| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread 20:33 - Apr 7 with 89633 views | exiledclaseboy |
About time we had one and it's got the word "official" in the title so that makes all the difference. If a mod wants to sticky it, feel free.
I seem to remember that five years ago (on the old, better Planet Swans) we got to nearly 100 pages and then another 60odd with the "aftermath" thread. They were good fun but there were more posters then and we were all a bit more tolerant of others' views. Let's try to be nice to each other, eh.
Anyway, best site for opinion polls is this one in my experience:
http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/
Polls are so tight the only conclusion is that the Tories and Labour are head to head nationwide. Can't put a whisker between them.
Tories need about 39-40% for an overall majority. Labour will probably get one on 36-37%. God bless our ridiculous voting system.
So, enjoy yourselves. I'll start with a prediction. Labour to win most seats but slightly fewer votes than the Tories and end up forming some kind of minority government with support from various parliamentary lefties on a vote by vote basis. And then all of a sudden many Tory supporters will discover that they've always hated first past the post and can't understand why we perpetuate a system under which the party which more people voted for than any other can lose the election. It'll be quite funny and lead to calls for a proper voting system. Which everyone will forget about in six months when all the fuss has died down.
What say you? |  |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 17:27 - Apr 14 with 1463 views | monmouth |
My goodness, I've just been half listening to some tory cretin trying to defend their ludicrously desperate 'manifesto'. I'm no lover of any of these political jerks but we really have reached rock bottom haven't we.
"We'll do this"..."but where will the money come from?"..."that's no problem, we've done brilliant over the last 5 years (increasingly strident), brilliant I tell you, and we'll keep doing brilliant so there"..."but where will the money come from?"....the demand is there the supply will come"...."what?"....(very stridently) "competence, we've done it before we'll do it again and we'll cut the deficit like we have done again and all"...."but where will the money come from?"...."it's magic"
The interviewer just laughed at one point, I suppose you just have to.
(those might not have been the exact words used...) |  |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 17:35 - Apr 14 with 1460 views | trampie |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 16:54 - Apr 14 by acejack3065 |
What gain do you think they will make? Surely not Neath or Llanelli? Ceredigion maybe with lib dems on the thin.
I personally think they will remain the same but them dropping a seat isn't completely inconceivable. |
Ynys Mon [Anglesey].
The problem Plaid have got is immigration in their heartlands they are being overrun, its a demographic time bomb that is hitting them, I make no comment about that only to say that is the way it is, I have just seen the figures for every constituency in Wales and in the so called Plaid heartlands the amount of what would have been typical Plaid voters are decreasing as a percentage at a rapid pace.
They have wanted to make in roads into South Wales for a long time, there is no choice now as there will be more Welsh born people in South Wales than in their heartlands, its probably one of the main reasons for their decline since the turn of the century. [Post edited 14 Apr 2015 17:37]
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 18:07 - Apr 14 with 1421 views | Lohengrin |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 17:35 - Apr 14 by trampie |
Ynys Mon [Anglesey].
The problem Plaid have got is immigration in their heartlands they are being overrun, its a demographic time bomb that is hitting them, I make no comment about that only to say that is the way it is, I have just seen the figures for every constituency in Wales and in the so called Plaid heartlands the amount of what would have been typical Plaid voters are decreasing as a percentage at a rapid pace.
They have wanted to make in roads into South Wales for a long time, there is no choice now as there will be more Welsh born people in South Wales than in their heartlands, its probably one of the main reasons for their decline since the turn of the century. [Post edited 14 Apr 2015 17:37]
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Make the comment, Trampie. Nationalism is a creed suitable only for people with clear ideals and transparent goals. In my view nobody should be permitted to settle in rural Wales unless they are fluent in the Welsh language or are demonstrably taking active steps to learn, otherwise the end result will be the death of native culture.
