| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts 23:22 - Aug 7 with 18690 views | KeithHaynes |
A young man who wants to play football.
Sunday evening supplement. From 5pm.
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 18:44 - Aug 11 with 1602 views | jasper_T |
You think players make up only half a club's wage bill, then? Where did you source these numbers from? | | | |
| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 18:47 - Aug 11 with 1590 views | Dr_Parnassus |
I don’t think, I know.
Any that significantly stand out that you disagree with?
I’m sure Keith can address your objections.
Player Name Weekly Wage Yearly Salary Age Position Nationality
André Ayew £83,000 £4,316,000 30 AM (RL), ST (C) Ghana
Ryan Bennett £23,000 £1,196,000 30 D (C) England
Kasey Palmer £20,000 £1,040,000 23 M (C), AM (RLC) England
Connor Roberts £14,000 £728,000 24 D/WB (RL) Wales
Kyle Naughton £14,000 £728,000 31 D (RL) England
Morgan Gibbs-White £14,000 £728,000 20 M/AM (C) England
Jamal Lowe £12,000 £624,000 26 AM (RLC), ST (C) England
George Byers £11,000 £572,000 24 M/AM (C) Scotland
Jake Bidwell £10,000 £520,000 27 D/WB (L) England
Ryan Manning £10,000 £520,000 24 D/WB (L), M (LC) Ireland
Matt Grimes £10,000 £520,000 25 DM, M (C) England
Freddie Woodman £9,300 £483,600 23 GK England
Declan John £8,400 £436,800 25 D/WB (L) Wales
Jay Fulton £8,100 £421,200 26 M/AM (C) Scotland
Wayne Routledge £7,400 £384,800 35 M/AM (RL), ST (C) England
Korey Smith £7,000 £364,000 29 DM, M (C) England
Joel Latibeaudiere £6,100 £317,200 20 D (C) England
Marc Guehi £4,900 £254,800 20 D (LC) England
Viktor Gyökeres £4,500 £234,000 22 AM (RL), ST (C) Sweden
Yan Dhanda £4,300 £223,600 21 M/AM (C) England
Ben Cabango £3,500 £182,000 20 D (C) Wales
Jordi Govea £2,100 £109,200 21 D/WB (L) Ecuador
Liam Cullen £2,000 £104,000 21 ST (C) Wales
Steven Benda £1,600 £83,200 21 GK Germany
Adrian Akande £1,500 £78,000 16 AM (RLC), ST (C) Nigeria
Jordon Garrick £910 £47,320 22 AM (R), ST (C) England
Harry Jones £580 £30,160 16 D (R) Wales
Harry Pinchard £530 £27,560 18 DM, M (C) Wales
Tivonge Rushesha £510 £26,520 18 D (R) Wales
Joe Lewis £510 £26,520 20 D (RLC) Wales
Player Name Weekly Wage Yearly Salary Age Position Nationality
Ali Al-Hamadi £500 £26,000 18 ST (C) Iraq
Matt Blake £480 £24,960 20 D/WB (L) Wales
Cameron Evans £430 £22,360 19 D (C) Wales
Daniel Williams £420 £21,840 19 DM, M (C) Wales
Jamie Searle £410 £21,320 19 GK New Zealand
Bradley Gibbings £390 £20,280 18 AM (R), ST (C) Wales
Lewis Webb £390 £20,280 18 GK Wales
Jacob Jones £360 £18,720 18 D (L) Wales
Oliver Cooper £360 £18,720 20 AM (LC) Wales
Jake Thomas £310 £16,120 18 D (C) Wales
Rio Campbell £280 £14,560 17 M/AM (RL), ST (C) England
Ryan Bevan £230 £11,960 18 D/WB (R), M (C) Wales
Josh Thomas £145 £7,540 17 ST (C) Wales
Scott Butler £145 £7,540 17 D (C) Wales
Cameron Congreve £145 £7,540 16 AM (C) Wales
Adnaan Moti £145 £7,540 17 M/AM (C) England
Kai Ludvigsen £145 £7,540 16 D (C) Wales
Michael Murphy £145 £7,540 17 M/AM (R) Wales
Morgan Clarke £145 £7,540 17 M (C) Wales
Cian Williams £145 £7,540 17 D (L) Wales
Erick Kenko £145 £7,540 17 M (C) England
Aaron Hillier £145 £7,540 16 M (L) Wales
Ruben Davies £145 £7,540 16 ST (C) Wales
Alex Rutter £145 £7,540 19 GK England
Joshua Hutchings £145 £7,540 17 GK Wales
Ryan Bassett £145 £7,540 16 D (C) Wales
Panashe Makokowe £145 £7,540 17 D (R) England
Joshua Edwards £145 £7,540 16 M (C) Wales
Kian Jenkins £145 £7,540 16 D (L) Wales
Jacob Edwards £145 £7,540 16 D (R) Wales
Dylan Perkins £145 £7,540 16 DM, M (C) Wales
Tyler Evans £117 £6,084 16 GK Wales [Post edited 11 Aug 2021 18:51]
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 19:00 - Aug 11 with 1566 views | jackrmee |
Very interesting.
