| Interesting Trust Email 20:09 - Jun 29 with 140434 views | Neath_Jack |
Regarding the options open to us.
It's going to cause some massive debate on here i reckon  |  |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 21:04 - Jun 30 with 2244 views | 3swan |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:01 - Jun 30 by BLAZE |
The removal of Jenkins and Dineen from paid employment within the club. After what they have done, to still draw a massive wage is simply unacceptable.
In fact, if the Americans want to prove they are perceptive toward fan feeling, let's go a step further and ban them from the Liberty full stop. They can stay home on a Saturday afternoon and count their winnings instead. |
I'd hope that will finally be the outcome, when the owners can get in the right person, and not a 'project' one.
Can't see it but live in hope that it's just a short transitional period. Maybe 1 more season? |  | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:04 - Jun 30 with 2244 views | Alarch |
| Interesting Trust Email on 20:50 - Jun 30 by max936 |
Main objective for me is that they all, lock stock and barrel leave the club and never ever return and for the Fan's Trust to be fully compensated for the deceit, hung drawn and quartered would be a perfect alternative though. |
Which I completely get. My issue here is how you expect this to be achieved given the options open to the Trust?
It's highly emotive, any time you're wronged human nature is to seek revenge. I don't think the Trust are out for that though, they just want to try and put themselves in the strongest position possible. Financially and as a physical presence. | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:12 - Jun 30 with 2206 views | morningstar |
I find it quite ironic that the only person who has mentioned 'Swexit' and 'Swexit means Swexit' is the person answering questions on the trust board's behalf. Be careful with your wording Ux, as we know what happened there!
The way i see it after reading the whole thread is that we should take it all the way. Money in the bank for a rainy day? Clubs bigger and smaller than us have had worse 'rainy days' and still survived as would we. Cash in the bank to safeguard against a share dilution? Wtf! So basically the trust reduces it's share from 21% to 11% to ensure they can buy shares in a potential new share issue so that they can retain the 11%?
The bottom line is that any money paid to the trust is virtually worthless. We'd be selling our souls for fvck all other than having patsy's on the board with far less input into the running of the club than the people that put the trust in this position and who hold a lesser % of shares. How fvckin submissive does that make us look! Go for it. Show them that the fans of this club will not be taken for a ride. This is OUR club, and it's our one opportunity to stand up and fight for it. If we lose, we lose. But at least we would lose with our dignity intact, because accepting this 'deal' put's us in the same category as accepting cash for a colour change. I urge the trust to change their stance on this. Vote Swexit (you said it Ux), and show these bastads who've tried to turn us over that we will not go quietly into the night. Because accepting it, is a defeat. |  |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 21:13 - Jun 30 with 2199 views | Alarch |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:01 - Jun 30 by BLAZE |
The removal of Jenkins and Dineen from paid employment within the club. After what they have done, to still draw a massive wage is simply unacceptable.
In fact, if the Americans want to prove they are perceptive toward fan feeling, let's go a step further and ban them from the Liberty full stop. They can stay home on a Saturday afternoon and count their winnings instead. |
I think we all know that the Americans view the club as a business. That's something we have to get used to, unfortunately. Will they be here come what may? I doubt it.
They will pay lip service in the programme notes but is this emotive for them? Unlikely.
Our choice right now is how the Trust proceeds. As difficult as it is, we must remove all emotion from the decision. It's a commercial one, not one driven by the desire to avenge the wrongdoings of the sellers. | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:19 - Jun 30 with 2168 views | BLAZE |
Cash in the bank to safeguard against a share dilution? Wtf! So basically the trust reduces it's share from 21% to 11% to ensure they can buy shares in a potential new share issue so that they can retain the 11%?
I was thinking that myself. I figured it was so ridiculous that I must be missing a fairly obvious point. |  | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:25 - Jun 30 with 2136 views | max936 |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:04 - Jun 30 by Alarch |
Which I completely get. My issue here is how you expect this to be achieved given the options open to the Trust?
It's highly emotive, any time you're wronged human nature is to seek revenge. I don't think the Trust are out for that though, they just want to try and put themselves in the strongest position possible. Financially and as a physical presence. |
Go back and push them harder, they're using this offer as a barging chip the Trust has a 21% stake there's no deal unless sellers are gone then and only then can we deal.
Next season we'll have the same thing happening with JVZ making another packet with his Premier League days out side line. it all stinks. |  |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 21:27 - Jun 30 with 2134 views | morningstar |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:19 - Jun 30 by BLAZE |
Cash in the bank to safeguard against a share dilution? Wtf! So basically the trust reduces it's share from 21% to 11% to ensure they can buy shares in a potential new share issue so that they can retain the 11%?
