| Gracie Fields statue 12:09 - Sep 17 with 7424 views | ColDale |
Waste of money or worthwhile tribute?
I'm all for honouring the heroes but in 2016 Rochdale, she's practically irrelevant |  | | |  |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:17 - Sep 18 with 2395 views | 49thseason |
| Gracie Fields statue on 22:23 - Sep 18 by CamdenDale |
All good 442.
Look, more generally, I have some issues about the town I still love, probably not best served aired on a club forum about a statue, but does ultimately, to my mind, have a bearing on the club.
It's this is a kernel - for every one bod trying to do anything for the town there's ten saying it will never work, or is a waste of money. Seeing 'something nasty in the woodshed' and giving up. This is circular in nature and has been in effect now for thirty years or more.
There are some proper stand up men and women trying in recent years to give resuscitation and they're kicked at every turn. But those small number will prevail and you/we will get a better Rochdale whether you like, or can even see it, or not.
Yes I live in London.
Wtf do I know.
Yatta yatta. |
Of course, there are those who have a vested interest in not trying too hard to make things better. Probably the same people who opposed letting people buy the council houses they had paid rent on for donkeys years or maybe those who ruined the town's businesses with ill thought through planning and disgracefully allowed the sports pitches and parks to fall into disrepair, who closed youth clubs and practically destroyed education in the Borough with meddling and incompetence.
After all, once people start to make some progress in their lives and become concerned about things like civic pride, they tend to stop voting for those who pretend to be their friends, with their placatory words and sympathetic ears but without any intention to put their well-paid positions in jeopardy by actually doing something.
Rochdale has been repeatedly kicked in the goolies by politicians of every colour and the population has grown accustomed to things turning to rat sh1te at every turn. We don't really play the game here, do we? We vote for the opposition party at almost every general election and consequently, have no say in the affairs of state and have nothing to barter for our votes. The town is run down, skint, and has nothing to offer new businesses except cheap labour that pays minimum wages, it has been sucked dry and success is but a fleeting illusion, not to be trusted because we have become used to the idea that "it won't last". The roll of Honour of past industrial giants that have left or closed simply points out how far the town has fallen, Rochdale is a wasteland, a dying fag end of a once proud and prosperous place, resurrection seems unlikely but I admire those who continue to believe it's possible.Meanwhile, I encourage those with the means to leave and prosper elsewhere, to do so at the earliest opportunity. |  | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:19 - Sep 18 with 2382 views | PDIDDY |
Fund for Victoria wood statue in Bury now, dame dench gave a grand, why don't miss woods family pay for it , 20k is the amount . |  |
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| Gracie Fields statue on 00:13 - Sep 19 with 2337 views | CamdenDale |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:17 - Sep 18 by 49thseason |
Of course, there are those who have a vested interest in not trying too hard to make things better. Probably the same people who opposed letting people buy the council houses they had paid rent on for donkeys years or maybe those who ruined the town's businesses with ill thought through planning and disgracefully allowed the sports pitches and parks to fall into disrepair, who closed youth clubs and practically destroyed education in the Borough with meddling and incompetence.
After all, once people start to make some progress in their lives and become concerned about things like civic pride, they tend to stop voting for those who pretend to be their friends, with their placatory words and sympathetic ears but without any intention to put their well-paid positions in jeopardy by actually doing something.
Rochdale has been repeatedly kicked in the goolies by politicians of every colour and the population has grown accustomed to things turning to rat sh1te at every turn. We don't really play the game here, do we? We vote for the opposition party at almost every general election and consequently, have no say in the affairs of state and have nothing to barter for our votes. The town is run down, skint, and has nothing to offer new businesses except cheap labour that pays minimum wages, it has been sucked dry and success is but a fleeting illusion, not to be trusted because we have become used to the idea that "it won't last". The roll of Honour of past industrial giants that have left or closed simply points out how far the town has fallen, Rochdale is a wasteland, a dying fag end of a once proud and prosperous place, resurrection seems unlikely but I admire those who continue to believe it's possible.Meanwhile, I encourage those with the means to leave and prosper elsewhere, to do so at the earliest opportunity. |
49th. Ace reply - completely get what you're saying. Rochdale has suffered so much, been kicked so hard and has indeed been let down by politicians past and present. (Rochdale is hardly alone in this). This does not mean this has to be an endless spiral downwards.
