| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games 18:19 - Dec 11 with 37895 views | 442Dale |
http://www.daletrust.co.uk/2015/12/question-to-the-club/
As a result of issues raised by supporters on here recently, questions were sent to the club via the Trust. The answers are in the link.
Please take the time to join the Trust and ask questions too or if you're already a member get them sent in (use the links at the top on their site). This illustrates that they will be answered, and those answers are there for everyone to see and debate.
Simple process that other clubs would do well to follow.
Thanks to those involved. [Post edited 11 Dec 2015 18:21]
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 17:31 - Jan 12 with 3130 views | jimmysbaldhead |
I have been searched every game since the Wigan match (I'm in the Pearl Street end) doesn't bother me in the slightest.
I would however question how effective these searches are. I had two phones and my wallet in the same coat pocket on Saturday, so quite bulky and the guy didn't even ask what was in there. It is half arsed.
If you're going to do it do it properly. Either way i'll take the pat down and get in and enjoy the footy. No flouncing off from me if they ask to search me. |  | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 17:51 - Jan 12 with 3080 views | 442Dale |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 17:31 - Jan 12 by jimmysbaldhead |
I have been searched every game since the Wigan match (I'm in the Pearl Street end) doesn't bother me in the slightest.
I would however question how effective these searches are. I had two phones and my wallet in the same coat pocket on Saturday, so quite bulky and the guy didn't even ask what was in there. It is half arsed.
If you're going to do it do it properly. Either way i'll take the pat down and get in and enjoy the footy. No flouncing off from me if they ask to search me. |
I think many fans would be ok with the searches if they were more aware about why and how they will be carried out.
This could have been communicated very easily ahead of the changes witnessed recently. Fans shouldn't have to ask for clarity but it's good that we have a process to do just that and the club and the Trust are happy to use it.
This could all be sorted before Saturday! | |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 18:45 - Jan 12 with 3009 views | rochdaleriddler |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 16:46 - Jan 12 by happyevaafter |
Maybe the ones who doth protest too much also complain about being stopped / not being stopped at customs at the airport when they come back from their two weeks away.
It's called profiling.
profiling
[proh-fahy-ling]
noun
1.
the use of personal characteristics or behaviour patterns to make generalizations about a person, as in gender profiling.
2.
the use of these characteristics to determine whether a person may be engaged in illegal activity, as in racial profiling. |
I know what profiling is, and I know you are talking rubbish. away fans bring flares in so searching and profiling fails all round. I'm a 55 year old local male, and I aint being searched, I'm not getting on a plane, I'm trying to support a league one club ffs |  |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:00 - Jan 12 with 2878 views | TVOS1907 |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 16:20 - Jan 12 by happyevaafter |
Add to that list searches at Blackpool, Bury away (although they did generously provide an amnesty flare bin) and Millwall (almost expected).
Not sure about the racist comment. What does a Muslim look like? What does a Roman Catholic look like? What does a Jedi look like?
Current threat level is classed as severe. There's only one higher status than this which has been reached twice in its history (2006 & 2007).
https://www.gov.uk/terrorism-national-emergency/terrorism-threat-levels
I can understand but not condone the haphazard way that the searches have been done. Compared to other grounds I'd say our stewarding was, on a scale of 0-10 (10 being very good) about a 3.5.
There's something going on which the majority on this board (including me) are not privy to. I doubt you'll get an answer as to what it is but I'm sure it's not the hunt for a smuggled sausage from the chippy. The guys and gals doing the searches are only following instructions and doing their job. I'm sure the majority on here would comply with the instruction of a club appointed steward and if that instruction is one of "I don't need to search you" then so be it.
Me - I'll be in the Dale Bar on Saturday, entering via the Ratcliffe Arms, past the SIA appointed doorman who has the right to refuse me entry. The same as any licenced premise in the country. I think he may even be allowed to search me. I hope they've still got some of that £1.50 Carlsberg left although best not have too much as it's an offence to be drunk in a football ground. And it's against my religion.
Rules - for the guidance of wise men and the obedience of fools. |
I think you're privy to more than you're letting on.
If the current threat level is severe, then surely it applies to EVERYONE who enters Spotland and every other ground in the country, just like it applies to everyone who uses an airport, to use your analogy.
