| Trust Statement 20:42 - Apr 11 with 37450 views | monmouth |
Good!!! |  |
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| Trust Statement on 16:11 - Apr 13 with 1753 views | Todger |
| Trust Statement on 16:06 - Apr 13 by Darran |
Who are you,are you a Swans fan and where are you from? |
Yep I am a fan born and bred in Swansea but probably a plastic in your eyes as only took interest when we got to the Prem. Don't attend the Liberty for Swans matches but watch on TV. Just trying to understand why you think you have such a strong legal case with so many of the facts missing. |  | | |
| Trust Statement on 16:15 - Apr 13 with 1741 views | Darran |
| Trust Statement on 16:11 - Apr 13 by Todger |
Yep I am a fan born and bred in Swansea but probably a plastic in your eyes as only took interest when we got to the Prem. Don't attend the Liberty for Swans matches but watch on TV. Just trying to understand why you think you have such a strong legal case with so many of the facts missing. |
Nah there's summin fishy here. |  |
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| Trust Statement on 16:16 - Apr 13 with 1735 views | perchrockjack |
Todge
Be wary
Better still, unless he cautions you ,say nowt
He ll use it against you in future of that I can assure you
Bluey...
Respect...?wont find much of that amongst Swans fans here when a moderator is the biggest culprit of showing complete contempt .
You ll also find fans are graded
Where they live
Do they go to games
If so ,for how long and where do they sit
We re pretty unique really | |
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| Trust Statement on 16:25 - Apr 13 with 1728 views | Spratty |
| Trust Statement on 15:51 - Apr 13 by Todger |
Its todger by the way.
My strategy would be to gain a full understanding of the facts the legalities and the risks involved. Not let anger take over. |
My apologies re your username - seems I was using the Scottish derivation
So as per the strategy - pretty much what we are doing now excellent - at one stage it seemed you were suggesting we ignore our counsel based on your concern of us taking legal action.
I would still be interested to know what your connections are in relation to this case |  | | |
| Trust Statement on 16:27 - Apr 13 with 1728 views | Nookiejack |
| Trust Statement on 16:11 - Apr 13 by Todger |
Yep I am a fan born and bred in Swansea but probably a plastic in your eyes as only took interest when we got to the Prem. Don't attend the Liberty for Swans matches but watch on TV. Just trying to understand why you think you have such a strong legal case with so many of the facts missing. |
Given your legal knowledge how could the Trust stop say an excessive £20m management fee being paid offshore to the Delaware incorporated company?
It appears from the Trust Board minutes the Trust on occasions hasn't received the Management Accounts for 3 months - so wouldn't pick this up in good time - if similar delays occurred.
Is there an agreement between US and U.K. to then force the Delaware company to remit the excessive management fee back to the UK - if the management fee was found by the courts to be excessive? | | | |
| Trust Statement on 16:34 - Apr 13 with 1718 views | marchamjack |
| Trust Statement on 10:11 - Apr 13 by Todger |
Not sure it is that simple. These cases are never black and white. whether you are going on unfair prejudice or quasi partnership angles. There was a very recent case between Hawkes and Cuddy over whether one should buy the other out of Neath rugby. I am told that court costs after all appeals were exhausted was well over £3 million and the judge ordered that neither had to buy each other out.
Counsel acting for both told them they had a winning case and the fees were not on a no win no fee basis.
What do you do if Counsel advises it is 50/50 and the other side have deeper pockets? What if costs are awarded against the Trust in a loss? |
Cases are rarely black and white, hence why parties seek Counsels opinion. And that's what is arrived at. An opinion. Not a guarantee.
The Trust will have to take a view then, on the opinion, whether it is worthwhile proceeding or not. There will never be a 100% guarantee they will be successful nor that they won't be exposed to a costs application.
Although on the latter point, Counsel will be able to give as good a steer as he can as to the likelihood of costs being awarded against the Trust. That is regardless of whether the Trust are successful or not in their action.
From my own experience of working with various Counsel over the years, if they say it's a 50/50 case and you look at the other side and they've got the deeper pockets...walk away...even if you really don't want to. Or unless it runs so deep that your prepared to lose possibly everything. As I say, I'd walk away at that point.
