| Grand Prix decider 12:23 - Dec 12 with 6940 views | pikeypaul |
40 minutes until what should be a great final Grand Prix.
I take Hamilton to win with Max having to start on soft tyres and a probable 2 stop strategy.
Anyway May the best man win. |  |
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| Grand Prix decider on 16:04 - Dec 12 with 1858 views | union_jack |
| Grand Prix decider on 15:55 - Dec 12 by JACKMANANDBOY |
I agree, probably end up in court and the official will get fired. |
Most likely scenario. Masi may even be relieved jf he was fired.
It wouldn't be so bad if the race was neck and neck. Hamilton had aced it yet the sporting God referred to by Horner made a timely appearance. |  |
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| Grand Prix decider on 16:26 - Dec 12 with 1824 views | DwightYorkeSuperstar |
I suspect this will go to the Court of Arbitration for Sport.
That was truly disgusting and was hopefully down to ineptitude on the part of Masi and not corruption. Hopefully that is the last we see of Masi in F1. |  |
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| Grand Prix decider on 16:37 - Dec 12 with 1806 views | union_jack |
| Grand Prix decider on 16:26 - Dec 12 by DwightYorkeSuperstar |
I suspect this will go to the Court of Arbitration for Sport.
That was truly disgusting and was hopefully down to ineptitude on the part of Masi and not corruption. Hopefully that is the last we see of Masi in F1. |
Think it will be the last. If not sacked he'll probably say its not worth it!
However, I don't see the final standings changing. The best chance for Merc will be the 'overtaking' by VER under safety car which carries a 5 sec penalty. But that will force a counter objection by RB and it would taint it even more than it is now. | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 16:42 - Dec 12 with 1792 views | DwightYorkeSuperstar |
| Grand Prix decider on 16:37 - Dec 12 by union_jack |
Think it will be the last. If not sacked he'll probably say its not worth it!
However, I don't see the final standings changing. The best chance for Merc will be the 'overtaking' by VER under safety car which carries a 5 sec penalty. But that will force a counter objection by RB and it would taint it even more than it is now. |
I think their best chance is how only a small group of cars were allowed to unlap themselves - specifically the cars that were in Verstappen's way.
It's farcical.
"48.12 If the clerk of the course considers it safe to do so, and the message "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW OVERTAKE" has been sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system, any cars that have been lapped by the leader will be required to pass the cars on the lead lap and the safety car"
That clearly wasn't followed. All cars were required to pass. That is black and white. | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 16:48 - Dec 12 with 1764 views | union_jack |
| Grand Prix decider on 16:42 - Dec 12 by DwightYorkeSuperstar |
I think their best chance is how only a small group of cars were allowed to unlap themselves - specifically the cars that were in Verstappen's way.
It's farcical.
"48.12 If the clerk of the course considers it safe to do so, and the message "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW OVERTAKE" has been sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system, any cars that have been lapped by the leader will be required to pass the cars on the lead lap and the safety car"
That clearly wasn't followed. All cars were required to pass. That is black and white. |
Totally agree but that was a Steward's blunder and I can't see them penalising RB by taking the result off them. I'd love to see Horner's reaction though. | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 16:55 - Dec 12 with 1752 views | JACKMANANDBOY |
Sometimes these human errors sum up life's ironies. All. The money that goes onto F1 and the main prize may have been down to a human error. VAR has watered this down in football but I always laugh when a billion pound industry is undermined by a 50 something bald bloke on 60k a year not paying attention......... that's life! |  |
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| Grand Prix decider on 18:36 - Dec 12 with 1678 views | theloneranger |
The first appeal rejected by the Stewards ... that Verstappen was in front of Hamilton when the safety car exited the track. |  |
| Everyday above ground ... Is a good day! 😎 |
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| Grand Prix decider on 19:16 - Dec 12 with 1649 views | theloneranger |
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| Everyday above ground ... Is a good day! 😎 |
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| Grand Prix decider on 19:16 - Dec 12 with 1647 views | union_jack |
| Grand Prix decider on 18:36 - Dec 12 by theloneranger |
The first appeal rejected by the Stewards ... that Verstappen was in front of Hamilton when the safety car exited the track. |
And the second.
