| Not A Penny More 22:28 - Sep 21 with 4623 views | basilrobbiereborn |
….. 294 there yesterday. Perhaps it should be re-named Not A Penny Full Stop.  |  |
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| Not A Penny More on 23:02 - Sep 21 with 2642 views | Rusty2Stands |
Different forum, same old shit. | | | |
| Not A Penny More on 00:01 - Sep 22 with 2622 views | hertfordseasider |
It's going to get a lot worse yet and you can't blame supporters for finding more enjoyable things to do than watch the tragedy that is BFC . |  | | |
| Not A Penny More on 06:53 - Sep 22 with 2590 views | Rusty2Stands |
| Not A Penny More on 00:01 - Sep 22 by hertfordseasider |
It's going to get a lot worse yet and you can't blame supporters for finding more enjoyable things to do than watch the tragedy that is BFC . |
Didn't you know herts? It's nothing to do with the Oystons.
It's all the fans' fault. | | | |
| Not A Penny More on 12:08 - Sep 22 with 2530 views | basilrobbiereborn |
Just an observation, some people do get touchy about it for some reason. Give that thousands also went missing between April and August at Wigan, I think it is a legitimate issue to raise. I didn't coin the phrase, after all.
Good support from those who went, mind you. | |
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| Not A Penny More on 13:27 - Sep 22 with 2490 views | straightatthewall |
I'd have thought you'd want to keep your head down Robbie, given that events this summer have finally proven that by backing Karl like you did, you were backing the wrong horse for all these years.
I notice you've posted this and the transport thread. Get that Clemmit story up, with a 'finally good to see some balance' follow up and you can make it a glorious hat-trick.
If I weren't so nice, I'd wonder whether the board owners have asked you to play the Adrian Durham role....  |  |
| We got Bogdanovic, Oyston got very rich |
| |
| Not A Penny More on 14:07 - Sep 22 with 2454 views | basilrobbiereborn |
| Not A Penny More on 13:27 - Sep 22 by straightatthewall |
I'd have thought you'd want to keep your head down Robbie, given that events this summer have finally proven that by backing Karl like you did, you were backing the wrong horse for all these years.
I notice you've posted this and the transport thread. Get that Clemmit story up, with a 'finally good to see some balance' follow up and you can make it a glorious hat-trick.
If I weren't so nice, I'd wonder whether the board owners have asked you to play the Adrian Durham role.... |
Your cynicism shocks me straighters, really it does.
As to the events of this summer, I feel vindicated actually. I've consistently said that some of the people who attack the chairman are at least as bad as he is if not worse. I've seen absolutely nothing to change my mind about that, to be honest. Go and cast a dispassionate eye over the old site and tell me I don't have a point. | |
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| Not A Penny More on 14:20 - Sep 22 with 2445 views | straightatthewall |
| Not A Penny More on 14:07 - Sep 22 by basilrobbiereborn |
Your cynicism shocks me straighters, really it does.
As to the events of this summer, I feel vindicated actually. I've consistently said that some of the people who attack the chairman are at least as bad as he is if not worse. I've seen absolutely nothing to change my mind about that, to be honest. Go and cast a dispassionate eye over the old site and tell me I don't have a point. |
I'm on there enough to read plenty. And I don't think you really do have a point, unless you want to take the extremists (for want of a better word) and paint them as the norm. There's far more dissent now on there, but if i'm honest, it's damn hard to find much to be positive about as far as the club is concerned.
We're a total and utter shambles - something I know you agree with - and for all the endeavour the players have applied to their task, too many are simply not even close to being good enough.
As mentioned after Millwall, I don't know the full details as to why we find ourselves in this position, but my gut feeling is that there is something happening that we aren't privy too and that is shaping the behaviour of the chairman. That behaviour is also shaping our season, which looks like being a very sorry tale.
There are 2 other possible answers:
1) The chairman is a complete and utter fool, with no ability at all to do his job or
2) The chairman knows exactly what he is doing and why.
In both cases, I'd say that as a football club, for that is all we ALL REALLY care about, as a football club we are well and truly goosed until they have gone.