But my basic point remains. I want the elected Trust officers to make the call and that's the call. They can explain the pros and con later and no doubt we'll have a 20 pager on here. But make the call in house and go from there. [Post edited 13 Apr 2017 16:45]
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| Oh,..Dave, what's occuring? |
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| Trust Statement on 16:46 - Apr 13 with 1692 views | monmouth |
| Trust Statement on 16:15 - Apr 13 by Darran |
Nah there's summin fishy here. |
Well this is hardly the first thread on these issues....but he/she is obviously just compelled to sign up and comment now...
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| Trust Statement on 16:47 - Apr 13 with 1685 views | Darran |
| Trust Statement on 16:16 - Apr 13 by perchrockjack |
Todge
Be wary
Better still, unless he cautions you ,say nowt
He ll use it against you in future of that I can assure you
Bluey...
Respect...?wont find much of that amongst Swans fans here when a moderator is the biggest culprit of showing complete contempt .
You ll also find fans are graded
Where they live
Do they go to games
If so ,for how long and where do they sit
We re pretty unique really |
It shouldn't really have anything to do with you as you were one of the only ones all for the sale and the super duper investment in 'your' club. | |
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| Trust Statement on 16:51 - Apr 13 with 1685 views | monmouth |
| Trust Statement on 16:34 - Apr 13 by marchamjack |
Cases are rarely black and white, hence why parties seek Counsels opinion. And that's what is arrived at. An opinion. Not a guarantee.
The Trust will have to take a view then, on the opinion, whether it is worthwhile proceeding or not. There will never be a 100% guarantee they will be successful nor that they won't be exposed to a costs application.
Although on the latter point, Counsel will be able to give as good a steer as he can as to the likelihood of costs being awarded against the Trust. That is regardless of whether the Trust are successful or not in their action.
From my own experience of working with various Counsel over the years, if they say it's a 50/50 case and you look at the other side and they've got the deeper pockets...walk away...even if you really don't want to. Or unless it runs so deep that your prepared to lose possibly everything. As I say, I'd walk away at that point.
But my basic point remains. I want the elected Trust officers to make the call and that's the call. They can explain the pros and con later and no doubt we'll have a 20 pager on here. But make the call in house and go from there. [Post edited 13 Apr 2017 16:45]
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Well, here's the rub on this one. What happens if the Trust goes to court, loses (or wins not very much) is made liable to pay costs of £Xm with assets of only a few hundred thousand?
What does betting the farm actually mean in this case? | |
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| Trust Statement on 17:01 - Apr 13 with 1666 views | blueytheblue |
| Trust Statement on 16:08 - Apr 13 by monmouth |
Although Newcy did get £35m for Sissoko and a shedload for Townsend. Lets hope Liverpool still do their buying on press hype and match of the day. |
Indeed - there are always the exceptions to the rule.
Difference being, Newcastle have higher income streams outside TC money than say you - they are thus in a position to drive harder bargains.
Equally, given Newcastle seem virtually guaranteed to go down then come back up the next season, a lot of players may not want to leave, being back in the Prem within a season. It helps Benitez set a good example in that regard. [Post edited 13 Apr 2017 17:02]
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| Trust Statement on 17:17 - Apr 13 with 1636 views | Todger |
| Trust Statement on 16:27 - Apr 13 by Nookiejack |
Given your legal knowledge how could the Trust stop say an excessive £20m management fee being paid offshore to the Delaware incorporated company?
It appears from the Trust Board minutes the Trust on occasions hasn't received the Management Accounts for 3 months - so wouldn't pick this up in good time - if similar delays occurred.
Is there an agreement between US and U.K. to then force the Delaware company to remit the excessive management fee back to the UK - if the management fee was found by the courts to be excessive? |
I don't think it could stop it but it would have a pretty good case for unfair prejudice if it happened. A management fee that is excessive is a bit like an elephant. Hard to define until you see it.
I am not sure that remaining a 21% shareholder before and after a transaction is unfair prejudice though, which is why I ask the question as to how solid the grounds for legal action are. Sure you can be diluted sure the articles could be changed but that could have happened before unless the SHA said otherwise. | | | |
| Trust Statement on 17:20 - Apr 13 with 1629 views | Todger |
| Trust Statement on 16:34 - Apr 13 by marchamjack |
Cases are rarely black and white, hence why parties seek Counsels opinion. And that's what is arrived at. An opinion. Not a guarantee.
