| Aren’t football fans so fickle 21:47 - Jan 13 with 10493 views | areasix |
I just looked back to see which of the forum members in Sept were calling for RM , Wilcox and the board for sackings and it’s interesting to see many are claiming how great a buzz it is at present yet if some people at the club had listened to them ( thank god they didn’t) so early into his Management term at SFC RM would of been on his bike and some journeyman manager who had failed with many clubs would of been given the job.
Instead we are watching exciting football which has been missing at St Mary’s for so long whether it’s good enough to gain automatic promotion only time will tell but if we sell Adams we need another goal scorer to come in that’s for sure.
I just hope that when we get into choppy waters again the clamber to get rid of everyone at the top is not lead by the same ones again who know who they are as they have gone on record on this forum with comments in September.
As a club we all need to pull in the same direction which I think is the way we are going at present in good times as well as bad.
I have said before games in the Championship are the best when we were here last time and this time, no VAR , away support is tremendous and it’s so good to be a supporter at present after so many hard times.
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 18:08 - Jan 14 with 1760 views | I_would |
RM has responded to widespread frustration at tippy tappy boring crap game after game and hollow promises of success.
He's getting them to move the ball FORWARD and QUICKLY at bloody last! Guess what? The fans know best after all. Still you have to give him credit for RM changing things around due to fan pressure. | |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 18:09 - Jan 14 with 1759 views | Heisenberg |
When we conceded a goal from our corner when Edozie was left as the last man and only man in defence I thought RM didn’t have a clue. At Sunderland we were truly abysmal which given our squad was totally unacceptable. But credit due to him. He has turned it around in style. All fans are fickle. |  |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 20:59 - Jan 14 with 1685 views | SaintNick |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 18:08 - Jan 14 by I_would |
RM has responded to widespread frustration at tippy tappy boring crap game after game and hollow promises of success.
He's getting them to move the ball FORWARD and QUICKLY at bloody last! Guess what? The fans know best after all. Still you have to give him credit for RM changing things around due to fan pressure. |
Nothing to do with fan pressure it is all about becoming confident in playing the system and then the players started to play it better and felt able to take a little more risk in the games.
If fan pressure was involved it was the groans from the crowd as we started out with the possession game, players became scared to take risks so just played simple balls to feet, as the players became better the crowd eased off, it was initially a catch 22 situation |  |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 21:57 - Jan 14 with 1659 views | GRIM |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 07:58 - Jan 14 by Butty101 |
Well said Pat. We have infinitely more resources than all the other clubs in the league. The unbeaten run is impressive but our league position in below par.
What other club in the league can spend 20mill on two players that can’t get a game? |
What other club in the Championship could afford or be daft enough to sign a striker for 8m that was injured, hadn't played for 9 mths & will not be fit to play for us this season & quite possibly will never play for us other than the couple of 10 minute substitute appearances.
But RM can't be blamed for that, that decision was probably made by more senior executives at the club.
I was very unsure about RM being the right fit for our club but always believe that you judge by results so let's judge him at end of season. | | | |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 07:50 - Jan 15 with 1605 views | 1teeminants |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 11:13 - Jan 14 by Meonsaint |
This forum is surely about people’s opinions isn’t it ? The fans are never going to all agree that is human nature.
After last year’s disastrous season and the debacle of hiring Jones and then the aftermath of Selles trying to salvage the already doomed wreckage it’s understandable after 4 straight defeats and leaking goals for fun in September that some Saints fans had enough. Thank goodness we have this board to air our frustrations.
I am old enough to remember Lawrie Mc having hot dogs, coffee and all sorts of rubbish being chucked at him when he made his way past the West Stand Dockers to the dug out back in the mid 70s after he took us down. What we all didn’t realise at the time that only a couple of years later we we would be on the global football stage with Pedro Rodrigues collecting the FA Cup off HRH The Queen.
In September I was critical of Martin’s style of football as it was just not achieving the results and success that us long suffering fans deserve.
Give credit where it’s due Russell Martin is turning the club around. |
It’s a good job the Man United board ignored the baying mob when Sir Alex Ferguson had a disastrous start to his Man United career. The fans wanted him sacked .I remember it well . 🤦♂️👀 |  |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 08:48 - Jan 15 with 1584 views | PatfromPoole |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 07:50 - Jan 15 by 1teeminants |
It’s a good job the Man United board ignored the baying mob when Sir Alex Ferguson had a disastrous start to his Man United career. The fans wanted him sacked .I remember it well . 🤦♂️👀 |
They didn’t ignore the fans at all.