Where the eff is Govea then? Hasn't played one game has he? So much buzz when he signed from Real | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 19:03 - Aug 11 with 1552 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Released, there are a few on there that shouldn’t be earning anywhere near that.
Declan John being a prime example. You can see why these players are being shifted on. Byers is another. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 19:13 - Aug 11 with 1542 views | ReslovenSwan1 |
Wages is only part of the equation. What about all the other expenditures. Some clubs were paying for wages on loans and debt. What is not in doubt is that Cooper had a excellent squad with Brewster, Guehi , Ayew and co. (the envy of the division)
Teams Swansea beat simply could not afford the loan fees and preferred longer term policies. I did not state Swansea could not afford the loans.
The club is now going for a more long term path incorporating / utilising the young prospects already at the club. Cooper did not fancy this longer term strategy. This strategy which is obvious must be supported by Winter, Allen and the US management. I believe they will give Martin extra time to build the squad. My suggestion that 'Levien realises......' is an indication that he is on the ball with the strategy which I believe to be the case.
Potter had a fantastic chance but his recruitment man let him down wasting £7m on players ditched by Cooper.
Cooper left Swansea to become unemployed not to move onto bigger and better things. Others moved onto bigger challenges. Cooper declined to full fill his contract.
You stated "Cooper in his second year finished around where his budgets suggested he should". Cooper only did 2 seasons. He probably did a little better in fact but not by that much. His third season never happened. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 19:53 - Aug 11 with 1492 views | jasper_T |
I can tell they've sourced numbers from the Football Manager videogames because Tyler Evans' wage is a typo I made in the database.
Wages of UK players are not public don't take lists like this as factual.
Harry Pinchard never even signed a contract with us. Was on trial and then went to college in the US (came back this summer to train a bit). [Post edited 11 Aug 2021 19:55]
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 20:17 - Aug 11 with 1464 views | jackrmee |
This wage list is off a computer game? | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 20:21 - Aug 11 with 1461 views | Chief |
Haha wow now....
"Potter had a fantastic chance but his recruitment man let him down wasting £7m on players ditched by Cooper".
The only one of his own signings that he even played regularly himself was Celina! Potter himself 'ditched' John, Asoro, McKay well before Cooper was appointed. Dhanda only played 6 times under Potter.
You're contradicting what you said on another thread where you suggested that it was Levein that was the driving force in Cooper leaving because he didn't appreciate his style of football. Now you're saying here it was Cooper who walked out?
Yet again tangling yourself up in these slanted assumptions, fabrications and fantasies. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 21:05 - Aug 11 with 1418 views | jasper_T |
Some of the figures, not all.
The positions listed are definitely my work, and are shown in the standard FM format. | | | |
| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 21:06 - Aug 11 with 1411 views | jackrmee |
You work for FM? | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 21:09 - Aug 11 with 1404 views | jasper_T |
I do the Swans data. | | | |
| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 21:12 - Aug 11 with 1397 views | jackrmee |
Ah right. That's pretty cool.
Now the comments make sense haha. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 01:20 - Aug 12 with 1240 views | Dr_Parnassus |
So you reckon it’s about £500 a week off?
Some of these players salaries are public knowledge, from Ayew on 80k a week to Byers being on £10k ish, as confirmed by people on this site.
All of these will be there or there abouts, there are other online sources if you don’t like this one. They all fall in about 10% of each other (although Routledge tends to vary for some reason). Which ever way you look at it you are going to roughly get the figure I listed.
Meaning at worst it will be maybe a million out overall, but that would be every team being incorrect by a small margin together, so it makes little difference to the overall picture of where we sit in comparison to others.
So it’s clearly not £40m a year worth among that lot as you can see. That was obvious without looking surely? The numbers you have quoted from The Swiss Ramble is for the whole 321 staff list, as confirmed on Companies House.
Even if I gave you £25m to spend, you wouldn’t be able to realistically split that between the squad list. We all know what we roughly pay, as Keith has confirmed on several occasions on here.
[Post edited 12 Aug 2021 9:54]
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 01:34 - Aug 12 with 1232 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Yep all other expenditures were similar, I have been through it all before on here. From salaries, to squad values to transfer fees.
There isn’t a way to twist it to make Coopers season last year or the one before look bad I’m afraid, I already did the donkey work months back when I could see certain people had an agenda and this reframing of reality was starting to become popular.
The salary comparisons are listed above, the transfer fee comparisons over 1 and 2 years are somewhere (I think we were around 16th) and the performance in relation to squad value. Out of the top 16 highest squad values in the league, we finished higher above our value than anyone else.
