| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:04 - Nov 9 with 3030 views | HollowayRanger |
yep total joke
i hope all our soldiers have learned the lesson
TURN OFF THE BLOODY CAMERAS AND RECORDING DEVICES before shooting the scum |  |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:08 - Nov 9 with 3016 views | gueRRilla |
I considered linking this to Holloway's thread on the Marines yesterday. Raises some valid points. Personally I find it amazing that Marine A did six tours in Afghanistan. The guy's head must be absolutely melted.
Robert Fisk has written some great, very similar articles to this. |  | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:19 - Nov 9 with 2996 views | BrianMcCarthy |
Good point, and I would personally never vote for them. It's also true in many other countries that went from war to peace including South Africa, where Mandela was elected (not that I would ever suggest that Mandela and Adams were on the same plain). |  |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:20 - Nov 9 with 2993 views | MrSheen |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:08 - Nov 9 by gueRRilla |
I considered linking this to Holloway's thread on the Marines yesterday. Raises some valid points. Personally I find it amazing that Marine A did six tours in Afghanistan. The guy's head must be absolutely melted.
Robert Fisk has written some great, very similar articles to this. |
Like this one?
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/antisoviet-warrior-puts-his-army-on-the- |  | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:25 - Nov 9 with 2976 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:08 - Nov 9 by gueRRilla |
I considered linking this to Holloway's thread on the Marines yesterday. Raises some valid points. Personally I find it amazing that Marine A did six tours in Afghanistan. The guy's head must be absolutely melted.
Robert Fisk has written some great, very similar articles to this. |
I like Fisk's writing, have a couple of his books (lonnnnnnng!). He's educated a lot of people to the politics behind the wars and invasions. But he's a bit fond of himself, tends to make himself the story. | |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:28 - Nov 9 with 2972 views | WarfieldHoop |
Very bad situation and I'm sure (although I would hope not) that this sort of thing has happened countless times before, but it's clearly murder. |  | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:39 - Nov 9 with 2954 views | gueRRilla |
No. But the general thrust of his pieces have been, 'Take off your blinkers. British soldiers routinely commit war crimes. Iraq and Afghanistan are littered with countless human rights abuses.'
Can't find specifically what I was thinking of, but this comes reasonably close: http://www.counterpunch.org/2004/12/15/who-killed-baha-mousa/ | | | |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:44 - Nov 9 with 2949 views | BrianMcCarthy |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:39 - Nov 9 by gueRRilla |
No. But the general thrust of his pieces have been, 'Take off your blinkers. British soldiers routinely commit war crimes. Iraq and Afghanistan are littered with countless human rights abuses.'
Can't find specifically what I was thinking of, but this comes reasonably close: http://www.counterpunch.org/2004/12/15/who-killed-baha-mousa/ |
I wasn't that interested in atrocities or murders, really, when I read the piece. I like the point made re the politics behind sending young men into awful situations and the politics behind it. The last line is excellent, and I found it particularly interesting coming from a soldier.
'The culture of irrational and uncritical soldier worship serves only to blind us to the realities of war and occupation — and this contrived, blinding effect, I have long suspected, is rather the point of lionising the military.' | |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:11 - Nov 9 with 2922 views | HollowayRanger |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:44 - Nov 9 by BrianMcCarthy |
I wasn't that interested in atrocities or murders, really, when I read the piece. I like the point made re the politics behind sending young men into awful situations and the politics behind it. The last line is excellent, and I found it particularly interesting coming from a soldier.
'The culture of irrational and uncritical soldier worship serves only to blind us to the realities of war and occupation — and this contrived, blinding effect, I have long suspected, is rather the point of lionising the military.' |
love to know how many mp's children are in the front line of armed forces
CAN ONLY IMAGINE what the morale is after this
war is never pretty and bad things happen but im sure if it were the other way round our wonded troop would get the best of care from the enemy | |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:21 - Nov 9 with 2909 views | wood_hoop |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 11:44 - Nov 9 by BrianMcCarthy |
I wasn't that interested in atrocities or murders, really, when I read the piece. I like the point made re the politics behind sending young men into awful situations and the politics behind it. The last line is excellent, and I found it particularly interesting coming from a soldier.
'The culture of irrational and uncritical soldier worship serves only to blind us to the realities of war and occupation — and this contrived, blinding effect, I have long suspected, is rather the point of lionising the military.' |
It is a terrible thing that we ask any human to kill another, especially when the reasoning is very politically motivated.