I was thinking that myself. I figured it was so ridiculous that I must be missing a fairly obvious point. |
You didn't miss anything. That statement couldn't have possibly meant anything else! Mind boggling stuff!  | |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 21:28 - Jun 30 with 2126 views | monmouth |
| Interesting Trust Email on 19:46 - Jun 30 by BLAZE |
What bothers me most is that we as fans have done absolutely nothing to unseat the corrupt bastard - we've sat on our hands pending trust investigation and outcome just to be told to let it slide - because apparently we've got 'no say in the matter'. We do have a say. We have a voice times 20,000 every match day. We protest, we chant, we make the f*cker dread having to step foot in the ground every other week.
But the truth is too much time has passed now, apathy has set in and the majority of the fans have no fight and are willing to forgive and forget. It makes me sick. For years we crowed about being better than Cardiff - are we f*ck. In some people's eyes the January transfer window was enough to redeem Jenkins - it's bewildering. If it wasn't for him and his accomplices we wouldn't have been in such a disastrous position to begin with. He gets no credit for our survival from me.
Legal action all day long. Go out swinging with our pride intact and a fairly strong case to boot. All this about burning bridges with the new owners - so f*cking what. They're already doing what they want in insisting Jenkins stays despite the fans and trusts disapproval. The point blank refusal to consider Jenkins' position just proves that the new owners will do exactly what the new owners want to do. This offer is a patronising tap on the head and any platitudes are hollow. It's lip service to keep us sweet. Let the trust feel as though they've bargained a good outcome and while they tap each other on the back, the Americans and sell outs can go about business as normal. No doubt sniggering at how easy it has all been.
We've been tucked up and we're on the brink of accepting it without so much as a whimper.  |
I've been waiting for something to really resonate with me. This one has just about made my mind up blaze, thanks. F*ck it. Let's prove we still have some of the spirit that actually made us different. |  |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 21:44 - Jun 30 with 2064 views | Alarch |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:25 - Jun 30 by max936 |
Go back and push them harder, they're using this offer as a barging chip the Trust has a 21% stake there's no deal unless sellers are gone then and only then can we deal.
Next season we'll have the same thing happening with JVZ making another packet with his Premier League days out side line. it all stinks. |
Who's to say that this is the first offer? I'd guess that the length of time that we've waited for this announcement would suggest that there have been lengthy negotiations behind the scenes. We're not privy to that information though.
The yanks are the majority shareholders. They have the final say on decisions. Isn't it better to have the right to make them consider a different perspective by working with them than to dig our heels in and end up in a battle which we simply can't win? | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:50 - Jun 30 with 2039 views | morningstar |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:28 - Jun 30 by monmouth |
I've been waiting for something to really resonate with me. This one has just about made my mind up blaze, thanks. F*ck it. Let's prove we still have some of the spirit that actually made us different. |
And let's do it with the backing of the trust board! SWEXIT! | |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 21:53 - Jun 30 with 2031 views | Starsky |
| Interesting Trust Email on 19:05 - Jun 30 by Uxbridge |
Ah I've missed you too
I was being slightly mischievous but there we are. This whole Jenkins thing is a sideshow. |
The Jenkins thing is a sideshow?
No it's not, it really isn't. |  |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 21:56 - Jun 30 with 2013 views | Phil_S |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:50 - Jun 30 by morningstar |
And let's do it with the backing of the trust board! SWEXIT! |
The Trust board will back the decision of our members. I will guarantee you that part.
The consultation and vote will lay out the options, the pros and cons and the recommendation of the board. As people in the room said last night and we were in full agreement the facts will be laid out for everyone to make an informed decision based on their own views.
I have stated my view but we all know the point of democracy |  | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:56 - Jun 30 with 2007 views | Starsky |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:12 - Jun 30 by morningstar |
I find it quite ironic that the only person who has mentioned 'Swexit' and 'Swexit means Swexit' is the person answering questions on the trust board's behalf. Be careful with your wording Ux, as we know what happened there!
The way i see it after reading the whole thread is that we should take it all the way. Money in the bank for a rainy day? Clubs bigger and smaller than us have had worse 'rainy days' and still survived as would we. Cash in the bank to safeguard against a share dilution? Wtf! So basically the trust reduces it's share from 21% to 11% to ensure they can buy shares in a potential new share issue so that they can retain the 11%?
The bottom line is that any money paid to the trust is virtually worthless. We'd be selling our souls for fvck all other than having patsy's on the board with far less input into the running of the club than the people that put the trust in this position and who hold a lesser % of shares. How fvckin submissive does that make us look! Go for it. Show them that the fans of this club will not be taken for a ride. This is OUR club, and it's our one opportunity to stand up and fight for it. If we lose, we lose. But at least we would lose with our dignity intact, because accepting this 'deal' put's us in the same category as accepting cash for a colour change. I urge the trust to change their stance on this. Vote Swexit (you said it Ux), and show these bastads who've tried to turn us over that we will not go quietly into the night. Because accepting it, is a defeat. |
Well said Gar
The trust have gone soft on this one.
