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Its all to do with context, she talks about her family and then talks about Labour abandoning. You need to listen to it, last I heard it was 11 million views online and counting.
Seems a bit of a girl, heard shes a Partick supporter, If so that lot sing about Celtic and Rangers and tell them what they can do with their Pope and their Queen. lol
Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
You've obfuscated a bit by now concentrating on social liberalism. I don't doubt that Cameron is in essence a social liberal. Many modern Tories are, they have their roots in libertarianism which posits that what you get up to is nothing to do with me or anyone else as long as it doesn't harm others or impinge on others' freedoms. A noble concept but most who claim to be libertarians are nothing of the sort. You'll never get unfettered libertarianism of course. That really would be disastrous. And most libertarians don't understand the meaning if the term let alone practice it. They're mostly fairly dim to be honest.
Anyway, in most aspects the current Tory party can't in any way be described as centrist. But your disdain for social liberalism does beg one question. What type of social orthodoxy would you like to see prevail in 21st century Britain?
I'd like to have a Government who were a bit cleverer than to think importing millions of people from an ultra-conservative religion and then going to war with countries practicing that same religion would be a good idea.
I'd also like a police force akin to that of Ray Mallon's in Cleveland who's priority was to monitor and make life hard for the 1% who cause 75% of the crime (my own estimation although I'm sure it's similar). To intimidate the intimidators. Either criminals live in fear of the police or the people live in fear of criminals. It's either one or the other in practice.
I'd like courts to hand out appropriate sentences and prisons to be harsh and austere places that even the top dogs feared going to. I'd like to ally harsh punishment to rigorous rehabilitation and back-to-work schemes.
In a nutshell though the two main parties seem to morph into each other to become "electable".
Labour financially and Conservative socially. Well-off Middle Englanders with fashionable social views probably.
[Post edited 28 Jul 2015 20:52]
The orthodox are always orthodox, regardless of the orthodoxy.
I think social justice parties like Plaid the SNP and the Greens would be better off if Corbyn lost. So they could [should in my view] attack Labour over and over for being a Tory party and keep telling people they are a Tory party and that will be easier without Corbyn being leader.
Even with Corbyn Labour would still be a Tory party as Corbyn will only win if the right wing vote within the party is split, so even if he wins he would be the most popular candidate but he would have more enemies than friends so the situation won't last anyway, I read one observer saying that these days at most its only 30% of the Labour party that is left leaning, others say its only 5%.
The left leaning Celts would be better off if the union fractures so Wales and Scotland can get more left leaning policies.
So you are suggesting that on 12500 out of 250000 Labour Party members are left leaning?
So you've observed the last few months of the Labour leadership campaign where the most left wing of the 4 candidates has emerged as a serious contender to win the election with support from tens of thousands of members, over 100 CLPs (more than any of the other candidates with the most right wing candidate barely getting in to double figures) and backing from Unite and come to the conclusion that only 5% of the party are left leaning?
I'm guessing that good analytical skills isn't something that you put on your CV?
If man evolved from monkeys why do we still have monkeys?
So you are suggesting that on 12500 out of 250000 Labour Party members are left leaning?
So you've observed the last few months of the Labour leadership campaign where the most left wing of the 4 candidates has emerged as a serious contender to win the election with support from tens of thousands of members, over 100 CLPs (more than any of the other candidates with the most right wing candidate barely getting in to double figures) and backing from Unite and come to the conclusion that only 5% of the party are left leaning?
I'm guessing that good analytical skills isn't something that you put on your CV?
I'd be surprised if his CV had much more than ketchup on it.
Those are figures i have read about, they are not my figures Cottsy, but the Labour party are a Tory party with Tory policies, so lots of their supporters and members are Tories. Lots of the Trade unions are Tories hence why they support the Red Tories, If they were not Tories they would not support the Red Tories.
[Post edited 28 Jul 2015 21:09]
Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
Those are figures i have read about, they are not my figures Cottsy, but the Labour party are a Tory party with Tory policies, so lots of their supporters and members are Tories. Lots of the Trade unions are Tories hence why they support the Red Tories, If they were not Tories they would not support the Red Tories.
[Post edited 28 Jul 2015 21:09]
We are due a war soon The government are gagging for a battle of some sort you watch .
