| Could the trust be doomed? 15:16 - Nov 6 with 26048 views | NOTRAC |
I am not sure about this, but because of the way the ownership of the shares in Swansea City have actually been made, it might be that two "owners" could allow the American investors virtual control of the Club, without recourse to the present Board of Directors, the Trust,or the remaining shareholders.
We are often told that Martin Morgan and his wife own 225,000 shares in the club and that Brian Ketzon owns 200,000 shares which together equate to 50% of the total shares issued.
In fact they actually own no shares at all.The shares are owned by Oth Limited (225,000 shares) and Five Thirty Limited (161216shares) and T L R Investments Limited (38784shares)
It can be assumed therefore that Oth Limited is owned by Martin Morgan and his wife, and the other two companies by Brian Ketzon and family.
Without knowing of any legal restrictions,both Martin Morgan and Brian Ketzon could sell their shares in Oth Limited, Five Thirty Limited and T L R Investments Limited without any recourse to Swansea City Football Club and let in the Americans through the back door.The shares as such would not have changed hands, they are still owned by the same Companies (where incidentally they are shown as investments on the Balance Sheets of those Companies), it is just that the Americans have control of those shares.
If the above is legally feasible, then the Americans could contain absolute control by buying in exactly the same way the shares allegedly owned by Dineen but which are in fact owned by Bulk Vending Limited and Van Zweden whose shares are owned by Swansea Jacks Limited.
If the above scenario was possible,and I know of no reason why legally it is not, then the Trust would be powerless to stop it, and would receive nothing for their shares
I would hope there are provisions in place to stop the above happening, otherwise the Trust could be doomed. |  |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:27 - Nov 6 with 1824 views | Rancid |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:14 - Nov 6 by Dr_Winston |
Phil mentioned it. Can't remember anything official although I could be wrong. |
Making an official statement would probably have been a bit over the top but Phil certainly voiced his opinions over it on here.
The last statement from the Trust was 7 days ago now if I'm correct.That was to condemn any takeover.Another would be nice saying they're still of the same mindset. |  | | |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:29 - Nov 6 with 1817 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:22 - Nov 6 by Dr_Winston |
Cause, y'know. The now is all that matters. F*ck the future. |
The day i start worrying about things that are outside my influence and things that may not happen is the day I'll give up (football) |  |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:38 - Nov 6 with 1796 views | Dr_Winston |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:29 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
The day i start worrying about things that are outside my influence and things that may not happen is the day I'll give up (football) |
Good job nobody else had that attitude in 2000/2001 eh?
You'd fit right in at Legoland. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:42 - Nov 6 with 1782 views | Davillin |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 19:27 - Nov 6 by Rancid |
For the benefit of the club of course  |
AceJack3065 asked: "Is this the point of no return for the board then? Why are they so keen to cash in?" and Rancid's snappy answer is above.
Snappy and sarcastic. Well played, Rancid. |  |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:46 - Nov 6 with 1771 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:38 - Nov 6 by Dr_Winston |
Good job nobody else had that attitude in 2000/2001 eh?
You'd fit right in at Legoland. |
How can you compare back then to today?? Paranoia maybe ? | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:48 - Nov 6 with 1763 views | longlostjack |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 20:19 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
No just enjoy the football that's being produced by the best ever Swans team. |
I am really enjoying it - but there's a bit of a sour taste now all this "need for an investor" crap has started. I really would love to take the Board's word for it that they have the clubs best interests at heart and I'd be the first to rejoice if in the end it was all just a storm in a teacup. Until that happens I'd prefer to back those who are working to avoid a worse case scenario. Should that scenario come to pass though I would hope that there's enough money left in the Trust's coffers to make another film. |  |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:06 - Nov 6 with 1708 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:01 - Nov 6 by Davillin |
No-one can give "evidence to the contrary" to an opinion.
But I will say this, if we had stuck with our philosophy of spending within our means, with instead huge property development and other large expenses, not the least large dividends, then we wouldn't "need" new "investment."
If you have read previous posts from me, and from many others, the entire question of "need" is an open one at its most generous best.
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Exactly it's "peoples opinions" thank you, so no facts just opinion and people freaking out about opinion FFS. | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:13 - Nov 6 with 1683 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:01 - Nov 6 by Davillin |
No-one can give "evidence to the contrary" to an opinion.
But I will say this, if we had stuck with our philosophy of spending within our means, with instead huge property development and other large expenses, not the least large dividends, then we wouldn't "need" new "investment."
If you have read previous posts from me, and from many others, the entire question of "need" is an open one at its most generous best.
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And also the club hasn't really lived within its "means" as Martin Morgan on a few occasions has given the club bridging loans and other loans (interest free) | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:16 - Nov 6 with 1675 views | acejack3065 |
What concerns me is how murky and unclear everything is becoming.
There have been no blueprints and outlines demonstrating why a takeover would be beneficial.
Everything is just grumblings and murmurs.
