| Those of you who like blaming the Government 02:13 - Apr 17 with 25061 views | DJack |
This is a very deserving article for your (our) ire.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-43784482
21st century Britain. |  |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 15:35 - Aug 23 with 2369 views | BarrySwan |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 15:12 - Aug 23 by oh_tommy_tommy |
Facking hell
So You’re alright jack ðŸ‘ðŸ»
Free food
I wonder if it’s because they are struggling to make ends meet [Post edited 23 Aug 2018 15:15]
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I'm sure there are people struggling to make ends meet, some due to government inefficiences with delaying benefit claims, delays that are unacceptable.
There are also charming young gentlemen such as the one featuring in a TV documentary a couple of months ago who picked his dole money up gambled and drunk it all away within a day or so and then cheerily announced that he was off up the food bank to get the food that presumably his benfits should have provided him with.
My point is....set up as many food banks as you wish they quite naturally mushroom as people grab free food (some admittedly who are struggling )
Which gives the handwringers the perfect opportunity to wail and whine about the need for ever more food banks and what a society that we live in.
Having been on the dole after suffering a work related knee injury and waiting for surgery I am well aware of challenge of feeding somebody on benefits and that sometimes you go without or are on stringent food rations for some time before the next cheque arrives.
I never found the need to go round begging for free food however I just went without and made do with what I had ( or didn't have) and got back to work to support myself after a short interval just as I and others have done throughout their entire working life.
If people or organisations wish to donate food to others then that great and entirely up to them isn't it?
But lets not have the ongoing 'what a society we live in' nonsense that the social justice warriors keep battering everyone with by illustrating the flourishing food bank trade.
Having worked as an engineer in homes all over the UK over the last 43 years from some of the most deprived areas to the richest the one thing that I never saw was any starving people despite the 'I've just donated to a food bank' wailers.
I did see people struggling for money and very much sympathised and still do sympathise with many pensioners struggling on a very small fixed income but still didn't see any people starving anywhere.
But of course we really really need previously unheard of food banks otherswise half the country would starve to death apparently. [Post edited 23 Aug 2018 15:46]
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 16:10 - Aug 23 with 2347 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 15:35 - Aug 23 by BarrySwan |
I'm sure there are people struggling to make ends meet, some due to government inefficiences with delaying benefit claims, delays that are unacceptable.
There are also charming young gentlemen such as the one featuring in a TV documentary a couple of months ago who picked his dole money up gambled and drunk it all away within a day or so and then cheerily announced that he was off up the food bank to get the food that presumably his benfits should have provided him with.
My point is....set up as many food banks as you wish they quite naturally mushroom as people grab free food (some admittedly who are struggling )
Which gives the handwringers the perfect opportunity to wail and whine about the need for ever more food banks and what a society that we live in.
Having been on the dole after suffering a work related knee injury and waiting for surgery I am well aware of challenge of feeding somebody on benefits and that sometimes you go without or are on stringent food rations for some time before the next cheque arrives.
I never found the need to go round begging for free food however I just went without and made do with what I had ( or didn't have) and got back to work to support myself after a short interval just as I and others have done throughout their entire working life.
If people or organisations wish to donate food to others then that great and entirely up to them isn't it?
But lets not have the ongoing 'what a society we live in' nonsense that the social justice warriors keep battering everyone with by illustrating the flourishing food bank trade.
Having worked as an engineer in homes all over the UK over the last 43 years from some of the most deprived areas to the richest the one thing that I never saw was any starving people despite the 'I've just donated to a food bank' wailers.
I did see people struggling for money and very much sympathised and still do sympathise with many pensioners struggling on a very small fixed income but still didn't see any people starving anywhere.
But of course we really really need previously unheard of food banks otherswise half the country would starve to death apparently. [Post edited 23 Aug 2018 15:46]
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Bless you for acknowledging their are people struggling using food banks in one of the richest countries in the world in 2018.
And yes there are kids starving in the uk right now in the school holidays living below the poverty line .
And we have people preaching to get on with it all over the place .
