| Defence 14:19 - Jul 20 with 15825 views | deanscfc |
Surely ours needs improving, not weakening??
For much of last season our defence looked weak and we let in goals at the wrong times causing us to lose games we should have at least drawn, if not won. Rangel is getting on a bit and looked slow in the highlights from last nights game and now our left back is going. Anyone else think we at least need good cover for a right back? |  | | |  |
| Defence on 18:57 - Jul 20 with 1450 views | Daggyjack |
| Defence on 18:49 - Jul 20 by FearOfAJackPlanet |
I also think the defence needs some investment. I don't think swapping Taylor for Ben really affects us much, in my opinion Taylor is the better defender of the two, but Ben had more to his game, especially going forwards, but Tayls isn't a slouch in that respect either (Still remember that peach of a cross for Bony at Arsenal last season in one of his rare appearances).
Ash is good enough. Chico is a bit...well, Chico. Amat is someone it seems hard to dislike based on his attitude and professionalism, as well as his versatility; I have doubts about him making it at centre-half in the Prem though, he seems to lose too many physical/aeriel battles for my liking. He's built more like a full-back to me, and I wouldn't mind seeing him getting a chance at RB at some point.
Bartley certainly has the physique, but question marks remain about the rest, although I'm more of a fan than most on here it seems...
Rangel doesn't have strong enough competition, and KIngsley is a complete unknown as understudy to Tayls (if that's how it's to work out).
Bit risky to go as we are into the season IMO. |
Agree with a lot of what you said.
I think Amat at RB is an option, as is Taylor. I think we should move for Kolodziejczak at LB. This gives us the option of playing Rangel, Amat or Taylor at RB (not Tiendalli please) then the cover of Taylor and Kingsley at LB for Kolodziejczak.
As for Bartley at RB, the Rangers fans had this discussion when he was with them and said that he didn't look comfortable out wide. [Post edited 20 Jul 2014 18:59]
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| Defence on 21:25 - Jul 20 with 1390 views | eastbanker |
My opinion of Fabianski has been arrived at by watching his performances, do you believe that the Swans shirt will automatically make him a good keeper? If that was the case everyone we sign would become another Messi or Ronaldo. The reality of the situation is that every player, immaterial of their club, will be judged on past performances/statistics etc. If Fabianski turns out to be a decent keeper and keeps numerous clean sheets next season, I will be the first to hold up my hands and say I was wrong. However, on past performances my opinion is that he will not prove to be one of the better keepers in the history of our club.
The nickname Flappyhandski was first used by Arsenal supporters due to his tendency to flap at crosses, even one of the player stats web sites has him down as very weak at crosses. I find it amusing that the continued use of it seems to offend posters, while nicknames for other players is widely accepted. | | | |
| Defence on 21:32 - Jul 20 with 1381 views | Daggyjack |
| Defence on 21:25 - Jul 20 by eastbanker |
My opinion of Fabianski has been arrived at by watching his performances, do you believe that the Swans shirt will automatically make him a good keeper? If that was the case everyone we sign would become another Messi or Ronaldo. The reality of the situation is that every player, immaterial of their club, will be judged on past performances/statistics etc. If Fabianski turns out to be a decent keeper and keeps numerous clean sheets next season, I will be the first to hold up my hands and say I was wrong. However, on past performances my opinion is that he will not prove to be one of the better keepers in the history of our club.
The nickname Flappyhandski was first used by Arsenal supporters due to his tendency to flap at crosses, even one of the player stats web sites has him down as very weak at crosses. I find it amusing that the continued use of it seems to offend posters, while nicknames for other players is widely accepted. |
As well as saying he is very weak at crosses, it states that he is "strong" at long passing and "very strong" at saving long shots and reflexes but you omitted the positives.
I guess that the point others were making about the nickname, is that you used it on several occasions, without any need, just to try and get your point across.
He is a Jack now so let's get behind him rather than slate him even before he has played a competitive game for us.
I'm sure that there will be plenty of time during the season to slate him when he makes the slightest mistake. | | | |
| Defence on 21:44 - Jul 20 with 1357 views | eastbanker |
| Defence on 21:32 - Jul 20 by Daggyjack |
As well as saying he is very weak at crosses, it states that he is "strong" at long passing and "very strong" at saving long shots and reflexes but you omitted the positives.
I guess that the point others were making about the nickname, is that you used it on several occasions, without any need, just to try and get your point across.
He is a Jack now so let's get behind him rather than slate him even before he has played a competitive game for us.
I'm sure that there will be plenty of time during the season to slate him when he makes the slightest mistake. |
Strong at long passing, thats going to be a massive positive for a team that plays out from the back. If you are no good at saving long shots and have poor reflexes you really shouldn't be playing in goals. Its MY opinion guys!
