| Reality check people 23:55 - Sep 18 with 11987 views | QPR1506 |
We're top of the league, unbeaten in the league, not conceded a goal for 5 games. Agree we need some help for Austin but I'm sure we all would have taken this at the beginning of the season. |  |
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| Reality check people on 12:14 - Sep 19 with 2380 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Reality check people on 11:41 - Sep 19 by adhoc_qpr |
Austin came to us with a reputation of a clinical and prolific goal scorer - and although we're a pretty rank team going forwards he has missed 1 or 2 good chances every game.
That's including playing as a lone striker, with AJ and with Zamora.
Not trying to get on the guys back, but he isn't living up to his billing for me, despite actually impressing me with his all round work rate and team play. |
Yeh, I was disappointed last night, too. He could have, and probably should have, won the game for us.
But he was trying (and not totally embarrassing himself), and he has been, tbf, somewhat out of form. His worst fault is that we have to play him, because there is no alternative.
He needs support. Even better, stick him on the bench and let him fight for a place with a determined 20 minutes. But we can't do either of those without more strikers. |  |
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| Reality check people on 12:24 - Sep 19 with 2363 views | RblockPrior |
| Reality check people on 02:47 - Sep 19 by SonofNorfolt |
Definitely not.
Some of his choices are strange, certainly against Brum, and tonight, when surely Faurlin was the man who could have at least tried to thread a clever pass through ahead of others who ended up on the pitch? |
I do love Faurlin but to suggest he shld of played last night is a lil crazy and ppl need to stop hanging on to the past |  |
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| Reality check people on 12:36 - Sep 19 with 2342 views | baz_qpr |
| Reality check people on 12:14 - Sep 19 by isawqpratwcity |
Yeh, I was disappointed last night, too. He could have, and probably should have, won the game for us.
But he was trying (and not totally embarrassing himself), and he has been, tbf, somewhat out of form. His worst fault is that we have to play him, because there is no alternative.
He needs support. Even better, stick him on the bench and let him fight for a place with a determined 20 minutes. But we can't do either of those without more strikers. |
Andy Cole needed 4 chances to score 1, only the best strikers take every chance they can get.
7 goals in 7 games and its not down to missing chances its down to not creating enough. Austin had one decent chance from a header, and was offside. The wingers failed to beat their men, Everytime one of the front 4 received the ball with back to goal the ball went backwards, and Barton played far too deep and failed to deliver a single incisive pass, in fact the only defence splitting pass came from Henry of all people in the first half. If we are going to play 4-2-3-1 we need to learn how to pass in front of the intended recipient or that recipient needs to be able to turn and beat their man. Also Faurlin is far more suited to the deep lying playmaker role than Barton |  | | |
| Reality check people on 12:46 - Sep 19 with 2334 views | RblockPrior |
| Reality check people on 12:36 - Sep 19 by baz_qpr |
Andy Cole needed 4 chances to score 1, only the best strikers take every chance they can get.
7 goals in 7 games and its not down to missing chances its down to not creating enough. Austin had one decent chance from a header, and was offside. The wingers failed to beat their men, Everytime one of the front 4 received the ball with back to goal the ball went backwards, and Barton played far too deep and failed to deliver a single incisive pass, in fact the only defence splitting pass came from Henry of all people in the first half. If we are going to play 4-2-3-1 we need to learn how to pass in front of the intended recipient or that recipient needs to be able to turn and beat their man. Also Faurlin is far more suited to the deep lying playmaker role than Barton |
failed to deliver a incisive pass?  he played a few, the main one a 40 yard ball over the top to Phillips whos first touch took him back | |
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| Reality check people on 13:05 - Sep 19 with 2324 views | gjc104 |
Its an interesting point re Austin, it hasnt happened for him yet, but he is not getting the service.
Having said that, not sure on Saturday his hold up play was any better than Zamora's, yet certain individuals are quick to jump on Bobby's back yet say nothing when it's Austin doing the same thing.
I thought that once Charlie got his 1st eague goal he would go on a run...not on last night's evidence! |  | | |
| Reality check people on 13:07 - Sep 19 with 2313 views | baz_qpr |
It wasn't an incisive pass was it then, it was a long diagonal punt that phillips had to bring down and control, rather than a cutting through ball that split the defence | | | |
| Reality check people on 13:11 - Sep 19 with 2306 views | PinnerPaul |
| Reality check people on 09:57 - Sep 19 by isawqpratwcity |
Thanks for the observation. It's difficult to point out on this site that we are not playing well and our squad has some serious problems without being slapped with a league table and the label of malcontent.