If he had lost that Cup tie at Forest, he would have been sacked.
Sadly he stayed and the rest is history. |  |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 10:31 - Jan 15 with 1561 views | 1teeminants |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 08:48 - Jan 15 by PatfromPoole |
They didn’t ignore the fans at all.
If he had lost that Cup tie at Forest, he would have been sacked.
Sadly he stayed and the rest is history. |
Which just goes to show you need patience  | |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 11:31 - Jan 15 with 1533 views | Ifonly |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 10:31 - Jan 15 by 1teeminants |
Which just goes to show you need patience |
So, for example, Birmingham needed to show patience with Rooney? Saints needed to show patience with Nathan Jones?
There is no rule here. | | | |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 11:37 - Jan 15 with 1530 views | SaintNick |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 08:48 - Jan 15 by PatfromPoole |
They didn’t ignore the fans at all.
If he had lost that Cup tie at Forest, he would have been sacked.
Sadly he stayed and the rest is history. |
Back when that Forest Cup Tie was played in January 1990, Fergie had been at Old Trafford since November 1986, over 3 years.
But those 3 years had been up and down, they had finished 2nd one year, but then regressed and in that time not got near a final in either competition, there were no European games for English clubs back then.
So by late 1989 and the club in mid table the fans were starting to protest, in November the famous banner appeared "Three years of excuses and it's still crap ... ta-ra Fergie." and they were up in arms officially.
So Fergie had been given a bit of patience by both the club and fans by the time he arrived at Forest that day and yes probably would have been sacked, but the board had had more patience than most clubs would have had by then | |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 11:49 - Jan 15 with 1523 views | Ifonly |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 20:59 - Jan 14 by SaintNick |
Nothing to do with fan pressure it is all about becoming confident in playing the system and then the players started to play it better and felt able to take a little more risk in the games.
If fan pressure was involved it was the groans from the crowd as we started out with the possession game, players became scared to take risks so just played simple balls to feet, as the players became better the crowd eased off, it was initially a catch 22 situation |
Maybe more because of results than fan pressure, but RM has clearly adapted at times. For example, I can't remember which game now but after a bad run, suddenly Baz started launching the ball forward. It was an obvious change.
Now, in games like Saturday, we're moving the ball quickly from defence to attack which is great and something we weren't doing before. I suspect that's for a mixture of reasons but partly because it's easy to do against crap teams like Sheff Weds without losing possession. What you say is partly true too, confidence and familiarity have helped. It will be interesting to see if we do it against better defences or revert back to the slow-slow build up because possession is the priority. [Post edited 15 Jan 11:52]
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 11:55 - Jan 15 with 1516 views | SalisburySaint |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 11:49 - Jan 15 by Ifonly |
Maybe more because of results than fan pressure, but RM has clearly adapted at times. For example, I can't remember which game now but after a bad run, suddenly Baz started launching the ball forward. It was an obvious change.
Now, in games like Saturday, we're moving the ball quickly from defence to attack which is great and something we weren't doing before. I suspect that's for a mixture of reasons but partly because it's easy to do against crap teams like Sheff Weds without losing possession. What you say is partly true too, confidence and familiarity have helped. It will be interesting to see if we do it against better defences or revert back to the slow-slow build up because possession is the priority. [Post edited 15 Jan 11:52]
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Baz was playing long balls forward occasionally from the very early games. I noticed this first in friendly away to Reading.
The one thing that has changed is that we mix the passing up a bit with far more balls over the top than we did earlier in the season, so our play is not so predictable as it was at start of te season |  | | |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 11:59 - Jan 15 with 1511 views | saint901 |
I'm pretty sure I did not call for RM's head after the 4 game losing streak but I have said that I'm not convinced he is the man to get us automatic promotion nor able to operate in the PL.
I was at the SW game and I'm really pleased to see how the team played. The first goal had RM stamped on it albeit helped by the defender missing the cross. The next three were breakaway goals as SW decided that they had travelled a long way and might as well have a go.
Were they RM goals, i.e. keep the ball and pass it into the net? No. But were they a result of having the ball so long that SW had little choice but to leave gaps? Yes. So a breakaway goal is RM style (being generous).
Let's remember however that SW are new to this league and the gulf in class showed. The real test is going to be top two teams and perhaps top six and some of those are yet to come.
Will the tactics from SW translate into games v Leicester and Ipswich and Leeds? I think not and I hope RM has some variations to play. And this is where I cannot shake off the feeling that he's a few percent short of what we need to avoid the lottery of the playoffs.