Yes he has signed for my team but that does not automatically make him one of my favoured players. If, as a supporter, you must love anyone who wears the shirt there would be no need for message boards. When I first saw Bony last season I thought he looked slow, cumbersome and his first touch was awful, but, credit to him he worked hard and proved to be a decent striker. I hope this keeper works out ok, but I'm sceptical. He hasn't been top drawer otherwise he would have been Arsenals first choice. Just accept that other people aren't one eyed Jacks. "He's a Jack now so he must be brilliant and you must back him" is just so juvenile. Like I said, prove me wrong with clean sheets and I will happily state on here that I was wrong. Anyone out there willing to admit they were wrong if he flops? | | | |
| Defence on 21:47 - Jul 20 with 1345 views | Phil_S |
| Defence on 16:52 - Jul 20 by eastbanker |
A solid dependable goal keeper is essential to an team with any hope of staying in the Premier League. If Vorm wants to go you have to replace him with a player of equal pedigree or better. David Marshall up the M4 would have been worth a cheeky bid or the youngster McCarthy at Reading. Pantilimon did well for Man City and he also went on a free. It just seems that we grabbed this Arsenal stiff quickly because he was on a free transfer without looking at the better options out there feels a bit like an act of desperation. |
Alex McCarthy earns £30k+ a week at Reading and would have cost us several millions
I'm not sure how the goalkeeping signing can be classed as desperation when we considered three viable options and went for who we believe to be the best option.
Let's see him play before we write him off is probably the best way (and before you say you haven't written him off referring to him as Flappyhandski suggests you have done just that!)
This post has been edited by an administrator |  | | |
| Defence on 21:51 - Jul 20 with 1336 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Defence on 21:44 - Jul 20 by eastbanker |
Strong at long passing, thats going to be a massive positive for a team that plays out from the back. If you are no good at saving long shots and have poor reflexes you really shouldn't be playing in goals. Its MY opinion guys!
Yes he has signed for my team but that does not automatically make him one of my favoured players. If, as a supporter, you must love anyone who wears the shirt there would be no need for message boards. When I first saw Bony last season I thought he looked slow, cumbersome and his first touch was awful, but, credit to him he worked hard and proved to be a decent striker. I hope this keeper works out ok, but I'm sceptical. He hasn't been top drawer otherwise he would have been Arsenals first choice. Just accept that other people aren't one eyed Jacks. "He's a Jack now so he must be brilliant and you must back him" is just so juvenile. Like I said, prove me wrong with clean sheets and I will happily state on here that I was wrong. Anyone out there willing to admit they were wrong if he flops? |
I'm not because I'm not saying anything other than why don't we watch him first before slagging him off.
And if you're saying that if someone can't be Arsenal's first choice then they won't be ours, frankly you haven't a clue. Why then would Man City's second choice goalkeeper be good enough for us? Or a goalkeeper (your preference) that can't get in a premier league team be good enough for us.
I am greatly encouraged though by your views on Bony (worked hard to become decent) since you obviously have absolutely no ability whatsoever to judge a good footballer (my opinion of course - I know that you want me to voice it). | | | |
| Defence on 22:09 - Jul 20 with 1306 views | eastbanker |
| Defence on 21:51 - Jul 20 by londonlisa2001 |
I'm not because I'm not saying anything other than why don't we watch him first before slagging him off.
And if you're saying that if someone can't be Arsenal's first choice then they won't be ours, frankly you haven't a clue. Why then would Man City's second choice goalkeeper be good enough for us? Or a goalkeeper (your preference) that can't get in a premier league team be good enough for us.
I am greatly encouraged though by your views on Bony (worked hard to become decent) since you obviously have absolutely no ability whatsoever to judge a good footballer (my opinion of course - I know that you want me to voice it). |
I don't have to justify my ability to spot talent to you my friend. As you rate this guy so highly you must hold a pro-licence or be scouting for a club at the very least. Who mentioned a goal keeper that can't get in a Premier league team not being good enough for us? Earlier in this topic three names were mentioned as examples of goal keepers that we could have considered.
