| JFH 18:16 - Dec 18 with 9148 views | traininvain |
Honest answer, do you think we would have been relegated under Hasselbaink?
The football wasn't great but I don't think we'd have gone down. Feels like a massive gamble / unnecessary risk to have sacked him and hired a manager who doesn't know this group of players.
Not calling for Holloway's head as that would clearly be ridiculous at this stage.
But still don't really understand the logic behind the decision to sack Hasselbaink mid season when we were not in the bottom three or even near.
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| JFH on 23:31 - Dec 18 with 1940 views | Northolt_Rs |
| JFH on 23:19 - Dec 18 by PunteR |
Unfortunately my mind tells me those games did happen, as well as the 5 games on the trot we've just lost. There's positives and negatives to both Holloway and JFH. My issue with the whole thing is i feel the JFH sacking was completely unnecessary.
I want Holloway to succeed and i think he has the ability to succeed. I just don't see him given the time to do it, and tbh why should Holloway be given more time than JFH?
I think Holloway needs to be given money to spend in January to get his players in and regardless what division we are playing in ,he needs to be backed.
Like another poster pointed out, it seems when thing were going wrong for JFH it was JFH fault. When things are going wrong for Holloway its JFH players fault. |
Our esteemed DoF built this team. Nobody else to blame for that one. |  |
| Scooters, Tunes, Trainers and QPR. |
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| JFH on 23:49 - Dec 18 with 1919 views | PunteR |
| JFH on 23:31 - Dec 18 by Northolt_Rs |
Our esteemed DoF built this team. Nobody else to blame for that one. |
Nobody else to blame?
Yeh i'm sure LF wants to be signing L1 players and work under the FFP restrictions. Whose fault is that?
He's been given the budget and a remit to scout lower league players who see QPR as a step up. He's done that.
He's helped bring in some good players, Smithies springs to mind.
Hall, Bidwell,Lynch,Cousins,Luongo, Wszolek, Borysaki(sp) even Washington are good young players that should be doing better atm but in time will do well. Its a new squad.
Compare that to the overpaid mercenaries we had before LF came here. |  |
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| JFH on 00:08 - Dec 19 with 1897 views | LythamR |
We were not going down under JFH and we were not going down under Ramsey Both should have been given more time even though the Football was mindnumbing under JFH for sure
And we are not going down under Holloway, we dont have a great squad but we have enough to achieve mediocrity and thats what we will do by the end of the season. it might be bumpy for another month but we will eventually string a few wins together once Holloway has experimented and then worked out the best use of the assets at his disposal |  | | |
| JFH on 01:12 - Dec 19 with 1847 views | DannytheR |
Hasselbaink wasn't sacked because there was a danger of relegation under him. He was sacked because fans were disappearing from HQ like victims of a mass alien abduction, his personality was off-putting, the football terrible, and there was enough ugly speculation about why he was in the job to poison the atmosphere around the club. Until such time as he makes a run for it a la Caterham, Fernandes is desperate to keep us all on side - hence the Spanish archer for Jimmy.
And now relegation clearly *is* a real possibility. Talk about unforeseen consequences.
If we're honest, the manager who was unfairly treated is Ramsey. We were playing decent football with no risk of going down at a time the club was crying out for a season of consolidation. Then TF decided Austin and Phillips spending 90 minutes working hard not to get injured should be enough to get us promoted, the crowd hounded him out of the job, and since then we've had unwatchable football and now an increasingly likely return to League One. |  | | |
| JFH on 05:10 - Dec 19 with 1801 views | dixiedean |
| JFH on 18:33 - Dec 18 by Pablo_Hoopsta |
NO - I don't think we would have gone down and I do think we were hasty (to say the least) in firing him. I would have called this a 'challenging' season for him and his report card at the end of the season would probably have said 'must do better' and he'd be warned. And who knows, maybe he would have learned all he needed in this challenging season and we would all have reaped the rewards next season. After all, I thought that was the plan?
But he was fired, and now we have a new manager who is struggling with the team, and they are probably struggling with a new regime too. It's gone rather badly so far but I remain confident that we will not go down, and I will support Holloway the same (or probably a bit more due to his past with us) as I did the last manager. |
Crikey Pablo . Some common sense being posted amid all the silly playground spats. When we're in the kind of run as we are a bit of unity might help instead of all the infighting going on here and at matches e.g. Robinson and now Chief by all accounts. For a team on a bad run I thought we tried to pass the ball well today despite low confidence but clearly we have no goal threat. Any good young Prem strikers we can get on loan? Anyone else got anything sensible to say apart from my dad's bigger than your dad? |  | | |
| JFH on 06:20 - Dec 19 with 1788 views | distortR |
| JFH on 20:01 - Dec 18 by bosh67 |
Very difficult to answer.