I do anticipate an argument that a few grants and 'heritage stuff' will not make a blind bit of difference. That argument is wrongheaded - it will make a difference. Rochdale is blessed with an open space with the Town Hall, St Chads, a sense of being somewhere and a wonderful civic history.
Twin that with riverside shopping, yes the big chains, and who would want to go to bother going to Manchester. Manchester's a dog to begin with.
Yes Gracie Fields, yes river opening, yes how great the Flying H and The Baum are. Some brave soul just opened a wine bar by The Butts. Get down there.
And yet some yobs hang out in the town centre. And Simon Danczuk is a ****. So ******* what? Where's your spirit? ******* tarmac? |  | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 00:25 - Sep 19 with 2331 views | D_Alien |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:17 - Sep 18 by 49thseason |
Of course, there are those who have a vested interest in not trying too hard to make things better. Probably the same people who opposed letting people buy the council houses they had paid rent on for donkeys years or maybe those who ruined the town's businesses with ill thought through planning and disgracefully allowed the sports pitches and parks to fall into disrepair, who closed youth clubs and practically destroyed education in the Borough with meddling and incompetence.
After all, once people start to make some progress in their lives and become concerned about things like civic pride, they tend to stop voting for those who pretend to be their friends, with their placatory words and sympathetic ears but without any intention to put their well-paid positions in jeopardy by actually doing something.
Rochdale has been repeatedly kicked in the goolies by politicians of every colour and the population has grown accustomed to things turning to rat sh1te at every turn. We don't really play the game here, do we? We vote for the opposition party at almost every general election and consequently, have no say in the affairs of state and have nothing to barter for our votes. The town is run down, skint, and has nothing to offer new businesses except cheap labour that pays minimum wages, it has been sucked dry and success is but a fleeting illusion, not to be trusted because we have become used to the idea that "it won't last". The roll of Honour of past industrial giants that have left or closed simply points out how far the town has fallen, Rochdale is a wasteland, a dying fag end of a once proud and prosperous place, resurrection seems unlikely but I admire those who continue to believe it's possible.Meanwhile, I encourage those with the means to leave and prosper elsewhere, to do so at the earliest opportunity. |
Never miss an opportunity to spew negativity do you, 49th?
There's just been a multi-million pound regeneration of the town centre, of which the statue is a focal point. There's more decent places to eat out or enjoy a quality pint than ever before in the Borough, and they're always pretty full so the poor downtrodden folk you're banging on about must be receiving massive handouts I've never heard of to afford to frequent these places. God knows where these people get their income from, eh?
Any child growing up in Rochdale will do just fine in the existing schools, if they have the ability and the drive, and their parents (of which I'm one) have got a much more positive outlook than to blame anyone but themselves if they don't succeed in life; here, right here in Rochdale.
[Post edited 19 Sep 2016 0:27]
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| Gracie Fields statue on 06:56 - Sep 19 with 2230 views | 1mark1 |
| Gracie Fields statue on 00:25 - Sep 19 by D_Alien |
Never miss an opportunity to spew negativity do you, 49th?
There's just been a multi-million pound regeneration of the town centre, of which the statue is a focal point. There's more decent places to eat out or enjoy a quality pint than ever before in the Borough, and they're always pretty full so the poor downtrodden folk you're banging on about must be receiving massive handouts I've never heard of to afford to frequent these places. God knows where these people get their income from, eh?
Any child growing up in Rochdale will do just fine in the existing schools, if they have the ability and the drive, and their parents (of which I'm one) have got a much more positive outlook than to blame anyone but themselves if they don't succeed in life; here, right here in Rochdale.