Given all the above, I can see why there's some ill-feeling amongst many, even if some of them are impossible to warm too because of their pretty anti-social stance. | |
| We got Bogdanovic, Oyston got very rich |
| |
| Not A Penny More on 15:32 - Sep 22 with 2414 views | basilrobbiereborn |
| Not A Penny More on 14:20 - Sep 22 by straightatthewall |
I'm on there enough to read plenty. And I don't think you really do have a point, unless you want to take the extremists (for want of a better word) and paint them as the norm. There's far more dissent now on there, but if i'm honest, it's damn hard to find much to be positive about as far as the club is concerned.
We're a total and utter shambles - something I know you agree with - and for all the endeavour the players have applied to their task, too many are simply not even close to being good enough.
As mentioned after Millwall, I don't know the full details as to why we find ourselves in this position, but my gut feeling is that there is something happening that we aren't privy too and that is shaping the behaviour of the chairman. That behaviour is also shaping our season, which looks like being a very sorry tale.
There are 2 other possible answers:
1) The chairman is a complete and utter fool, with no ability at all to do his job or
2) The chairman knows exactly what he is doing and why.
In both cases, I'd say that as a football club, for that is all we ALL REALLY care about, as a football club we are well and truly goosed until they have gone.
Given all the above, I can see why there's some ill-feeling amongst many, even if some of them are impossible to warm too because of their pretty anti-social stance. |
SATW
Good reply, I'd go along with a fair bit of that. "Shambles" is one of the words I used (and have used publicly, more than once) as you know. I think there are more possible explanations than the two you offer, personally, as I intimated to you when we spoke after Millwall. In any case, I don't think this is a case of foolishness, simple or otherwise. But i do agree that it is worrying and quite understand why people are struggling to be positive.
You point about extremism is interesting. I think you are partially right - the norm, in terms of attitude amongst our supporters, is NOT reflected by the kind of rhetoric you see routinely used on the old site. People are fed up, but reasonable about it in terms of the way they express themselves and the way they behave.
But the old site is turning into a zoo and has got steadily worse in recent months to the point where - even if I were posting there - I wouldn't bother because it has been overrun by people who will brook no other opinion other than their own. There is little point in trying to have a conversation with such people, and the way people depict the main players in terms of caricatures is very childish / simplistic.
I think the truth is rarely black and white and I don't see the current problems as being exclusively of the making of the chairman. He's had some help in making this mess from the manager and his agent (and, for the sake of completeness, from members of his own family). Nor do I see Belokon as being the Great Saviour - his intervention in the summer has been followed up with such complete silence that you wonder why he bothered at all. But to have the attitude I have - whereby I'me fed up with all of them, for various reasons - doesn't seem to be one that people want to debate. It's easier to blame one man, and one man alone for ALL of it, rather than trying to be fair about laying his (considerable) share at his door and admitting that others could have done better as well.
As for the club's long term future, I don't see the owners going anywhere just yet, although it's not beyond the realms of possibility that VB's silence is because he is contemplating seeking a change to the current status quo, whether alone or with third parties. In the medium term I don't see much possibility of new ownership coming from anywhere else than him other than possibly through BST - and they are probably some way off being ready for that.
If I'm right, that will frustrate a lot of people. And it is true that this season is already about surviving, rather than prospering. The key to improving that position is for the owners to acknowledge that their proper role lies in administering the business ; when it comes to football decisions, they need to appoint people who have the required attributes and then trust them with the resources to do the job. I said as much in March, and suggested then that they were at something of a crossroads. That we continue to be stuck there is in part because they have set their face against that approach. But I think it also reflects the fact that they are clearly not convinced that they have appointed the right people to do the footballing job. I wouldn't go as far as to say we were "goosed" - that seems to over-state it quite a lot. Unless you think that League 1 would be the end of the world of course - and some people do. | |
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| Not A Penny More on 15:37 - Sep 22 with 2406 views | Rusty2Stands |
| Not A Penny More on 12:08 - Sep 22 by basilrobbiereborn |
Just an observation, some people do get touchy about it for some reason. Give that thousands also went missing between April and August at Wigan, I think it is a legitimate issue to raise. I didn't coin the phrase, after all.
Good support from those who went, mind you. |
Just an observation
Bullshit. | | | |
| Not A Penny More on 15:52 - Sep 22 with 2393 views | TwoPhillips |
| Not A Penny More on 15:37 - Sep 22 by Rusty2Stands |
Just an observation
Bullshit. |
Nice to read an intelligent, well put argument between two passionate fans on here without the usual suspects diving in and making a mockery of it with abusive posts and base level arguments | |
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| Not A Penny More on 16:08 - Sep 22 with 2381 views | straightatthewall |
| Not A Penny More on 15:32 - Sep 22 by basilrobbiereborn |
SATW
Good reply, I'd go along with a fair bit of that. "Shambles" is one of the words I used (and have used publicly, more than once) as you know. I think there are more possible explanations than the two you offer, personally, as I intimated to you when we spoke after Millwall. In any case, I don't think this is a case of foolishness, simple or otherwise. But i do agree that it is worrying and quite understand why people are struggling to be positive.
