By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions. We in turn value your personal details in accordance with our Privacy Policy.
Please log in or register. Registered visitors get fewer ads.
It's very obvious he's got an issue with foreign players.
- He took against Sylla right from the start. - Banged on about Sylla & Yenni's English when everyone knows in this day and age in football it's not the most important thing - He also seemed to be genuinely surprised Wszolek was good - like he had presumed a foreign player couldn't be good. Kept mentioning how amazing it was that he could come in and have good relationship with a bloke from Poland. Now he's dropped him. - He binned off Polter - He binned off Chery - Both Chery and Polter seemed eager to leave after about a month under Ollie too. Coincidence? - He binned off Borsyiuk
In fact there isn't a single player in the team who doesn't speak English as a first language. Very unusual in today's football.
Gino Padula was the closest thing we had to foreign player last time round he took and age to give him ago despite that face he was playing well in the reserves. Also Gino had been at Walsall.
Just out of interest I had a look at the foreign signings during Ollie's time at Blackpool, and with the exception of Sylvestre and Grandin, it doesn't look like they got much game time.
N.B. I don't know how many of those spoke good English, and I haven't looked at the stats for the other 48 (presumably English speaking) players that were also signed (including gash like JET).
100% of people who drink water will die.
0
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 19:21 - Jan 31 with 2769 views
Ollie has also binned off a number of English players such as Caulker Doughty Comley JET Gladwin etc etc
the issue is that he acquired a team full of players from a previous manager, back when our strategy was to unearth foreign gems and then sell them on for a profit
this strategy, by its very nature, is very risky and likely to give you a bunch of dud players.
foreign players are also often easier to unload than English players. the reason is because most English players only want to play in England or Scotland, and therefore there is a somewhat finite pool of clubs they can go to. Foreign players playing in England are a self-selecting group of people who don't care about leaving home (as proved by the fact that they're playing in a foreign country). They can either be binned off to another English team or a team back in their home country or somewhere else in the world. that makes them easier to expend and move on
See below: Petrasso- went to MLS Polter- Germany Chery- China Borysik- Poland Yeni- France NEK- Holland
by contrast, JET isn't going to take his fat ass to play in Germany's 2nd division
0
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 19:33 - Jan 31 with 2739 views
Are you telling me that "Chuffed as a badger in the mating season", or "Getting an ugly bird in the back of a taxi", are not part of the universal language of football? If there is a problem between Ollie and the non-English players then it can only be down to the poor quality of the club interpreters.
0
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 22:52 - Jan 31 with 2522 views
He's got rid of a lot of English players as well so don't buy this he doesn't like foreigners thing, just feels like another excuse to have a go at Holloway based on very little. Warnock had a mostly English speaking and English born team bar Gorkss, Faurlin and Adel who were already here, no mention of him being anti foreigners.
Polter and Chery both wanted to leave, bugger all to do with Holloway, we could have Guardiola as manager and Chery was going to grab that China offer with both hands
Pawel has been a regular under him for most of his time until he lost form and recently got injured.
Really odd thread this.
2
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 22:55 - Jan 31 with 2515 views
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 19:58 - Jan 31 by Match82
Oh, the wrong type of foreigner...
Dear me. If you read my post - I said foreign players who 'don't speak English as their first language'.
Luongo is an Aussie, he came from the Spurs youth team & then Swindon - are you honestly saying you can't see how he might not have the same problems fitting in with Ollie & his staff compared to say a foreign player like Sylla or Yenni?
It feels a lot like you're being purposefully difficult over what is honestly a very reasonable distinction.
If you want to argue the wider point that's fine - disagree - but using Luongo as proof of your point is just silly.
Some interesting comments around this topic in a painful Holloway ramble from a while back.
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 19:39 - Jan 31 by stevec
I’d have thought one of Holloway’s most successful regular players was the great Danny Shittu.
At this point the Crown Prosecuting Service agreed to drop the case.