No doubt that the Marine committed what would be regarded as a crime outside the theater of war, but we ask them to kill within rules that are contradictory to what they have been trained for, when it comes to war it is impossible to prevent so called 'war crimes' and though over the years some have been brought to trial it has not prevented appalling acts being committed by one faction against another.
This man did what was asked of him, he killed an enemy combatant, maybe not to the nonsensical 'Queensbury Rules' that have been set by
those sitting comfortably well behind the front lines but to the rules of all wars, kill or be killed.
Uncomfortable truth for many back home that it ain't like playing a computer game when involved in a profession where death can be just a nano second away at all times, no doubt their will be a wringing of hands at the act of this marine, you want this never to happen again, then disband our armed forces totally, that's the only way it will ever cease. |  | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:25 - Nov 9 with 2903 views | TacticalR |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:11 - Nov 9 by HollowayRanger |
love to know how many mp's children are in the front line of armed forces
CAN ONLY IMAGINE what the morale is after this
war is never pretty and bad things happen but im sure if it were the other way round our wonded troop would get the best of care from the enemy |
But things aren't 'the other way round' because Afghanistan has rarely invaded Britain. |  |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:31 - Nov 9 with 2893 views | NW5Hoop |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:21 - Nov 9 by wood_hoop |
It is a terrible thing that we ask any human to kill another, especially when the reasoning is very politically motivated.
No doubt that the Marine committed what would be regarded as a crime outside the theater of war, but we ask them to kill within rules that are contradictory to what they have been trained for, when it comes to war it is impossible to prevent so called 'war crimes' and though over the years some have been brought to trial it has not prevented appalling acts being committed by one faction against another.
This man did what was asked of him, he killed an enemy combatant, maybe not to the nonsensical 'Queensbury Rules' that have been set by
those sitting comfortably well behind the front lines but to the rules of all wars, kill or be killed.
Uncomfortable truth for many back home that it ain't like playing a computer game when involved in a profession where death can be just a nano second away at all times, no doubt their will be a wringing of hands at the act of this marine, you want this never to happen again, then disband our armed forces totally, that's the only way it will ever cease. |
The Geneva Convention is not some woolly minded liberal conspiracy to hamper our brave boys. It's a necessary set of rules to try to ensure that war, a bloody and desolate thing at the best of times, can at least be conducted with some knowledge that soldiers are not encouraged to turn into monsters.
Executing prisoners is a monstrous act. It should not be shrugged off. If we fight, as we like to claim, for justice, we cannot condone murder outside combat. | | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:37 - Nov 9 with 2883 views | HollowayRanger |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:25 - Nov 9 by TacticalR |
But things aren't 'the other way round' because Afghanistan has rarely invaded Britain. |
In 2009, the last Office for National Statistics (ONS) estimated that there are 56,000 Afghans living in the UK.
sounds like an invasion to me | |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:40 - Nov 9 with 2882 views | kropotkin41 |
The beginning and the end of this is that British soldiers should not be and should never have been in Afghanistan. Neither should they have been in Iraq.
If you train people to kill and then put them into a war zone they will do dreadful things; they will end up brutalised and a lot of people will end up dead.
Apparently we can't manage to keep the fabric of British society together, we have food banks to feed the hungry and the only people doing well are the people who always do well, yet we can afford to have the army in Afghanistan. |  |
| ‘morbid curiosity about where this is all going’ |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:41 - Nov 9 with 2880 views | NW5Hoop |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:37 - Nov 9 by HollowayRanger |
In 2009, the last Office for National Statistics (ONS) estimated that there are 56,000 Afghans living in the UK.
sounds like an invasion to me |
Oh, did they come here with guns and helicopters and start killing people? I hadn't noticed. | | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:50 - Nov 9 with 2871 views | Jigsore |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:37 - Nov 9 by HollowayRanger |
In 2009, the last Office for National Statistics (ONS) estimated that there are 56,000 Afghans living in the UK.
sounds like an invasion to me |
Deary me Holloway, when did you join the EDL? |  |
| “The thing about football - the important thing about football - is that it is not just about football.†|
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:54 - Nov 9 with 2865 views | HollowayRanger |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:50 - Nov 9 by Jigsore |
Deary me Holloway, when did you join the EDL? |
just being like wise flip | |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 15:22 - Nov 9 with 2769 views | wood_hoop |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:31 - Nov 9 by NW5Hoop |
The Geneva Convention is not some woolly minded liberal conspiracy to hamper our brave boys. It's a necessary set of rules to try to ensure that war, a bloody and desolate thing at the best of times, can at least be conducted with some knowledge that soldiers are not encouraged to turn into monsters.
