| Net Migration 09:44 - May 21 with 6022 views | CountyJim |
Worst for ten years !! Really doing a cracking job the tories ffs [Post edited 21 May 2015 9:44]
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| Net Migration on 15:10 - May 22 with 1458 views | Flashberryjack |
| Net Migration on 14:26 - May 22 by londonlisa2001 |
Your assumption that they must either be coming to take British jobs or go on the dole is fundamentally missing the point.
You are not considering the mismatch between where the jobs are and what type of jobs they are and where the unemployment is.
For example - I can't remember the last time I went to a restaurant / pub where I wasn't served by an immigrant - usually an Eastern European. London service jobs have a massive number of immigrants filling them. Same in supermarkets, shops, cinemas etc etc. Exactly the same in the NHS up here - a huge number of people that work in hospitals, whether as porters, cleaners, nurses, doctors, are immigrants.
The issue is that unemployment doesn't really exist here. Anyone that wants a job and is able to work can do so. Shops / supermarkets etc. almost always have signs up saying they need staff. So those are the jobs that the immigrants are taking. There aren't 'British' people that are not taking them - they aren't around and available to do that type of work (or they don't want to).
So the immigrants aren't taking away jobs or signing on - they are filling jobs that need filling. Doesn't help the unemployed in Merthyr of course. And they will say "but why should I move, away from my family, home, to get work?". Well, of course, that's exactly what those immigrants are doing - they are moving to where the work exists.
What we actually need to do is look at ways of moving jobs around the country to where there are people that need work.
I find it interesting that in areas where there actually is high immigration (here in London for example) people are far less 'anti immigration' than a lot seem to be in Swansea (as an example). And yet Swansea has sod all immigration - it's just a convenient excuse.
And the parents of those children should damn well be ashamed. |
With respect Lisa.....this country can not possibly cope with the amount of imigration that we have seen over the last few years.
Whether they actually take british jobs is a matter of opinion, dependant if your job or working conditions could be affected by immigration.
As far as unemployed people moving away from Merthyr to work in a shop in London because that's what immigrants have done, well maybe people from Merthyr want to live in the community they were brought up in. Or Perhaps they should purchase a bike just like Mr Tebbit suggested a while Back. |  |
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| Net Migration on 15:24 - May 22 with 1444 views | CountyJim |
My point is the Tories have all along promised to get the numbers down and yet have failed to do five years in power and now a second term
More Tory lies | | | |
| Net Migration on 15:47 - May 22 with 1430 views | swan65split |
No Immigration in Swansea?!!!!...........I think not! |  | | |
| Net Migration on 15:50 - May 22 with 1419 views | LeonisGod |
| Net Migration on 15:24 - May 22 by CountyJim |
My point is the Tories have all along promised to get the numbers down and yet have failed to do five years in power and now a second term
More Tory lies |
Well yes, but it was obvious that was an unachievable promise. Roughly 50% of immigration, that coming from the EU, they have virtually no control over. Immigration wasn't a big issue in the election though, so I still think it's pretty far down the list of people's concerns. |  | | |
| Net Migration on 15:51 - May 22 with 1418 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Net Migration on 15:10 - May 22 by Flashberryjack |
With respect Lisa.....this country can not possibly cope with the amount of imigration that we have seen over the last few years.
Whether they actually take british jobs is a matter of opinion, dependant if your job or working conditions could be affected by immigration.
As far as unemployed people moving away from Merthyr to work in a shop in London because that's what immigrants have done, well maybe people from Merthyr want to live in the community they were brought up in. Or Perhaps they should purchase a bike just like Mr Tebbit suggested a while Back. |
with respect back though, you can't say that without also taking into account the death rate, life expectancy, birth rate and changing numbers of people of working age in the country as well.