Pilots and cabin crew at airports all go through the same security searches as passengers, so surely EVERYONE who enters Spotland on a matchday should be subject to the same searches as the fans. |  |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:18 - Jan 12 with 2853 views | nordenblue |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:00 - Jan 12 by TVOS1907 |
I think you're privy to more than you're letting on.
If the current threat level is severe, then surely it applies to EVERYONE who enters Spotland and every other ground in the country, just like it applies to everyone who uses an airport, to use your analogy.
Pilots and cabin crew at airports all go through the same security searches as passengers, so surely EVERYONE who enters Spotland on a matchday should be subject to the same searches as the fans. |
Agree with your post tvos,except the pilot and cabin crew dont go through the same security measures prior to boarding,their luggage gets checked the same as all passenger's though.
Having had their luggage checked the pilot,co pilot etc then have access to an axe in the cockpit!! [Post edited 12 Jan 2016 22:18]
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:30 - Jan 12 with 2837 views | TVOS1907 |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:18 - Jan 12 by nordenblue |
Agree with your post tvos,except the pilot and cabin crew dont go through the same security measures prior to boarding,their luggage gets checked the same as all passenger's though.
Having had their luggage checked the pilot,co pilot etc then have access to an axe in the cockpit!! [Post edited 12 Jan 2016 22:18]
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Thanks norden, I think I was meaning they don't just go through with no checks. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:32 - Jan 12 with 2833 views | Rosun |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:18 - Jan 12 by nordenblue |
Agree with your post tvos,except the pilot and cabin crew dont go through the same security measures prior to boarding,their luggage gets checked the same as all passenger's though.
Having had their luggage checked the pilot,co pilot etc then have access to an axe in the cockpit!! [Post edited 12 Jan 2016 22:18]
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I think the tongue in cheek comment about airports was about trying to smuggle 2 extra bricks of fags through the Nothing to Declare channel. Whilst sweating like a fat lass at a disco. Sat next to the radiator. With a puffa jacket on. And thermal underwear.
I feel guilty just smuggling my dirty underwear back into the country. |  | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:32 - Jan 12 with 2830 views | SuddenLad |
Does anyone frisk the stewards ? If so, who and when ? |  |
| “It is easier to fool people, than to convince them that they have been fooled†|
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:34 - Jan 12 with 2827 views | Rosun |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:32 - Jan 12 by SuddenLad |
Does anyone frisk the stewards ? If so, who and when ? |
Bagsy first dibs for Carol!
Especially if she wears her plant pot. | | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:42 - Jan 12 with 2815 views | nordenblue |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:30 - Jan 12 by TVOS1907 |
Thanks norden, I think I was meaning they don't just go through with no checks. |
I was just being pedantic for a change... | | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:43 - Jan 12 with 2812 views | TVOS1907 |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:42 - Jan 12 by nordenblue |
I was just being pedantic for a change... |
No, you were right.
I'm not a seasoned airport user, so it's good to get more info. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:58 - Jan 12 with 2794 views | D_Alien |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:34 - Jan 12 by Rosun |
Bagsy first dibs for Carol!
Especially if she wears her plant pot. |
Does she know about you smuggling dirty underwear? |  |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 23:24 - Jan 12 with 2760 views | Rosun |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 22:58 - Jan 12 by D_Alien |
Does she know about you smuggling dirty underwear? |
She will by the end of the night.
The only steward who looks like she has been given the correct size jacket. Not too small / tight. Nice way with the fans too. [Post edited 13 Jan 2016 9:18]
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 09:11 - Jan 13 with 2645 views | upthedale |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 15:04 - Jan 12 by TVOS1907 |
How are you so sure the searches started at the Wigan game? You seem remarkably well-informed. Hmm..
Anyway, as far as I can recall and from my own experience, the issue was first raised on here after the Port Vale game, but I'm happy for it to be proven otherwise.
You must have been unlucky at Doncaster and Scunthorpe, as I didn't see anyone else being searched. Not saying it didn't happen, but that I didn't see it, nor did I see it at Walsall and Swindon, while I believe it didn't happen at Gillingham.
The steward impersonator - another away fan, like the smoke bombs.