From your comment about Arsenals second choice keeper being good enough for the Swans, surely you would set your sights higher than reserve team football from which to recruit. Or perhaps it was the fact that he was free that makes him such a wonderful acquisition. I will try and make this simple for you, I don't rate Fabianski having seen him play numerous matches for Arsenal. I think that the Swans could have done far better than this guy, even though we might have had to pay for someone. Thats my opinion! now its down to HIM to prove me wrong. If you want to start a debate on how to spot a good footballer or a second rate player, start by slagging off the Arsenal manager and coaches who decided that Szczesny was a much better option than Fabianski. This opinion based on 32 Premier League appearances over seven years. | | | |
| Defence on 22:31 - Jul 20 with 1281 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Defence on 22:09 - Jul 20 by eastbanker |
I don't have to justify my ability to spot talent to you my friend. As you rate this guy so highly you must hold a pro-licence or be scouting for a club at the very least. Who mentioned a goal keeper that can't get in a Premier league team not being good enough for us? Earlier in this topic three names were mentioned as examples of goal keepers that we could have considered.
From your comment about Arsenals second choice keeper being good enough for the Swans, surely you would set your sights higher than reserve team football from which to recruit. Or perhaps it was the fact that he was free that makes him such a wonderful acquisition. I will try and make this simple for you, I don't rate Fabianski having seen him play numerous matches for Arsenal. I think that the Swans could have done far better than this guy, even though we might have had to pay for someone. Thats my opinion! now its down to HIM to prove me wrong. If you want to start a debate on how to spot a good footballer or a second rate player, start by slagging off the Arsenal manager and coaches who decided that Szczesny was a much better option than Fabianski. This opinion based on 32 Premier League appearances over seven years. |
I can't be bothered to argue and so let's just agree to disagree. I have never said he's perfect, just that we should give him a chance and the reports I've heard suggest the Arsenal supporters (since I live in London and have done for 25 years or so, I know many) disagree with you. My assessment after listening to them is that I believe him to be a great replacement for Vorm who I believe was very weak last year . But if you've watched him on the tele then that's fine (and presumably you watched McCarthy on whatever that programme is called that follows MOTD).
And the Arsenal manager & coaches believed him good enough to both offer a big contract to and to play in their most important game for years.
And as a final point - no player has ever signed for the Swans where I start out thinking 'he has to prove me wrong' - but them I am an actual supporter. | | | |
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| Defence on 22:41 - Jul 20 with 1251 views | Daggyjack |
| Defence on 22:09 - Jul 20 by eastbanker |
I don't have to justify my ability to spot talent to you my friend. As you rate this guy so highly you must hold a pro-licence or be scouting for a club at the very least. Who mentioned a goal keeper that can't get in a Premier league team not being good enough for us? Earlier in this topic three names were mentioned as examples of goal keepers that we could have considered.
From your comment about Arsenals second choice keeper being good enough for the Swans, surely you would set your sights higher than reserve team football from which to recruit. Or perhaps it was the fact that he was free that makes him such a wonderful acquisition. I will try and make this simple for you, I don't rate Fabianski having seen him play numerous matches for Arsenal. I think that the Swans could have done far better than this guy, even though we might have had to pay for someone. Thats my opinion! now its down to HIM to prove me wrong. If you want to start a debate on how to spot a good footballer or a second rate player, start by slagging off the Arsenal manager and coaches who decided that Szczesny was a much better option than Fabianski. This opinion based on 32 Premier League appearances over seven years. |
Your "argument" has deteriorated into childish nonsense spouting "pro-licence" and mis-reading other posts to suit your argument.
Long passing is important to us, given the number of times that Vorm had to accurately find a full back with a pass to Rangel or Davies on the flanks.
You ask if the posters on here will come on here IF he fails, well I'm pretty sure you'll be on here at the slightest hint of an error.
Given your previous on Bony and now Fabianski, you sound like a glass half empty kind of guy. Look on the positive and with hope, you'll feel much better. [Post edited 20 Jul 2014 22:45]
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| Defence on 22:55 - Jul 20 with 1234 views | quiff |
For all the love ins Marshall gets, and he is a very good shot stopper, he's pretty poor at organising his box and crosses. Lets give Fabianski a chance shall we! | |
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| Defence on 03:32 - Jul 21 with 1165 views | Wanderer |
I could not give a toss for the stats. That piss poor effort by Vorm against Southamton made me weep. All i want in my goalie is COMMAND YOUR AREA!, bloody Lambert should have been bounced off the post and ended up on the grass looking up at the seagulls in a clear blue sky! |  | | |
| Defence on 08:00 - Jul 21 with 1120 views | eastbanker |
| Defence on 22:31 - Jul 20 by londonlisa2001 |
I can't be bothered to argue and so let's just agree to disagree. I have never said he's perfect, just that we should give him a chance and the reports I've heard suggest the Arsenal supporters (since I live in London and have done for 25 years or so, I know many) disagree with you. My assessment after listening to them is that I believe him to be a great replacement for Vorm who I believe was very weak last year . But if you've watched him on the tele then that's fine (and presumably you watched McCarthy on whatever that programme is called that follows MOTD).