The Trust will have to take a view then, on the opinion, whether it is worthwhile proceeding or not. There will never be a 100% guarantee they will be successful nor that they won't be exposed to a costs application.
Although on the latter point, Counsel will be able to give as good a steer as he can as to the likelihood of costs being awarded against the Trust. That is regardless of whether the Trust are successful or not in their action.
From my own experience of working with various Counsel over the years, if they say it's a 50/50 case and you look at the other side and they've got the deeper pockets...walk away...even if you really don't want to. Or unless it runs so deep that your prepared to lose possibly everything. As I say, I'd walk away at that point.
But my basic point remains. I want the elected Trust officers to make the call and that's the call. They can explain the pros and con later and no doubt we'll have a 20 pager on here. But make the call in house and go from there. [Post edited 13 Apr 2017 16:45]
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Not much to argue with there. I have been told if a Counsel tells you 60/40 in reality it is a good as 90% but if he tells you 50/50 it is really 40/60 and if he tells you 40/60 it is really 90% against. | | | |
| Trust Statement on 17:24 - Apr 13 with 1620 views | Todger |
| Trust Statement on 16:51 - Apr 13 by monmouth |
Well, here's the rub on this one. What happens if the Trust goes to court, loses (or wins not very much) is made liable to pay costs of £Xm with assets of only a few hundred thousand?
What does betting the farm actually mean in this case? |
The concern might be that there is difficulty getting a case heard if they argue there is insufficient assets there to cover costs if they win.. Somebody might need to put a bond up or perhaps the Trusts shares are offered as security. | | | |
| Trust Statement on 17:32 - Apr 13 with 1604 views | Todger |
| Trust Statement on 16:25 - Apr 13 by Spratty |
My apologies re your username - seems I was using the Scottish derivation
So as per the strategy - pretty much what we are doing now excellent - at one stage it seemed you were suggesting we ignore our counsel based on your concern of us taking legal action.
I would still be interested to know what your connections are in relation to this case |
I have no connections to this case other than as a plastic fan as some would describe me. although I can remember waiting up for my father to return in the early hours after a Swans FA cup victory at Anfield when he told me some England international blasted a penalty over the bar in the last minute with a guy called Noel Dwyer I think in goal and also returning from a losing semi final after being 1 up at the half and making plans for Wembley.
I was at the Vetch for a few games as well in the old double decker when they were in the lower divisions.
My only advice with counsel is to ask him what he would be saying if the other side asked him to defend their case. [Post edited 13 Apr 2017 17:34]
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| Trust Statement on 17:41 - Apr 13 with 1573 views | lifelong |
| Trust Statement on 17:32 - Apr 13 by Todger |
I have no connections to this case other than as a plastic fan as some would describe me. although I can remember waiting up for my father to return in the early hours after a Swans FA cup victory at Anfield when he told me some England international blasted a penalty over the bar in the last minute with a guy called Noel Dwyer I think in goal and also returning from a losing semi final after being 1 up at the half and making plans for Wembley.
I was at the Vetch for a few games as well in the old double decker when they were in the lower divisions.
My only advice with counsel is to ask him what he would be saying if the other side asked him to defend their case. [Post edited 13 Apr 2017 17:34]
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Ronnie Moran took the penalty for Liverpool. |  | | |
| Trust Statement on 17:54 - Apr 13 with 1547 views | Highjack |
| Trust Statement on 16:15 - Apr 13 by Darran |
Nah there's summin fishy here. |
Yeah I thought the same thing. |  |
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| Trust Statement on 17:58 - Apr 13 with 1540 views | cimlajack |
| Trust Statement on 16:34 - Apr 13 by marchamjack |
Cases are rarely black and white, hence why parties seek Counsels opinion. And that's what is arrived at. An opinion. Not a guarantee.
The Trust will have to take a view then, on the opinion, whether it is worthwhile proceeding or not. There will never be a 100% guarantee they will be successful nor that they won't be exposed to a costs application.
Although on the latter point, Counsel will be able to give as good a steer as he can as to the likelihood of costs being awarded against the Trust. That is regardless of whether the Trust are successful or not in their action.
