| Christmas Carnage? 13:11 - Dec 18 with 34806 views | Sadoldgit |
Infection rates are generally rising fast despite the tier systems so you can imagine the spike after the free for all Christmas period. Johnson obviously doesn’t want to be seen as a Grinch but by not closing down Christmas there will be a lot fewer people enjoying it with their loved ones next year.
We are battening down the hatches this Christmas. I just hope that people are sensible and do the same. Sadly though I think people will just go for it and be damned. |  | | |  |
| Christmas Carnage? on 18:58 - Jan 5 with 1118 views | DorsetIan |
| Christmas Carnage? on 18:45 - Jan 5 by 1885_SFC |
Oh please - spare me your faux outrage Ian.
We both know the current spike is due to mixing at Xmas. You don't have to be Dr Witty to work that one out! |
Not outraged - it's just a cheap shot.
Look at the graph - the 'current spike' did not start at Christmas. The graph has been on an upward trajectory for weeks/months (paused briefly during the November lockdown) but on its way up again as soon as that ended. Christmas not even close to being the main reason for where we are now.
In my experience, the elderly and the vulnerable have tried their hardest to stay safe. The whole point is that the virus 'is not about you' - it's about who you might give it to.
You have no idea where the people in hospital caught it and how blameworthy they are. It's one of the things about a virus like that this that it is indiscriminate.
You should withdraw that remark. |  |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 19:00 - Jan 5 with 1112 views | Sadoldgit |
| Christmas Carnage? on 18:28 - Jan 5 by 1885_SFC |
Many of whom only have themselves to blame. |
Did they delay on deciding to lockdown the country? Did they prevaricate over closing the schools? | | | |
| Christmas Carnage? on 19:05 - Jan 5 with 1105 views | DorsetIan |
| Christmas Carnage? on 18:43 - Jan 5 by Bicester_North |
You suggested restrictions shouldn’t have been lifted in the summer.
Restrictions in summer wouldn’t have beaten covid like you were suggesting, just delayed it.
In summer, we didn’t know when a vaccine might have been available.
If we had spent summer locked down and then no vaccine was found, covid would just have come back again and again anyway, so we would’ve had loads more costs to society (from the summer lockdown) with no real benefit. |
Don't put words in my mouth. I said we missed a trick and we will find out in due course what that was.
As I said, you're just being complacent. You're basically saying that whatever we did wouldn't have made any difference. On that basis, we should have all along just searched for a vaccine and let the thing fly - is that what you're saying? [Post edited 5 Jan 2021 19:06]
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| Christmas Carnage? on 19:07 - Jan 5 with 1103 views | 1885_SFC |
| Christmas Carnage? on 18:55 - Jan 5 by grumpy |
What about the new variant? |
What about it? The virus was already highly contagious in its original form. A week from now, when all those who mixed together on NYE despite being advised not to, we will see even higher infection numbers than we currently have. Throw in the new variant - and it's a ticking time bomb.
Answer me this grumpy; how are all these people being infected every day if we're all still 'following the rules'? |  |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 19:15 - Jan 5 with 1087 views | Bicester_North |
| Christmas Carnage? on 19:05 - Jan 5 by DorsetIan |
Don't put words in my mouth. I said we missed a trick and we will find out in due course what that was.
As I said, you're just being complacent. You're basically saying that whatever we did wouldn't have made any difference. On that basis, we should have all along just searched for a vaccine and let the thing fly - is that what you're saying? [Post edited 5 Jan 2021 19:06]
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Ah look, it’s angry Ian!
“ With such low numbers, it would have been so much easier to properly kill it off back then and we clearly took our foot off the gas too soon. Too many foreign holidays. Too much eating out to help out. And then it seems the kids and students went back and whoosh”
What was the trick that we missed to “kill it off”? | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 19:16 - Jan 5 with 1086 views | 1885_SFC |
| Christmas Carnage? on 18:58 - Jan 5 by DorsetIan |
Not outraged - it's just a cheap shot.
Look at the graph - the 'current spike' did not start at Christmas. The graph has been on an upward trajectory for weeks/months (paused briefly during the November lockdown) but on its way up again as soon as that ended. Christmas not even close to being the main reason for where we are now.
In my experience, the elderly and the vulnerable have tried their hardest to stay safe. The whole point is that the virus 'is not about you' - it's about who you might give it to.
You have no idea where the people in hospital caught it and how blameworthy they are. It's one of the things about a virus like that this that it is indiscriminate.
You should withdraw that remark. |
So we've gone from 41,000 daily infections on December 28th to 60,000 daily infections on January 5th... but it's nothing whatsoever to do with Xmas?