You point about extremism is interesting. I think you are partially right - the norm, in terms of attitude amongst our supporters, is NOT reflected by the kind of rhetoric you see routinely used on the old site. People are fed up, but reasonable about it in terms of the way they express themselves and the way they behave.
But the old site is turning into a zoo and has got steadily worse in recent months to the point where - even if I were posting there - I wouldn't bother because it has been overrun by people who will brook no other opinion other than their own. There is little point in trying to have a conversation with such people, and the way people depict the main players in terms of caricatures is very childish / simplistic.
I think the truth is rarely black and white and I don't see the current problems as being exclusively of the making of the chairman. He's had some help in making this mess from the manager and his agent (and, for the sake of completeness, from members of his own family). Nor do I see Belokon as being the Great Saviour - his intervention in the summer has been followed up with such complete silence that you wonder why he bothered at all. But to have the attitude I have - whereby I'me fed up with all of them, for various reasons - doesn't seem to be one that people want to debate. It's easier to blame one man, and one man alone for ALL of it, rather than trying to be fair about laying his (considerable) share at his door and admitting that others could have done better as well.
As for the club's long term future, I don't see the owners going anywhere just yet, although it's not beyond the realms of possibility that VB's silence is because he is contemplating seeking a change to the current status quo, whether alone or with third parties. In the medium term I don't see much possibility of new ownership coming from anywhere else than him other than possibly through BST - and they are probably some way off being ready for that.
If I'm right, that will frustrate a lot of people. And it is true that this season is already about surviving, rather than prospering. The key to improving that position is for the owners to acknowledge that their proper role lies in administering the business ; when it comes to football decisions, they need to appoint people who have the required attributes and then trust them with the resources to do the job. I said as much in March, and suggested then that they were at something of a crossroads. That we continue to be stuck there is in part because they have set their face against that approach. But I think it also reflects the fact that they are clearly not convinced that they have appointed the right people to do the footballing job. I wouldn't go as far as to say we were "goosed" - that seems to over-state it quite a lot. Unless you think that League 1 would be the end of the world of course - and some people do. |
Plenty to discuss with that.
First off, I also agree that there are a multitude of explanations for where we find ourselves. Said much the same to Founts on the other site this morning. None of us really know the truth. But we can all agree that the result is a steaming pile of karl.
Can't disagree with some of the views expressed about the other site and some posters. And indeed some 'off-site' issues that have arisen about individuals. It's nasty and not welcome. What worries me though is the causes - as you allude to - won't go away, because it's truly driven by total frustration at having our club taken from us and used in a way that we can all see is wrong.
What I would add though, is there's definitely a divide and conquer element to it all. Just as with the BSA/BST 'debate', I think there's a desperate need for unity, not division. The quicker we get there as a fanbase, the more strength we have. I know there'll be people who even know still give the O's the benefit of the doubt, but for me, they have to 'wise up' and join up. The O's have directed this current situation and whatever you may think of the wider views, the specifics are simple. They have gained a lot more than they ever put in, stand to gain even more either through long term rental agreements or a one-off sale and are currently presiding over a disgrace of a club that is constantly in the news for all the wrong reasons.
This has been done over the tenure of a multitude of managers. One of whom masterminded the journey to the riches that they are now protecting with all their might. Riches that also simply wouldn't have been theirs to protect were it not for the investment (twice) of Valerie Belekon.
Whatever you, I or anyone else may think of message board posters who abuse and attack relentlessly, I think I can say, without fear of contradiction, that those posters intentions for the club are a lot more honoroble than the Oystons.
Re the current situation, I'll ask you one simple question. Why would Riga take the job - knowing as he did that it was a tough one, with constraints - and then spend the next few months being as stubborn and detrimental to his own teams progress as possible. I don't believe there is anyone in football who is in it for the good of the game, but I know who stands to lose the most as an individual in this dynamic and it's not Karl or Owen.