[Post edited 19 Sep 2016 0:27]
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Absolutely, correct about education. There are plenty of people educated in Rochdale schools who have made it well, and those wanting to do well with family support etc as you say will do well, if they are good enough. Rochdale schools have an excellent added value score for education, meaning that schools do a very good job overall in improving pupils' attainment in education. Added to that it has the most successful Sixth form College in England. And it's not just the well off areas of Rochdale that produce successful young adults, all areas of the Borough have produced successful young adults, who have gone on to do well.
I would say that businesses have failed Rochdale, not the other way. |  |
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| Gracie Fields statue on 07:22 - Sep 19 with 2209 views | downunder |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:19 - Sep 18 by PDIDDY |
Fund for Victoria wood statue in Bury now, dame dench gave a grand, why don't miss woods family pay for it , 20k is the amount . |
Last longer if made out of granite. |  | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 08:53 - Sep 19 with 2141 views | nordenblue |
| Gracie Fields statue on 00:13 - Sep 19 by CamdenDale |
49th. Ace reply - completely get what you're saying. Rochdale has suffered so much, been kicked so hard and has indeed been let down by politicians past and present. (Rochdale is hardly alone in this). This does not mean this has to be an endless spiral downwards.
I do anticipate an argument that a few grants and 'heritage stuff' will not make a blind bit of difference. That argument is wrongheaded - it will make a difference. Rochdale is blessed with an open space with the Town Hall, St Chads, a sense of being somewhere and a wonderful civic history.
Twin that with riverside shopping, yes the big chains, and who would want to go to bother going to Manchester. Manchester's a dog to begin with.
Yes Gracie Fields, yes river opening, yes how great the Flying H and The Baum are. Some brave soul just opened a wine bar by The Butts. Get down there.
And yet some yobs hang out in the town centre. And Simon Danczuk is a ****. So ******* what? Where's your spirit? ******* tarmac? |
"Manchesters a dog to begin with" have you banged your head? Tbf once i read that bit i stopped reading...
Having spent the last bank holiday in London I know where I'd rather live,work,socialise etc without a shadow of a doubt. |  | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 12:09 - Sep 19 with 1999 views | Shun |
Capri's gorgeous though. |  | | |
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| Gracie Fields statue on 12:57 - Sep 19 with 1937 views | 49thseason |
| Gracie Fields statue on 00:25 - Sep 19 by D_Alien |
Never miss an opportunity to spew negativity do you, 49th?
There's just been a multi-million pound regeneration of the town centre, of which the statue is a focal point. There's more decent places to eat out or enjoy a quality pint than ever before in the Borough, and they're always pretty full so the poor downtrodden folk you're banging on about must be receiving massive handouts I've never heard of to afford to frequent these places. God knows where these people get their income from, eh?
Any child growing up in Rochdale will do just fine in the existing schools, if they have the ability and the drive, and their parents (of which I'm one) have got a much more positive outlook than to blame anyone but themselves if they don't succeed in life; here, right here in Rochdale.
[Post edited 19 Sep 2016 0:27]
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Ahh, those rose tinted glasses.
There's just been a multi-million pound regeneration of the town centre, of which the statue is a focal point."
I have no argument regarding the opening of the River if it can be shown to increase footfall and trade in town, I understand the final cost was about £4m with RMBC putting in about half of that but,has anyone put a price on the cost to businesses whilst the work has been going on? How many closed down when the tramway closed Drake St for months? When is the new shopping centre going to be built? I guess you remember the £1m it cost us to move the Library from the Wheatsheaf to Riverside and that it's been closed since it flooded last January? What is the plan for space where the market is if there is no shopping centre? And who is going to travel to Rochdale to look at a river if there are no shops?
"and they're always pretty full so the poor downtrodden folk you're banging on about must be receiving massive handouts I've never heard of to afford to frequent these places. God knows where these people get their income from, eh"?
Many don't get an income, there are 4% of the population officially described as "destitute". A third of all the Wards in Rochdale are in the 10% most deprived in England and 54 are in the poorest 20%.