As this thread is about a failing government here’s a lovely little article about all that’s good since these fackers took over
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jul/25/britain-politicians-child- [Post edited 23 Aug 2018 16:11]
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:16 - Aug 23 with 2309 views | BarrySwan |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 16:10 - Aug 23 by oh_tommy_tommy |
Bless you for acknowledging their are people struggling using food banks in one of the richest countries in the world in 2018.
And yes there are kids starving in the uk right now in the school holidays living below the poverty line .
And we have people preaching to get on with it all over the place .
As this thread is about a failing government here’s a lovely little article about all that’s good since these fackers took over
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jul/25/britain-politicians-child- [Post edited 23 Aug 2018 16:11]
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I won't if you don't mind
The day that I take seriously anything thats printed in the tax haven registered Guardian is the day that I'll believe stories about hordes of starving kids and adults in Britain despite my own experiences being to the contrary.
Thats not to say that there are not cases of negligent and irresponsible parents neglecting their children.
But to suggest that people in the UK are starving on any sort of mass scale if it wasn't for food banks is to read the ramblings of loonytune fantasists.
It doesn't matter how many food banks there are....if people wish to donate food to others then thats up to them and best of luck to them.
But as the basis of a rant against any particular government it's pure political opportunist. nonsense. | | | |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:22 - Aug 23 with 2305 views | pikeypaul |
And they are still above Labour in the opinion polls.
Tells us all we need to know about Corbyn. |  |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:25 - Aug 23 with 2301 views | pikeypaul |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 23:34 - Aug 22 by burty |
Again I got to laugh, how many retail stores are closing banks closing, council cuts for young people NHS still struggling load of bull_hit people paying so much on bills its a joke. |
Retail stores and banks are closing because its 2018 and people realise it’s so much easier to do these things online.
It’s not rocket science. [Post edited 23 Aug 2018 21:26]
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:30 - Aug 23 with 2294 views | Jack_Meoff |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:22 - Aug 23 by pikeypaul |
And they are still above Labour in the opinion polls.
Tells us all we need to know about Corbyn. |
Polls exist for the purpose of influence, not to inform. The media serves the same purpose it could be argued. |  |
| If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever. |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 00:45 - Aug 24 with 2259 views | Jack_Meoff |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:16 - Aug 23 by BarrySwan |
I won't if you don't mind
The day that I take seriously anything thats printed in the tax haven registered Guardian is the day that I'll believe stories about hordes of starving kids and adults in Britain despite my own experiences being to the contrary.
Thats not to say that there are not cases of negligent and irresponsible parents neglecting their children.
But to suggest that people in the UK are starving on any sort of mass scale if it wasn't for food banks is to read the ramblings of loonytune fantasists.
It doesn't matter how many food banks there are....if people wish to donate food to others then thats up to them and best of luck to them.
But as the basis of a rant against any particular government it's pure political opportunist. nonsense. |
Should we though, in 2018, be a society where there's people that should be even approaching 'starving?' That it's even an option? The fact we need foodbanks is a disgrace, and it's also sad that there's those that would abuse them.
I concur about the Graun by the way, controlled opposition at best.
Speaking of media and tax havens, it never harms to remind who owns which media outlets in the UK.
Lord Rothermere, a billionaire living in France, owns the Mail, Mail on Sunday, and the Metro.
Rupert Murdoch, a billionaire living in Australia, owns the Sun, Sun on Sunday and is the man behind Fox News, BSkyB, News Corp, etc, etc.
Alexander and Evgeny (son) Lebedev, an Ex KGB Russian Billionaire, owns The Independent, Independent on Sunday, The Evening Standard.
Richard Desmond, a billionaire, owns the Daily Star, Sunday Star, Daily Express, Sunday Express.
David and Frederick Barclay, billionaire brothers living on a private island near Saark, own the Telegraph, The Spectator, and the Business.
I will never understand until my dying day why people buy newspapers in this day and age, though I guess it's a generational thing. Paying for your own disinformation? Insane. | |
| If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever. |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 01:50 - Aug 24 with 2245 views | Highjack |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:16 - Aug 23 by BarrySwan |
I won't if you don't mind
The day that I take seriously anything thats printed in the tax haven registered Guardian is the day that I'll believe stories about hordes of starving kids and adults in Britain despite my own experiences being to the contrary.