Riga could have kept a dignified silence over things. Trying manfully to make it work. He'd have been carrying the can for this start had he done so. And personally, I don't think it's in his job description to bend over and take one for the Oyston family.
The second thing I'd add is why is it other clubs are able to sign foreign players without it being a total farce? Why are we the only ones who are faced with shadow banking and faceless middle-men?
I think we both know that the reality is, we're not. It's a nice easy excuse that the good hearted fan base of Blackpool roll with. No offence, but you and Wiz would see the good in Fred West if he had Blackpool connections. That's not a dig, you just WANT to believe so much.
The reality right now, is that we've been lumbered with a poor team who will undoubtedly reflect the investment made in them. And let's not have any of this 'Miller is on X' rubbish. There's many different types of contract.
If 1 year deals are the best way of building a squad, why aren't lots of other clubs doing it?
If waiting until the season is about to start and then building a team through the first 8 weeks of the season is so beneficial (or perhaps that should be not so detrimental) why are others not doing it too and why are we languishing at the bottom of the league, with 3 goals in 8 games to our name? It's not a coincidence and it's not something any manager worth his salt would want his name attached too.
Even by being stubborn, Riga won't come out of this well. He's tarnished too. So again, I'll ask, what's really in it for him?
Re there being no other options to buy out the club mid-term, thats just a total myth. Buyers will always be found IF the deal is a good one. While part of me suspects the spat with Belekon could have been a public way of both he and the O's fighting their own corner in a takeover bid/possible sale, I'm also willing to bet that the next owner of the football club is someone none of us have ever heard of.
And finally, I don't think you'll find too many of the core support who find League 1 a bad thing per se, it's how you ended up there that's the issue. A club that is so well run, cash rich and who 'does things properly' probably would expect to go down, with one or 2 assets to sell or at least with a squad that looks more than capable of coming straight back up. Neither of those things look possible at present.
It's all a damning indictment of the owners. Nothing could or should deflect from that in my view. Never forget and never forgive. If they stick around, then they should expect grief continually. As should those who seek to support them, because they cannot be Blackpool supporters in my view. | |
| We got Bogdanovic, Oyston got very rich |
| |
| Not A Penny More on 17:01 - Sep 22 with 2357 views | Wizaard |
| Not A Penny More on 16:08 - Sep 22 by straightatthewall |
Plenty to discuss with that.
First off, I also agree that there are a multitude of explanations for where we find ourselves. Said much the same to Founts on the other site this morning. None of us really know the truth. But we can all agree that the result is a steaming pile of karl.
Can't disagree with some of the views expressed about the other site and some posters. And indeed some 'off-site' issues that have arisen about individuals. It's nasty and not welcome. What worries me though is the causes - as you allude to - won't go away, because it's truly driven by total frustration at having our club taken from us and used in a way that we can all see is wrong.
What I would add though, is there's definitely a divide and conquer element to it all. Just as with the BSA/BST 'debate', I think there's a desperate need for unity, not division. The quicker we get there as a fanbase, the more strength we have. I know there'll be people who even know still give the O's the benefit of the doubt, but for me, they have to 'wise up' and join up. The O's have directed this current situation and whatever you may think of the wider views, the specifics are simple. They have gained a lot more than they ever put in, stand to gain even more either through long term rental agreements or a one-off sale and are currently presiding over a disgrace of a club that is constantly in the news for all the wrong reasons.
This has been done over the tenure of a multitude of managers. One of whom masterminded the journey to the riches that they are now protecting with all their might. Riches that also simply wouldn't have been theirs to protect were it not for the investment (twice) of Valerie Belekon.
Whatever you, I or anyone else may think of message board posters who abuse and attack relentlessly, I think I can say, without fear of contradiction, that those posters intentions for the club are a lot more honoroble than the Oystons.
Re the current situation, I'll ask you one simple question. Why would Riga take the job - knowing as he did that it was a tough one, with constraints - and then spend the next few months being as stubborn and detrimental to his own teams progress as possible. I don't believe there is anyone in football who is in it for the good of the game, but I know who stands to lose the most as an individual in this dynamic and it's not Karl or Owen.
Riga could have kept a dignified silence over things. Trying manfully to make it work. He'd have been carrying the can for this start had he done so. And personally, I don't think it's in his job description to bend over and take one for the Oyston family.
The second thing I'd add is why is it other clubs are able to sign foreign players without it being a total farce? Why are we the only ones who are faced with shadow banking and faceless middle-men?