And the Arsenal manager & coaches believed him good enough to both offer a big contract to and to play in their most important game for years.
And as a final point - no player has ever signed for the Swans where I start out thinking 'he has to prove me wrong' - but them I am an actual supporter. |
So you are a supporter then because you blindly accept every signing as being better than the player he is to replace. I'm not a supporter then because I question the quality of signings. Priceless! | | | |
| Defence on 08:41 - Jul 21 with 1100 views | JackSomething |
Anyone who clings to the notion that Bony wasn't very good early last season can safely be ignored.
He certainly improved in the second half, but many of us were vocal about how good he looked straightaway. His composed finish off the bench against United and his salmon-like leap to score against Malmo were pretty clear evidence to me that he had the talent, but it seems some weren't willing to change their mind until they had no choice. |  |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Defence on 08:48 - Jul 21 with 1092 views | Phil_S |
| Defence on 08:00 - Jul 21 by eastbanker |
So you are a supporter then because you blindly accept every signing as being better than the player he is to replace. I'm not a supporter then because I question the quality of signings. Priceless! |
I think the point she is making is more she is prepared to give people a chance rather than blindly writing them off | | | |
| Defence on 08:57 - Jul 21 with 1069 views | Big_Phil |
| Defence on 08:48 - Jul 21 by Phil_S |
I think the point she is making is more she is prepared to give people a chance rather than blindly writing them off |
Couldn't agree more Phil. Some of our 'supporters' baffle me...... |  | | |
| Defence on 09:09 - Jul 21 with 1056 views | CTB184 |
Just to add to this forum on a slightly different note, what do people think of Jay Fulton covering for Leon? Leon obviously won't be around forever and I think that under his guidance, Jay could be a good replacement sitting in front of the defence. Seemed to have a good start with the club and I was quite impressed and liked the potential I saw. Having played in the Scottish league, I'm sure he'll have no problems getting stuck in with defensive challenges. Anybody else agree or have a difference opinion?
As for defensive frailaties, IMHO I think Amat will become a great CB and could easily step in for Chico/Ash. Needs a bit of work but is he young. We could do with a decent back up LB to Taylor (who I think is just as good, if not better, than Davies) and a better replacement for Angel. |  |
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| Defence on 09:15 - Jul 21 with 1042 views | JackSomething |
| Defence on 09:09 - Jul 21 by CTB184 |
Just to add to this forum on a slightly different note, what do people think of Jay Fulton covering for Leon? Leon obviously won't be around forever and I think that under his guidance, Jay could be a good replacement sitting in front of the defence. Seemed to have a good start with the club and I was quite impressed and liked the potential I saw. Having played in the Scottish league, I'm sure he'll have no problems getting stuck in with defensive challenges. Anybody else agree or have a difference opinion?
As for defensive frailaties, IMHO I think Amat will become a great CB and could easily step in for Chico/Ash. Needs a bit of work but is he young. We could do with a decent back up LB to Taylor (who I think is just as good, if not better, than Davies) and a better replacement for Angel. |
It looks like Monk certainly sees Fulton as part of the first-team squad. Shame he's injured and missing pre-season. If he develops into Britton's long-term replacement then great. In an ideal world, we'd have a stop-gap signing coming in now to spell Leon, but with the amount of players we need, perhaps it's a Ben like situation and we have to throw him in.
We definitely need some more bodies in the middle of the park though. Especially if Ki leaves as well. | |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Defence on 12:14 - Jul 21 with 988 views | eastbanker |
| Defence on 08:48 - Jul 21 by Phil_S |
I think the point she is making is more she is prepared to give people a chance rather than blindly writing them off |
How can you accuse me of "blindly writing him off" when I have clearly stated that Ive seen him play for Arsenal on numerous occasions. My opinion is based on past performances and I don't understand how people believe that signing for the Swans is going to improve a players ability. I would concede that the argument that form is temporary whilst class is permanent could apply to certain individuals, however, Fabianski has played 89 matches in all competitions over seven seasons at the Gunners. The fact that he has never nailed down a starting place for more than a handful of matches surely points to a lack of class not a temporary loss of form. | | | |
| Defence on 12:21 - Jul 21 with 974 views | JackSomething |
| Defence on 12:14 - Jul 21 by eastbanker |
How can you accuse me of "blindly writing him off" when I have clearly stated that Ive seen him play for Arsenal on numerous occasions. My opinion is based on past performances and I don't understand how people believe that signing for the Swans is going to improve a players ability. I would concede that the argument that form is temporary whilst class is permanent could apply to certain individuals, however, Fabianski has played 89 matches in all competitions over seven seasons at the Gunners. The fact that he has never nailed down a starting place for more than a handful of matches surely points to a lack of class not a temporary loss of form. |
Maybe because there is a strong history of players playing better for one club than they played for another?