For example, if the demographics of the existing 'British' population mean that each year, because of the post war baby boom and subsequent fall in birth rates mean that there are 300,000 less people of working age available amongst that population, and 300,000 more people retired, then you have to find those workers from somewhere, otherwise the whole notion of the welfare system (where existing workers pay for the benefits of other people of working age and retirees as well) falls apart. The net migration figure on its own is not enough to judge one way or another whether it is the correct level.
And I am well aware that people may not want to move away from their community - but that is, after all, what the immigrants are doing. They don't want to leave their communities either but they are prepared to move to the jobs and the unemployed in this country are not as prepared to do so. Why shouldn't people have to move for work? I had to. The ancestors of the people in Merthyr did - the reason that there are so many people in the Welsh Valleys is exactly for that reason - people moved there to work in coal and the jobs that came along with that - if they hadn't done so, those areas would have the same population density as other rural agricultural places. The whole of the industrial revolution saw people move to where the work is.
As I said, we have to move jobs and opportunities around the country, otherwise you end up with an even more extreme case of what we have now - wealthy areas with virtually no unemployment which need immigration to fill jobs and other more deprived areas with significant unemployment and the result of that is that some areas become ridiculously overcrowded, house prices soar, and infrastructure fails. But the immigrants are not going to the areas without employment, so they are not the reason that the people are unemployed - it's just that populist media portray it that way and set people against each other.
Tebbit should have been more careful in what he said, and lacked sensitivity but it wasn't completely untrue - the whole recent history of population movement has been people moving to work and areas of opportunity. |  | | |
| Net Migration on 15:58 - May 22 with 1413 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Net Migration on 15:47 - May 22 by swan65split |
No Immigration in Swansea?!!!!...........I think not! |
There is very little immigration in Swansea compared to the UK as a whole.
That is the case for people from different ethnic backgrounds and also people from 'other' white backgrounds. | | | |
| Net Migration on 16:12 - May 22 with 1395 views | Lohengrin |
| Net Migration on 15:58 - May 22 by londonlisa2001 |
There is very little immigration in Swansea compared to the UK as a whole.
That is the case for people from different ethnic backgrounds and also people from 'other' white backgrounds. |
A marked change is very noticeable here, Lisa. |  |
| An idea isn't responsible for those who believe in it. |
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| Net Migration on 16:38 - May 22 with 1372 views | ScoobyWho |
| Net Migration on 16:12 - May 22 by Lohengrin |
A marked change is very noticeable here, Lisa. |
My old man used to complain about all the Italians and their bloody cafes when I was a kid. |  |
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| Net Migration on 16:52 - May 22 with 1365 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Net Migration on 16:12 - May 22 by Lohengrin |
A marked change is very noticeable here, Lisa. |
I understand that it seems marked Loh, but that's only because the starting point was virtually non existent.
When I was in Olchfa, there were over 1200 kids in school. There was one black girl whose father taught in the university, one mixed race boy whose father was also in the university and one family (sister and two brothers) from Sri Lanka - their Dad was a vet, and the sister, Shamini, was a good friend of mine, and her two brothers, Raj and Shashi both played in the West Glam brass band with me. There were also some Chinese kids whose parents had the takeaway in Sketty, one of whom played rugby at Dunvant as a kid. That was pretty much it (I'm sure there must have been a handful of others, but they were the only ones of my sort of age). For years, if you saw a black person down the Swans, they were usually a player.
Now, of course, things have changed hugely since then, but if you look at the latest census, it breaks down the population of Wales as a whole and Swansea itself into various ethnic backgrounds, and it is genuinely tiny compared to other UK cities.