Those are figures i have read about, they are not my figures Cottsy, but the Labour party are a Tory party with Tory policies, so lots of their supporters and members are Tories. Lots of the Trade unions are Tories hence why they support the Red Tories, If they were not Tories they would not support the Red Tories.
[Post edited 28 Jul 2015 21:09]
Where did you read about those figures, the Ladybird Big Book of Bollox?
Its probably the same book where you got the bollox that lots of members of the party are Tories despite the most left wing candidate in the leadership contest currently having around 50% support of the membership while the most right wing candidate has around 10%, if polls are to be believed., or that lots of trade unions are Tory. Are the Tory trade unions supporting the governments efforts to pass the trade union bill in Parliament as well.
If man evolved from monkeys why do we still have monkeys?
Tony Blair was more of a Tory than Mrs Thatcher, Labour policies are so similar to Conservative policies that some say the Conservatives pinched Labour policies for the recent budget.
Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
As an active and card carrying member of the Labour Party I can safely say that you're talking complete sh*t Trampie. Most of the members in South Wales, that I've had the pleasure to speak to are quite on the left and have no problem in showing it. There were emotions and tears in my last constituency meeting when discussing the nominations for Leader, such is the importance of Corbyns role in the election. He's the only one that people believe in and that's the truth. The rest of them are sound bite fodder and ordinary people don't buy it anymore. These are just my observations and I'm still very undecided on who to back.
You don't want Corbyn to get elected because you're worried that the Labour Party might start standing on your "only socialist in the village" Plaid toting toes.
As an active and card carrying member of the Labour Party I can safely say that you're talking complete sh*t Trampie. Most of the members in South Wales, that I've had the pleasure to speak to are quite on the left and have no problem in showing it. There were emotions and tears in my last constituency meeting when discussing the nominations for Leader, such is the importance of Corbyns role in the election. He's the only one that people believe in and that's the truth. The rest of them are sound bite fodder and ordinary people don't buy it anymore. These are just my observations and I'm still very undecided on who to back.
You don't want Corbyn to get elected because you're worried that the Labour Party might start standing on your "only socialist in the village" Plaid toting toes.
As a fellow card carrying member of the party I can 100% vouch that Trampie is talking complete sh*t.
If man evolved from monkeys why do we still have monkeys?
Ace called it in the last paragraph and trample has said as much previously. The concern is that a more left labour party will take votes of plaid. Would take mine in a general election most likely. Particularly as labour have more chance than plaid of ousting Crabb.
Its good to read reasonable posts regarding politics. Clearly this site is overwhelmingly left wing, but every now again sense prevails and I concur some of their ideals but not the way they are articulated.
One thing for sure, this country of ours needs uniting.
Cameron hasn't done it Corbyn most definatley wont.
Might be a good idea to fook off somewhere for good. The thought is sticking with me and Lady Perch . Im beginning to dislike this country
As an active and card carrying member of the Labour Party I can safely say that you're talking complete sh*t Trampie. Most of the members in South Wales, that I've had the pleasure to speak to are quite on the left and have no problem in showing it. There were emotions and tears in my last constituency meeting when discussing the nominations for Leader, such is the importance of Corbyns role in the election. He's the only one that people believe in and that's the truth. The rest of them are sound bite fodder and ordinary people don't buy it anymore. These are just my observations and I'm still very undecided on who to back.
You don't want Corbyn to get elected because you're worried that the Labour Party might start standing on your "only socialist in the village" Plaid toting toes.
'emotions and tears' you say, lol, I do believe that too, blydi English Tories I say, Labour on the left ........ha ha ha, do me a favour, Labour have virtually the same policies as the Conservative and Unionist party, they have Harman as leader and recently had Tony Blair as their main man and then Gordon Brown, they have Kendall and Cooper standing for leader.
Labour are Red Tories.
Continually being banned by Planet Swans for Porthcawl and then being reinstated.
'emotions and tears' you say, lol, I do believe that too, blydi English Tories I say, Labour on the left ........ha ha ha, do me a favour, Labour have virtually the same policies as the Conservative and Unionist party, they have Harman as leader and recently had Tony Blair as their main man and then Gordon Brown, they have Kendall and Cooper standing for leader.