It's not as if the likes of Routledge or Shelvey were pulling up trees when they joined us. Also plenty of examples of players who do far better away from the pressure of being at a big club.
I'm not saying you're wrong about Fabianski, but by not waiting to see how he does for us, you are writing him off prematurely, blindly or not. | |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Defence on 12:24 - Jul 21 with 966 views | raynor94 |
| Defence on 12:14 - Jul 21 by eastbanker |
How can you accuse me of "blindly writing him off" when I have clearly stated that Ive seen him play for Arsenal on numerous occasions. My opinion is based on past performances and I don't understand how people believe that signing for the Swans is going to improve a players ability. I would concede that the argument that form is temporary whilst class is permanent could apply to certain individuals, however, Fabianski has played 89 matches in all competitions over seven seasons at the Gunners. The fact that he has never nailed down a starting place for more than a handful of matches surely points to a lack of class not a temporary loss of form. |
Ok, let's cut to the chase, who in your expert opinion would you have signed? oh and how did you happen to see so many of Fabianskis 89 appearances? |  |
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| Defence on 12:26 - Jul 21 with 964 views | Tom1912 |
| Defence on 12:14 - Jul 21 by eastbanker |
How can you accuse me of "blindly writing him off" when I have clearly stated that Ive seen him play for Arsenal on numerous occasions. My opinion is based on past performances and I don't understand how people believe that signing for the Swans is going to improve a players ability. I would concede that the argument that form is temporary whilst class is permanent could apply to certain individuals, however, Fabianski has played 89 matches in all competitions over seven seasons at the Gunners. The fact that he has never nailed down a starting place for more than a handful of matches surely points to a lack of class not a temporary loss of form. |
For one, goalkeepers tend to do much better when they are playing consistently. Look at someone like Casillas, who did not play regurlarly in La Liga last season and went into the World Cup and struggled. Playing week in week out for us will hopefully mean we see the best of him.
The fact that he never nailed down a starting place at Arsenal doesn't mean he lacks the ability to play for us either. | | | |
| Defence on 13:38 - Jul 21 with 927 views | Phil_S |
| Defence on 12:14 - Jul 21 by eastbanker |
How can you accuse me of "blindly writing him off" when I have clearly stated that Ive seen him play for Arsenal on numerous occasions. My opinion is based on past performances and I don't understand how people believe that signing for the Swans is going to improve a players ability. I would concede that the argument that form is temporary whilst class is permanent could apply to certain individuals, however, Fabianski has played 89 matches in all competitions over seven seasons at the Gunners. The fact that he has never nailed down a starting place for more than a handful of matches surely points to a lack of class not a temporary loss of form. |
How many of the 89 games have you watched to lead you to your 'Flappyhandski' comments
You have written him off before watching his performances whether you want that to be blind or not is your call
And do you know how many those that believe he is a better keeper than Vorm have watched as you accused them of blind faith?
This post has been edited by an administrator | | | |
| Defence on 13:41 - Jul 21 with 920 views | Dr_Winston |
| Defence on 08:41 - Jul 21 by JackSomething |
Anyone who clings to the notion that Bony wasn't very good early last season can safely be ignored.
He certainly improved in the second half, but many of us were vocal about how good he looked straightaway. His composed finish off the bench against United and his salmon-like leap to score against Malmo were pretty clear evidence to me that he had the talent, but it seems some weren't willing to change their mind until they had no choice. |
Odd how his performances improved once he was given consistent game time innit?
Anyone would think that we should have done it sooner. Y'know. Before Michu got injured and Laudrup had no choice but to. |  |
| Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair, or f*cking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. |
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| Defence on 13:46 - Jul 21 with 904 views | JackSomething |
| Defence on 13:41 - Jul 21 by Dr_Winston |
Odd how his performances improved once he was given consistent game time innit?
Anyone would think that we should have done it sooner. Y'know. Before Michu got injured and Laudrup had no choice but to. |
Exactafookingmundo. | |
| You know, Hobbes, some days even my lucky rocket ship underpants don't help. |
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| Defence on 14:23 - Jul 21 with 871 views | eastbanker |
| Defence on 12:24 - Jul 21 by raynor94 |
Ok, let's cut to the chase, who in your expert opinion would you have signed? oh and how did you happen to see so many of Fabianskis 89 appearances? |
Ive got a TV and a sky dish | | | |
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