Are you sure about that? | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 19:20 - Jan 5 with 1080 views | Bicester_North |
| Christmas Carnage? on 18:51 - Jan 5 by Saintsforeverj |
You could blame the messaging, but imo, people were stupid to crowd on the beach, protest in London, people stopped socially distancing, not everyone wore masks, people started mixing in households - who do we blame for those things?
We went to a good local restaurant in the summer. There was a one way system, sanitiser, distanced tables. It was safe. But we saw people go to the bar without a mask, people ignored the one way system etc. We saw hundreds congregate in various places. Who can we blame in all honesty?
We all saw the people going on holiday. Why couldn't they wait for next year!!! [Post edited 5 Jan 2021 19:03]
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Definitely, this country is full of absolute selfish helmets, you can’t really legislate for that | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 19:27 - Jan 5 with 1057 views | JaySaint |
| Christmas Carnage? on 19:20 - Jan 5 by Bicester_North |
Definitely, this country is full of absolute selfish helmets, you can’t really legislate for that |
Absolutely agree with the selfish part.
I do not agree with lockdown but I follow the rules.
Tired of people doing what they want or just whinging because they are stuck at home and bored.
A friend of the family is an estate agent, last April she was not at work. This time however, she is working but with additional measures. WTF!!!?? You just know tossers everywhere will be doing the same thing.
One beam of light, first time I heard at a C19 press conference that sooner or later, the country is going to have to tolerate COVID and open up - like we do with all other illnesses. | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 19:36 - Jan 5 with 1038 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Christmas Carnage? on 19:27 - Jan 5 by JaySaint |
Absolutely agree with the selfish part.
I do not agree with lockdown but I follow the rules.
Tired of people doing what they want or just whinging because they are stuck at home and bored.
A friend of the family is an estate agent, last April she was not at work. This time however, she is working but with additional measures. WTF!!!?? You just know tossers everywhere will be doing the same thing.
One beam of light, first time I heard at a C19 press conference that sooner or later, the country is going to have to tolerate COVID and open up - like we do with all other illnesses. |
Basically, because a sizeable and selfish minority don't follow the rules and spread the virus, we all have to be in lockdown or the NHS would collapse. But I take the point. They should dam well come down heavy on the idiots not obeying the rules. No way should they have allowed all the gatherings in the summer. They should have dealt with them and stopped them. [Post edited 5 Jan 2021 19:37]
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| Christmas Carnage? on 19:53 - Jan 5 with 1022 views | Sadoldgit |
I think I may have a cunning plan. I do have a small amount of pity for Boris Johnson, after all he didn’t sign up for this pandemic malarkey. His gig was to be the hero who was going to lead us out of Europe, something his bullsh*ting, bumbling, blustering style was perfectly suited for. This is seriously serious stuff and not his cup of tea at all. Firstly he needs to get rid of Matt Hancock. Perhaps he could look after the new lorry parks on the M20? Secondly, set up a cross party committee to take over the handling of the pandemic and make the Chair Sir Keir Starmer (who seems much more enthusiastic about doing something about the pandemic rather than finding reasons not to do something). Johnson could then spend any time and energy that he has left after his daily shagging sessions on dealing with the aftermath of Brexit. Win-win. 🤗 | | | |
| Christmas Carnage? on 20:03 - Jan 5 with 1014 views | Saintsforeverj |
| Christmas Carnage? on 19:53 - Jan 5 by Sadoldgit |
I think I may have a cunning plan. I do have a small amount of pity for Boris Johnson, after all he didn’t sign up for this pandemic malarkey. His gig was to be the hero who was going to lead us out of Europe, something his bullsh*ting, bumbling, blustering style was perfectly suited for. This is seriously serious stuff and not his cup of tea at all. Firstly he needs to get rid of Matt Hancock. Perhaps he could look after the new lorry parks on the M20? Secondly, set up a cross party committee to take over the handling of the pandemic and make the Chair Sir Keir Starmer (who seems much more enthusiastic about doing something about the pandemic rather than finding reasons not to do something). Johnson could then spend any time and energy that he has left after his daily shagging sessions on dealing with the aftermath of Brexit. Win-win. 🤗 |
Except Boris legally and democratically has the final say. He is the boss and the buck stops with him. | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 20:17 - Jan 5 with 1006 views | DorsetIan |
| Christmas Carnage? on 19:16 - Jan 5 by 1885_SFC |
So we've gone from 41,000 daily infections on December 28th to 60,000 daily infections on January 5th... but it's nothing whatsoever to do with Xmas?
Are you sure about that? |
See first graph here.
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/
Steep upward curve since the beginning of October. Levelled a bit during Nov lockdown. Very steep upward line since the start of December.