Thats not to say that there are not cases of negligent and irresponsible parents neglecting their children.
But to suggest that people in the UK are starving on any sort of mass scale if it wasn't for food banks is to read the ramblings of loonytune fantasists.
It doesn't matter how many food banks there are....if people wish to donate food to others then thats up to them and best of luck to them.
But as the basis of a rant against any particular government it's pure political opportunist. nonsense. |
Yeah we must be the only country in the world with both a youth starvation and a youth obesity crisis. |  |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 02:42 - Aug 24 with 2237 views | BarrySwan |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 00:45 - Aug 24 by Jack_Meoff |
Should we though, in 2018, be a society where there's people that should be even approaching 'starving?' That it's even an option? The fact we need foodbanks is a disgrace, and it's also sad that there's those that would abuse them.
I concur about the Graun by the way, controlled opposition at best.
Speaking of media and tax havens, it never harms to remind who owns which media outlets in the UK.
Lord Rothermere, a billionaire living in France, owns the Mail, Mail on Sunday, and the Metro.
Rupert Murdoch, a billionaire living in Australia, owns the Sun, Sun on Sunday and is the man behind Fox News, BSkyB, News Corp, etc, etc.
Alexander and Evgeny (son) Lebedev, an Ex KGB Russian Billionaire, owns The Independent, Independent on Sunday, The Evening Standard.
Richard Desmond, a billionaire, owns the Daily Star, Sunday Star, Daily Express, Sunday Express.
David and Frederick Barclay, billionaire brothers living on a private island near Saark, own the Telegraph, The Spectator, and the Business.
I will never understand until my dying day why people buy newspapers in this day and age, though I guess it's a generational thing. Paying for your own disinformation? Insane. |
Desmond has sold the Express to Trinity Mirror or Reach or whatever they've recently called themselves.
Trinity Mirror meanwhile are hoovering up just about every local paper in the UK that they can get their hands on in an alarming socialist leaning grab on the media.
Another alarming move in my view is that the BBC have rather bizarrely employed 160 or so young journalists called local democracy reporters and have placed them around the country with a brief to write reports on local democracy and political issues and make these reports available for publication to every media organisation or newspaper in their area many of which which now operate with only one or maybe two hard pressed reporters due to budget cuts.
I find this quite sinister given the BBC's clear left wing leanings in their normal news broadcasting and would also wonder why on earth the licence fee that we pay is being used to subsidise reporting on commercially owned local newspapers throughout the country.
Where is this starvation crisis that you mention? Where have you seen these starving hordes? [Post edited 24 Aug 2018 11:29]
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 14:11 - Aug 24 with 2184 views | Catullus |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 02:42 - Aug 24 by BarrySwan |
Desmond has sold the Express to Trinity Mirror or Reach or whatever they've recently called themselves.
Trinity Mirror meanwhile are hoovering up just about every local paper in the UK that they can get their hands on in an alarming socialist leaning grab on the media.
Another alarming move in my view is that the BBC have rather bizarrely employed 160 or so young journalists called local democracy reporters and have placed them around the country with a brief to write reports on local democracy and political issues and make these reports available for publication to every media organisation or newspaper in their area many of which which now operate with only one or maybe two hard pressed reporters due to budget cuts.
I find this quite sinister given the BBC's clear left wing leanings in their normal news broadcasting and would also wonder why on earth the licence fee that we pay is being used to subsidise reporting on commercially owned local newspapers throughout the country.
Where is this starvation crisis that you mention? Where have you seen these starving hordes? [Post edited 24 Aug 2018 11:29]
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Do Trinity own WOL? I ask because on most stories there is a link to a daily mirror story. | |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 15:37 - Aug 24 with 2152 views | BarrySwan |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 14:11 - Aug 24 by Catullus |
Do Trinity own WOL? I ask because on most stories there is a link to a daily mirror story. |
Yup as well as the Daily Post in North Wales and just about every other regional paper large and small.
It's quite scary how they've hoovered up so much of the nations news outlets. | | | |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 18:05 - Aug 24 with 2129 views | oh_tommy_tommy |
Fair points
Seems this guy agrees with it
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 23:46 - Aug 24 with 2102 views | Jack_Meoff |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 02:42 - Aug 24 by BarrySwan |
Desmond has sold the Express to Trinity Mirror or Reach or whatever they've recently called themselves.