From my own experience of working with various Counsel over the years, if they say it's a 50/50 case and you look at the other side and they've got the deeper pockets...walk away...even if you really don't want to. Or unless it runs so deep that your prepared to lose possibly everything. As I say, I'd walk away at that point.
But my basic point remains. I want the elected Trust officers to make the call and that's the call. They can explain the pros and con later and no doubt we'll have a 20 pager on here. But make the call in house and go from there. [Post edited 13 Apr 2017 16:45]
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My understanding is, that the Trust has already received advice from one chambers,and were seeking a second opinion from another chambers.
Could someone correct me if i'm wrong ?
Thanks in advance | | | |
| Trust Statement on 17:59 - Apr 13 with 1536 views | Darran |
| Trust Statement on 17:41 - Apr 13 by lifelong |
Ronnie Moran took the penalty for Liverpool. |
Sure it wasn't a Scoucer called Richie Moron? | |
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| Trust Statement on 18:20 - Apr 13 with 1504 views | marchamjack |
| Trust Statement on 17:58 - Apr 13 by cimlajack |
My understanding is, that the Trust has already received advice from one chambers,and were seeking a second opinion from another chambers.
Could someone correct me if i'm wrong ?
Thanks in advance |
If that is the case, then just based on my own experiences ( and I have no knowledge on the Trust case/advice) that usually means the 1st advice is unclear or that there's a part of the advice that some specific clarification is being sought on. Rare to seek a 2nd opinion if the 1st opinion sought is unequivocal, one way or the other. | |
| Oh,..Dave, what's occuring? |
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| Trust Statement on 18:29 - Apr 13 with 1486 views | Shaky |
| Trust Statement on 15:51 - Apr 13 by Todger |
Its todger by the way.
My strategy would be to gain a full understanding of the facts the legalities and the risks involved. Not let anger take over. |
Fair enough, Todger, I am happy to accept your good intentions, but this is hardly Moses coming down from the Mount is it?
In fact it is precisely what the Trust has done!
Therefore you coming down from where ever invoking a load of jargon doesn't really help much at all. At best it is a distraction, and at worst you are spreading FUD.
And just so we understand each other clearly, the more you repeat the same thing over and over again in slightly different ways, the more I am inclined to mistrust your intentions. |  |
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| Trust Statement on 18:31 - Apr 13 with 1479 views | Shaky |
| Trust Statement on 18:20 - Apr 13 by marchamjack |
If that is the case, then just based on my own experiences ( and I have no knowledge on the Trust case/advice) that usually means the 1st advice is unclear or that there's a part of the advice that some specific clarification is being sought on. Rare to seek a 2nd opinion if the 1st opinion sought is unequivocal, one way or the other. |
The difference is second time around I gave the Trust a significantly stronger case. | |
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| Trust Statement on 18:35 - Apr 13 with 1466 views | Darran |
| Trust Statement on 18:29 - Apr 13 by Shaky |
Fair enough, Todger, I am happy to accept your good intentions, but this is hardly Moses coming down from the Mount is it?
In fact it is precisely what the Trust has done!
Therefore you coming down from where ever invoking a load of jargon doesn't really help much at all. At best it is a distraction, and at worst you are spreading FUD.
And just so we understand each other clearly, the more you repeat the same thing over and over again in slightly different ways, the more I am inclined to mistrust your intentions. |
So what are your intentions then Shaky Of The Bailey? | |
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| Trust Statement on 18:37 - Apr 13 with 1461 views | Shaky |
| Trust Statement on 18:35 - Apr 13 by Darran |
So what are your intentions then Shaky Of The Bailey? |
Get a fcuking life, you piece of human excrement.
Alright? | |
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| Trust Statement on 18:39 - Apr 13 with 1457 views | Darran |
| Trust Statement on 18:37 - Apr 13 by Shaky |
Get a fcuking life, you piece of human excrement.
Alright? |
Answer the question before I tell the Mods to ban you. | |
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| Trust Statement on 18:46 - Apr 13 with 1448 views | Shaky |
| Trust Statement on 18:39 - Apr 13 by Darran |
Answer the question before I tell the Mods to ban you. |
Are you stupid, as well as a digusting amoral piece of shit? | |
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