Thing about virulent viruses: they spread exponentially, Christmas or no Christmas.
Are you going withdraw your crass remark about people in hospital only having themselves to blame? | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 20:21 - Jan 5 with 1000 views | DorsetIan |
| Christmas Carnage? on 19:15 - Jan 5 by Bicester_North |
Ah look, it’s angry Ian!
“ With such low numbers, it would have been so much easier to properly kill it off back then and we clearly took our foot off the gas too soon. Too many foreign holidays. Too much eating out to help out. And then it seems the kids and students went back and whoosh”
What was the trick that we missed to “kill it off”? |
Why do you assume that I'm angry? I'm bemused more than anything.
Again, I don't know what it was, and you are clearly not at all curious about what happened at the end of the summer. | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 20:35 - Jan 5 with 984 views | Bicester_North |
| Christmas Carnage? on 20:21 - Jan 5 by DorsetIan |
Why do you assume that I'm angry? I'm bemused more than anything.
Again, I don't know what it was, and you are clearly not at all curious about what happened at the end of the summer. |
If it was “so much easier to kill it off” as you suggested, you must know the trick that we missed? | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 20:37 - Jan 5 with 979 views | DorsetIan |
| Christmas Carnage? on 20:35 - Jan 5 by Bicester_North |
If it was “so much easier to kill it off” as you suggested, you must know the trick that we missed? |
You think it's easier to kill it off now when we've got a new variant and it's accelerating like a train, do you? | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 20:40 - Jan 5 with 974 views | Bicester_North |
| Christmas Carnage? on 20:37 - Jan 5 by DorsetIan |
You think it's easier to kill it off now when we've got a new variant and it's accelerating like a train, do you? |
Yes it’s easier to kill it off now because we’ve got a vaccine.
We couldn’t have killed it off before, as you suggested, because we didn’t have a vaccine. | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 20:42 - Jan 5 with 973 views | 1885_SFC |
| Christmas Carnage? on 20:17 - Jan 5 by DorsetIan |
See first graph here.
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/
Steep upward curve since the beginning of October. Levelled a bit during Nov lockdown. Very steep upward line since the start of December.
Thing about virulent viruses: they spread exponentially, Christmas or no Christmas.
Are you going withdraw your crass remark about people in hospital only having themselves to blame? |
Now you're just being a prize plum & making yourself look rather silly by making things up.
You know full well that I said, and I quote, "Many of whom only have themselves to blame"... because... exactly that.
Unless of course, you're telling me that each & every one of the 27,000 covid patients in English hospitals right now were all just incredibly unlucky? The majority were of course - but many others, I have no doubt, did not follow the guidelines and are now paying for their stupidity.
Unless of course you know different & every single individual was simply unlucky?
I look forward to your opinions in the coming days when the NYE infections mean we pass 70,000 cases per day & who's fault those numbers will be too. It's not rocket science mate. A surge after Christmas. Tick. A surge after New Years Eve. Tick | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 20:53 - Jan 5 with 954 views | DorsetIan |
| Christmas Carnage? on 20:42 - Jan 5 by 1885_SFC |
Now you're just being a prize plum & making yourself look rather silly by making things up.
You know full well that I said, and I quote, "Many of whom only have themselves to blame"... because... exactly that.
Unless of course, you're telling me that each & every one of the 27,000 covid patients in English hospitals right now were all just incredibly unlucky? The majority were of course - but many others, I have no doubt, did not follow the guidelines and are now paying for their stupidity.
Unless of course you know different & every single individual was simply unlucky?
I look forward to your opinions in the coming days when the NYE infections mean we pass 70,000 cases per day & who's fault those numbers will be too. It's not rocket science mate. A surge after Christmas. Tick. A surge after New Years Eve. Tick |
I'll take your acknowledgment that the 'the majority' of people in hospital are blameless, as the best I'm going to get.
I asked you originally if you had the stats to back up your suggestion that 'many' only had themselves to blame but you obviously don't. I personally wouldn't be so glib as to assume that 'many' are to blame for their predicament but I think you are quicker to judge than I am.
As for the Christmas stuff - I've gave you the graph, and if you can't see the trend since October that's not really my issue.
I think you were suggesting that most recent increase in numbers was down to Christmas mixing and that those people only had themselves to blame.
Because the graph shows that the numbers would have increased whatever happened at Christmas, you're just wrong about that. What you are identifying as 'surges' are just the inexorably increasing numbers of a now exponentially spreading virus. | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 21:30 - Jan 5 with 917 views | 1885_SFC |
| Christmas Carnage? on 20:53 - Jan 5 by DorsetIan |
I'll take your acknowledgment that the 'the majority' of people in hospital are blameless, as the best I'm going to get.