Wales per the 2011 census is over 93% White British (including Irish). Now that is lower than it was ten years earlier when it was 96%, but is incredibly low (lower than any English region). The other interesting part of the census is that the Welsh population is ageing (18% are of pensionable age). Someone has to support those pensioners and the only growth in the Welsh population is immigration (they include movement from other parts of Britain in that but over 90% of the total increase in Welsh population in that 10 years, which was only 153,000 anyway is immigrant). If there wasn't immigration, the ageing population would be increasingly under-supported. | | | |
| Net Migration on 16:54 - May 22 with 1364 views | londonlisa2001 |
| Net Migration on 16:38 - May 22 by ScoobyWho |
My old man used to complain about all the Italians and their bloody cafes when I was a kid. |
see - without immigration we wouldn't have Joes for God's sake! | | | |
| Net Migration on 17:08 - May 22 with 1355 views | swan65split |
| Net Migration on 16:12 - May 22 by Lohengrin |
A marked change is very noticeable here, Lisa. |
True ........the last few years have a seen a change happening! | | | |
| Net Migration on 17:19 - May 22 with 1345 views | ScoobyWho |
| Net Migration on 16:54 - May 22 by londonlisa2001 |
see - without immigration we wouldn't have Joes for God's sake! |
Exactly 👠| |
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| Net Migration on 17:28 - May 22 with 1339 views | jackal |
| Net Migration on 16:38 - May 22 by ScoobyWho |
My old man used to complain about all the Italians and their bloody cafes when I was a kid. |
My family were Italian cafe owners.
When my Grandfather came over here (1890's). There was no benefit system, N.H.S. free housing, or government handouts of any kind.
Every penny he made he earned with hard work off his own back.
My family love Wales and consider themselves Welsh/Italian. |  | | |
| Net Migration on 18:24 - May 22 with 1312 views | libertine |
the unions are ruined there is no strength in being a tradesman other than the fact that the wicked witch made them rare by stopping apprenticeships. The rareity is helpful as it allows the hourly wage to be fair, now the foreign tradespeople have come in and cut the wages by allowing themselves to be paid less, therefore in the case of a big company employing 2,000 tradespeople what an enormous saving from £13 per hour to £9 and that's just the start.
Our unskilled employees cannot afford to take a cut but foreigners can, they generally live in multi occupancy properties 10 people sharing a house (illegally) therefore they can work for less, they also have families back home to support so a lot of the money does not go back into the economy. Our people can not afford to work for these wages/conditions.
I hate the liberal nonsense "these people have come to our country and they have helped us" "without them we would have been in a mess" the truth is they have come in and taken the jobs because successive governments have failed to get the training done, the big 3 blame each other but they have all been in government in the last 15 years so they could all have done things to help.
These people are not heroes at all they have deserted their countries when their countries have paid for them to have training and need them most. They come here for money lets not paint them as heroes, I don't blame the people I would do the same myself but that doesn't mean its right. |  | | |
| Net Migration on 19:33 - May 22 with 1289 views | LeonisGod |
| Net Migration on 17:28 - May 22 by jackal |
My family were Italian cafe owners.
When my Grandfather came over here (1890's). There was no benefit system, N.H.S. free housing, or government handouts of any kind.
Every penny he made he earned with hard work off his own back.
My family love Wales and consider themselves Welsh/Italian. |
Bl00dy Italians, coming over here, making both big and little kids alike happy with their flavoured iced deserts. 'My name's Paul Nuttals of the UKIPs and I say the Italians should go home and concentrate on making their Mediterranean nation economically prosperous, instead of coming over here and improving the seaside experience for millions of holidaying Britons.' 
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x23yv5y_stewart-lee-on-immigration-paul-nuttall | | | |
| Net Migration on 19:38 - May 22 with 1226 views | longlostjack |
| Net Migration on 19:33 - May 22 by LeonisGod |
Bl00dy Italians, coming over here, making both big and little kids alike happy with their flavoured iced deserts. 'My name's Paul Nuttals of the UKIPs and I say the Italians should go home and concentrate on making their Mediterranean nation economically prosperous, instead of coming over here and improving the seaside experience for millions of holidaying Britons.'
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x23yv5y_stewart-lee-on-immigration-paul-nuttall |
Well I did my bit for the country - I migrated - Tories would be proud of me. |  |
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| Net Migration on 20:04 - May 22 with 1210 views | trampie |
libertine makes some good points. |  |
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