The next ten games all look winnable. I'd hope we could pick up 24 points from them. Then we have Leicester away and shortly after that Ipswich away. I'd hope the ten games before then will see us practice tactics that will work against both and I'll be looking for them.
Is RM good enough for the PL? We'll see. Worse managers than him have survived there.
Is the team good enough for the PL? We have some decent players but who would get into a PL team. KWP. THB. Ryan Fraser on present form. AA? SA? Struggling after that.
SO if we did get promoted and brought in 4 or 5 players, how long would it need to get them playing in the RM way?
That would not be RM's fault of course, but would be a good test of whether he has the credentials.
For me, he's still a little shortof what we need (and I hope I'm wrong). | | | |
| Football fans are not Stepford Wives on 13:44 - Jan 15 with 1481 views | dirk_doone |
So, the answer to the original question is no, not really. They are just normal human beings, and when they are in a football discussion forum, where the main topics are the manager and the players, if one is doing badly, they will say so and if they improve a lot, they will be pleased and say so too. Sounds reasonable to me. I recall the same thing happened with Lawrie McMenemy and he obviously thrived on it here if not at Sunderland, where the improvement never came so the crticism there just got worse until they sacked him.
I think what we are seeing here is just a case of 'I told you so' from a couple of fans who thought that Russell Martin was a good appointment and have been proved right. Well done! You deserve a pat on the back. [Post edited 15 Jan 14:02]
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 16:08 - Jan 15 with 1402 views | saints__fan__73 |
Difficult to get too effusive with praise for Martin when our squad is light years ahead of anything any other club in this league has other than Leeds and Leicester.
We spent more money in the Summer on squad player Shea Charles than the likes of Swansea/QPR/Millwall/Blackburn have spent on their entire squads. |  |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 17:14 - Jan 15 with 1357 views | 1teeminants |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 11:31 - Jan 15 by Ifonly |
So, for example, Birmingham needed to show patience with Rooney? Saints needed to show patience with Nathan Jones?
There is no rule here. |
Some saints fans wrote Russell Martin off even before he arrived saying “no we don’t want him he has an awful record” ( which is just not true) . He got Swansea to just off play offs with a small squad and no money. You don’t have to be a brain surgeon to realise that if he just missed out at Swansea then he could do better playing his way with a bigger club like saints with better players already here and more money to spend which of course would take time but some didn’t want to give him that but as I said , some didn’t want him here at all.
The tippy tappy stuff is now quicker and more incisive and all the players, every single one of them is brimming with confidence . | |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 17:49 - Jan 15 with 1343 views | grumpy |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 17:14 - Jan 15 by 1teeminants |
Some saints fans wrote Russell Martin off even before he arrived saying “no we don’t want him he has an awful record” ( which is just not true) . He got Swansea to just off play offs with a small squad and no money. You don’t have to be a brain surgeon to realise that if he just missed out at Swansea then he could do better playing his way with a bigger club like saints with better players already here and more money to spend which of course would take time but some didn’t want to give him that but as I said , some didn’t want him here at all.
The tippy tappy stuff is now quicker and more incisive and all the players, every single one of them is brimming with confidence . |
Russell got Swansea to within 3 points of a playoff place.
Milton Keynes P 80 W 30 D 19 L 31
Swansea P 99 W 36 D 27 L 36
It wasn't a great record,and you have to understand Saints fans having doubts after the fiasco with the previous two managers.
He has done extremely well at Saints after a poor start and credit to him for that because he was under a lot of pressure.
Do I think he will get us promoted? Well unless he sits on the owners desk and demands a centre forward who will score and just be a nuisance in the box, I don't think so.
I dearly want that automatic spot because come the playoffs,I don't think we have the cutting edge to make promotion.
Having said all that Russell has got the team into a fantastic position and must be congratulated,just need the final pieces to the jigsaw to achieve the final goal. |  | | |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 22:02 - Jan 15 with 1271 views | areasix |
I started this thread A) To see if the real anti any manager would still voice being anti RM or anyone else we had and it appears that is the case.
B) I agree like the majority that the tactics / squad would be found out in the premiership but we can have fun getting there and a good manager should adapt his team for it and maybe reinvent his tactics similar to what RM has done so far this season.
C) The argument so far that we should be top two because of the squad well personally I would rate us third best behind Leicester and Leeds and Watford , Middlesbrough, WBA have good squads also.
There has been comments regarding loan players well I can only applaud Wilcox and his team for finding some excellent loanees except for Holgate who appears to have lost all confidence from playing at Everton.