Yes, I know it's a condition of entry to Spotland and any other grounds, but for this to just appear out of the blue with no reasonable explanation is what is irking most people.
No, it isn't the society we live in, because, as I've mentioned, we would be searched at every other public place.
Airports are a completely different matter and there are very good reasons why people are searched, x-rayed and so on there. Similarly with the other places you mention, which are all high risk and high security establishments.
Rochdale v Chesterfield doesn't fall into the same category.
And it's impossible to hear anything above the sound of the tannoy. |
I think it started at the game following the Paris attacks because I remember commenting on it.
And as such the searches certainly haven't started "out of the blue"....it was because 130 people died going about their day-to-day business. If that's not a good enough reason to search people then I'm not sure what is.
Though of course the searches should be effective and efficient, which they don't appear to be atm. I've not been searched yet (as you may have assumed TVOS). |  | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 09:31 - Jan 13 with 2619 views | KenBoon |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 09:11 - Jan 13 by upthedale |
I think it started at the game following the Paris attacks because I remember commenting on it.
And as such the searches certainly haven't started "out of the blue"....it was because 130 people died going about their day-to-day business. If that's not a good enough reason to search people then I'm not sure what is.
Though of course the searches should be effective and efficient, which they don't appear to be atm. I've not been searched yet (as you may have assumed TVOS). |
The searches are to do with fans (generally away fans) bringing Flares into the ground. As for the terrorism excuse. Well that could be used for anything. Trackers on your Car. CCTV in your house. Pre-approving all post... on and on and on. I'm going to refuse any searches on Saturday. I'm fed up of being treated like a criminal and any 'terrorism' excuses are pure and utter shite. If it's about public safety then everyone should stay at home and do nothing. |  | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 10:13 - Jan 13 with 2590 views | TVOS1907 |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 09:11 - Jan 13 by upthedale |
I think it started at the game following the Paris attacks because I remember commenting on it.
And as such the searches certainly haven't started "out of the blue"....it was because 130 people died going about their day-to-day business. If that's not a good enough reason to search people then I'm not sure what is.
Though of course the searches should be effective and efficient, which they don't appear to be atm. I've not been searched yet (as you may have assumed TVOS). |
'Out of the blue' in as much as something that hasn't happened before.
I fully understand the immediate reaction after the Paris attacks, but as has been mentioned ad infinitum, why isn't this happening to EVERYONE who enters the ground, why isn't it happening at every away game, why isn't it happening at Tesco, ASDA, Morrison's, etc..?
As KenBoon says, you could use the terrorism angle to justify anything. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 10:37 - Jan 13 with 2573 views | DomDale |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 09:31 - Jan 13 by KenBoon |
The searches are to do with fans (generally away fans) bringing Flares into the ground. As for the terrorism excuse. Well that could be used for anything. Trackers on your Car. CCTV in your house. Pre-approving all post... on and on and on. I'm going to refuse any searches on Saturday. I'm fed up of being treated like a criminal and any 'terrorism' excuses are pure and utter shite. If it's about public safety then everyone should stay at home and do nothing. |
I'm not entirely sure where the link to terrorism and increased searching has even come from. Did the club carry out frisking post the Munich Massacre in 1972? Did they carry out frisking during the troubles? Did it carry out frisking post Manchester or Warrington Bombs, 9/11, 7/7 etc etc.
It just seems to be a tragic conicidence that there was a terrorist attack some 500 miles away around the time some numpty away fans started to bring flares to our ground... |  |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 10:47 - Jan 13 with 2562 views | DomDale |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 10:13 - Jan 13 by TVOS1907 |
'Out of the blue' in as much as something that hasn't happened before.
I fully understand the immediate reaction after the Paris attacks, but as has been mentioned ad infinitum, why isn't this happening to EVERYONE who enters the ground, why isn't it happening at every away game, why isn't it happening at Tesco, ASDA, Morrison's, etc..?
As KenBoon says, you could use the terrorism angle to justify anything. |
I'd hope (perhaps naively) that the population of this island would oppose blatant encroachment into personal liberty. | |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 10:49 - Jan 13 with 2559 views | TVOS1907 |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 10:47 - Jan 13 by DomDale |
I'd hope (perhaps naively) that the population of this island would oppose blatant encroachment into personal liberty. |
Precisely. | |
| When I was your age, I used to enjoy the odd game of tennis. Or was it golf? |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 13:26 - Jan 13 with 2470 views | upthedale |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 10:13 - Jan 13 by TVOS1907 |
'Out of the blue' in as much as something that hasn't happened before.