I think we both know that the reality is, we're not. It's a nice easy excuse that the good hearted fan base of Blackpool roll with. No offence, but you and Wiz would see the good in Fred West if he had Blackpool connections. That's not a dig, you just WANT to believe so much.
The reality right now, is that we've been lumbered with a poor team who will undoubtedly reflect the investment made in them. And let's not have any of this 'Miller is on X' rubbish. There's many different types of contract.
If 1 year deals are the best way of building a squad, why aren't lots of other clubs doing it?
If waiting until the season is about to start and then building a team through the first 8 weeks of the season is so beneficial (or perhaps that should be not so detrimental) why are others not doing it too and why are we languishing at the bottom of the league, with 3 goals in 8 games to our name? It's not a coincidence and it's not something any manager worth his salt would want his name attached too.
Even by being stubborn, Riga won't come out of this well. He's tarnished too. So again, I'll ask, what's really in it for him?
Re there being no other options to buy out the club mid-term, thats just a total myth. Buyers will always be found IF the deal is a good one. While part of me suspects the spat with Belekon could have been a public way of both he and the O's fighting their own corner in a takeover bid/possible sale, I'm also willing to bet that the next owner of the football club is someone none of us have ever heard of.
And finally, I don't think you'll find too many of the core support who find League 1 a bad thing per se, it's how you ended up there that's the issue. A club that is so well run, cash rich and who 'does things properly' probably would expect to go down, with one or 2 assets to sell or at least with a squad that looks more than capable of coming straight back up. Neither of those things look possible at present.
It's all a damning indictment of the owners. Nothing could or should deflect from that in my view. Never forget and never forgive. If they stick around, then they should expect grief continually. As should those who seek to support them, because they cannot be Blackpool supporters in my view. |
Thanks for the considered points on here. Makes such a change from one line insults and caricatures.
From my perspective Fred West could be just the thing we need in midfield except he's dead.
I think it's gone past the point where people are blindly following whatever Karl says. I don't think we've had a more popular manager than Riga since the heady days of Holloway, and that's without winning a game. He'll be deified when we beat Norwich. The crowd support is such that I genuinely think Oyston daren't fire him, regardless of results
The other point I'd make is that this isn't part of any plan to sell up. Anyone looking to sell wouldn't do so when the business is in crisis and a poisoned chalice throughout football, no matter how much you might think you've driven down the costs.
It's not a sale at present unless at rock bottom prices and Oyston is never going to take that. It simply doesn't make any sense. |  | | |
| Not A Penny More on 17:29 - Sep 22 with 2336 views | straightatthewall |
| Not A Penny More on 17:01 - Sep 22 by Wizaard |
Thanks for the considered points on here. Makes such a change from one line insults and caricatures.
From my perspective Fred West could be just the thing we need in midfield except he's dead.
I think it's gone past the point where people are blindly following whatever Karl says. I don't think we've had a more popular manager than Riga since the heady days of Holloway, and that's without winning a game. He'll be deified when we beat Norwich. The crowd support is such that I genuinely think Oyston daren't fire him, regardless of results
The other point I'd make is that this isn't part of any plan to sell up. Anyone looking to sell wouldn't do so when the business is in crisis and a poisoned chalice throughout football, no matter how much you might think you've driven down the costs.
It's not a sale at present unless at rock bottom prices and Oyston is never going to take that. It simply doesn't make any sense. |
West was very adept at finding space at the back. He usually had to dig down, but my god he found it......
So if you're right about there being no plan to sell, what the hell does that tell us about what's going on? It's back to my preposition of it being total incompetence or a very deliberate and intentional downgrade.
If so, then we all must be totally united in our derision of them and wanting them out of the club for good. That also means, sadly, that the football must suffer for the short term, because we can't give the manager and players the support they need while also giving the owners the pressure we have to apply.
What do we truly want?
A shell of a club that is pointless because we don't try to compete to the best of our abilities?
or
A real football club where, whatever league we're in, we always put football first and do everything we can to achieve growth on and off the pitch?
