| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? 23:42 - Oct 16 with 44006 views | jackrabbit |
You'd think so from all the pompous pontification dominating the airwaves in the last few days. Pompous-Prat-in-Chief, Nick Clegg piled in with his fourpennorth today and in true Cleggy style managed to sway me right over onto the side of Evans. I had not given it much thought or had an opinion before - I wasn't that aware of Evans either as a footballer or a person - but I decided to read about the case.
From what I understand he went bed pissed wth a pissed-up 19 year old and sex took place - there was no physical violence. I wasn't there so i don't know the precise details. There was another person involved but he got off relatively mildly - Evans received a hefty jail term.
Now having served his fairly hefty sentence, he is being threatened with denial of his right to earn a living by continuing his career.
Now rape is a foul and terrible crime. However I have problem with some of these situations being described as 'rape'. Without being crass, when does 'persuasive and persistent seduction' carry over into 'rape'? I always thought it was when it was accompanied by force or violence to get your way. I am so glad I'm an old fart and was young when I was young in the 60s and 70s.
Since time immemorial women (and men) have woken up, taken one look at the head on the pillow next to them and instantly regretted the night before. Usually it has been logged under 'big mistake - not to be repeated' and then the person has just gone away and carried on with life. Je ne regrette rien. There was a song about it. Now all too often there is the cry of 'RAPE!' And the inevitable court case. As I say I'm talking generally and not specifically about the Evans case, but I am uneasy about the vilification that's taking place and I certainly see no reason why he should not return to his day job, - playing football.
Let all those who have not had a pissed-up one-night stand with a pissed-up bird, cast the first stone.
I'm now going to brace myself for the abuse! |  | | |  |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 23:46 - Oct 16 with 6330 views | Starsky |
Didn't he film it as well?
Feck him |  |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:14 - Oct 17 with 6304 views | Kilkennyjack |
If i were a wealthy club owner he would never kick a ball for my club, i can tell you that for nothing. Thankfully not good enough for our great club - so no decision needed. Up to other clubs to decide for their own clubs. |  |
| Beware of the Risen People
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:16 - Oct 17 with 6294 views | londonlisa2001 |
I can only imagine that the accounts that the OP has read of that night are the ones published by his family.
Again I repeat that his supporters have done a phenomenal job at persuading everyone that it was all a bit of a p*ssed up lark.
What actually happened - Evans let himself in to a hotel room that was not his (after persuading the desk clerk or similar to give him a key even though he had no right to it - it wasn't his room - it was his mate's room, who the girl did have sex with and who was acquitted of any wrong doing). He then had sex with a woman that was unconscious and therefore could not possible give consent and filmed it.
That is rape. Full stop. It didn't need to be violent did it - she was unconscious and couldn't resist.
And by the way - persistent seduction (by which I assume you mean failing to accept it when the woman (sorry, 'bird') says no) is rape when the woman says no. It's not that difficult to understand surely. And by saying you're glad you were young in the 60s and 70s - I do hope that you don't mean 'when women were told to shut up and get on with it' if they tried to report rape. |  | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:21 - Oct 17 with 6277 views | Joe_bradshaw |
Whether he plays for Sheffield United or any other club is up to them.
I really hope that he never wears the shirt of my country again though. |  |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:24 - Oct 17 with 6274 views | raynor94 |
Ah right, young in the sixties and seventies when anything went on, thank god we have moved on, op hang your head in shame you old dinosaur |  |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:27 - Oct 17 with 6261 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:21 - Oct 17 by Joe_bradshaw |
Whether he plays for Sheffield United or any other club is up to them.
I really hope that he never wears the shirt of my country again though. |
exactly my view. Playing for Wales is not part of his 'job' . | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:28 - Oct 17 with 6260 views | Lohengrin |
The kid was tucked up. The verdict was more to do with sticking two fingers up at someone earning ten, twenty even, more than you than it ever was about justice. |  |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:33 - Oct 17 with 6252 views | Lohengrin |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:24 - Oct 17 by raynor94 |
Ah right, young in the sixties and seventies when anything went on, thank god we have moved on, op hang your head in shame you old dinosaur |
And to think you genuinely believethat Britain, indeed the world, is in a better place now than it was in 197O  | |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:46 - Oct 17 with 6216 views | DwightYorkeSuperstar |
While what he did was probably rape it likely happens hundreds if not thousands of times every Friday/Saturday night up and down the country.