Yes I see where the confusion was, I meant the second year in this division (which was managed by Cooper) and the third. So in the first year we were abjectly short of budgets vs performance. Second year we were about right. Third year we finished way above budget vs performance.
It’s as simple as that. If you are trying to make a budget/performance angle work, you are probably trying that on the wrong person. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 01:43 - Aug 12 with 1228 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Back to salaries, this one is an updated one for this season, which is interesting.
This company works with a network of agents and sell the data they harvest. Some are verified, some have used an algo to give best estimates. Again they are there or there abouts with the other lists that are available online.
I forecasted around £11m from memory when projecting the wage bill for this year, slotting us somewhere in mid table. I assume when we do get the signings through the door then it will sit around that figure.
Now Ayew and the loans are out the door it’s got us at just shy of £9m (minus a couple of notable exceptions).
Flynn Downes isn’t there for example, which would tip that balance to over £9m and they also don’t have verified figures for Walsh, Piroe, Garrick, Joseph and Cullen so have them on ‘zero unlisted’, that puts us at around £10m p/a currently, which sounds about right. In that ball park.
While some of them may not be to the exact pounds and pence, I have no doubt they will be around the mark. Subscriptions to this site starts at $3000 USD per annum:-
https://capology.com/club/swansea/salaries/ [Post edited 12 Aug 2021 7:21]
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 01:45 - Aug 12 with 1226 views | Dr_Parnassus |
I scratched my head at that point too. Bizarre what depths are been scratched out in order to have a go at the manager that got us some of our best ever league finishes in this league in the clubs history. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 08:34 - Aug 12 with 1128 views | vetchonian |
You keep saying Cooper quit...yet the club paid him up for the remainder of his contract...if he just "quit" the club are not legally obliged to do so which to me indicates something else was happening in the background...given it appears it was Coopers legal that leaked that an announcement was imminent I suspect there might have been an issue of "constructive dismmisal" ..otherwise why should the club shell out funds just because as you intimate Cooper threw his toys out of the pram.. Maybe the clubs insitience on the level of compensation affected his negotioations with the clubs who showed an interest, maybe the owners renaged on certain promises they had made ....Cooper certainly didnt just walk.
You talk of strategies and policies and how the wonderful Potter was let down by his recruitment man but fail to say how Cooper was let down by you Amercian friends by sending him the two loanees you keep banging on about who had hardly palyed in 12 months when what we needed was another goal scorer of no 9 as Cooper kept requesting.
You are correct Coopers third season never happened maybe one day we will discover the real reason as to why...now we are all speculating but I am sure there is more to this than Cooper just throwing his toys out of the pram as he was going to end up with a weaker squad.....it seems the owners are happy to spend to "stregthen" this season.
DOnt forget, Cooper did not have Brewster for his second season and Geuhi was a very raw player in that forst season.....he was all over the place before Cooper changed to a back 5 after the covid break...you make it sound as though Swansea got the equivalent of JOhn Stones when Geuhi arrived.....there was at least 18 months of development time involved.Cooper in his second season had to deal with the loss of key players such as Van Der Hoorn and then Joe Rodon and had his most successful season without these two or Brewster.....Potter tinkered much too much and got lucky with Dan James coming alive in the second half of the season as he wanted to get himself a transfer ....by the way did the club pay Potter out the remaining years of his contract when he "quit" ? | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 09:12 - Aug 12 with 1083 views | Dr_Parnassus |
He also wasn't given them, he signed them, they arrived because of him not despite him. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 09:12 - Aug 12 with 1085 views | raynor94 |
To cut a long story short, the Club and Cooper parted by mutual consent. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 09:26 - Aug 12 with 1063 views | Dr_Parnassus |
But if Cooper had decided he wanted to stay no doubt he would have been offered a spanking new contract.
He refused to entertain the clubs approach to enter into a dialogue. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 09:38 - Aug 12 with 1042 views | 34dfgdf54 |
Yes, paid off. | | | |
| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 09:49 - Aug 12 with 1023 views | Dr_Parnassus |
I think they will regret not keeping him happy to the point he wouldn't accept their advances for a new contract.
Well, I think they already did as soon as they had to start asking for back up options after their replacement fell through.
But time will tell. They have said they will back RM, and that's exactly what they should have done prior to that. They need to, its the only way we can play the way he wants, is by bringing in the right people. Downes is a good start.
I can only assume they learned their lesson with that. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 09:59 - Aug 12 with 1009 views | jackrmee |
I don't think they'll regret it. And neither will any of us. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 10:00 - Aug 12 with 1005 views | Dr_Parnassus |
Time will tell I suppose.
If we are languishing in the league come January, you may still not be... but they will. I can guarantee you that. | |
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| Joel Piroe : Facing up to facts on 10:02 - Aug 12 with 998 views | jackrmee |
I think it's a longer term plan than that. Same as with Potter. I don't think any of the owners thought for one minute that we'd finish 6th and then 4th in Cooper's firsts seasons as a manager. | |
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