There you go. Clear cut and in no way open to interpretation. Exactly like Leanne Wood's overt presence at No Borders demonstrations. We all know exactly where we are and who's who. |  |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 18:23 - Apr 14 with 1413 views | yescomeon |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 15:39 - Apr 14 by Lohengrin |
Really? Do you suppose that if it came to light Natalie Bennett had made a financial contribution to The National Front it would be greeted with media indifference? |
Well (correct me if I'm wrong) but she made the donation to a left wing paper associated with one of the communist parties not to a communist party. All a bit different to making a donation to national front. |  |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 18:40 - Apr 14 with 1393 views | Lohengrin |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 18:23 - Apr 14 by yescomeon |
Well (correct me if I'm wrong) but she made the donation to a left wing paper associated with one of the communist parties not to a communist party. All a bit different to making a donation to national front. |
She's made two donations. One to The Communist Review and another to Challenge!, the journal of The Young Communist League. Both official publications.
"Jezebel! Harbinger of The Beast..."  | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 18:59 - Apr 14 with 1375 views | trampie |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 18:07 - Apr 14 by Lohengrin |
Make the comment, Trampie. Nationalism is a creed suitable only for people with clear ideals and transparent goals. In my view nobody should be permitted to settle in rural Wales unless they are fluent in the Welsh language or are demonstrably taking active steps to learn, otherwise the end result will be the death of native culture.
There you go. Clear cut and in no way open to interpretation. Exactly like Leanne Wood's overt presence at No Borders demonstrations. We all know exactly where we are and who's who. |
I cant speak for Ms Wood but it looks like she see's her people as anyone living in Wales or regarding themselves as Welsh regardless of ethnicity or creed.
I wouldn't call her a nationalist, but if she is, she is a civic nationalist and not a cultural one. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:23 - Apr 14 with 1363 views | Lohengrin |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 18:59 - Apr 14 by trampie |
I cant speak for Ms Wood but it looks like she see's her people as anyone living in Wales or regarding themselves as Welsh regardless of ethnicity or creed.
I wouldn't call her a nationalist, but if she is, she is a civic nationalist and not a cultural one. |
You wouldn't call her a Nationalist yet you endorse her as head of the Nationalist party??
Her comments to The Guardian cannot be read often enough by would-be Plaid voters but they MUST be scrutinised long and hard by actual Plaid members...
On Welsh Culture: "...nationality, identity — those kinds of questions — they’re not really important..."
On the Welsh language: "I don’t think it does [matter], really."
I'm coming around to the idea that behind that gormless smirk abides a cipher for something truly unclean. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:36 - Apr 14 with 1352 views | trampie |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:23 - Apr 14 by Lohengrin |
You wouldn't call her a Nationalist yet you endorse her as head of the Nationalist party??
Her comments to The Guardian cannot be read often enough by would-be Plaid voters but they MUST be scrutinised long and hard by actual Plaid members...
On Welsh Culture: "...nationality, identity — those kinds of questions — they’re not really important..."
On the Welsh language: "I don’t think it does [matter], really."
I'm coming around to the idea that behind that gormless smirk abides a cipher for something truly unclean. |
Its the Brit Nats, Labour, Conservatives etc that call Plaid nationalists when they themselves are far bigger nationalists in many senses.
Plaid have been one of the least nationalistic parties going and its been like that for decades. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:41 - Apr 14 with 1349 views | exiledclaseboy |
Dear trampie and Lohengrin. You're both lovely but your increasingly tedious exchanges about the nature of nationalism and Wood's apparent murderously communist skeletons are not general election issues. At least not to anyone other than you two. And if Saunders Lewis and Gwynfor Whatsisname, both of whom are about as relevant to a 2015 general election as Pitt the Younger, make another appearance on this thread I'll probably tut like the girlie liberal I am.
Thanks like. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:47 - Apr 14 with 1341 views | Lohengrin |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:41 - Apr 14 by exiledclaseboy |
Dear trampie and Lohengrin. You're both lovely but your increasingly tedious exchanges about the nature of nationalism and Wood's apparent murderously communist skeletons are not general election issues. At least not to anyone other than you two. And if Saunders Lewis and Gwynfor Whatsisname, both of whom are about as relevant to a 2015 general election as Pitt the Younger, make another appearance on this thread I'll probably tut like the girlie liberal I am.