From a 2015 population of 214,000, just over 50,000 men are economically active and only 37400 are employed - 8% lower than GB average, statistics for women are 40,500 economically active and 37,700 in employment - 11% lower than GB average.
Rochdale has a much lower qualifications profile than the rest of the Northwest and GB as a whole. 8% fewer NVQ L4 equivalents and 6% more are totally unqualified.
Wages are lower too, the average weekly pay (full time) for a man is £438 , over £130 per week less than the GB average (£569) and £60 less than the Northwest average. Rochdale has less than half as many Civil Service jobs (0.7%) as other Northwest towns (1.7%) and GB.(1.5%)
"Any child growing up in Rochdale will do just fine in the existing schools, if they have the ability and the drive, and their parents (of which I'm one) have got a much more positive outlook than to blame anyone but themselves if they don't succeed in life; here, right here in Rochdale".
An interesting view point. You mention parents (plural) in 2011 there were 8000 single parent families (4%). There are schools in Rochdale where over 40% of White British students are from single parent families. Education in Rochdale is so good that in 2015 Rochdale had the 4th worst drop in GCSE results in the country (6.4%) and was overall, the 13th worst performing LEA in thecountry (of 150). Rochdale 6th Form College does a great job with "A" level students but then the two Rochdale Grammar Schools used to do pretty well too but in the 40 intervening years how many kids didn't get the results they should have done?
I applaud your optimism but the facts don't paint such a wonderful picture. The truth is we are still slipping behind other towns on many measures with no real plan to halt the slide. But hey, the river looks OK! | | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 13:34 - Sep 19 with 1888 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Gracie Fields statue on 00:25 - Sep 19 by D_Alien |
Never miss an opportunity to spew negativity do you, 49th?
There's just been a multi-million pound regeneration of the town centre, of which the statue is a focal point. There's more decent places to eat out or enjoy a quality pint than ever before in the Borough, and they're always pretty full so the poor downtrodden folk you're banging on about must be receiving massive handouts I've never heard of to afford to frequent these places. God knows where these people get their income from, eh?
Any child growing up in Rochdale will do just fine in the existing schools, if they have the ability and the drive, and their parents (of which I'm one) have got a much more positive outlook than to blame anyone but themselves if they don't succeed in life; here, right here in Rochdale.
[Post edited 19 Sep 2016 0:27]
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Not quite sure your last paragraph captures the problem. If both parents are together and/or both play an active role in the child's life then agreed. However, if one parent leaves and, for whatever reason, plays no or very little part in the life of their child, the outlook of that parent, whether positive or negative, will have little if no effect on the educational success of that child. [Post edited 19 Sep 2016 13:43]
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| Gracie Fields statue on 15:07 - Sep 19 with 1778 views | pioneer |
| Gracie Fields statue on 14:30 - Sep 18 by R17ALE |
Certain stories were peddled which weren't really true due to her stepping out with some Itie during the war I think.
Nevertheless, she was well aware that her popularity ratings had slumped in England. Hence her opening song on her debut performance after the war was the specially written "Take me to your hearts again".
Her Dresser (old word for stylist) used to live in the house right behind the petrol station's car wash on bury Road. My Mum lived opposite and every time Gracie was in Rochdale she'd rock up on Battersby Street to visit said dresser and have pictures taken with the Half Acre locals etc. My Mum still has a picture of them both (signed by Gracie) amongst other signed memorabilia. |
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gracie_Fields
If anyone is deserving of a statue in Rochdale she would be #1. A wonderful, talented, generous person who never forgot her roots.
She left UK because her husband was not welcome here. | | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 16:01 - Sep 19 with 1718 views | mikehunt |
"Fields also helped Rochdale F.C. in the 1930s when they were struggling to pay fees and buy sports equipment."