Trinity Mirror meanwhile are hoovering up just about every local paper in the UK that they can get their hands on in an alarming socialist leaning grab on the media.
Another alarming move in my view is that the BBC have rather bizarrely employed 160 or so young journalists called local democracy reporters and have placed them around the country with a brief to write reports on local democracy and political issues and make these reports available for publication to every media organisation or newspaper in their area many of which which now operate with only one or maybe two hard pressed reporters due to budget cuts.
I find this quite sinister given the BBC's clear left wing leanings in their normal news broadcasting and would also wonder why on earth the licence fee that we pay is being used to subsidise reporting on commercially owned local newspapers throughout the country.
Where is this starvation crisis that you mention? Where have you seen these starving hordes? [Post edited 24 Aug 2018 11:29]
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Totally fair point re The Express, I'd forgotten about that. I've not seen it morph into the Morning Star in the meantime, at least from the headlines I see on the supermarket shelves. 
I was quoting you on the word 'starving' Baz. I'm wondering where you're getting your perspective about food banks from? You seem to be of the opinion that they're some kind of self fulfilling prophecy that encourages the 'feckless.' (Generalised quote.)
Have you ever been to one? Only in my last job I'd visited a few as we used to have tin collections so we used to drop them off occasionally when the basket was full. You'd have a variety of people there; from vulnerable adults to people who'd got into debt for whatever reason and everyone in between - they'd have have one thing in common though - they didn't want to be there. It was last chance saloon; nowhere else to go. It's not somewhere you'd generally rock up to to grab some Super Noodles and beans for tea after spunking your giro; you'd have to be referred there by a GP or (I think) social worker, and I think Dr Winston has said previously the job centre can signpost you there also.
Don't take my word for it anyway, or indeed the media's. Stick your head around the door of your local one and have a chat with a volunteer. That's where you'll get at least a true picture of the reality of the situation. It's a grim reality too pal just speaking from experience. [Post edited 25 Aug 2018 0:04]
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| If you want a vision of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--forever. |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 10:30 - Sep 10 with 1966 views | felixstowe_jack |
More bad news to blame on the Government .
In the three months to July, the economy expanded by 0.6%. | |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 15:11 - Sep 10 with 1896 views | Catullus |
There's a good reason for those things, the politicians are mostly rich, wannabe rich or rich peoples playthings so they cultivate connections....rich friends, and then they do what the rich friends want (I'm not accusing anyone of taking bribes or anything, they do it by listening to what is wanted, to opinions, then mirroring those needs and opinions in their actions though sometimes they will do as asked) so we have the government running the country for the wants and needs of the rich and priviliged. It's been true regardless who's in power.
Corbyn is different, he's in thrall to Momentum, McCluskey etc. Just as bad but in the other direction.
The worlds biggest problem is we have too many politicians and they feel too safe, priviliged and protected. We need to reduce the numbers and make them easily more accountable.
On the growth, 0.6% of a massive number is much preferable to 5% of booger all. | |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 16:18 - Sep 10 with 1875 views | Professor |
Which if 1.2% annually is much less than Germany (2.2%), US (4%) or Ethiopia (8.5%) | | | |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:38 - Sep 10 with 1838 views | Catullus |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 16:18 - Sep 10 by Professor |
Which if 1.2% annually is much less than Germany (2.2%), US (4%) or Ethiopia (8.5%) |
So would you prefer (in a lump sum) 0.6% of the Uk's economy or 8.5% of Ethiopia's? UK gdp roughly 2.01 trillion, Ethiopia 61.5 billion. | |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 23:37 - Sep 10 with 1815 views | DJack |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:38 - Sep 10 by Catullus |
So would you prefer (in a lump sum) 0.6% of the Uk's economy or 8.5% of Ethiopia's? UK gdp roughly 2.01 trillion, Ethiopia 61.5 billion. |
You forgot to mention the scale of the German and Yank economies... obviously an accidental oversight on your part. | |
| It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 07:46 - Sep 11 with 1778 views | Professor |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 23:37 - Sep 10 by DJack |
You forgot to mention the scale of the German and Yank economies... obviously an accidental oversight on your part. |
The UK economy should be similar to Germany but is not- that is down the last 60 odd years of poor decisions. The point was the UK economy is not surging ahead and one metric does
Not a better country make. Food banks and homelessness are clear to see. I hear policing issues due to underfunding on the radio this morning. Of course Ethiopia has a smaller economy based on agriculture, but as you suggest we have an undersized economy based on service and finance | | | |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 09:57 - Sep 11 with 1755 views | Catullus |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 07:46 - Sep 11 by Professor |
The UK economy should be similar to Germany but is not- that is down the last 60 odd years of poor decisions. The point was the UK economy is not surging ahead and one metric does
Not a better country make. Food banks and homelessness are clear to see. I hear policing issues due to underfunding on the radio this morning. Of course Ethiopia has a smaller economy based on agriculture, but as you suggest we have an undersized economy based on service and finance |
Yes, bad decisions, but who made those bad decisions? Are we going to blame Westminster or the EU?