Thanks like. |
Bloody bingo-playing killjoy!
Me and Tramp are engaged in a battle for the soul of a nation and you want to yak about the London-based hirelings of the multi-nationals and an electoral charade that will see absolutely no brake applied to national decline.  | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:52 - Apr 14 with 1333 views | exiledclaseboy |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:47 - Apr 14 by Lohengrin |
Bloody bingo-playing killjoy!
Me and Tramp are engaged in a battle for the soul of a nation and you want to yak about the London-based hirelings of the multi-nationals and an electoral charade that will see absolutely no brake applied to national decline. |
Yes. Yes I do. Of course nothing of substance will change but it's fun watching people get het up over it.
So anyway. The Tories' big centrepiece policy is to sell more council houses. Genius. That'll help see. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:54 - Apr 14 with 1329 views | Lohengrin |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:52 - Apr 14 by exiledclaseboy |
Yes. Yes I do. Of course nothing of substance will change but it's fun watching people get het up over it.
So anyway. The Tories' big centrepiece policy is to sell more council houses. Genius. That'll help see. |
Good news for tenants wanting to buy though, no question about that. Don't you regard it as a parental obligation to hand something tangible down to help your children and grandchildren? | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:03 - Apr 14 with 1319 views | trampie |
I have written about Ms Wood being on Bloomberg and the Daily Politics show both today exiledclaseboy, the demographic make up of rural Wales could affect results in Wales, the type of leader Plaid have might effect votes in Plaids heartlands and might effect their votes in South Wales.
You are quite welcome to talk about other parties and I no doubt would make comment but without wishing to sound like Ms Wood, they are 4 shades of Westminster grey (Lab, Lib, Con, Kippers), its Plaid that make politics interesting in Wales and I say this with no agenda, that has always been the case since Labour moved to the right. [Post edited 14 Apr 2015 20:05]
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:08 - Apr 14 with 1312 views | exiledclaseboy |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:54 - Apr 14 by Lohengrin |
Good news for tenants wanting to buy though, no question about that. Don't you regard it as a parental obligation to hand something tangible down to help your children and grandchildren? |
Not necessarily. My parents rented the same house for close on 50 years and my mother only gave it up when she moved into sheltered housing last summer. The house is now occupied by another family who will raise their own kids and make their own memories there. That's what social housing is for, for the benefit of many not to be flogged off cheaply to benefit a few. Don't get me wrong, I still get pangs when I go past the house, it was the place we all grew up in and I still consider it my home. We had the chance to buy it dirt cheap years ago.
I don't want to come across as all Monty Python here but there's nothing for any of us when my mother goes. Everything they had when we were kids was spent on us. I don't consider that a failure on my parents' part. They worked hard against a lot of stacked odds at times to give a small army of us the most stable upbringing possible in a true family home. I'm glad we haven't deprived someone else of that opportunity in the same house. [Post edited 14 Apr 2015 20:09]
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:08 - Apr 14 with 1302 views | trampie |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:52 - Apr 14 by exiledclaseboy |
Yes. Yes I do. Of course nothing of substance will change but it's fun watching people get het up over it.
So anyway. The Tories' big centrepiece policy is to sell more council houses. Genius. That'll help see. |
It will make things worse, its a disgrace and shouldn't be allowed. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:08 - Apr 14 with 1301 views | Uxbridge |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 19:52 - Apr 14 by exiledclaseboy |
Yes. Yes I do. Of course nothing of substance will change but it's fun watching people get het up over it.