Well she has just gone up a notch in my estimation re. the above snippet from her Wiki biog. |  |
| The worm of time turns not for the cuckoo of circumstance. |
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| Gracie Fields statue on 17:55 - Sep 19 with 1640 views | mingthemerciless |
The sale of Council Housing without the slightest intention of replacing the lost housing stock was a policy error of epic proportions. I don't think we'll ever recover from it. | | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 21:33 - Sep 19 with 1542 views | Nerazzurri |
| Gracie Fields statue on 21:50 - Sep 18 by 442Dale |
The tarmac looks rubbish. No further issues than that. Is it wrong to comment on half a job? |
The tarmac was a temporary finish so that the area could be used for the statue unveiling yesterday. It's now been removed to finish off the paving. |  |
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| Gracie Fields statue on 22:51 - Sep 19 with 1404 views | CamdenDale |
Someone there missed the point bigstyle about Manchester/London - where you'd prefer blah blah. This is not what we're talking about.
Manchester I raised only cos it's somewhere Rochdale needs to compete with on basic retail, footfall and energy. Nobody shops in Rochdale, though there's money in the town, cos there's nothing to buy.
Chicken and egg with the river opening, plans for new market, even GF statue but ffs sake have a bit of feeling for it, it already looks so much better than five years ago.
That contract for the new build on the black box and bus station site needs getting on with. Ask the council about that, not was my bin emptied last Wednesday.
Forwards!
So, the | | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 22:59 - Sep 19 with 1394 views | CamdenDale |
| Gracie Fields statue on 12:57 - Sep 19 by 49thseason |
Ahh, those rose tinted glasses.
There's just been a multi-million pound regeneration of the town centre, of which the statue is a focal point."
I have no argument regarding the opening of the River if it can be shown to increase footfall and trade in town, I understand the final cost was about £4m with RMBC putting in about half of that but,has anyone put a price on the cost to businesses whilst the work has been going on? How many closed down when the tramway closed Drake St for months? When is the new shopping centre going to be built? I guess you remember the £1m it cost us to move the Library from the Wheatsheaf to Riverside and that it's been closed since it flooded last January? What is the plan for space where the market is if there is no shopping centre? And who is going to travel to Rochdale to look at a river if there are no shops?
"and they're always pretty full so the poor downtrodden folk you're banging on about must be receiving massive handouts I've never heard of to afford to frequent these places. God knows where these people get their income from, eh"?
Many don't get an income, there are 4% of the population officially described as "destitute". A third of all the Wards in Rochdale are in the 10% most deprived in England and 54 are in the poorest 20%.
From a 2015 population of 214,000, just over 50,000 men are economically active and only 37400 are employed - 8% lower than GB average, statistics for women are 40,500 economically active and 37,700 in employment - 11% lower than GB average.
Rochdale has a much lower qualifications profile than the rest of the Northwest and GB as a whole. 8% fewer NVQ L4 equivalents and 6% more are totally unqualified.
Wages are lower too, the average weekly pay (full time) for a man is £438 , over £130 per week less than the GB average (£569) and £60 less than the Northwest average. Rochdale has less than half as many Civil Service jobs (0.7%) as other Northwest towns (1.7%) and GB.(1.5%)
"Any child growing up in Rochdale will do just fine in the existing schools, if they have the ability and the drive, and their parents (of which I'm one) have got a much more positive outlook than to blame anyone but themselves if they don't succeed in life; here, right here in Rochdale".
An interesting view point. You mention parents (plural) in 2011 there were 8000 single parent families (4%). There are schools in Rochdale where over 40% of White British students are from single parent families. Education in Rochdale is so good that in 2015 Rochdale had the 4th worst drop in GCSE results in the country (6.4%) and was overall, the 13th worst performing LEA in thecountry (of 150). Rochdale 6th Form College does a great job with "A" level students but then the two Rochdale Grammar Schools used to do pretty well too but in the 40 intervening years how many kids didn't get the results they should have done?