Well at least Harry is now agreeing with what some of us have been saying since early August. |
That's ignoring the fact that Harry has been saying ' We can play better & we need to strengthen in certain areas" in every press conference since August! | | | |
| Reality check people on 13:12 - Sep 19 with 2306 views | QPunkR |
| Reality check people on 13:07 - Sep 19 by baz_qpr |
It wasn't an incisive pass was it then, it was a long diagonal punt that phillips had to bring down and control, rather than a cutting through ball that split the defence |
Yep, there's a distinction twixt the two |  |
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| Reality check people on 13:15 - Sep 19 with 2304 views | PinnerPaul |
| Reality check people on 10:45 - Sep 19 by isawqpratwcity |
You're missing his point, Blob. he isn't comparing Harry to Houston. Quite the contrary, he is pointing out that being top after a handful of games is no guarantee that there aren't serious problems. |
I think using phrases like "serious problems" given what REAL serious problems on & off the pitch there have been in the past is what angers people.
If we, sitting where we are, with the points we have, have "serious problems", where does that leave the other 23 clubs?! | | | |
| Reality check people on 13:17 - Sep 19 with 2297 views | PinnerPaul |
| Reality check people on 11:20 - Sep 19 by isawqpratwcity |
Who's being pessimistic? I'm not saying that the wheels are going to fall off. What I am saying is that our current position owes a sh*tload more to luck than it should, but we can change that by addressing several, arguably self-evident points.
And none of the recesses of my brain are anything but dark. |
No it doesn't.
We were maybe "lucky" to get the 3 pts v Birmingham, but what other games so far have we "deserved" to lose and therefore can be classed as being "lucky" in?
We have Johnson, Hoilett, Zamora, Onuha, Karnjcar all injured - that's not very "lucky" for a start! | | | |
| Reality check people on 13:22 - Sep 19 with 2291 views | PinnerPaul |
| Reality check people on 12:36 - Sep 19 by baz_qpr |
Andy Cole needed 4 chances to score 1, only the best strikers take every chance they can get.
7 goals in 7 games and its not down to missing chances its down to not creating enough. Austin had one decent chance from a header, and was offside. The wingers failed to beat their men, Everytime one of the front 4 received the ball with back to goal the ball went backwards, and Barton played far too deep and failed to deliver a single incisive pass, in fact the only defence splitting pass came from Henry of all people in the first half. If we are going to play 4-2-3-1 we need to learn how to pass in front of the intended recipient or that recipient needs to be able to turn and beat their man. Also Faurlin is far more suited to the deep lying playmaker role than Barton |
Incredible post!
I saw at least 3 x 50 yd plus passes from Barton who was near enough MOTM for me
This thread is amazing.
Can't wait to see what you come up with if we actually lose a game! | | | |
| Reality check people on 13:56 - Sep 19 with 2265 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Reality check people on 13:17 - Sep 19 by PinnerPaul |
No it doesn't.
We were maybe "lucky" to get the 3 pts v Birmingham, but what other games so far have we "deserved" to lose and therefore can be classed as being "lucky" in?
We have Johnson, Hoilett, Zamora, Onuha, Karnjcar all injured - that's not very "lucky" for a start! |
Who said anything about 'deserved to lose'? If the difference between 'deserved to lose' and 'lucky to win' is beyond you, then please f*ck off.
Yes, those injuries aren't 'lucky'. Three of the five are long term/repetitive. One hasn't even fronted up once. | |
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| Reality check people on 14:01 - Sep 19 with 2264 views | Antti_Heinola |
| Reality check people on 13:22 - Sep 19 by PinnerPaul |
Incredible post!
I saw at least 3 x 50 yd plus passes from Barton who was near enough MOTM for me
This thread is amazing.
Can't wait to see what you come up with if we actually lose a game! |
I don't agree with everything on these threads, but to suggest, as you seem to, that as long as we're winning we should all be happy and never make any critiques of the team, players, management or tactics is a bit silly. I go to football to be entertained. I'm very pleased we're winning, very pleased with the defence, but generally bored by our lack of invention and adventure. Sorry if that upsets you - but I think most people are the same. |  |
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| Reality check people on 14:03 - Sep 19 with 2259 views | Hunterhoop |
In simple terms the status quo is this:
We're strong defensively.
We've got good forwards but we're one light. Austin will be fine. His all round play is very good.