Labour are Red Tories.
But J-Corbz is quite clearly not a tory? He's standing for leader too...
As an active and card carrying member of the Labour Party I can safely say that you're talking complete sh*t Trampie. Most of the members in South Wales, that I've had the pleasure to speak to are quite on the left and have no problem in showing it. There were emotions and tears in my last constituency meeting when discussing the nominations for Leader, such is the importance of Corbyns role in the election. He's the only one that people believe in and that's the truth. The rest of them are sound bite fodder and ordinary people don't buy it anymore. These are just my observations and I'm still very undecided on who to back.
You don't want Corbyn to get elected because you're worried that the Labour Party might start standing on your "only socialist in the village" Plaid toting toes.
It's your last point I find interesting (not the Trampie bit -he's clearly a deranged WUM), but about your current indecision.
I imagine that is the fundamental problem for Labour party members at the moment - your heart tells you to go with Corbyn if you are a genuine socialist but your head tells you it will result in Tory rule as he is unelectable for the country as a whole.
It's the issue for Labour in general - what exactly can they do if they ever want power other than to move further right and effectively become a social democrat type party to at least temper the excesses of the right. Because the real Labour party is probably finished other than as an opposition who become gradually more marginalised?
That constant source of merriment, the modern Labour Party, is at it again. Whilst to normal sane people, the prospect of a raving Left loony like Jeremy Corbyn being let anywhere near the leadership of anything more than the local LGBT Workers Directive, seems unthinkable, to Labour it is perfectly reasonable — “ we lost because we weren’t left wing enough. Jeremy will fix it”. As Richard Littlejohn would say “ You couldn’t make it up”. It’s funny, but sad at the same time as we are left with no viable Opposition apart from the Scottish Nutters Party.
This was Janet Daley in the Telegraph, and I relate more than usual to this article, because I lived in Crouch End from 1981 to 1987, in the Trotskyite People’s Republic of Haringey where your biggest handicap was to be white, middle class and male. I escaped to Fulham in 1987:
“I’ve lived under Jeremy Corbyn’s rule — it turned me into a Tory
Reader, I have lived in Corbyn World and I am here to tell you what it was like. It was in the London borough of Haringey, where my husband and I lived in the Seventies, in which Mr Corbyn made his first notable appearance on the public stage. As well as being a major force on Haringey council and in the Hornsey Labour Party, he had a day job as a full-time official of the National Union of Public Employees (now part of Unison) which involved him in employment negotiations with local councils.
This dual role was not seen, oddly enough, as a conflict of interest. But the employment conditions of the council’s workforce were only one element of his political programme. Mr Corbyn’s world view is often described as a “return to the politics of the Eighties” but, in fact, it was Haringey in the Seventies that was the pure, unspoilt article: an era of undaunted moral certainty before the debacle of the 1983 general election which reduced the hard Left to a despairing, rancid protest movement.
Back then, both the Labour council and the Hornsey Labour Party had been infiltrated by activists from the Trotskyist organisations which I knew well, having been involved with their activities in my own far-Left days in the Sixties. A great many of our friends (comrades?) from what was then known as International Socialism — later relaunched as the Socialist Workers Party — had joined the entryist army into Labour with the specific intention of running for local council seats. Many of them, like Mr Corbyn, earned their living as trade union officials. So the composition of what was officially a conventional Labour borough council was, in fact, a proactive militant engine for class war and anti-capitalist agitation. One form this took played a particularly memorable part in our family history.
We lived in what the Labour council referred to, with open contempt, as “the western half of the borough”, meaning the middle-class (sorry, “bourgeois”), largely owner-occupier, neighbourhoods of Muswell Hill, Crouch End and Highgate. How they hated us — in spite of the fact that we were the ones who funded all of their social engineering projects with our local taxes (then called “rates”), and supported the vast tracts of council estate to the east which were their electoral heartlands.
They were particularly annoyed by the tendency of many, but by no means all, of the people in our part of the borough to vote Conservative. To correct this unfortunate political imbalance, the council would buy up properties in the area whenever they became available and turn them into council housing, with the intention of injecting Labour voters into Tory communities. This is, of course, a form of gerrymandering but leave that to one side. As it turned out, the project was much more interesting and politically educative than a simple manipulation of constituencies. ......”