I applaud your optimism but the facts don't paint such a wonderful picture. The truth is we are still slipping behind other towns on many measures with no real plan to halt the slide. But hey, the river looks OK! |
You're an idiot mate. Cold. Stone. Idiot. | | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:16 - Sep 19 with 1370 views | Ninco |
If they want to recognise someone from the town, why not have a statue of Lisa Stansfield or Jimmy Cricket? | | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:30 - Sep 19 with 1360 views | 49thseason |
| Gracie Fields statue on 22:59 - Sep 19 by CamdenDale |
You're an idiot mate. Cold. Stone. Idiot. |
Is any part of what I wrote untrue? | | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:49 - Sep 19 with 1341 views | CamdenDale |
| Gracie Fields statue on 23:30 - Sep 19 by 49thseason |
Is any part of what I wrote untrue? |
It's the truth that's the problem. In place, I give you will. | | | |
| Gracie Fields statue on 01:19 - Sep 20 with 1308 views | D_Alien |
| Gracie Fields statue on 12:57 - Sep 19 by 49thseason |
Ahh, those rose tinted glasses.
There's just been a multi-million pound regeneration of the town centre, of which the statue is a focal point."
I have no argument regarding the opening of the River if it can be shown to increase footfall and trade in town, I understand the final cost was about £4m with RMBC putting in about half of that but,has anyone put a price on the cost to businesses whilst the work has been going on? How many closed down when the tramway closed Drake St for months? When is the new shopping centre going to be built? I guess you remember the £1m it cost us to move the Library from the Wheatsheaf to Riverside and that it's been closed since it flooded last January? What is the plan for space where the market is if there is no shopping centre? And who is going to travel to Rochdale to look at a river if there are no shops?
"and they're always pretty full so the poor downtrodden folk you're banging on about must be receiving massive handouts I've never heard of to afford to frequent these places. God knows where these people get their income from, eh"?
Many don't get an income, there are 4% of the population officially described as "destitute". A third of all the Wards in Rochdale are in the 10% most deprived in England and 54 are in the poorest 20%.
From a 2015 population of 214,000, just over 50,000 men are economically active and only 37400 are employed - 8% lower than GB average, statistics for women are 40,500 economically active and 37,700 in employment - 11% lower than GB average.
Rochdale has a much lower qualifications profile than the rest of the Northwest and GB as a whole. 8% fewer NVQ L4 equivalents and 6% more are totally unqualified.
Wages are lower too, the average weekly pay (full time) for a man is £438 , over £130 per week less than the GB average (£569) and £60 less than the Northwest average. Rochdale has less than half as many Civil Service jobs (0.7%) as other Northwest towns (1.7%) and GB.(1.5%)
"Any child growing up in Rochdale will do just fine in the existing schools, if they have the ability and the drive, and their parents (of which I'm one) have got a much more positive outlook than to blame anyone but themselves if they don't succeed in life; here, right here in Rochdale".
An interesting view point. You mention parents (plural) in 2011 there were 8000 single parent families (4%). There are schools in Rochdale where over 40% of White British students are from single parent families. Education in Rochdale is so good that in 2015 Rochdale had the 4th worst drop in GCSE results in the country (6.4%) and was overall, the 13th worst performing LEA in thecountry (of 150). Rochdale 6th Form College does a great job with "A" level students but then the two Rochdale Grammar Schools used to do pretty well too but in the 40 intervening years how many kids didn't get the results they should have done?
I applaud your optimism but the facts don't paint such a wonderful picture. The truth is we are still slipping behind other towns on many measures with no real plan to halt the slide. But hey, the river looks OK! |
Nice to see you've taken the trouble to try and justify your negativity, which remains just that. Rose tinted glasses? No, just a different outlook from you. | |
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| Gracie Fields statue on 01:35 - Sep 20 with 1298 views | D_Alien |
| Gracie Fields statue on 13:34 - Sep 19 by BigDaveMyCock |
Not quite sure your last paragraph captures the problem. If both parents are together and/or both play an active role in the child's life then agreed. However, if one parent leaves and, for whatever reason, plays no or very little part in the life of their child, the outlook of that parent, whether positive or negative, will have little if no effect on the educational success of that child. [Post edited 19 Sep 2016 13:43]
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It'd be an interesting study for an educational psychologist, I guess.