At this stage JFH had a lot more luck than Ollie is having.
We won at Fulham having been torn a new one for most of the game there. Followed by a draw at Forest where we were torn a new one for quite a lot of the game. So 4 points after one of the most abject displays against Brentford at Loftus Road for many a year. And we also forget the 6 nil smashing by Newcastle that really should have been 12.
It's easy to look back and say JFH was duller but better. I remember his football as just plain dull. Possibly a little more solid but to even be fair to JFH he took over from Ramsey, who was out of his depth, who was thrown in after Harry walked out on us, who came in after Hughes f*cked the club up.
So the bottom line is perhaps even Guardiola would have found it difficult to get much more out of us. It's been a sticking plaster on the Titanic for years. But Ramsey, JFH and now Ollie have all essentially inherited a sinking ship. It depends if Ollie has enough plasters to patch it up.
We are horribly unbalanced. Almost no punch down the left. Not enough up front and not enough play making in the middle. I think the defence comes under far too much pressure because of what's not ahead of them. |
Ollie had some luck in the first game in Olsson's brainfart, and then a run of eminently winnable games. So in many ways, i suppose, if you were going to off jfh, and i understand the decision, the timing was right. I probably wouldn't have sacked him because on the back of that draw at forest the players were still very much behind him. [Post edited 19 Dec 2016 6:25]
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| JFH on 07:15 - Dec 19 with 1757 views | daveB |
I don't think we'd have gone down under JFH and don't think we will under Holloway either.
We are on a very bad run but thought we played pretty well in the last 2 games, just lack a final ball and Chery has gone off the boil at the worst time |  | | |
| JFH on 08:50 - Dec 19 with 1697 views | CorbyQPR |
But that is the problem & is very often a trait of teams that get relegated. They play well & still lose. Very quickly a defeatist mentality sets in.. | | | |
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| JFH on 08:54 - Dec 19 with 1687 views | Toast_R |
I think QPR will go down now. I said it at the start of the season that things can repeat themselves and I think it's happening again just like when we fell out the Prem in 1996. A mediocre season back in the second tier followed by one where we reckon we should be challenging but it all goes south and we are scrapping to stay in it just like 97/98. Even the timing of managerial changes is similar.
QPR are losing both home and away matches to teams beneath them (have been all season) and that is THE recipe for relegation. The current squad just don't have enough goals in them to trouble anyone. They'll be alright in League 1 though. |  | | |
| JFH on 08:57 - Dec 19 with 1684 views | Dorse |
I think we've always pulled the trigger either too early or too late. Colin was too early, Hughes and Redknapp were tolerated for too long, Ramsey and JFH too early.
For me, the key moment was letting Redknapp stay on after promotion. That was precisely the time to move him on. It would have worked for both parties: we'd get the 'clean slate' we needed, his stock would be high enough to be able to pull down someone else's pants before screaming 'grease me up - I'm going in!' But, as usual, the ever-accommodating milk-fed gimp that is QPR mumbled 'Yes please' around it's ball-gag and the rest is history. Ever-repeating, arse-numbing history. |  |
| 'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!' |
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| JFH on 09:08 - Dec 19 with 1675 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| JFH on 01:12 - Dec 19 by DannytheR |
Hasselbaink wasn't sacked because there was a danger of relegation under him. He was sacked because fans were disappearing from HQ like victims of a mass alien abduction, his personality was off-putting, the football terrible, and there was enough ugly speculation about why he was in the job to poison the atmosphere around the club. Until such time as he makes a run for it a la Caterham, Fernandes is desperate to keep us all on side - hence the Spanish archer for Jimmy.
And now relegation clearly *is* a real possibility. Talk about unforeseen consequences.
If we're honest, the manager who was unfairly treated is Ramsey. We were playing decent football with no risk of going down at a time the club was crying out for a season of consolidation. Then TF decided Austin and Phillips spending 90 minutes working hard not to get injured should be enough to get us promoted, the crowd hounded him out of the job, and since then we've had unwatchable football and now an increasingly likely return to League One. |
If we're honest, the manager who was unfairly treated is Ramsey. We were playing decent football with no risk of going down at a time the club was crying out for a season of consolidation. Then TF decided Austin and Phillip spending 90 minutes working hard not to get injured should be enough to get us promoted
Apples and Oranges
The squad is far worse now and that's the real reason we are in a mess.