Danny Shittu foreign??? He moved to England when he was 7 years old. I'll leave that there.
And Smegma - if you're going to dismiss me at least do me the favour of explaining what evidence you have that I am totally wrong and 'speaking out of my deriere'?
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 22:52 - Jan 31 by daveB
He's got rid of a lot of English players as well so don't buy this he doesn't like foreigners thing, just feels like another excuse to have a go at Holloway based on very little. Warnock had a mostly English speaking and English born team bar Gorkss, Faurlin and Adel who were already here, no mention of him being anti foreigners.
Polter and Chery both wanted to leave, bugger all to do with Holloway, we could have Guardiola as manager and Chery was going to grab that China offer with both hands
Pawel has been a regular under him for most of his time until he lost form and recently got injured.
Really odd thread this.
Have to agree with Dave and others on this, Westbourne.
Maybe you're not saying that Holloway's being anti-foreigner but your first sentence in your OP certainly says exactly that, inadvertently maybe.
Anyway we've had this kicked around on here before, I can't see anything in it.
"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 19:21 - Jan 31 by qprd
Ollie has also binned off a number of English players such as Caulker Doughty Comley JET Gladwin etc etc
the issue is that he acquired a team full of players from a previous manager, back when our strategy was to unearth foreign gems and then sell them on for a profit
this strategy, by its very nature, is very risky and likely to give you a bunch of dud players.
foreign players are also often easier to unload than English players. the reason is because most English players only want to play in England or Scotland, and therefore there is a somewhat finite pool of clubs they can go to. Foreign players playing in England are a self-selecting group of people who don't care about leaving home (as proved by the fact that they're playing in a foreign country). They can either be binned off to another English team or a team back in their home country or somewhere else in the world. that makes them easier to expend and move on
See below: Petrasso- went to MLS Polter- Germany Chery- China Borysik- Poland Yeni- France NEK- Holland
by contrast, JET isn't going to take his fat ass to play in Germany's 2nd division
Decent point mate. I'll take that. Sure it is a factor. Mind you he doesn't give them much of chance before they leave either.
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 23:00 - Jan 31 by BrianMcCarthy
Have to agree with Dave and others on this, Westbourne.
Maybe you're not saying that Holloway's being anti-foreigner but your first sentence in your OP certainly says exactly that, inadvertently maybe.
Anyway we've had this kicked around on here before, I can't see anything in it.
Alright Brian, fair enough, I knew I wouldn't get a lot of agreement but that's my gut feeling.
Dave mentions Warnock having all English players 'bar Gorkss, Adel and Faurlin' - well that's 3 exceptions in an eleven man team! And he didn't even mention Helguson. That's four.
I think it's just a matter of phrasing, Westy. Had you said 'maybe Ollie likes a team full of players who can understand the English language and have experience of playing in England' then I think there would be a decent conversation to be had, with some pointing out (as they have here) that he has signed plenty of players in the past who don't fit that criteria.
But 'maybe Ollie likes a team full of players who can understand the English language and have experience of playing in England' sounds a lot different to 'It's very obvious he's got an issue with foreign players'.
That's my only point here, really.
"The opposite of love, after all, is not hate, but indifference."
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 23:06 - Jan 31 by WestbourneR
Alright Brian, fair enough, I knew I wouldn't get a lot of agreement but that's my gut feeling.
Dave mentions Warnock having all English players 'bar Gorkss, Adel and Faurlin' - well that's 3 exceptions in an eleven man team! And he didn't even mention Helguson. That's four.
Very different from Ollie, very different.
out of interest then which foreign players at the club or the ones who have left do you think should be playing or shouldn't have been offloaded?
Sylla is probably the only one but its more his work rate than his birthplace thats the issue with him.
If you look at the ones who have left such as Nasser, Yenni and Ariel they were not playing before Holloway came in so he hasn't binned regular first team players. As I said before Chery and polter were both regulars under Holloway but both had personal reasons why they left.