I asked you originally if you had the stats to back up your suggestion that 'many' only had themselves to blame but you obviously don't. I personally wouldn't be so glib as to assume that 'many' are to blame for their predicament but I think you are quicker to judge than I am.
As for the Christmas stuff - I've gave you the graph, and if you can't see the trend since October that's not really my issue.
I think you were suggesting that most recent increase in numbers was down to Christmas mixing and that those people only had themselves to blame.
Because the graph shows that the numbers would have increased whatever happened at Christmas, you're just wrong about that. What you are identifying as 'surges' are just the inexorably increasing numbers of a now exponentially spreading virus. |
Let me get this right then - just so I understand what you're saying:
* Not one single person is in hospital right now because they didn't wear a mask/mix with people they shouldn't have/keep a 6ft distance/wash their hands/etc when they should have?
* There have been zero, zilch, no rise in numbers at all - not one - due to Christmas?
* If/when the cases reach 70,000 per day next week - it'll be entirely due to the new, highly infectious strain and nothing else like NYE parties/get togethers?
I think I've got it.
One last question; where exactly Ian, bearing in mind we are all following the guidelines & taking safety measures to avoid getting the virus, do you think these 60,000 infections per day are coming from??? | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 21:37 - Jan 5 with 901 views | kentsouthampton |
| Christmas Carnage? on 21:30 - Jan 5 by 1885_SFC |
Let me get this right then - just so I understand what you're saying:
* Not one single person is in hospital right now because they didn't wear a mask/mix with people they shouldn't have/keep a 6ft distance/wash their hands/etc when they should have?
* There have been zero, zilch, no rise in numbers at all - not one - due to Christmas?
* If/when the cases reach 70,000 per day next week - it'll be entirely due to the new, highly infectious strain and nothing else like NYE parties/get togethers?
I think I've got it.
One last question; where exactly Ian, bearing in mind we are all following the guidelines & taking safety measures to avoid getting the virus, do you think these 60,000 infections per day are coming from??? |
It's a microscopic airborne virus it knows no boundaries. |  | | |
| Christmas Carnage? on 21:37 - Jan 5 with 900 views | Bicester_North |
| Christmas Carnage? on 21:30 - Jan 5 by 1885_SFC |
Let me get this right then - just so I understand what you're saying:
* Not one single person is in hospital right now because they didn't wear a mask/mix with people they shouldn't have/keep a 6ft distance/wash their hands/etc when they should have?
* There have been zero, zilch, no rise in numbers at all - not one - due to Christmas?
* If/when the cases reach 70,000 per day next week - it'll be entirely due to the new, highly infectious strain and nothing else like NYE parties/get togethers?
I think I've got it.
One last question; where exactly Ian, bearing in mind we are all following the guidelines & taking safety measures to avoid getting the virus, do you think these 60,000 infections per day are coming from??? |
He must be a bit mixed up, one minute he’s saying Christmas has no bearing on it, another minute he’s saying too much social interaction in summer caused it to go wild just when we could’ve “killed it”- with no vaccine. | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 21:42 - Jan 5 with 892 views | 1885_SFC |
| Christmas Carnage? on 21:37 - Jan 5 by kentsouthampton |
It's a microscopic airborne virus it knows no boundaries. |
... but one that's even more deadly when you're mask-less in a confined space or room... with people you shouldn't be... not that anyone has been... obviously. | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 21:44 - Jan 5 with 889 views | 1885_SFC |
| Christmas Carnage? on 21:37 - Jan 5 by Bicester_North |
He must be a bit mixed up, one minute he’s saying Christmas has no bearing on it, another minute he’s saying too much social interaction in summer caused it to go wild just when we could’ve “killed it”- with no vaccine. |
He's no Chris Whitty - that's for sure! | |
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| Christmas Carnage? on 21:56 - Jan 5 with 870 views | grumpy |
| Christmas Carnage? on 19:07 - Jan 5 by 1885_SFC |
What about it? The virus was already highly contagious in its original form. A week from now, when all those who mixed together on NYE despite being advised not to, we will see even higher infection numbers than we currently have. Throw in the new variant - and it's a ticking time bomb.
Answer me this grumpy; how are all these people being infected every day if we're all still 'following the rules'? |
The Governments handling of this Virus leaves a lot to be desired.
Its too simplistic just to generally blame people not following the rules. |  | | |
| Christmas Carnage? on 22:09 - Jan 5 with 853 views | Bicester_North |
| Christmas Carnage? on 21:56 - Jan 5 by grumpy |
The Governments handling of this Virus leaves a lot to be desired.
Its too simplistic just to generally blame people not following the rules. |
Bit of both would be a fair summary probably | |
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