Seems there's a get out clause regarding SC deployment which begs a load of questions.
Anyway, I hope Merc don't bother with an appeal. Don't get angry, get even. Roll on March 20th. | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 19:49 - Dec 12 with 1609 views | DwightYorkeSuperstar |
| Grand Prix decider on 19:16 - Dec 12 by union_jack |
And the second.
Seems there's a get out clause regarding SC deployment which begs a load of questions.
Anyway, I hope Merc don't bother with an appeal. Don't get angry, get even. Roll on March 20th. |
Why? They've been shafted out of a well earned Championship either through incompetence or corruption. I sincerely hope they appeal to CAS. If this is allowed to stand, it tarnishes the reputation of the sport. | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 19:54 - Dec 12 with 1605 views | pikeypaul |
| Grand Prix decider on 16:42 - Dec 12 by DwightYorkeSuperstar |
I think their best chance is how only a small group of cars were allowed to unlap themselves - specifically the cars that were in Verstappen's way.
It's farcical.
"48.12 If the clerk of the course considers it safe to do so, and the message "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW OVERTAKE" has been sent to all Competitors via the official messaging system, any cars that have been lapped by the leader will be required to pass the cars on the lead lap and the safety car"
That clearly wasn't followed. All cars were required to pass. That is black and white. |
Wrong. Any does not mean all.
That was red bulls point and you can’t really argue with that.
Besides Rule 15 allows the race director to control the safety car to his discretion and was the the reason mercedes appeal was thrown out.
All teams at the start of the year agreed that whenever possible a race would not be ended in yellow , today it was possible and decided in race mode, which everybody who is a race fan should want.
Unlucky Hamilton, well done Max. | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 20:04 - Dec 12 with 1586 views | Dr_Winston |
| Grand Prix decider on 19:16 - Dec 12 by union_jack |
And the second.
Seems there's a get out clause regarding SC deployment which begs a load of questions.
Anyway, I hope Merc don't bother with an appeal. Don't get angry, get even. Roll on March 20th. |
Yep.
As much as they've been shafted, they can bounce back next season. Probably will.
Hamilton with the title tucked up by the end of October. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Grand Prix decider on 20:18 - Dec 12 with 1553 views | union_jack |
| Grand Prix decider on 19:49 - Dec 12 by DwightYorkeSuperstar |
Why? They've been shafted out of a well earned Championship either through incompetence or corruption. I sincerely hope they appeal to CAS. If this is allowed to stand, it tarnishes the reputation of the sport. |
Well Pikey has answered the question but I'd add that they should accept it gracefully now and get on with the big payback next year.
Don't get me wrong, I was sick with the way it transpired today. Hollywood couldn't write that scenario with any credibility and you can ask yourself whether nefarious forces were at large, but I think its just been one of those seasons. Very bad luck on Lewis.
Someone on the TV mentioned the similarity between this finish and the '89 PL decider where Arsenal had to score 2 at Anfield and did with practically the last kick of the game. I wanted Liverpool to win. I wanted Hamilton to win. Maybe its my fault?
Hope Russell shows up better than Bottas. I'm not overly optimistic but with the changes next year, who knows? | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 20:38 - Dec 12 with 1522 views | Whiterockin |
| Grand Prix decider on 20:18 - Dec 12 by union_jack |
Well Pikey has answered the question but I'd add that they should accept it gracefully now and get on with the big payback next year.
Don't get me wrong, I was sick with the way it transpired today. Hollywood couldn't write that scenario with any credibility and you can ask yourself whether nefarious forces were at large, but I think its just been one of those seasons. Very bad luck on Lewis.
Someone on the TV mentioned the similarity between this finish and the '89 PL decider where Arsenal had to score 2 at Anfield and did with practically the last kick of the game. I wanted Liverpool to win. I wanted Hamilton to win. Maybe its my fault?