Personally I can go all the way back to the 30's and blame some of todays problems on bad decisions taken by the "upper classes" and ruling elites over those 80/90 years. Not that I think the EU has helped, not us anyway.
This might surprise some people, I voted to leave the EU because I think the half in/half out approach is bad for us and I'm not ready for a fully federalised EU, I don't think Europe is and the lurch to the right kind of proves that. So, I chose leave. However I am a well known critic of politicians, ours are the most useless, self serving bunch you could hope to find be they in Westminster, the WAG, Scotland or Eire. There again, I'm none to keen on the EU version of democracy, wary of the political and financial growth of Germany and worried by that loose cannon in America.
Our system, our government is a shambles, it has encouraged welfare dependency even whilst vilifying it. It has encouraged tax avoidance and the HMRC even admitted treating the rich more favourably than the poor and why......"to protect reputations" apparently.
In the EU we have a reputed drunk for a president, nepotism in senior roles, financial waste on an industrial scale and rising crime fuelling a far right wing growth on a scale not seen since the 30's.
Any wonder I have a deep loathing for politicians? I would cut their numbers significantly. I would step back from devolution, I would close down the EU, unless Europe wide federalism was accepted by the peoples in which case I'd close down Westminster but like I say, Europeans are not ready for that step, it'd more likely cause a war.
I argue against the EU because it is the political body I think most likley to fail and even after saying all that, I can't blame the government or politicians for everything because people are people and we all have human failings.
It's a bit of a ramble sorry! | |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 10:46 - Sep 11 with 1751 views | Professor |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 09:57 - Sep 11 by Catullus |
Yes, bad decisions, but who made those bad decisions? Are we going to blame Westminster or the EU?
Personally I can go all the way back to the 30's and blame some of todays problems on bad decisions taken by the "upper classes" and ruling elites over those 80/90 years. Not that I think the EU has helped, not us anyway.
This might surprise some people, I voted to leave the EU because I think the half in/half out approach is bad for us and I'm not ready for a fully federalised EU, I don't think Europe is and the lurch to the right kind of proves that. So, I chose leave. However I am a well known critic of politicians, ours are the most useless, self serving bunch you could hope to find be they in Westminster, the WAG, Scotland or Eire. There again, I'm none to keen on the EU version of democracy, wary of the political and financial growth of Germany and worried by that loose cannon in America.
Our system, our government is a shambles, it has encouraged welfare dependency even whilst vilifying it. It has encouraged tax avoidance and the HMRC even admitted treating the rich more favourably than the poor and why......"to protect reputations" apparently.
In the EU we have a reputed drunk for a president, nepotism in senior roles, financial waste on an industrial scale and rising crime fuelling a far right wing growth on a scale not seen since the 30's.
Any wonder I have a deep loathing for politicians? I would cut their numbers significantly. I would step back from devolution, I would close down the EU, unless Europe wide federalism was accepted by the peoples in which case I'd close down Westminster but like I say, Europeans are not ready for that step, it'd more likely cause a war.
I argue against the EU because it is the political body I think most likley to fail and even after saying all that, I can't blame the government or politicians for everything because people are people and we all have human failings.