D) Negativity by fans at St Mary’s put pressure on the players over the last couple of seasons I always felt they tried better away because they didn’t have such pressure. The positivity around St Mary’s is fantastic at present and you can see that the players are enjoying it and the results are coming.
E) I worry that Leeds will pip us for the second spot in the last game of the season so I would love us to keep eating into the Leicester lead to bring them into the mix and get some pressure on them as any team that has vestegard as an automatic CB choice must be able to be got at by teams.
F) The post was not to get people to apologise etc but just to highlight that for once the management team made the right call and they must be applauded on not listening to a group of negative supporters who have every right to have free speech and all that but appear to very rarely have a good thing to say about the players and the club and although I will get crucified for saying that it’s my opinion and as I know we are all allowed opinions but to say sack RM , Wilcox & The board in Sept was a total over reaction to losing 4 games on the trot and I am glad these supporters don’t run my business with that type of overreaction to the situation as ending up with no manager , no transfer manager, no board we would of been in the same state as teams like Sheffield Weds.
Anyway I have made my comments let’s try and help Saints overhaul Leicester Ipswich and keep Leeds over 4 points behind us so that last game of the season won’t matter for us. | | | |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 22:15 - Jan 15 with 1256 views | Butty101 |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 22:02 - Jan 15 by areasix |
I started this thread A) To see if the real anti any manager would still voice being anti RM or anyone else we had and it appears that is the case.
B) I agree like the majority that the tactics / squad would be found out in the premiership but we can have fun getting there and a good manager should adapt his team for it and maybe reinvent his tactics similar to what RM has done so far this season.
C) The argument so far that we should be top two because of the squad well personally I would rate us third best behind Leicester and Leeds and Watford , Middlesbrough, WBA have good squads also.
There has been comments regarding loan players well I can only applaud Wilcox and his team for finding some excellent loanees except for Holgate who appears to have lost all confidence from playing at Everton.
D) Negativity by fans at St Mary’s put pressure on the players over the last couple of seasons I always felt they tried better away because they didn’t have such pressure. The positivity around St Mary’s is fantastic at present and you can see that the players are enjoying it and the results are coming.
E) I worry that Leeds will pip us for the second spot in the last game of the season so I would love us to keep eating into the Leicester lead to bring them into the mix and get some pressure on them as any team that has vestegard as an automatic CB choice must be able to be got at by teams.
F) The post was not to get people to apologise etc but just to highlight that for once the management team made the right call and they must be applauded on not listening to a group of negative supporters who have every right to have free speech and all that but appear to very rarely have a good thing to say about the players and the club and although I will get crucified for saying that it’s my opinion and as I know we are all allowed opinions but to say sack RM , Wilcox & The board in Sept was a total over reaction to losing 4 games on the trot and I am glad these supporters don’t run my business with that type of overreaction to the situation as ending up with no manager , no transfer manager, no board we would of been in the same state as teams like Sheffield Weds.
Anyway I have made my comments let’s try and help Saints overhaul Leicester Ipswich and keep Leeds over 4 points behind us so that last game of the season won’t matter for us. |
A) RM has won nothing yet, lets wait till the end of the season.
B) He was forced to change tactics as we were getting tanked.
C) Im not sure you can count.
The loan signings have been shrewd. Shame Wilcox spunked 20mill on a crock and a man city youth whos not up to this level. If we go up neither will be part of the prem squad.
D) Stop blaming the fans you plonker. These highly paid people get paid a fortune to kick a bag of air around. They have literally given the fans nothing for 3 seasons. |  |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 23:09 - Jan 15 with 1218 views | areasix |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 22:15 - Jan 15 by Butty101 |
A) RM has won nothing yet, lets wait till the end of the season.
B) He was forced to change tactics as we were getting tanked.
C) Im not sure you can count.
The loan signings have been shrewd. Shame Wilcox spunked 20mill on a crock and a man city youth whos not up to this level. If we go up neither will be part of the prem squad.
D) Stop blaming the fans you plonker. These highly paid people get paid a fortune to kick a bag of air around. They have literally given the fans nothing for 3 seasons. |
Butty101, A) So are you saying that if we finish 3rd and miss out in the playoffs RM will have to go?
B) I agree we were getting tanked but has sorted that by adjusting his play some managers don’t do that Burnley being a perfect example.
C) I can count just can’t write! If you read it again it says I think we are top 3 with Leicester and Leeds and that Watford etc also have ok squads to counter the argument that we should be up there because of money and squad.
He has gambled on Stewart which might or might not pay off but I would agree not ideal to be injured for so long , the ex Man City player you are saying is not up to I don’t know who you are talking about and he bought and sold Lavia for £50+ so has a hell of a lot of credit in the bank !