We have lots of midfielders but at present the passing of ALL those playing is woeful, absolutely woeful.
Barton is a case in point. He does lots of good things: the odd hollywood ball that comes off, tracking midfield runners, covering the ground, winning the ball, good set pieces, etc....but I would love to see the stats on his passing because he gives the ball away all the bloody time! His passing is dreadful. Sometimes it's bad decisions, e.g. trying to play the killer pass straight away when it's not quite on, other times it's simply wayward passing under no pressure.
Jenas came on and lost possession 3 times out of his first 5 touches!
O'Neill's final ball in the final third was lacking.
Henry, who I actually think passed the ball better than anyone last night, tends to play it safe and is never going to take the game by the scruff of the nexk, a la Gerrard, with his defence splitting passing.
Carrol, on the evidence of the Brum game only plays the safe pass (back to Nedum Onouha!) and rarely plays forward.
The other problem with the above is that ALL of them take too many touches on the ball. The time it takes to receive the ball and then shift it on to a teammate takes too long. That is crux of our problem, it slows us down when we attack. And when combined with our passing inaccuracy means we just can't string decent attacks together.
Our midfield is crying out for a sitting midfielder who can pass and can move the ball on quickly (1 or 2 touches per time, not 4 or 5).
For all his faults, the player best equipped for this based on stats, history and how he played in his one league appearance is Ale Faurlin.
If we're going to replicate the Warnock system (4-2-3-1), with Krancjar in the Adel role in the middle of the '3', then we may as well give him a passer behind him, who can give him the ball in the right parts of the pitch to hurt other sides. Then you play a "piano carrier", a la Derry, alongside Ale. At present, we are playing 3 piano carriers, all working hard and trying and running but just not moving the ball quickly enough or accurately enough for us to outplay Championship sides.
My ideal team and shape:
Green
Simpson Onouha Dunne BAE
Faurlin Barton
O'Neill/SWP Krancjar M Phillips
Austin
Henry and Carrol as reserves for Faurlin and Barton (who remember played really well together in the Prem and Barton loves Ale - said loads of positive things about him whilst with us).
I think that side would tear the league up, I really do. |  | | |
| Reality check people on 14:19 - Sep 19 with 2247 views | Jeff |
| Reality check people on 14:03 - Sep 19 by Hunterhoop |
In simple terms the status quo is this:
We're strong defensively.
We've got good forwards but we're one light. Austin will be fine. His all round play is very good.
We have lots of midfielders but at present the passing of ALL those playing is woeful, absolutely woeful.
Barton is a case in point. He does lots of good things: the odd hollywood ball that comes off, tracking midfield runners, covering the ground, winning the ball, good set pieces, etc....but I would love to see the stats on his passing because he gives the ball away all the bloody time! His passing is dreadful. Sometimes it's bad decisions, e.g. trying to play the killer pass straight away when it's not quite on, other times it's simply wayward passing under no pressure.
Jenas came on and lost possession 3 times out of his first 5 touches!
O'Neill's final ball in the final third was lacking.
Henry, who I actually think passed the ball better than anyone last night, tends to play it safe and is never going to take the game by the scruff of the nexk, a la Gerrard, with his defence splitting passing.
Carrol, on the evidence of the Brum game only plays the safe pass (back to Nedum Onouha!) and rarely plays forward.
The other problem with the above is that ALL of them take too many touches on the ball. The time it takes to receive the ball and then shift it on to a teammate takes too long. That is crux of our problem, it slows us down when we attack. And when combined with our passing inaccuracy means we just can't string decent attacks together.
Our midfield is crying out for a sitting midfielder who can pass and can move the ball on quickly (1 or 2 touches per time, not 4 or 5).
For all his faults, the player best equipped for this based on stats, history and how he played in his one league appearance is Ale Faurlin.
If we're going to replicate the Warnock system (4-2-3-1), with Krancjar in the Adel role in the middle of the '3', then we may as well give him a passer behind him, who can give him the ball in the right parts of the pitch to hurt other sides. Then you play a "piano carrier", a la Derry, alongside Ale. At present, we are playing 3 piano carriers, all working hard and trying and running but just not moving the ball quickly enough or accurately enough for us to outplay Championship sides.
My ideal team and shape:
Green
Simpson Onouha Dunne BAE
Faurlin Barton
O'Neill/SWP Krancjar M Phillips
Austin
Henry and Carrol as reserves for Faurlin and Barton (who remember played really well together in the Prem and Barton loves Ale - said loads of positive things about him whilst with us).