As I understand it CR is the Technical Director. I take it he is not doing the twitter account so must still be involved in the recruitment and development of players ? or is he just sitting in a back office somewhere counting his money ? [Post edited 19 Dec 2016 9:51]
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| JFH on 09:15 - Dec 19 with 1662 views | terryb |
| JFH on 23:19 - Dec 18 by PunteR |
Unfortunately my mind tells me those games did happen, as well as the 5 games on the trot we've just lost. There's positives and negatives to both Holloway and JFH. My issue with the whole thing is i feel the JFH sacking was completely unnecessary.
I want Holloway to succeed and i think he has the ability to succeed. I just don't see him given the time to do it, and tbh why should Holloway be given more time than JFH?
I think Holloway needs to be given money to spend in January to get his players in and regardless what division we are playing in ,he needs to be backed.
Like another poster pointed out, it seems when thing were going wrong for JFH it was JFH fault. When things are going wrong for Holloway its JFH players fault. |
I agree with every word of this apart from that Holloway has the ability to succeed.
However, I DO NOT want the club to dismiss him. We should give him time to try to bring the team out of the current slump. If he is unable to, I expect that Ollie will admit defeat & resign. One thing that can't be aimed at him is that he is not a man of honour.
I certainly agree that Holloway should not be given more time than any other manager should have been . That is a condemnation of our senior management changing their stated policy every three months though & TF hitting the panic button!
Would we have been relegated under JFH? I don't think so, but it certainly was a possibility.
Will we be relegated under Holloway? I don't think so, but it certainly is a possibility.
One thing I'm sure of is that changing manager has not improved our chances of avoiding relegation! | | | |
| JFH on 11:11 - Dec 19 with 1615 views | Dorse |
| JFH on 09:08 - Dec 19 by 2Thomas2Bowles |
If we're honest, the manager who was unfairly treated is Ramsey. We were playing decent football with no risk of going down at a time the club was crying out for a season of consolidation. Then TF decided Austin and Phillip spending 90 minutes working hard not to get injured should be enough to get us promoted
Apples and Oranges
The squad is far worse now and that's the real reason we are in a mess.
As I understand it CR is the Technical Director. I take it he is not doing the twitter account so must still be involved in the recruitment and development of players ? or is he just sitting in a back office somewhere counting his money ? [Post edited 19 Dec 2016 9:51]
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I'm not sure that Ramsey has much to do with it. His role is aimed at the development and Academy sides:
From the Offish: '(Ramsey) will oversee all aspects of coaching and coach education within the Academy, and be responsible for developing and implementing player development strategies.
He will also oversee the integration between the Academy, Development Squad and First Team, as well as focusing on the monitoring and reporting of players on loan to other clubs.'
http://www.qpr.co.uk/news/article/chris-ramsey-appointed-technical-director-2885
With that in mind, it looks like he's doing a reasonable job. Just looking at the kids on the verge of First Team action: Shodipo, Kakay, Petrasso, Hamalainen and Chris Paul have all signed new contracts recently, Furlong and Doughty are playing well at Swindon, Ebereche Eze looks the part, there are a number of others, Finney for example, who have recently come in and we actually took a transfer fee for Kpekawa! | |
| 'What do we want? We don't know! When do we want it? Now!' |
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| JFH on 11:21 - Dec 19 with 1600 views | 2Thomas2Bowles |
| JFH on 11:11 - Dec 19 by Dorse |
I'm not sure that Ramsey has much to do with it. His role is aimed at the development and Academy sides:
From the Offish: '(Ramsey) will oversee all aspects of coaching and coach education within the Academy, and be responsible for developing and implementing player development strategies.
He will also oversee the integration between the Academy, Development Squad and First Team, as well as focusing on the monitoring and reporting of players on loan to other clubs.'
http://www.qpr.co.uk/news/article/chris-ramsey-appointed-technical-director-2885
With that in mind, it looks like he's doing a reasonable job. Just looking at the kids on the verge of First Team action: Shodipo, Kakay, Petrasso, Hamalainen and Chris Paul have all signed new contracts recently, Furlong and Doughty are playing well at Swindon, Ebereche Eze looks the part, there are a number of others, Finney for example, who have recently come in and we actually took a transfer fee for Kpekawa! |
Well good that's his level and should never have been the first team coach. | |
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| JFH on 12:01 - Dec 19 with 1575 views | PinnerPaul |
| JFH on 20:01 - Dec 18 by johncharles |
We were sliding to relegation in some kind of trance. JFH seemed to be in another world. |
Nonsense, we were 10 points from bottom three and never looked like losing 5, 6, 7 on the bounce.
