Lord_Bony |
Remember justin Fashanu of Notts Forest...great player at the time he was only one of two professional players ever to come out and admit their gay.
15 years later he hanged himself because of the pressure.
This is no joke.
professional footballers cannot come out until they retire...FACT. |
Well it's not a fact, it's a choice. A tough one either way, but still a choice.
I can't fathom Dav's line of argument that he can't understand why a homosexual in the public eye has to declare it. It's pretty self-evident. I rather think most in football would find it a relief if a high-profile player actually outed themselves ... in terms of sheer statistics, many surely are and to remove the question from the discussion would be a pretty big step forward. I don't think Hitzlsperger has been particularly brave or moved the discussion on all that much really ... would have had 100 times more impact if he'd done so a few years earlier.
As for le Saux, he might be a bit of a whinging grauniad reading bore but I found that article rather interesting. Partly because it confirmed my thoughts on the likes of Townsend and Savage (there's an irony on the latter eh), partly because Gwyn Williams fancied himself as a Windsor Davies but partly because it can't have been much fun for him and it was interesting to read his opinion. Frankly it was straight-out bullying on an industrial scale. Quite horrid really. I think football, and society, have moved on from then ... while things would still be said, the spite would have gone for the majority. |  |
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