I think that side would tear the league up, I really do. |
Hoilett for ONeill/SWP, and you've got yourself a deal... |  |
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| Reality check people on 14:24 - Sep 19 with 1955 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Reality check people on 14:03 - Sep 19 by Hunterhoop |
In simple terms the status quo is this:
We're strong defensively.
We've got good forwards but we're one light. Austin will be fine. His all round play is very good.
We have lots of midfielders but at present the passing of ALL those playing is woeful, absolutely woeful.
Barton is a case in point. He does lots of good things: the odd hollywood ball that comes off, tracking midfield runners, covering the ground, winning the ball, good set pieces, etc....but I would love to see the stats on his passing because he gives the ball away all the bloody time! His passing is dreadful. Sometimes it's bad decisions, e.g. trying to play the killer pass straight away when it's not quite on, other times it's simply wayward passing under no pressure.
Jenas came on and lost possession 3 times out of his first 5 touches!
O'Neill's final ball in the final third was lacking.
Henry, who I actually think passed the ball better than anyone last night, tends to play it safe and is never going to take the game by the scruff of the nexk, a la Gerrard, with his defence splitting passing.
Carrol, on the evidence of the Brum game only plays the safe pass (back to Nedum Onouha!) and rarely plays forward.
The other problem with the above is that ALL of them take too many touches on the ball. The time it takes to receive the ball and then shift it on to a teammate takes too long. That is crux of our problem, it slows us down when we attack. And when combined with our passing inaccuracy means we just can't string decent attacks together.
Our midfield is crying out for a sitting midfielder who can pass and can move the ball on quickly (1 or 2 touches per time, not 4 or 5).
For all his faults, the player best equipped for this based on stats, history and how he played in his one league appearance is Ale Faurlin.
If we're going to replicate the Warnock system (4-2-3-1), with Krancjar in the Adel role in the middle of the '3', then we may as well give him a passer behind him, who can give him the ball in the right parts of the pitch to hurt other sides. Then you play a "piano carrier", a la Derry, alongside Ale. At present, we are playing 3 piano carriers, all working hard and trying and running but just not moving the ball quickly enough or accurately enough for us to outplay Championship sides.
My ideal team and shape:
Green
Simpson Onouha Dunne BAE
Faurlin Barton
O'Neill/SWP Krancjar M Phillips
Austin
Henry and Carrol as reserves for Faurlin and Barton (who remember played really well together in the Prem and Barton loves Ale - said loads of positive things about him whilst with us).
I think that side would tear the league up, I really do. |
Just to take my particlular bugbear: "We've got good forwards but we're one light."
That is of when? Do we discount Shafrin (0 goals)? Do we discount Hitchcock (1 goal)? Do we discount Johnson? By any reasonable evaluation, crocked. Do we discount Zamora? By any reasonable evaluation, double crocked.
So we are left with Austin. He is off form and not scoring like you'd expect.
Worse,he's playing alone up front and attracting heavy opposition.
This is the best area for harry to address, but we're still waiting. | |
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| Reality check people on 16:06 - Sep 19 with 1927 views | Hunterhoop |
What I meant was Austin and Johnson are very good forwards for this level but we need another one. In a 4-2-3-1 system I think 3 good forwards with Hitchcock and Sharrif behind is enough. Johnson looked great earlier. Now he's out, but no one has said anything about it being for months.
And Jeff, yes, inexplicably forgot Hoilett. He would definitely start on that side and then we'd win the league by +10 points. Convinced of it, from what I've seen so far in this league - every game that is. | | | |
| Reality check people on 16:16 - Sep 19 with 1923 views | baz_qpr |
I saw at least 3 50 yard passes from Clint hill that reached a QPR player, they weren't incisive. and I am sure Barton may well have stood out as MOTM for you, because it was the Joey Barton show, but my point was it was ineffective where as quick one touch team play in the middle of the park would be. (as it was for the disallowed goal) I think Barton has been excellent so far this season, but last night particularly second half we saw a lot more of the Barton of 11/12 who had to be the "main man" in detriment to the team and he was guilty of slowing down play, picking the ball of the back four in their line and others were guilty of playing the ball back to him in the centre circle where a quicker pass to a runner further forward would have been more effective. | | | |
| Reality check people on 16:24 - Sep 19 with 1914 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Reality check people on 16:06 - Sep 19 by Hunterhoop |
What I meant was Austin and Johnson are very good forwards for this level but we need another one. In a 4-2-3-1 system I think 3 good forwards with Hitchcock and Sharrif behind is enough. Johnson looked great earlier. Now he's out, but no one has said anything about it being for months.