I fully understand the immediate reaction after the Paris attacks, but as has been mentioned ad infinitum, why isn't this happening to EVERYONE who enters the ground, why isn't it happening at every away game, why isn't it happening at Tesco, ASDA, Morrison's, etc..?
As KenBoon says, you could use the terrorism angle to justify anything. |
Yeah agreed, but I should imagine The Football League has told clubs to step up security and it's our reaction to that. The Premier League certainly told clubs to step it up.
Of course everyone who's commented about where does it end, like your point with supermarkets, is 100% right - I don't know the point where we stop, and I'm certainly not pretending to be an expert.
Just that, in my opinion, I don't mind being searched going into public places such as football matches. I went to the Apollo a couple of months ago and was searched (and fully expected to be), it didn't bother me even slightly - though flares were actually let off in the gig so shows the searches are pretty awful everywhere...not just Spotland!
If I have a bag with me, I expect it to be searched going into a stadium/concert etc. Can you hide stuff? Yes. Again, proves the searches aren't great at finding small things but it doesn't bother me even slightly to take 5 seconds out of my day.
Even forgetting terrorism, surely it's worth either random or full searches to potentially pick up the odd flare/firecracker - it might deter people? (But hopefully not just from coming to the game full stop!) | | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 13:50 - Jan 13 with 2399 views | Bobbyjoe |
It's the scattergun approach that seems to be the issue. | | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 13:59 - Jan 13 with 2388 views | judd |
I were wearing flares last Saturday and got let in without a search. |  |
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games (n/t) on 14:14 - Jan 13 with 2366 views | D_Alien |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 23:24 - Jan 12 by Rosun |
She will by the end of the night.
The only steward who looks like she has been given the correct size jacket. Not too small / tight. Nice way with the fans too. [Post edited 13 Jan 2016 9:18]
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[Post edited 30 Jan 2016 14:04]
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| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 15:10 - Jan 13 with 2308 views | aleanddale |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 16:23 - Jan 12 by dawlishdale |
I'm amazed that people are so upset about this.
From memory;
The new search policy started at the Wigan game, which was just after the Paris attacks. Wasn't there a minutes silence before kick off?
I'm sure someone from the club told me it was a Government instruction to address the heightened security threat of a terrorist attack. So technically, it's not merely to prevent people coming in with chips etc. They also told me that all clubs had the same instructions.
I've been searched this season at Bury (aggressively) and at Doncaster( in a much more relaxed manner) I haven't been searched at the few home games I've been to after Wigan.
I'm disappointed that so many people can't grasp that the club probably don't want to search people, but would be leaving themselves open to criticism if they chose not to. As to who is searched; then this comes down to Steward discretion, which seems to rankle with those who are complaining. I doubt we have enough stewards to search everyone.
A question for the dissenters...
Would you be happy with the club if no searches took place, but someone did gain entry to the ground, and let off a device that caused you a serious injury? Perhaps a firework or a flare that landed on you and burned you severely... Would you then attach any blame to the club.
Finally, it is on the Ground Regulations that anyone seeking to enter the ground submits themselves for a search if required. If they choose not to submit to a search, they do not meet the entry requirements and may be refused entry. This doesn't seem to have changed...just the frequency of the searches, which is a direct consequence of the increased risk of a terrorist attack in the UK. |
Answers.....
I would be happy taking my chance.. 35 years not been hit by a flare once. And more importantly what if I was hit now whilst the pathetic half arsed attempt of searches are happening? That would open up a can of liability worms.
It's always been in the rules it's the way it has been implemented that stinks and is pissing plenty off.
The club need to act now or more regular fans will start joining the lapsed occasionals club.
No way will a high vis search me again. | | | |
| Replies from the club re. Ticketing and searches at games on 13:57 - Jan 30 with 2068 views | 442Dale |
As this is the thread both the Trust and the club were alerted to re. issues raised by supporters, please put any experiences around searches today here.
Hopefully the feedback will have led to the situation being addressed positively. | |
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