Hope Russell shows up better than Bottas. I'm not overly optimistic but with the changes next year, who knows? |
So much money involved with a team having the champion I don't think Mercedes will give up without a fight. |  | | |
| Grand Prix decider on 21:10 - Dec 12 with 1503 views | theloneranger |
| Grand Prix decider on 19:54 - Dec 12 by pikeypaul |
Wrong. Any does not mean all.
That was red bulls point and you can’t really argue with that.
Besides Rule 15 allows the race director to control the safety car to his discretion and was the the reason mercedes appeal was thrown out.
All teams at the start of the year agreed that whenever possible a race would not be ended in yellow , today it was possible and decided in race mode, which everybody who is a race fan should want.
Unlucky Hamilton, well done Max. |
It wasn't an Appeal -- It was only a Protest!
Mercedes have 72 hours to make an Appeal. | |
| Everyday above ground ... Is a good day! 😎 |
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| Grand Prix decider on 21:39 - Dec 12 with 1481 views | DwightYorkeSuperstar |
You say Rule 15 allowed the director to control the safety car at his discretion - why, at his discretion, did he allow the cars in front of Verstappen to unlap themselves but no others?
Sainz had lapped cars in front of him at the restart, preventing him from challenging for P2 or P1. And so on.
The discretion he used only benefited one driver in the race. The excuse they gave in the statement says they wanted to avoid finishing under a safety car. That logic has never been used in my time watching this sport. Why suddenly apply that logic today?
I'm glad to see they have appealed the result of the protest and at the very least we should see Masi removed and the rule book rewritten.
What was supposed to be the biggest F1 race in decades, perhaps ever, felt like watching a WWE event. It's appalling. I'm not sure how any neutral fan of the sport can defend it. | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 21:59 - Dec 12 with 1463 views | max936 |
| Grand Prix decider on 21:39 - Dec 12 by DwightYorkeSuperstar |
You say Rule 15 allowed the director to control the safety car at his discretion - why, at his discretion, did he allow the cars in front of Verstappen to unlap themselves but no others?
Sainz had lapped cars in front of him at the restart, preventing him from challenging for P2 or P1. And so on.
The discretion he used only benefited one driver in the race. The excuse they gave in the statement says they wanted to avoid finishing under a safety car. That logic has never been used in my time watching this sport. Why suddenly apply that logic today?
I'm glad to see they have appealed the result of the protest and at the very least we should see Masi removed and the rule book rewritten.
What was supposed to be the biggest F1 race in decades, perhaps ever, felt like watching a WWE event. It's appalling. I'm not sure how any neutral fan of the sport can defend it. |
It was a shocking way to end the season and championship decider, Red Bulls attitude to win by any means, means their driving tactic's are dangerous Perez was driving dangerously in trying to hold Hamilton back and Verstappen himself is reckless, I can't stand Horner his appraisal of Hamilton was laughable. |  |
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| Grand Prix decider on 22:00 - Dec 12 with 1463 views | union_jack |
| Grand Prix decider on 21:39 - Dec 12 by DwightYorkeSuperstar |
You say Rule 15 allowed the director to control the safety car at his discretion - why, at his discretion, did he allow the cars in front of Verstappen to unlap themselves but no others?
Sainz had lapped cars in front of him at the restart, preventing him from challenging for P2 or P1. And so on.
The discretion he used only benefited one driver in the race. The excuse they gave in the statement says they wanted to avoid finishing under a safety car. That logic has never been used in my time watching this sport. Why suddenly apply that logic today?
I'm glad to see they have appealed the result of the protest and at the very least we should see Masi removed and the rule book rewritten.
What was supposed to be the biggest F1 race in decades, perhaps ever, felt like watching a WWE event. It's appalling. I'm not sure how any neutral fan of the sport can defend it. |
Can't really argue with any of that.
I've had a rethink and now I feel Mercedes must make a stand on this. Masi has made it up on the hoof and his decision could only have benefitted one driver. And the influence exerted by Horner "we only need one lap of racing" proved too much for Masi who will undoubtedly need to review his own position. [Post edited 12 Dec 2021 22:00]
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| Grand Prix decider on 23:19 - Dec 12 with 1403 views | theloneranger |
| Grand Prix decider on 22:00 - Dec 12 by union_jack |
Can't really argue with any of that.