D) The St Mary’s crowd did not help the team to try and play out of trouble whereas the away game supporters did try and lift the players. Going into a hostile atmosphere does not help players to preform. Just like at work if you have a shi- boss you don’t give your all to him or the business. | | | |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 23:32 - Jan 15 with 1206 views | Butty101 |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 23:09 - Jan 15 by areasix |
Butty101, A) So are you saying that if we finish 3rd and miss out in the playoffs RM will have to go?
B) I agree we were getting tanked but has sorted that by adjusting his play some managers don’t do that Burnley being a perfect example.
C) I can count just can’t write! If you read it again it says I think we are top 3 with Leicester and Leeds and that Watford etc also have ok squads to counter the argument that we should be up there because of money and squad.
He has gambled on Stewart which might or might not pay off but I would agree not ideal to be injured for so long , the ex Man City player you are saying is not up to I don’t know who you are talking about and he bought and sold Lavia for £50+ so has a hell of a lot of credit in the bank !
D) The St Mary’s crowd did not help the team to try and play out of trouble whereas the away game supporters did try and lift the players. Going into a hostile atmosphere does not help players to preform. Just like at work if you have a shi- boss you don’t give your all to him or the business. |
A) I’m not saying he should go, but he will have failed if we don’t go up . Next season will be harder to go up so we need to do it this season.
B) not sure what you are on about. Burnely stormed it last season.
C) we signed Charles for 10mill this season , not Lavia. Lavia s money went to covering last seasons disastrous policy.
D) the players didn’t give anything at home for 3 years | |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 09:14 - Jan 16 with 1145 views | areasix |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 23:32 - Jan 15 by Butty101 |
A) I’m not saying he should go, but he will have failed if we don’t go up . Next season will be harder to go up so we need to do it this season.
B) not sure what you are on about. Burnely stormed it last season.
C) we signed Charles for 10mill this season , not Lavia. Lavia s money went to covering last seasons disastrous policy.
D) the players didn’t give anything at home for 3 years |
A) Funny that you were in September saying outttttttttt! Now he’s ok and you wouldn’t sack him.
B) The manager this season at Burnley is not willing to change the way they play.
C) No credit for Wilcox for signing Lavia and then selling him for a huge profit?
D) With the toxic atmosphere at St Mary’s no player showed their best. It’s like a broken marriage you just want to get out! | | | |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 14:03 - Jan 16 with 1081 views | Chesham_Saint |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 09:14 - Jan 16 by areasix |
A) Funny that you were in September saying outttttttttt! Now he’s ok and you wouldn’t sack him.
B) The manager this season at Burnley is not willing to change the way they play.
C) No credit for Wilcox for signing Lavia and then selling him for a huge profit?
D) With the toxic atmosphere at St Mary’s no player showed their best. It’s like a broken marriage you just want to get out! |
Toxic atmosphere? Any negativity from Saints fans is as nothing if you ever visit a ground like Spurts or West Ham when they're in the shit. Every player and the manager is screamed at for being a "fvcking cvnt" and woe betide any away fan that gets cught up. SMS is an oasis of civility in comparison. |  |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 16:17 - Jan 16 with 1038 views | Butty101 |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 09:14 - Jan 16 by areasix |
A) Funny that you were in September saying outttttttttt! Now he’s ok and you wouldn’t sack him.
B) The manager this season at Burnley is not willing to change the way they play.
C) No credit for Wilcox for signing Lavia and then selling him for a huge profit?
D) With the toxic atmosphere at St Mary’s no player showed their best. It’s like a broken marriage you just want to get out! |
A) I cant remember saying we must sack him. But i probably did - the first couple months were shocking and cost us a chance at the title. If we go up, his football will be bringing us back down again.
B) And?
C) Wilcox joined a year after we signed Lavia. Why would i give him credit. Wilcoxs permant signings have been terrible.
D) utter rubbish | |
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| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 18:00 - Jan 16 with 1010 views | felly1 |
| Aren’t football fans so fickle on 16:17 - Jan 16 by Butty101 |
A) I cant remember saying we must sack him. But i probably did - the first couple months were shocking and cost us a chance at the title. If we go up, his football will be bringing us back down again.
B) And?
C) Wilcox joined a year after we signed Lavia. Why would i give him credit. Wilcoxs permant signings have been terrible.
D) utter rubbish |
A. Harsh saying the first couple of months were shocking.
Aug. P4 W3 D1 L0
Sept was a disaster though. | | | |
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