I think him being a footballer did influence the case. As long as he doesn't sign for Swansea City I'm not too fussed regarding him. If he is chosen to play for Wales then so be it. He's probably the best striker we have despite being behind bars for a few years. |  |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:48 - Oct 17 with 6220 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:28 - Oct 17 by Lohengrin |
The kid was tucked up. The verdict was more to do with sticking two fingers up at someone earning ten, twenty even, more than you than it ever was about justice. |
yes - of course he was - that's why after independent review he wasn't allowed to appeal.
If you think it's OK to break into a hotel room and rape a woman that is unconscious in that room (and film it) and that anyone done for that has been 'tucked up' then I despair. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:50 - Oct 17 with 6210 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:46 - Oct 17 by DwightYorkeSuperstar |
While what he did was probably rape it likely happens hundreds if not thousands of times every Friday/Saturday night up and down the country.
I think him being a footballer did influence the case. As long as he doesn't sign for Swansea City I'm not too fussed regarding him. If he is chosen to play for Wales then so be it. He's probably the best striker we have despite being behind bars for a few years. |
what part of 'he broke into a hotel room that wasn't his' do people not understand?
This isn't about 2 people going back to a room pissed up - she did that with his mate which is why his mate wasn't done for anything (and neither should he have been).
A woman saying yes to one bloke is not saying yes to his mate who lets himself into that mate's room - it does not happen up and down the country every weekend. It's not that complicated a case and yet everyone seems to be struggling with the facts (thankfully the people on the jury were able to understand). | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:51 - Oct 17 with 6211 views | skippyjack |
F*ck him.. the system likes to f*ck me around.. why don't they f*ck this bellend around.. I haven't committed a crime.. why doesn't he join me on the minimum wage bus.. that's all I can get.. come and join the 'boys' I'm sure you'll get along great.. he deserves it after all.. it's better than him scrounging around like all us non criminals..
This is society ^.. |  |
| The awkward moment when a Welsh Club become the Champions of England.. shh
The Swansea Way.. To upset the odds. | | Poll: | Best Swans Player |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:53 - Oct 17 with 6200 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:33 - Oct 17 by Lohengrin |
And to think you genuinely believethat Britain, indeed the world, is in a better place now than it was in 197O |
in a lot of ways it thankfully is. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:59 - Oct 17 with 6189 views | Joe_bradshaw |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:50 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
what part of 'he broke into a hotel room that wasn't his' do people not understand?
This isn't about 2 people going back to a room pissed up - she did that with his mate which is why his mate wasn't done for anything (and neither should he have been).
A woman saying yes to one bloke is not saying yes to his mate who lets himself into that mate's room - it does not happen up and down the country every weekend. It's not that complicated a case and yet everyone seems to be struggling with the facts (thankfully the people on the jury were able to understand). |
Lisa, I've done jury service and on reading media accounts of the cases I sat on after the verdicts I didn't recognise any of them.
Yet people who haven't sat through every minute of the evidence and who only have media accounts of trials to go on make decisions about the defendant's guilt or innocence.
It certainly opened my eyes about the reporting of trials. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 01:05 - Oct 17 with 6167 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:59 - Oct 17 by Joe_bradshaw |
Lisa, I've done jury service and on reading media accounts of the cases I sat on after the verdicts I didn't recognise any of them.
Yet people who haven't sat through every minute of the evidence and who only have media accounts of trials to go on make decisions about the defendant's guilt or innocence.
It certainly opened my eyes about the reporting of trials. |
that may be the case, but I suspect that the media coverage together with the coverage of the appeal being turned down are more accurate than the version being propagated by Ched Evans' family and friends which is being relied on here by a lot of people (all of which is based on a campaign funded by his girlfriend's millionaire father).
As you say - the only people that actually heard every single shred of evidence in this case found him guilty and the judge who also heard every piece of evidence sentenced him to 5 years and the appeals process that also reviewed all the evidence refused him right to appeal. I would, therefore, tend to agree with them rather than Evans' mates. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 01:13 - Oct 17 with 6155 views | Joe_bradshaw |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 01:05 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
that may be the case, but I suspect that the media coverage together with the coverage of the appeal being turned down are more accurate than the version being propagated by Ched Evans' family and friends which is being relied on here by a lot of people (all of which is based on a campaign funded by his girlfriend's millionaire father).