Pawel has been a regular and with money limited he has gone wth safer options in the transfer window who happen to be English. Really don't see the issue if he had the kind of foreign players Warnock did then they'd all be regulars in the team. Warnock made a big thing of wanting an English core to his dressing room as well, no different to what Holloway has said.
I do think it helps to have an English/British core to the team in the Championship, it's not essential but in the past we've had a real mix and it's caused issues with the changing room split into different camps and several managers found it difficult bringing them all together.
[Post edited 1 Feb 2018 7:07]
1
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 23:38 - Jan 31 with 2428 views
FWIW Westbourne, I've had the same feelings about Ollie. Obviously nothing conclusive, but just how it seems to me too.
I like to think it's not some sort of bigotry, but instead a pragmatic approach: easier to build team spirit among a lot of people with similar backgrounds and expectations, and certainly beneficial to have people who don't have the distraction of being away from their family, or settling in a new culture or style of football.
When I spent a month as a football agent (that's another story), Ewan Chester who was in charge of recruitment for Norwich at the time, indicated they were only signing players who were already in England. I don't think it's an uncommon approach.
0
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 23:49 - Jan 31 with 2398 views
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 22:55 - Jan 31 by WestbourneR
Dear me. If you read my post - I said foreign players who 'don't speak English as their first language'.
Luongo is an Aussie, he came from the Spurs youth team & then Swindon - are you honestly saying you can't see how he might not have the same problems fitting in with Ollie & his staff compared to say a foreign player like Sylla or Yenni?
It feels a lot like you're being purposefully difficult over what is honestly a very reasonable distinction.
If you want to argue the wider point that's fine - disagree - but using Luongo as proof of your point is just silly.
Some interesting comments around this topic in a painful Holloway ramble from a while back.
[Post edited 31 Jan 2018 23:02]
No, I see your point, but if you're excluding Luongo then you should also probably exclude Chery, as the Dutch speak excellent English on the whole.
If your point is actually that Olly is less trustful of players with experience in the English league then you have more of a point, but, how is this different to Neil Warnock's approach?
0
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 00:53 - Feb 1 with 2360 views
Definitely NOT a prejudice thing - he really isn't that type of person, in fact he's incredibly decent & humane whatever his other shortcomings - case for a preference thing, perhaps, but then Alex Bonnot was mentioned earlier in this thread. I remember Holloway going up to fans at a get-together and (seriously) asking if anyone could babysit for Bonnot and his other half so that they could get some time out of the house - there may be others on here who were at the same thing and also remember this. He was acutely conscious of the challenges faced by foreign players at the most basic of levels, and I doubt he's become any less enlightened.
Have a go at the tactics, formations and selections by all means (plenty of scope for that) but not the slightest imputation of the guy's character, please, - Ian is an entirely decent man.
5
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 06:54 - Feb 1 with 2260 views
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 22:25 - Jan 31 by GloryHunter
Are you telling me that "Chuffed as a badger in the mating season", or "Getting an ugly bird in the back of a taxi", are not part of the universal language of football? If there is a problem between Ollie and the non-English players then it can only be down to the poor quality of the club interpreters.
Or the poor quality of the English used by the manager?.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the Earth all one's lifetime." (Mark Twain)
Find me on twitter @derbyhoop and now on Bluesky
0
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 07:38 - Feb 1 with 2217 views
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 19:00 - Jan 31 by SimonJames
Just out of interest I had a look at the foreign signings during Ollie's time at Blackpool, and with the exception of Sylvestre and Grandin, it doesn't look like they got much game time.
N.B. I don't know how many of those spoke good English, and I haven't looked at the stats for the other 48 (presumably English speaking) players that were also signed (including gash like JET).
Perhaps they all spoke good English but couldn’t understand Wurzel Holloway.....
Scooters, Tunes, Trainers and QPR.
0
Ollie & foreign players - worrying pattern on 09:21 - Feb 1 with 2120 views
By continuing to use the site, you agree to our use of cookies and to abide by our Terms and Conditions.