It's a no brainer guys. | |
| We got Bogdanovic, Oyston got very rich |
| |
| Not A Penny More on 18:20 - Sep 22 with 2324 views | hertfordseasider |
| Not A Penny More on 15:32 - Sep 22 by basilrobbiereborn |
SATW
Good reply, I'd go along with a fair bit of that. "Shambles" is one of the words I used (and have used publicly, more than once) as you know. I think there are more possible explanations than the two you offer, personally, as I intimated to you when we spoke after Millwall. In any case, I don't think this is a case of foolishness, simple or otherwise. But i do agree that it is worrying and quite understand why people are struggling to be positive.
You point about extremism is interesting. I think you are partially right - the norm, in terms of attitude amongst our supporters, is NOT reflected by the kind of rhetoric you see routinely used on the old site. People are fed up, but reasonable about it in terms of the way they express themselves and the way they behave.
But the old site is turning into a zoo and has got steadily worse in recent months to the point where - even if I were posting there - I wouldn't bother because it has been overrun by people who will brook no other opinion other than their own. There is little point in trying to have a conversation with such people, and the way people depict the main players in terms of caricatures is very childish / simplistic.
I think the truth is rarely black and white and I don't see the current problems as being exclusively of the making of the chairman. He's had some help in making this mess from the manager and his agent (and, for the sake of completeness, from members of his own family). Nor do I see Belokon as being the Great Saviour - his intervention in the summer has been followed up with such complete silence that you wonder why he bothered at all. But to have the attitude I have - whereby I'me fed up with all of them, for various reasons - doesn't seem to be one that people want to debate. It's easier to blame one man, and one man alone for ALL of it, rather than trying to be fair about laying his (considerable) share at his door and admitting that others could have done better as well.
As for the club's long term future, I don't see the owners going anywhere just yet, although it's not beyond the realms of possibility that VB's silence is because he is contemplating seeking a change to the current status quo, whether alone or with third parties. In the medium term I don't see much possibility of new ownership coming from anywhere else than him other than possibly through BST - and they are probably some way off being ready for that.
If I'm right, that will frustrate a lot of people. And it is true that this season is already about surviving, rather than prospering. The key to improving that position is for the owners to acknowledge that their proper role lies in administering the business ; when it comes to football decisions, they need to appoint people who have the required attributes and then trust them with the resources to do the job. I said as much in March, and suggested then that they were at something of a crossroads. That we continue to be stuck there is in part because they have set their face against that approach. But I think it also reflects the fact that they are clearly not convinced that they have appointed the right people to do the footballing job. I wouldn't go as far as to say we were "goosed" - that seems to over-state it quite a lot. Unless you think that League 1 would be the end of the world of course - and some people do. |
Probably your best post for some time Roberto! Well thought and well put. | | | |
| Not A Penny More on 18:54 - Sep 22 with 2282 views | Bigbrother |
| Not A Penny More on 18:20 - Sep 22 by hertfordseasider |
Probably your best post for some time Roberto! Well thought and well put. |
Wizz - don't you think that Football Focus interview reflected that KO will do what he wants and isn't arsed about the consequences. Riga's position is about as promising as this year's Cliff Richard album sales! | |
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| Not A Penny More on 19:00 - Sep 22 with 2277 views | Wizaard |
| Not A Penny More on 18:54 - Sep 22 by Bigbrother |
Wizz - don't you think that Football Focus interview reflected that KO will do what he wants and isn't arsed about the consequences. Riga's position is about as promising as this year's Cliff Richard album sales! |
I was in a pub in Lewes so haven't seen the interview. Having said that, Karl is the most stubborn man in history, so he will do what he wants but he's not stupid.He knows that those going to games are just about remaining onside because we're not getting thrashed and at times play some decent football (when compared to the previous two years).
For that reason, it would be a step too far to sack Riga. It won't happen for a good while yet, unless Gary Rowett has a change of heart....
He'll ignore the more vociferous points made on the Internet, of course | | | |
| Not A Penny More on 19:01 - Sep 22 with 2277 views | basilrobbiereborn |
SATW
you asked a couple of questions.
I would obviously be guessing about Riga's motivations and about how the job was sold to him, and am a bit reluctant to do so. But I think the opportunity to manage a Championship club in England has a power all of its own.
Aas to the issue of signing foreign players, you are, with all due respect, making a lot of assertions about clubs that you can't really back up - none of us know how difficult or otherwise it is, or how the clubs involved approach it. What I will say is that playing hard ball with football agents will always be one of the least of the chairman's crimes, as far as I'm concerned. And none of us know for sure what kind of deals he has been asked to endorse by the current manager or anyone else. I myself am more sympathetic to him on this issue than most, but I've only really heard the story from his side. | |
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| Not A Penny More on 20:15 - Sep 22 with 2230 views | Plumbs |
| Not A Penny More on 18:20 - Sep 22 by hertfordseasider |
Probably your best post for some time Roberto! Well thought and well put. |
His best post was the one where he referred to 'coining the phrase' when talking about the 'penny more' brigade. Top punning.