As you say - the only people that actually heard every single shred of evidence in this case found him guilty and the judge who also heard every piece of evidence sentenced him to 5 years and the appeals process that also reviewed all the evidence refused him right to appeal. I would, therefore, tend to agree with them rather than Evans' mates. |
Absolutely.
That was my point. The jury heard every word of the evidence from both sides and reached their verdict based on that.
That for me is infinitely more reliable than reports that concentrate on the sensational bits and often omit the crucial bits that result in the verdict that the jury reach. | |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 01:22 - Oct 17 with 6133 views | DwightYorkeSuperstar |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:50 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
what part of 'he broke into a hotel room that wasn't his' do people not understand?
This isn't about 2 people going back to a room pissed up - she did that with his mate which is why his mate wasn't done for anything (and neither should he have been).
A woman saying yes to one bloke is not saying yes to his mate who lets himself into that mate's room - it does not happen up and down the country every weekend. It's not that complicated a case and yet everyone seems to be struggling with the facts (thankfully the people on the jury were able to understand). |
I'm not saying he didn't rape her. I believe he did. I'm just pointing out it happens every weekend. I don't think I've been in a taxi queue after a night out and not seen at least one girl unable to stand being held up buy a guy waiting to get into a taxi.
I don't understand how she was unable to consent to Ched yet was able to consent to the other person. From the summary I read she consented to both but was (correctly) deemed not in a fit state to consent. I believe they both were guilty.
Anyway, he's served his time. He's nowt free to score the goals to get Wales to France 2016. [Post edited 17 Oct 2014 1:22]
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? (n/t) on 01:30 - Oct 17 with 6127 views | Lohengrin |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:53 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
in a lot of ways it thankfully is. |
[Post edited 17 Oct 2014 2:50]
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| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 02:37 - Oct 17 with 6085 views | Lohengrin |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:48 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
yes - of course he was - that's why after independent review he wasn't allowed to appeal.
If you think it's OK to break into a hotel room and rape a woman that is unconscious in that room (and film it) and that anyone done for that has been 'tucked up' then I despair. |
You may not want to hear this, Lisa, but not every woman out there has the morals of Edith Cavell. | |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:12 - Oct 17 with 5972 views | YrAlarch |
I am struggling to understand why there is such a witch hunt concerning this this young man. Even the news media refer to him as the 'rapist footballer'. He has been found guilty of a serious criminal offence, sentenced to imprisonment, and served the time deemed, by law, appropriate. Surely he is now due the opportunity, like other offenders, to re-integrate into the community, making a positive contribution to society (assuming that is what professional footballers do). I do not recall such a outcry against other footballer offenders, like those who kill others in car crash and then leg it from the scene. Is it not time to allow him to rehabilitate and ply his trade like other ex-cons. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:21 - Oct 17 with 5962 views | jackb |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 02:37 - Oct 17 by Lohengrin |
You may not want to hear this, Lisa, but not every woman out there has the morals of Edith Cavell. |
you may not want to hear this but not every man has the morals of a tomcat |  | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:30 - Oct 17 with 5949 views | Le_Swans |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 00:50 - Oct 17 by londonlisa2001 |
what part of 'he broke into a hotel room that wasn't his' do people not understand?
This isn't about 2 people going back to a room pissed up - she did that with his mate which is why his mate wasn't done for anything (and neither should he have been).
A woman saying yes to one bloke is not saying yes to his mate who lets himself into that mate's room - it does not happen up and down the country every weekend. It's not that complicated a case and yet everyone seems to be struggling with the facts (thankfully the people on the jury were able to understand). |
Not forgetting that he snuck out the fire exit too. | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:31 - Oct 17 with 5946 views | premierjack |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:12 - Oct 17 by YrAlarch |
I am struggling to understand why there is such a witch hunt concerning this this young man. Even the news media refer to him as the 'rapist footballer'. He has been found guilty of a serious criminal offence, sentenced to imprisonment, and served the time deemed, by law, appropriate. Surely he is now due the opportunity, like other offenders, to re-integrate into the community, making a positive contribution to society (assuming that is what professional footballers do). I do not recall such a outcry against other footballer offenders, like those who kill others in car crash and then leg it from the scene. Is it not time to allow him to rehabilitate and ply his trade like other ex-cons. |
Well said | | | |
| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:43 - Oct 17 with 5922 views | Ponderosa |
_____ [Post edited 17 Oct 2014 8:49]
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| Ched Evans - is he the evil incarnate? on 08:53 - Oct 17 with 5899 views | NOTRAC |
How about shagging your brothers wife? | |
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