And Jeff, yes, inexplicably forgot Hoilett. He would definitely start on that side and then we'd win the league by +10 points. Convinced of it, from what I've seen so far in this league - every game that is. |
You can't seriously take Hitch and Shariff into account? They are late subs at best.
FFS, we need a striker up supporting Austin (and, for form or injury' sake) that means two.
We cannot depend on Johnson or Zamora. | |
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| Reality check people on 16:47 - Sep 19 with 1902 views | PinnerPaul |
| Reality check people on 13:56 - Sep 19 by isawqpratwcity |
Who said anything about 'deserved to lose'? If the difference between 'deserved to lose' and 'lucky to win' is beyond you, then please f*ck off.
Yes, those injuries aren't 'lucky'. Three of the five are long term/repetitive. One hasn't even fronted up once. |
Always good to engage in rational debate.
You said our wins were down to a "s***load" of luck.
That's saying we're "lucky" in anyone s language
Happy to debate but if you want to use a clever swear word again - go ahead. | | | |
| Reality check people on 16:50 - Sep 19 with 1899 views | PinnerPaul |
| Reality check people on 14:01 - Sep 19 by Antti_Heinola |
I don't agree with everything on these threads, but to suggest, as you seem to, that as long as we're winning we should all be happy and never make any critiques of the team, players, management or tactics is a bit silly. I go to football to be entertained. I'm very pleased we're winning, very pleased with the defence, but generally bored by our lack of invention and adventure. Sorry if that upsets you - but I think most people are the same. |
No I accept that, but to try and make an argument fit by just making things up - eg Barton never made a pass all night - is ridiculous.
Before I upset anyone else, I'm not accusing YOU of making up "facts" but some on here are! | | | |
| Reality check people on 17:02 - Sep 19 with 1885 views | simmo |
| Reality check people on 14:19 - Sep 19 by Jeff |
Hoilett for ONeill/SWP, and you've got yourself a deal... |
Exactly what I was going to say, agree completely with Hunter. Hoilett even said himself at the beginning of the season that a lot of his good form had been down to Ale giving him the ball in the right areas. People with intelligent movement like Kranjcar and from what I saw last night Phillips will thrive off Faurlin's passes. Barton can pick a ball too and also seems to really rate Faurlin personally so for me this is the best possible CM 2, especially at home. |  |
| ask Beavis I get nothing Butthead |
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| Reality check people on 17:45 - Sep 19 with 1875 views | isawqpratwcity |
| Reality check people on 16:47 - Sep 19 by PinnerPaul |
Always good to engage in rational debate.
You said our wins were down to a "s***load" of luck.
That's saying we're "lucky" in anyone s language
Happy to debate but if you want to use a clever swear word again - go ahead. |
Happy to engage in rational debate.
And your argument is? | |
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| Reality check people on 17:58 - Sep 19 with 1869 views | Hunterhoop |
| Reality check people on 16:24 - Sep 19 by isawqpratwcity |
You can't seriously take Hitch and Shariff into account? They are late subs at best.
FFS, we need a striker up supporting Austin (and, for form or injury' sake) that means two.
We cannot depend on Johnson or Zamora. |
Mate, take some time to think about what I'm saying.
"Shariff and Hitchcock behind" meant as back ups to 3 main forwards in the squad. I wasn't suggesting they start! Did you not see the team I suggested?! In a 4-2-3-1 you only need 3 decent out and out forwards. We have Austin and Johnson and we need another. That's my view.
I do not agree 4-4-2 is the solution though.
The system we came up with, with Niko instead of Adel, Faurlin and Barton instead of Derry will p*ss all over sides. Add Hoilett, M Phillips to the wings, with O'Niel and SWP in reserve and it's a great team and shape.
4-4-2 does not play to our strengths, means we will be outnumbered in midfield and as a result have to play more direct, which doesn't suit Austin or Johnson.
That's my view - think it's pretty logical and I've explained it at length. | | | |
| Reality check people on 09:21 - Sep 20 with 1826 views | PinnerPaul |
| Reality check people on 17:45 - Sep 19 by isawqpratwcity |
Happy to engage in rational debate.
And your argument is? |
OK, lets try again.
You said where we were was down to luck.
Apart from Birmingham, I really can't see how we can said to have been lucky in any of the other games. | | | |
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