Executing prisoners is a monstrous act. It should not be shrugged off. If we fight, as we like to claim, for justice, we cannot condone murder outside combat. |
I doubt there has ever been a conflict where the parties signed up to the convention have not violated them.
The Geneva Convention may be useful in bringing the worst of those transgressors to trial but it is unrealistic to expect highly trained killers in combat situations to not break some of the rules laid out.
I am not in anyway trying to put our armed forces onto pedestals, they do a service for this country that I am glad my son does not have to do , but then I also do not expect them to be whiter than white when they are asked to kill and maim in an arena where death can be the ultimate cost.
This soldier did not go in and wipe out a village full of innocent people, he killed someone who moments before had tried to kill him, maybe revenge was his motive and under the convention the dead man should have been taken prisoner but I can fully understand why he was not.
It is a dilemma many of our troops must face and this soldier knew he was 'breaking the rules' yet still went ahead and killed him, I would like to think that our army would weed out the truly psychotic from serving and that this soldier had reasons other than blood lust for his action.
We are putting people in enormously stressful situations that many of us will never have to face and expect them to live by the same rules as though they were back in civvy street, I do not think this man is a fallen hero, in my eyes a victim of the horrendous situation that my government has decided to put him into. | | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 17:14 - Nov 9 with 2702 views | BklynRanger |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:37 - Nov 9 by HollowayRanger |
In 2009, the last Office for National Statistics (ONS) estimated that there are 56,000 Afghans living in the UK.
sounds like an invasion to me |
That, even for you Holloway, is an embarassing statement |  | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 17:16 - Nov 9 with 2700 views | EalingRanger |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:37 - Nov 9 by HollowayRanger |
In 2009, the last Office for National Statistics (ONS) estimated that there are 56,000 Afghans living in the UK.
sounds like an invasion to me |
Ridiculous. |  | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 17:32 - Nov 9 with 2681 views | HollowayRanger |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 17:14 - Nov 9 by BklynRanger |
That, even for you Holloway, is an embarassing statement |
do you not get it
i was being flippant as i said if things were the other way round our wounded wouldnt stand a chance
then some clever clogs says things arent the other way round as afgans never invade uk
i dont want our soldiers over there they should never have been sent there full stop
but they are there though no fault of their own im sure none of them want to be and they have all lost mates 445 at the last count i think
some piece of scum tries to kill them and then they are expected to give him first aid ! how many of our soldiers are given first aid by the enemy?
if a uk soldier is going round killer unarmed civillians over there he should be shot! if he's killing terrorists wounded or not he should be given a medal! | |
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| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 18:23 - Nov 9 with 2631 views | hoopdog |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 17:32 - Nov 9 by HollowayRanger |
do you not get it
i was being flippant as i said if things were the other way round our wounded wouldnt stand a chance
then some clever clogs says things arent the other way round as afgans never invade uk
i dont want our soldiers over there they should never have been sent there full stop
but they are there though no fault of their own im sure none of them want to be and they have all lost mates 445 at the last count i think
some piece of scum tries to kill them and then they are expected to give him first aid ! how many of our soldiers are given first aid by the enemy?
if a uk soldier is going round killer unarmed civillians over there he should be shot! if he's killing terrorists wounded or not he should be given a medal! |
Can't say I've always agreed with your posts H but your objectors should try to put their selve's in a front line squaddies boots and see how they feel , nah the PC mob only believe the book is always right
What a jobs worth the investing police must be when he saw computer it would have easy just hit reject button | | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 18:38 - Nov 9 with 2607 views | THEBUSH |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 12:37 - Nov 9 by HollowayRanger |
In 2009, the last Office for National Statistics (ONS) estimated that there are 56,000 Afghans living in the UK.
sounds like an invasion to me |
Yep and we've been invading Afghanistan since 1839, how many Afghans were living here then !! |  | | |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 18:40 - Nov 9 with 2601 views | hoopstilidie |
| "Soldier worship blinds Britain to the grim reality of war" on 18:38 - Nov 9 by THEBUSH |
Yep and we've been invading Afghanistan since 1839, how many Afghans were living here then !! |
Not an invasion if you are invited to be there. |  |
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