Good read this and cheers to satw for pointing it out. | |
| Real fans go to pubs like the HITW or the Welly |
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| Not A Penny More on 20:54 - Sep 22 with 2201 views | Bloodtangerine |
| Not A Penny More on 20:15 - Sep 22 by Plumbs |
His best post was the one where he referred to 'coining the phrase' when talking about the 'penny more' brigade. Top punning.
Good read this and cheers to satw for pointing it out. |
This debate between you two would have been hijacked on the other site and left dripping with poisoned blood by now! | |
| Voice of the two scarfers..UTMP |
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| Not A Penny More on 21:01 - Sep 22 with 2192 views | ribble |
| Not A Penny More on 20:54 - Sep 22 by Bloodtangerine |
This debate between you two would have been hijacked on the other site and left dripping with poisoned blood by now! |
Yep, makes a refreshing change. The other site will self implode some day soon. | | | |
| Not A Penny More on 21:40 - Sep 22 with 2174 views | straightatthewall |
| Not A Penny More on 19:01 - Sep 22 by basilrobbiereborn |
SATW
you asked a couple of questions.
I would obviously be guessing about Riga's motivations and about how the job was sold to him, and am a bit reluctant to do so. But I think the opportunity to manage a Championship club in England has a power all of its own.
Aas to the issue of signing foreign players, you are, with all due respect, making a lot of assertions about clubs that you can't really back up - none of us know how difficult or otherwise it is, or how the clubs involved approach it. What I will say is that playing hard ball with football agents will always be one of the least of the chairman's crimes, as far as I'm concerned. And none of us know for sure what kind of deals he has been asked to endorse by the current manager or anyone else. I myself am more sympathetic to him on this issue than most, but I've only really heard the story from his side. |
Robbie,
He'd already managed a Championship club. Done well, enhanced his reputation and generally made himself in demand. He was also seen as the victim of a poor boardroom situation, so again, his stock wasn't damaged by being out of work. There's a fair chance that had he waited, he'd have got another job. He took ours and then it all went wrong.
Now don't get me wrong. Since taking the role, he's obviously had to do things that aren't helpful for the club in general. But it's hard for me to fathom why a sane man would do that 'proactively' for some unknown gain rather than be pushed into it by the actions of others. One scenario is in the realms of fantasy land, the other is all too plausible given our recent history sadly.
As for the second question, you're right. I don't know how others work. All I can do is see who arrives and signs for various clubs - and have been doing for the last 20 years - and make a judgement call.
Had we a chairman who didn't have form for going missing, having 'broken' faxes and generally being well known to mess people around at will (countless examples) I might be persuaded to believe that we've been led astray by a charlatan. As it is.......
As for being sympathetic to the chairman on the whole 'agent' issue, there was a time when I could have accepted your view. Sadly, I feel that their moral posture has been rather straightened out by their willingness to remove millions of football money and keep it for themselves through a myriad of ways. Being a moral compass when others get rich and turning a blind eye when the cash comes your own way doesn't sit well with me. I tend to find it a touch hypocritical....... | |
| We got Bogdanovic, Oyston got very rich |
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| Not A Penny More on 22:15 - Sep 22 with 2125 views | basilrobbiereborn |
| Not A Penny More on 21:40 - Sep 22 by straightatthewall |
Robbie,
He'd already managed a Championship club. Done well, enhanced his reputation and generally made himself in demand. He was also seen as the victim of a poor boardroom situation, so again, his stock wasn't damaged by being out of work. There's a fair chance that had he waited, he'd have got another job. He took ours and then it all went wrong.
Now don't get me wrong. Since taking the role, he's obviously had to do things that aren't helpful for the club in general. But it's hard for me to fathom why a sane man would do that 'proactively' for some unknown gain rather than be pushed into it by the actions of others. One scenario is in the realms of fantasy land, the other is all too plausible given our recent history sadly.
As for the second question, you're right. I don't know how others work. All I can do is see who arrives and signs for various clubs - and have been doing for the last 20 years - and make a judgement call.