All I really know for certain at the minute is that the Trust have the clubs interest at heart so they need to be in as strong a position as possible. That's why I joined yesterday and I implore everyone else to do the same. |  | | |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:18 - Nov 6 with 1671 views | STEVE1 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:13 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
And also the club hasn't really lived within its "means" as Martin Morgan on a few occasions has given the club bridging loans and other loans (interest free) |
Yes they have the accounts show that I think martin Morgan have given loans on occasions due to the time periods of receiving premier league money. | | | |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:20 - Nov 6 with 1663 views | Davillin |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:18 - Nov 6 by STEVE1 |
Yes they have the accounts show that I think martin Morgan have given loans on occasions due to the time periods of receiving premier league money. |
Those loans are called "bridge loans," and are not at all uncommon in the world of business. Nor do they affect a business' creditworthiness in any significant way. | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:25 - Nov 6 with 1649 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:18 - Nov 6 by STEVE1 |
Yes they have the accounts show that I think martin Morgan have given loans on occasions due to the time periods of receiving premier league money. |
It also happened in the days before the premier league and i believe MM also loaned the club money for the Scott Sinclair deal if what I've been told is correct. | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:28 - Nov 6 with 1639 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:20 - Nov 6 by Davillin |
Those loans are called "bridge loans," and are not at all uncommon in the world of business. Nor do they affect a business' creditworthiness in any significant way. |
So is it fair then to say the club didn't live within it's means. | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:30 - Nov 6 with 1535 views | STEVE1 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:25 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
It also happened in the days before the premier league and i believe MM also loaned the club money for the Scott Sinclair deal if what I've been told is correct. |
Yes but at the end of the day the accounts were stable yes they had
bridging loans through cash flow which before the premier league would have been season ticket sales and championship money which I believe is around 2 million pound. | | | |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:32 - Nov 6 with 1529 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:30 - Nov 6 by STEVE1 |
Yes but at the end of the day the accounts were stable yes they had
bridging loans through cash flow which before the premier league would have been season ticket sales and championship money which I believe is around 2 million pound. |
So without these loans would the club have been able to live within their " means " yes or no. | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:41 - Nov 6 with 1509 views | STEVE1 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:32 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
So without these loans would the club have been able to live within their " means " yes or no. |
Yes they happen in lots of business it is just that the money you will earn needs time to come through I work as a contractor if I took a big job on which i may not get paid for 3 months i would take a bridging loan of say 4k at the end of the 3 months I would get paid 8k if I did not take the loan I would not be able to take the job but I am still living within my budget. | | | |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:55 - Nov 6 with 1485 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:41 - Nov 6 by STEVE1 |
Yes they happen in lots of business it is just that the money you will earn needs time to come through I work as a contractor if I took a big job on which i may not get paid for 3 months i would take a bridging loan of say 4k at the end of the 3 months I would get paid 8k if I did not take the loan I would not be able to take the job but I am still living within my budget. |
Would you get interest free loans, like the club had. | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:59 - Nov 6 with 1477 views | dgt73 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:41 - Nov 6 by STEVE1 |
Yes they happen in lots of business it is just that the money you will earn needs time to come through I work as a contractor if I took a big job on which i may not get paid for 3 months i would take a bridging loan of say 4k at the end of the 3 months I would get paid 8k if I did not take the loan I would not be able to take the job but I am still living within my budget. |
And also how many board members from other businesses do you know that have worked for nothing for 10 yrs, like the SCFC board did and how much would it have cost had they been paid during that 10 yrs ?. [Post edited 6 Nov 2014 22:01]
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 22:05 - Nov 6 with 1458 views | STEVE1 |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:59 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
And also how many board members from other businesses do you know that have worked for nothing for 10 yrs, like the SCFC board did and how much would it have cost had they been paid during that 10 yrs ?. [Post edited 6 Nov 2014 22:01]
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We have always run the club within its means it is a good point we have had certain people work for nothing but that is the way we budgeted it if for example we had to put £100,000 a side for other salaries then maybe we would have had to cut back in other areas but I am confident we would have still tried to stay within budget. | | | |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 22:08 - Nov 6 with 1452 views | _ |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:59 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
And also how many board members from other businesses do you know that have worked for nothing for 10 yrs, like the SCFC board did and how much would it have cost had they been paid during that 10 yrs ?. [Post edited 6 Nov 2014 22:01]
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Fack me you're naive to believe that load of old bollox... |  |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 22:09 - Nov 6 with 1451 views | longlostjack |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:59 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
And also how many board members from other businesses do you know that have worked for nothing for 10 yrs, like the SCFC board did and how much would it have cost had they been paid during that 10 yrs ?. [Post edited 6 Nov 2014 22:01]
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Of course I appreciate what they've done for the club and long may it continue. Anything can happen though - at the end of the day people are people and we've all got our flaws. Surely it's better to be vigilant. | |
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| Could the trust be doomed? on 22:18 - Nov 6 with 1431 views | blaine_scfc |
The board have worked miracles over the past ten years, but the change in attitude was plain to see last season in my opinion.
This takeover or something close will happen. Wouldn't surprise me if the yanks may even be at the game Sunday. |  | | |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 22:34 - Nov 6 with 1400 views | Rancid |
| Could the trust be doomed? on 21:59 - Nov 6 by dgt73 |
And also how many board members from other businesses do you know that have worked for nothing for 10 yrs, like the SCFC board did and how much would it have cost had they been paid during that 10 yrs ?. [Post edited 6 Nov 2014 22:01]
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Aye up until last year Huw was claiming Jobs Seekers allowance and 1 or 2 others on the board on the sick with bad backs.True that. | | | |
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