Never looked like going on a winning run either tbf or scoring more than 2, but looking at the facts, rather than opinions, we were much better off under JFH. | | | |
| JFH on 12:04 - Dec 19 with 1460 views | daveB |
| JFH on 12:01 - Dec 19 by PinnerPaul |
Nonsense, we were 10 points from bottom three and never looked like losing 5, 6, 7 on the bounce.
Never looked like going on a winning run either tbf or scoring more than 2, but looking at the facts, rather than opinions, we were much better off under JFH. |
Sorry but we did look like we could go on a losing run under Hasselbaink, I'm not sure the results would have been much different under him | | | |
| JFH on 12:09 - Dec 19 with 1443 views | thame_hoops |
Does anyone know how Ollie compares to Paul Hart, in terms of win percentage in his 2nd stint?
thanks |  | | |
| JFH on 12:14 - Dec 19 with 1432 views | dolcelatte |
| JFH on 12:09 - Dec 19 by thame_hoops |
Does anyone know how Ollie compares to Paul Hart, in terms of win percentage in his 2nd stint?
thanks |
Hart was P5 W1 D2 L2 |  |
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| JFH on 12:16 - Dec 19 with 1424 views | PinnerPaul |
| JFH on 12:04 - Dec 19 by daveB |
Sorry but we did look like we could go on a losing run under Hasselbaink, I'm not sure the results would have been much different under him |
We never lost more than two in a row and this season never failed to score in 2 consecutive games, so really not sure how anyone can conclude from his stats that we would go on a run as bad as we are now - not backed up by the form at all. | | | |
| JFH on 12:19 - Dec 19 with 1409 views | daveB |
| JFH on 12:16 - Dec 19 by PinnerPaul |
We never lost more than two in a row and this season never failed to score in 2 consecutive games, so really not sure how anyone can conclude from his stats that we would go on a run as bad as we are now - not backed up by the form at all. |
you wouldn't conclude we'd go on this type of run after the Norwich game either but it happens. I wasn't calling for JFH to go but really can't rewrite his spell with us, we were pretty dire most of the time. | | | |
| JFH on 12:22 - Dec 19 with 1393 views | thame_hoops |
| JFH on 12:14 - Dec 19 by dolcelatte |
Hart was P5 W1 D2 L2 |
thanks!!
crikey.......  | | | |
| JFH on 12:45 - Dec 19 with 1364 views | PinnerPaul |
| JFH on 12:19 - Dec 19 by daveB |
you wouldn't conclude we'd go on this type of run after the Norwich game either but it happens. I wasn't calling for JFH to go but really can't rewrite his spell with us, we were pretty dire most of the time. |
its all guesswork Dave I agree, but its a bit harsh to say I'm "rewriting his spell" by just quoting the facts! | | | |
| JFH on 16:00 - Dec 19 with 1299 views | timcocking |
Absolutely not. Now though, were going down. |  | | |
| JFH on 16:09 - Dec 19 with 1289 views | SimonJames |
No. We would have finished about 11th. |  |
| 100% of people who drink water will die. |
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| JFH on 23:16 - Dec 19 with 1206 views | isawqpratwcity |
| JFH on 12:19 - Dec 19 by daveB |
you wouldn't conclude we'd go on this type of run after the Norwich game either but it happens. I wasn't calling for JFH to go but really can't rewrite his spell with us, we were pretty dire most of the time. |
And by 'dire' you mean, what, 'dull', 'uninspiring'? Surely not 'ineffective', which is what our last five games have been. At least JFH kept the point meter ticking over.
Hasselbaink's sacking isn't remotely defensible on the basis that you 'could see us going on a losing streak under him'.
It isn't even defensible on the basis of him alienating supporters unless you consider 'boring football' more aversive than relegation.
Warnock's sacking proved that dismissal, while a rational response to a developing set of circumstances, can easily bring in a new set of problems.
Sometimes I despair of this club and it's supporters. [Post edited 19 Dec 2016 23:18]
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