Jenkins is an irrelivance apparently.
I hope I get the chance to vote before my membership expires. | |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 21:59 - Jun 30 with 1996 views | Phil_S |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:56 - Jun 30 by Starsky |
Well said Gar
The trust have gone soft on this one.
Jenkins is an irrelivance apparently.
I hope I get the chance to vote before my membership expires. |
The Trust most definitely have not gone soft - please dont confuse recommending not taking a nuclear option as that.
Having considered the facts and options in front of us we believe that taking the rainy day fund and keeping a input that allows us to keep close eye on club governance is a better option then gambling our money on a case that we may lose (and for balance yes I know we may win)
And a case that will not give us what I think from reading this what most people want
However, as said before it isn't my decision so its very soon going to be a call for the members as we take the consultation process all the way through
The simple question to ask yourselves before you vote is what do you want as the result as an individual because the likely outcome to any litigation is a complete sale of the Trust shares.
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:01 - Jun 30 with 1979 views | NeathJack |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:56 - Jun 30 by Starsky |
Well said Gar
The trust have gone soft on this one.
Jenkins is an irrelivance apparently.
I hope I get the chance to vote before my membership expires. |
That last sentence is an interesting point. It was stated that approx 1800 people are eligible to vote and the cut off date has passed for anyone wanting to join in order to vote.
When is the membership renewal date and if members do not renew, but the ballot date is after the deadline for renewals, will members who have not renewed still have the right to vote? |  | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:04 - Jun 30 with 1960 views | Phil_S |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:01 - Jun 30 by NeathJack |
That last sentence is an interesting point. It was stated that approx 1800 people are eligible to vote and the cut off date has passed for anyone wanting to join in order to vote.
When is the membership renewal date and if members do not renew, but the ballot date is after the deadline for renewals, will members who have not renewed still have the right to vote? |
The ballot is planned to take place before the membership renewal date | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:04 - Jun 30 with 1960 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:44 - Jun 30 by Alarch |
Who's to say that this is the first offer? I'd guess that the length of time that we've waited for this announcement would suggest that there have been lengthy negotiations behind the scenes. We're not privy to that information though.
The yanks are the majority shareholders. They have the final say on decisions. Isn't it better to have the right to make them consider a different perspective by working with them than to dig our heels in and end up in a battle which we simply can't win? |
Firstly it depends on your definition of 'we' and secondly it depends on your definition of 'win'. | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:06 - Jun 30 with 1942 views | morningstar |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:56 - Jun 30 by Phil_S |
The Trust board will back the decision of our members. I will guarantee you that part.
The consultation and vote will lay out the options, the pros and cons and the recommendation of the board. As people in the room said last night and we were in full agreement the facts will be laid out for everyone to make an informed decision based on their own views.
I have stated my view but we all know the point of democracy |
We know that Phil. But voting 'Swexit' means a revolution! Will the trust board back that? As basically that what the members will be voting for! It will not simply be a vote against the offer on the table. You do realise that don't you. | |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 22:11 - Jun 30 with 1909 views | BLAZE |
It's being said that if we go down the route of legal action, then there's no guarantees that the people who want shot of Jenkins will get what they want
But surely if he's found guilty his position is untenable. If, in the eyes of the law, he's found to have knowingly and purposefully mislead the prospective buyers and lied about the situation regarding a major shareholder then he can no longer reside as chairman of said company. Surely? | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:11 - Jun 30 with 1903 views | Phil_S |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:06 - Jun 30 by morningstar |
We know that Phil. But voting 'Swexit' means a revolution! Will the trust board back that? As basically that what the members will be voting for! It will not simply be a vote against the offer on the table. You do realise that don't you. |
By Swexit I assume you mean litigation?
The Trust board will back any mandate provided to it by its membership. No matter how revolutionary, we cannot do any different
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:12 - Jun 30 with 1897 views | Alarch |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:04 - Jun 30 by londonlisa2001 |
Firstly it depends on your definition of 'we' and secondly it depends on your definition of 'win'. |
"We" = those of us not on the Trust board.
"Win" = The view of many on this board. Winning = a removal/unseating/dismemberment/beheading of one or all if the sellers. | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:16 - Jun 30 with 1871 views | Starsky |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:59 - Jun 30 by Phil_S |
The Trust most definitely have not gone soft - please dont confuse recommending not taking a nuclear option as that.
Having considered the facts and options in front of us we believe that taking the rainy day fund and keeping a input that allows us to keep close eye on club governance is a better option then gambling our money on a case that we may lose (and for balance yes I know we may win)
And a case that will not give us what I think from reading this what most people want
However, as said before it isn't my decision so its very soon going to be a call for the members as we take the consultation process all the way through
The simple question to ask yourselves before you vote is what do you want as the result as an individual because the likely outcome to any litigation is a complete sale of the Trust shares.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
When you paid all this money for QC guidance... it's been reported on here that he feels you have a good case.