Had we a chairman who didn't have form for going missing, having 'broken' faxes and generally being well known to mess people around at will (countless examples) I might be persuaded to believe that we've been led astray by a charlatan. As it is.......
As for being sympathetic to the chairman on the whole 'agent' issue, there was a time when I could have accepted your view. Sadly, I feel that their moral posture has been rather straightened out by their willingness to remove millions of football money and keep it for themselves through a myriad of ways. Being a moral compass when others get rich and turning a blind eye when the cash comes your own way doesn't sit well with me. I tend to find it a touch hypocritical....... |
SATW
he'd managed a Championship club for what ? Sixteen games? Think you are doing a bit of over-egging there.
Why has he acted in the way he has? None of us know for sure. But it may just be possible that he knows that his side of the bath isn't squeaky clean either. But your construction is equally plausible, and I'd hate to have people think I said otherwise.
Your twenty years analogy is a bit daft, if you don't mind me saying so. Twenty years ago we were in the L1 doldrums and showing no signs of getting out. Something haas been working at least some of the time since. If we are not careful we are both going to be selective with history and prove nothing to anyone.
On agents, I deliberately didn't say that KO was right all of the time. He clearly isn't. Nor did I suggest he was some kind of paragon. He isn't that either. What I do say is that if he doesn't trust the average football agent as far as he can throw them, i don't blame him. Does it get in the way of business? Of course it does, some of the time. Do I think he's right, on balance, to play the game by his rules? Yes, I probably do. Agents represent two parties - themselves, and their client. Blackpool FC features nowhere in their calculation - Karl is there to do that.
As for your last paragraph - I take your point entirely, but it is their football club, in law, if not in spirit. That means that if they want to remove monies, they can, and no amount of moral outrage will change that. Especially when it comes from people who only go to watch when they get a freebie, or who don't go at all. You know the kind of people I mean. | |
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| Not A Penny More on 22:29 - Sep 22 with 2111 views | hertfordseasider |
| Not A Penny More on 22:15 - Sep 22 by basilrobbiereborn |
SATW
he'd managed a Championship club for what ? Sixteen games? Think you are doing a bit of over-egging there.
Why has he acted in the way he has? None of us know for sure. But it may just be possible that he knows that his side of the bath isn't squeaky clean either. But your construction is equally plausible, and I'd hate to have people think I said otherwise.
Your twenty years analogy is a bit daft, if you don't mind me saying so. Twenty years ago we were in the L1 doldrums and showing no signs of getting out. Something haas been working at least some of the time since. If we are not careful we are both going to be selective with history and prove nothing to anyone.
On agents, I deliberately didn't say that KO was right all of the time. He clearly isn't. Nor did I suggest he was some kind of paragon. He isn't that either. What I do say is that if he doesn't trust the average football agent as far as he can throw them, i don't blame him. Does it get in the way of business? Of course it does, some of the time. Do I think he's right, on balance, to play the game by his rules? Yes, I probably do. Agents represent two parties - themselves, and their client. Blackpool FC features nowhere in their calculation - Karl is there to do that.
As for your last paragraph - I take your point entirely, but it is their football club, in law, if not in spirit. That means that if they want to remove monies, they can, and no amount of moral outrage will change that. Especially when it comes from people who only go to watch when they get a freebie, or who don't go at all. You know the kind of people I mean. |
And what kind of people are those exactly Robbie?? | | | |
| Not A Penny More on 22:31 - Sep 22 with 2109 views | basilrobbiereborn |
| Not A Penny More on 22:29 - Sep 22 by hertfordseasider |
And what kind of people are those exactly Robbie?? |
You're a bit tetchy tonight Pete. | |
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| Not A Penny More on 22:38 - Sep 22 with 2094 views | hertfordseasider |
| Not A Penny More on 22:31 - Sep 22 by basilrobbiereborn |
You're a bit tetchy tonight Pete. |
Not at all Robbie, in fact I said your earlier post was the best for a long time and I agreed with most of it. I just get irked with the "those that don't go" jibe, as you know, and i wasn't thinking of myself here, I don't care what people think about me, I have tangerine blood I know where I stand, but a lot of people don't go and I just think that continued attack is below the belt and doesn't do the debate any favours. But hey, we have been down this road a lot of times over the years and I am sure it will crop up again!
Good debate between you and Straighters, I agree with both of you on some points and disagree with others. | | | |
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