I've had a rethink and now I feel Mercedes must make a stand on this. Masi has made it up on the hoof and his decision could only have benefitted one driver. And the influence exerted by Horner "we only need one lap of racing" proved too much for Masi who will undoubtedly need to review his own position. [Post edited 12 Dec 2021 22:00]
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| Everyday above ground ... Is a good day! 😎 |
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| Grand Prix decider on 09:46 - Dec 13 with 1287 views | A_Fans_Dad |
No one bothering to mention Hamilton cutting the corner and not handing back the gained position. |  | | |
| Grand Prix decider on 11:45 - Dec 13 with 1243 views | britferry |
Its like being 3-nil up in the last minute, the ref sending off 4 of our players and then saying, next goal wins.
Seen that elsewhere, found it quite funny. | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 14:20 - Dec 13 with 1219 views | pikeypaul |
Eddie Jordan summed the whole situation up perfectly this morning on Talksport,Hamilton very unlucky but everthing was done within the regulations,if they were not then appeal would have been upheld.
Personally I would prefer to listen to the knowledge of the former F1 chief over some know nothings on a football forum.
Well done Max,unlucky hamilton. [Post edited 13 Dec 2021 14:42]
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| Grand Prix decider on 14:40 - Dec 13 with 1212 views | pikeypaul |
| Grand Prix decider on 21:59 - Dec 12 by max936 |
It was a shocking way to end the season and championship decider, Red Bulls attitude to win by any means, means their driving tactic's are dangerous Perez was driving dangerously in trying to hold Hamilton back and Verstappen himself is reckless, I can't stand Horner his appraisal of Hamilton was laughable. |
red bull wanting to win it by any means possible ?
You are obviously a little mixed up.
mercedes want to win it in the court room now and wanted to win it behind the safety car yesterday.
Red Bull wanted it sorted out on the race track yesterday,which they did,far better tactics despite a far inferior car.
EVERY team at the start of the season agreed to whenever possible and yesterday it was safely possible for races to finish in race mode,mercedes havee now decided the race is better off decided off the track,despite the regs blowing apart any hope of them succeding,let them continue their whiging,nothing will change,thats for sure.
Hamilton unlucky yes but everything done by the book,like has been pointed out Any and All are two seperate words with total different meanings and the deployment and return of the safety car is TOTALLY up to the race officals discretion under reg 15.So frankly i cant see what the hamilton fan boys are crying about,they have not got a leg to stand on as pointed out by Eddie Jordan this morning, | |
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| Grand Prix decider on 16:20 - Dec 13 with 1162 views | felixstowe_jack |
| Grand Prix decider on 14:40 - Dec 13 by pikeypaul |
red bull wanting to win it by any means possible ?
You are obviously a little mixed up.
mercedes want to win it in the court room now and wanted to win it behind the safety car yesterday.
Red Bull wanted it sorted out on the race track yesterday,which they did,far better tactics despite a far inferior car.
EVERY team at the start of the season agreed to whenever possible and yesterday it was safely possible for races to finish in race mode,mercedes havee now decided the race is better off decided off the track,despite the regs blowing apart any hope of them succeding,let them continue their whiging,nothing will change,thats for sure.
Hamilton unlucky yes but everything done by the book,like has been pointed out Any and All are two seperate words with total different meanings and the deployment and return of the safety car is TOTALLY up to the race officals discretion under reg 15.So frankly i cant see what the hamilton fan boys are crying about,they have not got a leg to stand on as pointed out by Eddie Jordan this morning, |
Hardly better tactics nobody can plan on a crash with 5 laps to go. If the crash happened with 10 laps to a chance for everyone to change tyres. If the crash had happened a lap latter race would have finished under safety car.
Congratulations to Red bull and max they got lucky on the day but over the course of the season he had more points and more wins. | |
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