I imagine most correspondents on this board are too young to have memories of the hard left in the 70s and 80s. What Daley describes above was rampant in most inner city politics - a classic example being in Liverpool with Derek Hatton and his Militant Tendency which to his credit, Neil Kinnock scuttled later on. It all came to a head in the 1983 election when the deluded Labour Party put up Michael Foot and his 'longest suicide note in history' and were absolutely routed in that election. Sort of 'deja vu all over again' at the moment isn't it. :)
That constant source of merriment, the modern Labour Party, is at it again. Whilst to normal sane people, the prospect of a raving Left loony like Jeremy Corbyn being let anywhere near the leadership of anything more than the local LGBT Workers Directive, seems unthinkable, to Labour it is perfectly reasonable — “ we lost because we weren’t left wing enough. Jeremy will fix it”. As Richard Littlejohn would say “ You couldn’t make it up”. It’s funny, but sad at the same time as we are left with no viable Opposition apart from the Scottish Nutters Party.
This was Janet Daley in the Telegraph, and I relate more than usual to this article, because I lived in Crouch End from 1981 to 1987, in the Trotskyite People’s Republic of Haringey where your biggest handicap was to be white, middle class and male. I escaped to Fulham in 1987:
“I’ve lived under Jeremy Corbyn’s rule — it turned me into a Tory
Reader, I have lived in Corbyn World and I am here to tell you what it was like. It was in the London borough of Haringey, where my husband and I lived in the Seventies, in which Mr Corbyn made his first notable appearance on the public stage. As well as being a major force on Haringey council and in the Hornsey Labour Party, he had a day job as a full-time official of the National Union of Public Employees (now part of Unison) which involved him in employment negotiations with local councils.
This dual role was not seen, oddly enough, as a conflict of interest. But the employment conditions of the council’s workforce were only one element of his political programme. Mr Corbyn’s world view is often described as a “return to the politics of the Eighties” but, in fact, it was Haringey in the Seventies that was the pure, unspoilt article: an era of undaunted moral certainty before the debacle of the 1983 general election which reduced the hard Left to a despairing, rancid protest movement.
Back then, both the Labour council and the Hornsey Labour Party had been infiltrated by activists from the Trotskyist organisations which I knew well, having been involved with their activities in my own far-Left days in the Sixties. A great many of our friends (comrades?) from what was then known as International Socialism — later relaunched as the Socialist Workers Party — had joined the entryist army into Labour with the specific intention of running for local council seats. Many of them, like Mr Corbyn, earned their living as trade union officials. So the composition of what was officially a conventional Labour borough council was, in fact, a proactive militant engine for class war and anti-capitalist agitation. One form this took played a particularly memorable part in our family history.
We lived in what the Labour council referred to, with open contempt, as “the western half of the borough”, meaning the middle-class (sorry, “bourgeois”), largely owner-occupier, neighbourhoods of Muswell Hill, Crouch End and Highgate. How they hated us — in spite of the fact that we were the ones who funded all of their social engineering projects with our local taxes (then called “rates”), and supported the vast tracts of council estate to the east which were their electoral heartlands.
They were particularly annoyed by the tendency of many, but by no means all, of the people in our part of the borough to vote Conservative. To correct this unfortunate political imbalance, the council would buy up properties in the area whenever they became available and turn them into council housing, with the intention of injecting Labour voters into Tory communities. This is, of course, a form of gerrymandering but leave that to one side. As it turned out, the project was much more interesting and politically educative than a simple manipulation of constituencies. ......”
I imagine most correspondents on this board are too young to have memories of the hard left in the 70s and 80s. What Daley describes above was rampant in most inner city politics - a classic example being in Liverpool with Derek Hatton and his Militant Tendency which to his credit, Neil Kinnock scuttled later on. It all came to a head in the 1983 election when the deluded Labour Party put up Michael Foot and his 'longest suicide note in history' and were absolutely routed in that election. Sort of 'deja vu all over again' at the moment isn't it. :)
I like Janet Daley. She's entertaining and occasionally thought provoking. She's also a bit mental, rabidly right wing and as likely to provide an even remotely unbiased view of any left-leaning politician as Lohengrin.
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