It's a bit of a ramble sorry! |
It's a sound argument. I voted to remain- I'm a scientist and the EU was an important source of funding for research and allowed collaboration in areas to compete with the US and China that no individual member has the resource to do so. I don't believe the equivalent will be given to UKRI so there will be a negative impact-mostly in areas such as physics and agri-food (my area). I still believe many people were duped by the leave arguments and there is a clear drive by certain rich individuals to change the UK to a lower tax, lower rights, lower state provision economy like the US.
I also think there is a lack of knowledge of what other Northern European, largely protestant countries are like-more 'soft' socialist policies accompanied by a wider industrial base. We are too reliant on our 'spiv' economy compared to Germany, Netherlands or Sweden. I think the fear of federalism comes from this and the idea the EU is regulated highly, even if often the regulations actually are hugely beneficial. Food safety is a clear example-prevalence rates of Salmonella are more than double in the US over the EU-as there are specific controls in EU chicken production ( (US levels are around four fold higher than UK and Germany where they were implemented most strictly)
Like you I have no confidence in government or the opposition (though I think both parties have competent politicians) and the rise of the right is a real worry. | | | |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 18:36 - Sep 11 with 1689 views | Catullus |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 10:46 - Sep 11 by Professor |
It's a sound argument. I voted to remain- I'm a scientist and the EU was an important source of funding for research and allowed collaboration in areas to compete with the US and China that no individual member has the resource to do so. I don't believe the equivalent will be given to UKRI so there will be a negative impact-mostly in areas such as physics and agri-food (my area). I still believe many people were duped by the leave arguments and there is a clear drive by certain rich individuals to change the UK to a lower tax, lower rights, lower state provision economy like the US.
I also think there is a lack of knowledge of what other Northern European, largely protestant countries are like-more 'soft' socialist policies accompanied by a wider industrial base. We are too reliant on our 'spiv' economy compared to Germany, Netherlands or Sweden. I think the fear of federalism comes from this and the idea the EU is regulated highly, even if often the regulations actually are hugely beneficial. Food safety is a clear example-prevalence rates of Salmonella are more than double in the US over the EU-as there are specific controls in EU chicken production ( (US levels are around four fold higher than UK and Germany where they were implemented most strictly)
Like you I have no confidence in government or the opposition (though I think both parties have competent politicians) and the rise of the right is a real worry. |
I understand where you're coming from but, unlike most remain politicians you give sound reasons for remaining. If the politicians had gone with sound reasons rather than trying to scare the plebs into voting remain, it could have been different.
Osborne shot remain in the foot with project fear. Cameron let the country down with his weak kneed "renegotiation" and even with that, I do believe the EU to be undemocratic, more so than the Uk which isn't perfect, obviously.
Whichever way anybody voted, the rich remain obliviously unaffected and the poor are still falling further behind.
people on here still trot out how bad it will be for us in the future but the truth is, nobody knows. It could go either way, if it was so easy to predict the future we'd be right more than wrong.
Thank you though, it's nice to be able to post opinions without the usual tirade and abuse that is all too common. | |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 19:56 - Sep 11 with 1666 views | felixstowe_jack |
Unemployment in Wales is now less than the UK average and half the EU average. Another success for the Welsh assembly or even Westminster. | |
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| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 21:03 - Sep 11 with 1656 views | Professor |
| Those of you who like blaming the Government on 18:36 - Sep 11 by Catullus |
I understand where you're coming from but, unlike most remain politicians you give sound reasons for remaining. If the politicians had gone with sound reasons rather than trying to scare the plebs into voting remain, it could have been different.
Osborne shot remain in the foot with project fear. Cameron let the country down with his weak kneed "renegotiation" and even with that, I do believe the EU to be undemocratic, more so than the Uk which isn't perfect, obviously.
Whichever way anybody voted, the rich remain obliviously unaffected and the poor are still falling further behind.
people on here still trot out how bad it will be for us in the future but the truth is, nobody knows. It could go either way, if it was so easy to predict the future we'd be right more than wrong.
Thank you though, it's nice to be able to post opinions without the usual tirade and abuse that is all too common. |
And you too. Respect and moderation are too easily forgotten | | | |
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