However, in my own experience, children can sometimes adopt the opposite characteristic to a parent whether they remain part of their child's life or not. My own father tended towards pessimism, whereas I could see how that wasn't the way I wanted to be, and it was something I was aware of by the time I was about 10 years old.
As far as educational success is concerned, there are studies which suggest the children of divorced parents can be adversely affected, although each individual case is different. As with myself, a lot is down to one's own attitude towards life.
Nice of you to shown such concern though.
[Post edited 20 Sep 2016 1:39]
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| Gracie Fields statue on 06:54 - Sep 20 with 1234 views | BigDaveMyCock |
| Gracie Fields statue on 01:35 - Sep 20 by D_Alien |
It'd be an interesting study for an educational psychologist, I guess.
However, in my own experience, children can sometimes adopt the opposite characteristic to a parent whether they remain part of their child's life or not. My own father tended towards pessimism, whereas I could see how that wasn't the way I wanted to be, and it was something I was aware of by the time I was about 10 years old.
As far as educational success is concerned, there are studies which suggest the children of divorced parents can be adversely affected, although each individual case is different. As with myself, a lot is down to one's own attitude towards life.
Nice of you to shown such concern though.
[Post edited 20 Sep 2016 1:39]
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Concern? What an odd thing to write. I'm commenting on the social problem of parental irresponsibility, which I think is a huge issue.
My point was that it is probably only relevant if the parent is part of the child's life.
Divorce/separation wasn't my point. My point was each parent being a presence in their child's life so as to provide them with the best chance to develop and achieve. It's a responsibility of each parent surely? Of course, some children will not be fortunate enough to have that, through no fault of their own, and it is to their merit when they develop into good people and achieve. However, it's not just the child's responsibility to develop the right attitude towards life, it's just as much the responsibility of the parent to endeavour to provide them with the tools to get there as best they can.
Surely someone who extols the merits of self responsibility agrees with that? [Post edited 20 Sep 2016 9:13]
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| Gracie Fields statue on 10:38 - Sep 20 with 1127 views | D_Alien |
| Gracie Fields statue on 06:54 - Sep 20 by BigDaveMyCock |
Concern? What an odd thing to write. I'm commenting on the social problem of parental irresponsibility, which I think is a huge issue.
My point was that it is probably only relevant if the parent is part of the child's life.
Divorce/separation wasn't my point. My point was each parent being a presence in their child's life so as to provide them with the best chance to develop and achieve. It's a responsibility of each parent surely? Of course, some children will not be fortunate enough to have that, through no fault of their own, and it is to their merit when they develop into good people and achieve. However, it's not just the child's responsibility to develop the right attitude towards life, it's just as much the responsibility of the parent to endeavour to provide them with the tools to get there as best they can.
Surely someone who extols the merits of self responsibility agrees with that? [Post edited 20 Sep 2016 9:13]
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Why should you think it odd that I consider it nice of you to express concern for the wellbeing of our younger generations?
In terms of strange things to say, that takes some beating.
Regarding your point about responsibility, there's many a parent who tries to exercise an overly controlling influence on their children, and their future lives. Just having children doesn't qualify anyone to be able to provide a positive environment, and as I explained in my own case I developed a different mindset from the one my father would perhaps have preferred me to do. It makes me smile when I hear people coming out with the "my parents taught me that..." line.
The only vital thing to my mind is that children are enabled to grow into the kind of people who can think independently, and if that results in having a different outlook from their parents, that's just fine. Perhaps someone whose parents failed to show much interest in their children (and some parents can be very selfish, or ill-equipped for the role) might be more inclined to take the opposite approach with their own offspring.
As I've already indicated, it's a very interesting area, or as Philip Larkin once wrote in a famous poem "They f*ck you up, your mum and dad"
I don't necessarily subscribe to that, but as ever, it contains a kernel of truth in many cases.
[Post edited 20 Sep 2016 11:16]
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