Were you honestly expecting him to say 100% win, no problem?
I could see your point of view if what he has said was less optimistic...
All I'm hearing is "what do you hope to achieve by going legal"
Why did we bother at all?
It may not bother some on here anymore but what happened stinks. And if we've got to suck it up and take the hush money whilst watching Jenkins, Dineen and Jiffy slapping us in the face every week, then OUR Swansea City is dead. I may as well watch Trunds at Llanelli.
I think the fact that the Americans steadfastly refused to get rid of Jenkins is a good measure that they don't give a fig about the fans and the trusts feelings on this matter.
The way that they've won that argument seems like a knockout with the first punch. | |
| It's just the internet, init. |
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| Interesting Trust Email on 22:18 - Jun 30 with 1860 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:59 - Jun 30 by Phil_S |
The Trust most definitely have not gone soft - please dont confuse recommending not taking a nuclear option as that.
Having considered the facts and options in front of us we believe that taking the rainy day fund and keeping a input that allows us to keep close eye on club governance is a better option then gambling our money on a case that we may lose (and for balance yes I know we may win)
And a case that will not give us what I think from reading this what most people want
However, as said before it isn't my decision so its very soon going to be a call for the members as we take the consultation process all the way through
The simple question to ask yourselves before you vote is what do you want as the result as an individual because the likely outcome to any litigation is a complete sale of the Trust shares.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Phil or Ux, in October of last year, the Trust issued a statement containing a list of demands that it felt should be met failing which legal action should be taken. It talked about long term protection being vital.
How do you think this proposed deal does that? What long term protection does it give the Trust? | | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:20 - Jun 30 with 1840 views | Swanzay |
| Interesting Trust Email on 21:59 - Jun 30 by Phil_S |
The Trust most definitely have not gone soft - please dont confuse recommending not taking a nuclear option as that.
Having considered the facts and options in front of us we believe that taking the rainy day fund and keeping a input that allows us to keep close eye on club governance is a better option then gambling our money on a case that we may lose (and for balance yes I know we may win)
And a case that will not give us what I think from reading this what most people want
However, as said before it isn't my decision so its very soon going to be a call for the members as we take the consultation process all the way through
The simple question to ask yourselves before you vote is what do you want as the result as an individual because the likely outcome to any litigation is a complete sale of the Trust shares.
This post has been edited by an administrator |
Hi Phil
I respect all the Trusts hard work in the last few months, but why do you keep calling it the "nuclear option"
AGAIN the trust quote...
We have a rare model where fans can directly be involved in the club management (albeit remotely throu the Trust reps). Isn't the aim to have as big an influence as possible, which can only be achieved through as large a shareholding as possible? These owners will soon go, but the Trust preserves the link between the fans and the club, so our kids and their kids still have a stake one day. Why would we want to dilute that link?
To me this has nothing to do with the current owners and the future of the Swans for future generations is critical.
But what truly annoys me is the sell out kunts, 2 of which, enjoyed each others company today (Dineen and Katzan) over lunch. Get away with it!
The Trust are basically being bribed to keep stumm, whilst being screwed yet again, by those who originally did the dirty deed! |  | | |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:22 - Jun 30 with 1829 views | Phil_S |
| Interesting Trust Email on 22:16 - Jun 30 by Starsky |
When you paid all this money for QC guidance... it's been reported on here that he feels you have a good case.
Were you honestly expecting him to say 100% win, no problem?
I could see your point of view if what he has said was less optimistic...
All I'm hearing is "what do you hope to achieve by going legal"
Why did we bother at all?
It may not bother some on here anymore but what happened stinks. And if we've got to suck it up and take the hush money whilst watching Jenkins, Dineen and Jiffy slapping us in the face every week, then OUR Swansea City is dead. I may as well watch Trunds at Llanelli.
I think the fact that the Americans steadfastly refused to get rid of Jenkins is a good measure that they don't give a fig about the fans and the trusts feelings on this matter.
The way that they've won that argument seems like a knockout with the first punch. |
The reason I ask people just to think of what they want the outcome to be is purely because that is the thing that should drive the decision
If you want a complete sale then the only way to that is to attempt litigation, we won't get that without it
If you want Jenkins out then litigation isn't a route towards that happening.
And no I wasnt expecting him to say a 100% win that would be crazy but he is very clearly saying that we should be negotiating hard first and foremost and that has been the route. The fact that he backed what we were saying last night and the way we went about it speaks volumes to me.
But as said that isn't my decision to make so we see what the vote says.
I'm sorry to anyone that thinks I have done a bad job, almost wish I had just watched the football instead... :D | | | |
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