So anyway. The Tories' big centrepiece policy is to sell more council houses. Genius. That'll help see. |
I see absolutely no historical precedent that could point to this going horribly wrong. None at all. |  |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:13 - Apr 14 with 1291 views | trampie |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:07 - Apr 14 by Lohengrin |
No agenda! You're like Wood's PA !!  |
I'm talking about the last 30 odd years, Ms Wood would have been a young girl back then so nothing to do with her Plaid injecting some interest into elections. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:14 - Apr 14 with 1287 views | exiledclaseboy |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:08 - Apr 14 by Uxbridge |
I see absolutely no historical precedent that could point to this going horribly wrong. None at all. |
The bits of the Tory manifesto I've seen read like semi-apologetic Thatcherism 30 years on. Sell, sell, sell. Even stuff the government doesn't own. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:18 - Apr 14 with 1273 views | Lohengrin |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:08 - Apr 14 by exiledclaseboy |
Not necessarily. My parents rented the same house for close on 50 years and my mother only gave it up when she moved into sheltered housing last summer. The house is now occupied by another family who will raise their own kids and make their own memories there. That's what social housing is for, for the benefit of many not to be flogged off cheaply to benefit a few. Don't get me wrong, I still get pangs when I go past the house, it was the place we all grew up in and I still consider it my home. We had the chance to buy it dirt cheap years ago.
I don't want to come across as all Monty Python here but there's nothing for any of us when my mother goes. Everything they had when we were kids was spent on us. I don't consider that a failure on my parents' part. They worked hard against a lot of stacked odds at times to give a small army of us the most stable upbringing possible in a true family home. I'm glad we haven't deprived someone else of that opportunity in the same house. [Post edited 14 Apr 2015 20:09]
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It does rather sound as if you're kicking yourself now for not having bought it, though.
As for the family living there now not having an opportunity, I'm not trying to deprive them of a helping hand I've called time and again for the renovation of brownfield sites and derelict buildings to increase the stock of social housing in the form of a big public works programme. Absorbing the unemployed and creating desperately needed affordable housing.
For the tenants of these new houses I would absolutely offer them for sale after an occupancy of, say, ten years. Why not? The widest possible distribution of ownership is a good thing in terms of fostering aspiration. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:20 - Apr 14 with 1270 views | yescomeon |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:08 - Apr 14 by exiledclaseboy |
Not necessarily. My parents rented the same house for close on 50 years and my mother only gave it up when she moved into sheltered housing last summer. The house is now occupied by another family who will raise their own kids and make their own memories there. That's what social housing is for, for the benefit of many not to be flogged off cheaply to benefit a few. Don't get me wrong, I still get pangs when I go past the house, it was the place we all grew up in and I still consider it my home. We had the chance to buy it dirt cheap years ago.
I don't want to come across as all Monty Python here but there's nothing for any of us when my mother goes. Everything they had when we were kids was spent on us. I don't consider that a failure on my parents' part. They worked hard against a lot of stacked odds at times to give a small army of us the most stable upbringing possible in a true family home. I'm glad we haven't deprived someone else of that opportunity in the same house. [Post edited 14 Apr 2015 20:09]
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Great post. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:21 - Apr 14 with 1266 views | Lohengrin |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:08 - Apr 14 by trampie |
It will make things worse, its a disgrace and shouldn't be allowed. |
You'd like to see future generations as glorified wards of State, unthinking consumer-producers in the socialist mould.  | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:23 - Apr 14 with 1264 views | exiledclaseboy |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:18 - Apr 14 by Lohengrin |
It does rather sound as if you're kicking yourself now for not having bought it, though.
As for the family living there now not having an opportunity, I'm not trying to deprive them of a helping hand I've called time and again for the renovation of brownfield sites and derelict buildings to increase the stock of social housing in the form of a big public works programme. Absorbing the unemployed and creating desperately needed affordable housing.
For the tenants of these new houses I would absolutely offer them for sale after an occupancy of, say, ten years. Why not? The widest possible distribution of ownership is a good thing in terms of fostering aspiration. |
You've misread me entirely. I have no regrets about not buying that house. None at all. It's doing exactly what it was designed to do. | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:26 - Apr 14 with 1261 views | Lohengrin |
| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:23 - Apr 14 by exiledclaseboy |
You've misread me entirely. I have no regrets about not buying that house. None at all. It's doing exactly what it was designed to do. |
What about your sisters? None of them fancy it, Clase? | |
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| The Official Planet Swans General Election 2015 Thread on 20:26 - Apr 14 with 1260 views | exiledclaseboy |
I would throw in an "all property is theft" quote but I fear Lohengrin may combust. 
For the avoidance of doubt, I obviously don't agree with that myself. | |
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